SNK Stuff Thread 16- Winter 2015 Edition - http://www.mmcafe.com/ Forums


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Professor
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"SNK Stuff Thread 16- Winter 2015 Edition" , posted Thu 10 Dec 22:39:post reply

SNK Stuff Thread 3
SNK Stuff Thread 4
SNK Stuff Thread 5
SNK Stuff Thread 6
SNK Stuff Thread 7
SNK Stuff Thread 8
SNK Stuff Thread 9
SNK Stuff Thread 10
SNK Stuff Thread 11
SNK Stuff Thread 12
SNK Stuff Thread 13
SNK Stuff Thread 14
SNK Stuff Thread 15


Art stuff :

Senri Kita Blog / Hiroaki Blog
Nona Twitter / Nona Yfrog / Nona Blog
Other Artist Info / Other Artist Info 2


Hidden stuff in old games:

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm16260198 - Nico
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm12375295 - Nico
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm12949449 - Nico
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm11733011 - Nico
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm12290526 - Nico

https://tcrf.net/Art_of_Fighting_%28Neo_Geo%29 AOF1 Stuff
https://tcrf.net/Art_of_Fighting_2_%28Arcade%29#Unused_Title_Text AOF2 stuff





[this message was edited by Professor on Thu 10 Dec 23:05]

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Professor
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"Re(1):SNK Stuff Thread 16- Winter 2015 Editio" , posted Thu 10 Dec 23:03:post reply

Famitsu did an interview with KOF14's producer Yasuyuki Oda. Normally, I'd just write a quick outline for these kinds of things, but he mentions a few pretty interesting things like keeping scanlines in mind when doing pixel art in the NeoGeo era (almost like old interlaced screen tricks) which had me interested enough in translating the whole thing.

[NOTE: Feel free to link but please try not to copy-pasta to other forums and whatnot. Reason is, this translation was sort of done on the fly without much editing so it's likely that I'll come back and fix things later (took really long).]


Summary:

- All 50 characters will be playable at launch/release. Roster is already solid.
- Additional characters/dlc is undecided
- All voices have already been recorded. Some VAs will be different from before due to various circumstances.
- Online will feature a 3on3 mode where 6 players each control a character when it's their turn. Same characters will be allowed (at current planning stage)
- Development went full throttle in spring 2014.
- Project started out after company CEO (Kawasaki?) suddenly said in 2013, "We're gonna be #1 in [fighting] games again!".
- Oda comes from the former SNK R&D Division 1, aka the "Fatal Fury/AOF dev team".
- A bunch of other staff from R&D Division 1 have also returned to work on the game; the dev team is a mix of seasoned and new staff
- All the returning staff have been active in the front line, meaning no washed out staff.
- Game is returning to its roots in terms of graphics with "sharp looks on the characters"
- Attention is being given to game balance and controls
- Fighting game aspect for both offline and online are priority, but single player/story mode experience will also be given focus
- Whether game will be updated by versions (ala SF4) or go by sequels (KOF15,16) is still undecided, but it'll be the beginning of another new saga in terms of storyline




Translation of Famitsu's interview with KOFXIV producer Yasuyuki Oda
http://www.famitsu.com/news/201512/10094237.html


-When did you join the company?
I originally joined SNK in 1993 and was placed in R&D Division 1 which mainly did the "Fatal Fury" and "Art of Fighting" series. I left SNK when the company went in its fiasco near the end of the 20th century. Then in 2014, I came back together with other ex-SNK staffs to work on KOFXIV. So in other words, KOFXIV is being developed by a team consisting of core ex-SNK staffs that've reunited as well as new excellent dev members.


- So basically you were entrusted with the creation of "KOF XIV". How exactly did this happen betweem you and SNK Playmore?
It happened in 2013. The CEO back at the time suddenly flipped his switch or something and said "We're gonna take back our Number 1 spot in [fighting] games again!" (laughs). So that was the start of everything and everyone came around, and so we ended up with a team of old and new staff. The project went in full throttle in spring of 2014.


- So that one word from the CEO got everyone fired up.
Right. Of course I told him "it'll cost this and this, and the development time will take as long as this", but he still said "We're still gonna do it!", so I went "OK then, let's go!".


- So was it you that reassembled the former SNK devs?
Actually it wasn't me. There's a staff who's been in the company since the old SNK era and he's kept in touch with everyone all this time. He's the one who called them up.


- That's a lot of drama, reuniting staff that've worked from the past.
Yeah, but because the skills and the environment for developing have changed so much during the years, we've called back the core members from SNK R&D Division 1 that are still active in the front line. Even up until now the KOF series has been in 2D, but this time we needed developers that had 3D skills.


- Members of the core staff including yourself have been keeping up with the times after leaving SNK, leveling up your skillsets.
Correct. The members gathered (for XIV) have been around the industry this whole time, and they've got over a decade of development experience in consumer games and fighting games.


- That's quite an amazing team. This time, the graphic have changed from 2D to 3D. Why 3D?
After leaving SNK, all the games I made were in 3D. Moreso, going from 2D to 3D is pretty natural when you consider the evolution in hardware, and we decided to take that path when thinking about things that are ahead.


- There weren't any internal debate on whether things should go 2D or 3D?
It was already decided that we'd be developing for the high-end enviornment so it was never a debate. However, even though we've gathered good staff, we don't have the technology/knowledge base as SNKPlaymore yet [for doing 3D], and that's something we'll need to do building up from this project.


- It was a bit surprising since KOF has always had a reputation of going 2D.
Back in our days, the Neo Geo had restrictiona and we only had the option of going by pixel art. But even back then, there were high-quality 3D games like "Virtua Fighter", and it was certainly something I wanted to try if we had a good PCB. 2D pixel art is still something that remains as a culture, and I know there's a lot of people that like them. I like them too. But on the other hand as a developer, there's always the unconfortable feeling that there's no tomorrow if you can't keep up with the times, the progress, and new technology. So it's a hard decision.


- So those are the reasons behind going 3D.
Just to add on to that, this is personal opinion, but remember scanlines on CRT screens? Back in the old days, we'd say [to our artists] "add 0.5 of a pixel", and have them draw in the pixels by taking scanlines into account. But with the modern Full HD monitor, the pixels comes out too clearly and too perfectly that you can't have that same taste. I don't think that modern hardare and monitors go well with pixel art.


- "KOF XIII" came out in 2010, so it's already been five years. As a new game, what's the concept behind KOFXIV's project?
First, we're focusing on the sharp character design that's always been a trademark in KOF. We've been around SNK since the old days when KOF was still called by its project name "Survivor", and we certainly remember the impact that KOF94 made in its debut. It was back when the fighting game craze happened from Street Fighter II and Neogeo titles like Fatal Fury and Art of Fighting were smash hits. Back in those days, pixel art with realistic more artstyle were mainstream. And then came along KOF, featuring characters with much a sharper, aesthetic look. It had an impact. Right now, KOF13 is pretty popular so everyone has the image of KOF = anime-ish, but back then, that was the image we had for the series.


- Back then, KOF's graphics were different from other fighting games.
And another thing is character volume. Back when KOF94 came out, it was a time when having 16 characters was considered to be big. And KOF94 had 24 characters. I still remember being amazed, thinking to myself "man they sure were able to throw in a ton of characters", considering the hardware spec and development enviornment. I think that sort of astounding volume is what makes "KOF", so we plan to have 50 characters in the game. We're hoping that throwing in that many will be enough to surprise everyone (laughs).


- The all-star feeling that KOF94 had was quite something. Nowadays, fighting games are getting attention as an e-sport. Is that something that's being kept under consideration for KOFXIV?
E-sports has widespread and there's a lot more people that are knowledgeable about fighting games compared to the old days. So we're putting in a lot of attention in KOFXIV's controls and balance to satisfy those kinds of people.


- Are you keeping KOF98 and KOF2002 in mind when doing that? Those two games are well praised by hardcore players.
Yes, and of course KOF13 as well. Although let's be honest, when you play KOF98 now, you realize that its controls aren't really that great (laughs). We know that we need to keep things [for KOFXIV] at a good enough quality so that people can play it worry-free as a modern game. We're also keeping into account that it's for the PS4 this time, so it needs to be playable on a pad.


- As a console title, are there anything in particular that's being kept into account?
One thing that's certainly different from the arcade is the sound. In the arcades, it's noisy and you can't hear things too well. But at home, you can hear the acted voices that aren't even shouted out. Because of that, the character's actings and lines have to be chosen more carefully. Also, there needs to be more focus on the single player experience.


- By that, do you mean better single player modes?
Right. Of course we'll be throwing in a lot of effort into the fighting game side for both online and offline mode. But I don't think people will really consider us to be SNK unless we have a good story mode. We also think that, the more that e-sports gets attention, the more important it also is to make a single player mode that compliments it.


- Are there that many people who play the single player modes?
While we haven't actually taken statistics, it's certainly true that a lot of people play SNKPlaymore titles, thinking, "I want to play KOF but I don't want to seriously go head-to-head" or "I'm not really good at doing special moves but I still want to play". And we need to treasure such fans.


- Some fighting games are finally starting to get a substantial story mode, but the KOF series has always sort of had focus on storyline and characters since its early releases. That's probably why there's so many fans of the characters.
And of course we're focusing on the quality of online play too.


- As a fighting game, online play is really important. Are there going to be any elements to compliment it?
Live streaming has become a part of gaming, so we want to throw in some mechanisms that'll compliment that. We can't say anything solid since we're still working on the game, but one of those additions will be the "Party Battle". You'll fight as a 3-member team where each player uses one character; up to 6 players can participate. We're still figuring out other fun elements that we can add in, like things that players can do while they're waiting for their turn.


- That sounds like fun.
We might change it, but we're thinking of allowing same characters to be picked, so you can have a match of Kyo-Kyo-Kyo vs Kyo-Kyo-Kyo for example. It'll be truely chaotic (laughs)


- For example, what do you have in plan that players can do while they're waiting for their turn?
It'd be fun if they can type in comments like Nico Nico Douga. Eh, not saying we'll do it! (laughs)


- It'd be fun if there's a bullet hell of comments during the matches.
Texts have a more visual effect than voice chat, and it certainly gives a better appeal for live streams.






- Changing the topic, you said there's going to be 50 characters. Were there any criterias in the character's selections?
I can't talk in details, but we've had a draft for a roster that was nearly all old characters and another one that was nearly all new characters, and we took them and also put into consideration our market which has become pretty global. Either way, we wanted give the roster some regional colors. Teams by countries, teams by concepts like the female fighters team... until the game gets released, feel free to fantasize about the roster.


- The popular characters like Kyo and Iori have already been announced. It seems likely by that flow that other staple characters in the KOF series may also be appearing...?
In selecting the characters, we've considered everything including characters that we knew that "everyone would be pretty happy if this character was in the game".


- Do you mean that all 50 characters have been decided already?
Yes. They're solid.


- What's the ratio like between the old and new characters?
I can't disclose that yet, but with as many as 50 characters, the popular characters might be in the game. That's all that I can say now (laughs)


- Let's change the question. Are you adding new elements to the new characters to distinguish them from the older characters?
Well yeah. When we're to make a new character, we emphasize "adding in completely new element(s)" and "taking on a challenge". Back with the NeoGeo, we had to release a KOF every year so there simply wasn't enough development time and there was no choice but to take a conservative approach. But this time we have plenty of time, so the new characters will show more of our challenge.


- Can you tell us what sort of essence/elements you've incorporated into some of your new characters?
There's various things but for example, [some of them] feature a design that would've infuriated the designers if we told them to do it in pixel art (laughs)


- You mean it's a design that was possible because you're going 3D? Like having a really wacky costume?
You can take it that way. It's certainly possible to do so in 2D, but it would be a considerable pain (laughs)


- In some ways, going 3D has broadened the possibilities in designs. Have the designs [for old characters] been re-tuned when shifting from 2D to 3D?
Yes. If you design them with a 2D mind, they often cause issues when you make them into 3D. So there's been a lot of cases where where we've tweaked things numerous times while moving forward.


- Personally, Leona looks completely natural in 3D and it actually sort of makes her look even more sexy. So have there been some characters that were easier than others to make into 3D?
Really muscular characters and characters that are deformed(simplified) tend to look good when they're in 3D. They don't cause problems, their shadows look good, and they look pretty three-dimensional. But KOF has a lot of slim characters, and they're pretty hard to shift to 3D (laughs)


- In that sense, Chang must've been pretty easy to render.
Actually he was a headache. He was easy to render because his body shape is pretty unique, but he has accessories like his jingling chains.


- Let's talk about the voices. You said that you're putting attention into voices and dialogues. Have you already decided on the voice actors?
The recordings are already done. Some characters have a different VA and some are still the same. Please stay tuned to more details in the future.


- The Neogeo has a long history so there's a lot of fans that have memories about the voices. As far as the characters with a new VA goes, did you search for VAs that have similar voices?
Basically yes. We had to go through voice samples for 50 characters, and record the voices for 50 characters.. it was quite something (laughs)


- We can certainly imagine. Did you basically use the same VAs for anyone that was available, and switched to new VAs for those who couldn't continue providing their voices?
It really depended on various reasons including the situation of the VAs. We certainly didn't switch VAs because of a single policy.


- So you're not creating characters based on the availablity of their voice actors.
Yes. The game comes first, and then we pick VAs that are close to their images.


- When it comes to fighting games, the motivation of players will certainly change depending on whether there's a huge tournament or not. Talking about a bit into the future, are there any plans to run a nationwide tournament once after the game's launch?
We don't have any solid plans, but once the game gets released I plan to ask my company that "we want to run a tournament like this!" (laughs)


- Aside from official tournaments, do you also keep EVO and other tournaments in mind?
We'd love to see it get played at various tournaments including domestic tournaments and Evo. Realistically speaking, we need to start thinking about how to expand [to tournament events] worldwide.


- Are there any elements/modes that have been implemented with e-sports in mind?
There isn't any game system with that sort of thing in mind, but we want to keep a good game balance. However, it's not fun if every character played the same, so if one part [of the character] is strong enough to be 10 points we'd tone down some other points for that character, and make sure its charasteristic stands out.


- In fighting games, it's not too fun if all the characters played the same.
KOF is a game where you use 3 characters, so we hope that players would cover for the weakness of a character by picking another character to cover for that. That sort of thing is one of the strongpoints of a team battle game, but being able to use 3 characters becomes mandatory. So we need to tweak the characters so they're playable on the fly to a certain level. That's one of the differences from balancing characters in a 1-on-1 game.


- With 50 characters, it seems like you'll be working on the balance until the very end. Will they all be playable on the game's launch?
Don't worry about that. You'll be able to play all 50 characters on launch. It's not going to be a game where you can only use a few characters at launch and the roster will gradually increase. Make sure you write that clearly (laughs). After all, it's not a KOF if doesn't have many characters.


- It's pretty common for a normal fighting game to gradually get new characters together with version updates, but having 50 characters right on bat is certainly going to have a huge impact.
Having 50 characters at launch is something we'll be ussing as KOFXIV's selling point.


- Will you have additional characters after launch?
We'll have to see about that once the game and its 50 characters are out. We don't have any plans yet. As we keep releasing more titles, it would be cool to release some characters like those from "Sasuke vs Commander" (laughs)


- Will KOFXIV continue on as a series?
Whether to release verion updates for XIV or to release XV isn't decided yet, but we've been releasing each KOF story in trilogies, so we're looking at XIV's saga from a similar viewpoint.


- This time there won't be an arcade release, meaning there won't be a loketest. Are there plans for any sort of hands-on event prior to launch?
In terms of game balancing, we'd like to gain feedback from players prior to launch by having an event or something. That's something we'll need to plan.


- Talk about balance, what do you think makes KOF's battle unique?
I think it's the mind-reading that takes place during the speed-paced battle. All fighting games aren't too different from each other when it comes to their speed of attack motions, but the moving speed of characters, the timings for cancels, hitstops, hit detections, reset timings, amongst other basic points in game systems makes a huge difference. So we're certainly keeping a lot of attention on that. Although when it comes to talking about "what makes a KOF", there's so many iterations of KOFs (laughs). But it won't be the type of fighting game that emphasizes "footsies". There'll be running and jumping; we want to bring the thrilling battle that makes a "KOF".


- Any last words for tne fans?
We're going crazy and fighting with a tremendous amount of data every day, but we're confident that it'll be a fun game so please look forward to more details.





[this message was edited by Professor on Fri 11 Dec 04:38]

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"Re(2):SNK Stuff Thread 16- Winter 2015 Editio" , posted Thu 10 Dec 23:56post reply

Good stuff! Funny that they talk like KOF Maximum Impact never happened.





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"Re(2):SNK Stuff Thread 16- Winter 2015 Editio" , posted Fri 11 Dec 00:47post reply

Thank you prof!
Not thank you to the producer, though. He really doesn't sound like he knows what he's doing.





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"Re(2):SNK Stuff Thread 16- Winter 2015 Editio" , posted Fri 11 Dec 01:23post reply

quote:
.
.
.
Translation of Famitsu interview to KOF14 producer oda
http://www.famitsu.com/news/201512/10094237.html

[Work in Progrees-- do not copy-pasta text to other forums yet. Free free to post permalink. This is only 40% done]



Summary:
- All 50 characters will be playable at launch/release. Roster is already solid.
- Additional characters/dlc is undecided
- All voices have already been recorded.
- Online will feature a 3on3 mode where 6 players each control a character when it's their turn. Same characters will be allowed (at current planning stage)
- Development went full throttle in spring 2014.
- Project started out after company CEO (Kawasaki?) suddenly said in 2013, "We're gonna be #1 in [fighting] games again!".
- Oda comes from the former SNK R&D Division 1, aka the "Fatal Fury/AOF dev team".
- A bunch of other staff from R&D Division 1 have also returned to work on the game; the dev team is a mix of seasoned and new staff
- All the returning staff have been active in the front line, meaning no washed out staff.
- Game is returning to its roots in terms of graphics with "sharp looks on the characters"
- Attention is being given to game balance and controls
- Fighting game aspect for both offline and online are priority, but single player/story mode experience will also be given focus
- Whether game will be updated by versions (ala SF4) or go by sequels (KOF15,16) is still undecided, but it'l

-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --

WOW! Kudos! I feel much better now about KOF. Interesting how the 3v3 controlled by 6 players was something I brought about in the E-sports board here while talking about E-Sports :) Thanks Prof!





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"Re(3):SNK Stuff Thread 16- Winter 2015 Editio" , posted Fri 11 Dec 04:02post reply

quote:

Work in Progrees-- do not copy-pasta text to other forums yet.



Loved how the first thing that happened was this being posted in other places and they claiming it as "entire interview".

quote:
Thank you prof!
Not thank you to the producer, though. He really doesn't sound like he knows what he's doing.



Well, that's certainly taking the series back to it's roots.....
I'm worried about the "controls" comment, after all KoF XIII console version "improvement" on the controls made it one of the worsts episodes control wise in a saga that's eternally plagued by awful controls.






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"Re(2):SNK Stuff Thread 16- Winter 2015 Editio" , posted Fri 11 Dec 04:24post reply

Thanks Prof for the translation!

quote:

We might change it, but we're thinking of allowing same characters to be picked, so you can have a match of Kyo-Kyo-Kyo vs Kyo-Kyo-Kyo for example. It'll be truely chaotic (laughs)

-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --



I hope they will keep this feature in the final release





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"Re(4):SNK Stuff Thread 16- Winter 2015 Editio" , posted Fri 11 Dec 04:40post reply

Thanks for all the hard work Professor!

I understand his feelings about how modern hardware are not conductive to proper presentation of classic pixel design. A digression, but are there new techniques that can make pixel art that will give it the smooth look of CRT scans? But what was more interesting was that nobody addressed the elephant in the room; it's not that KoF XIV is in 3D, it's that it's in bad 3D. At some point I hope someone discusses the art direction for this game and why someone thought that first trailer was a good idea.

quote:
I hope they will keep this feature in the final release


The question they should ask isn't "Can we do this?" but "Should we do this?"





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"Re(5):SNK Stuff Thread 16- Winter 2015 Editio" , posted Fri 11 Dec 07:28post reply

quote:
bullet hell of comments



I want the nico-style comments to actually have a gameplay effect (either in the actual match for super crazy fun, or just in the background), and that when a comment is entered the commenter has to enter which side they are supporting. The storm of comments will clash with each other as the players try to drum up fan support.

GIVE <PLAYERNAME> YOUR STRENGTH





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"Seriously, what the hell is going on?" , posted Fri 11 Dec 08:10post reply

I understand that my positivity is like Charlie Sheen's to some people here, but whatever, I'll just say my thing because I didn't expect KOFXIV discussions in the cafe to be so depressing. This bothers me the most because this board has been around for so long and there are barely any dedicated forums (or people) left to discuss this game. I didn't think it would turn out like this. I started following SNK games fanatically since my cousin hooked me up with an emulator in 2002 and have been a fan ever since and bought many of their products, so I'm not a longtime fan as most of you people are. But still, there are many of you here and on other sites who are in serious need of a reality check.


This is such a stupid situation that spans across multiple sites and communities, normally I'd use more profanity and address people specifically, but I respect the Professor for all the work he has done during all these years for the SNK community and I don't want to ruin the mood here too much. Besides, my years of arguing on the internet are a thing of the past, it's way too stressful.


I've said before that gameplay matters more than graphics, but most SNKP fans turned into a bunch of pathetic casuals/Twitch chat trolls who only harp about the looks (that are improving every time it appears in public) and don't even bother to talk about the fact that we get 50 goddamn fighters. It's barely acknowledged, exactly what the inebriated Christ is going on? We all love SNK characters, right? We've grown up with them; with their appearances, evolving fighting styles, costumes, music, artwork etc. They are a big part of games, so why isn't anybody hyped? It's said that Prisoner Chang was a lucky guess, but even if the leaked roster is fake, I'm still more excited than I expected. Would you rather have a gorgeous game with 30 characters and the rest locked behind expensive DLC that you won't see in a while? Did we all forget what happened with XII and how destructive that game was? There are still delusional people who want to see sprites AND a huge roster. Not going to happen.


Let me refresh your memories by comparing the production of XII/XIII and what we know so far of XIV:


KOF XII/XIII:

- Took 6 years (from the planning of KOF12 in October 2005 until the console release of KOF13 in November 2011)
- Tons of work hours and a huge amount of money. It was their most expensive project ever
- A lot of stressed employees in awful work circumstances
- Regulation A2 was canceled, Falcoon has left the building
- Nona left the building. Old interview says the reason he was the art director was because he was the most consistent with quality output and the hardest worker
- Old IGN article hinted at the fact that XII was supposed to be released in 2007.
- Debut was Feb 2008, would have been released in the same year. Ended up getting delayed until April 2009 because not enough characters were completed.
- Arcade version bombed, didn't even enter the list of top revenues, something that KOF2001 managed to do
- Console version was released and pretty much everything was missing. Let me stress the fact that they needed to release a 60 dollar beta to survive. A 60 DOLLAR BETA. --I actually bought a PS3 for this game-- They didn't even properly patch the online, they moved on immediately to arcade XIII. Thanks for the quality 480p sprites and expensive music DLC though, SNKP. The datamined characters on the XII disc and K'/Mai portraits on the anniversary site also managed to piss people off.
- Arcade XIII was much closer to the intended product and is a good game
- After a long silence, console version is finally announced and YAY ON DISC DLC I LOVE YOU SNKP
- The game now has 36 playable characters that feature headswaps, some lacklustre movesets here and there and very conservative roster choices. Also, many animations from previous games are missing, they were clearly scraping the barrel.
- After XIII, almost everyone left the building and the gaming division was on the verge of getting shut down
- XIII finally achieved attention at Evo, but not because of the graphics because KOFXII was sharper and had more lighting effects
- XII was $60 new, XIII + 3 character DLC = $65. $125 combined.

And people still want sprites, after all this drama. Keep in mind that XII was made when sprite fighters were more common, at least there were more artists compared to now. They could have achieved more if they went with simplified shading like Arc does, because they achieved more with much less of a budget for the X/XX series. They severely underestimated the work it would take and it cost them big time. Fans should know by now that graphics aren't everything, they won't save a poor product with a painful lack of content.

SNKP would never be able to do KOF real justice if they continued with sprites and you know it. You have an autistic obsession with sprites if you think it's best for this company and the gamers to keep making 2D graphics.


KOF XIV:

- They were planning this game around July 2013 and development started full throttle in spring 2014. For convenience and to make a point, let's say it started in June 2013.
- They're going to release this game in 2016. I'll give you this as well, let's say December 2016.
- WE ARE GETTING 50 GODDAMN CHARACTERS WITH NO STRINGS ATTACHED. It's confirmed that we're getting new characters as well, it won't be a high school reunion like XIII was. No retail exclusive on-disc pre-order season pass microtransaction Red Bull Subway social app BS. Even if there are EX head swap clones among them, that's one hell of a goddamn deal.
- Underwhelming graphics, looks last-gen
- First impressions are positive, the gameplay is ace and there are no complaints about the mechanics
- (Major) problems that could occur: some characters with poor movesets, poor netcode, not enough stages, not enough modes, balance issues, graphics aren't polished to an acceptable minimum level


They'll have achieved more in < 4 years, and that's being VERY generous, than XII/XIII did in 6 years. Even if the game was delayed, it would still offer way more content in a shorter period of time.


Now, I've been quite critical of SNKP in the past --Rhythm of Fighters is unplayable now, period. Can't even play it offline, it basically Ashed itself. A refund would be nice. MSD is also an expensive cluster fudge.-- I'm not a blind fanboy who defends SNKP on every whim, I tend to look at both the good and bad aspects of their products and try to rationalize it. Again, 50 fighters. No pre-order/on-disc/season pass nonsense like other companies do and yet they still get fellated by their degenerate fanbase.


Ask anyone who works in gaming development; creating high quality graphics/animations is the most expensive part of a project, especially with a 50-man roster. Why can't you focus on the good things? The characters don't seem to lack any moves because they're building on the foundation that XIII laid, it would be a giant waste to throw all of that away. Chang smashes people around the world with his Climax DM and still has his funny Wild Ball DM enders, they seem to do characters justice here. From what we've heard so far, we're also getting remixes of fan favorite themes and no doubt new tracks as well for the newly formed teams.


Many companies kicked the bucket in the HD era because they couldn't keep up with the rapidly increasing development costs and SNKP was on the brink of pushing daisies again BECAUSE THEY FOCUSED ON GRAPHICS TOO MUCH. Can you sprite loving spergs seriously blame SNKP for playing it safe now? You do remember what happened with SSF2T HD Remix, right? They started development with way too many color gradients and the game kept getting delayed over and over until Capcom Japan told them to decrease the amount of color detail so they could finally release the damn game.


Yes, the debut trailers were poor and I don't know what they were thinking revealing the game in that state and I don't blame people for having a bad first impression because I felt the same way, I'll give you that.


SNKP is making good moves here by making gameplay their top priority and it's not fair of people to disregard that because of the poor graphics. If you want to talk smack about the graphics, that's fine, but realize that there are alternatives where you get less quality for your buck and if you care so much about polygons then go play goddamn Clayfighter Street Fighter V that's made by a richer company but still looks like trash and barely has any fighters available. Oh, and enjoy the expensive DLC that you can't grind for that's coming your way. I detest awful DLC practices, but if SNKP released for example alternate costumes after the game was released I'd buy them without thinking twice because they already give so much value in the base game.


Call me a cheerleader, whatever. I'm just telling it like it is. Not saying that you should get on your knees and praise them blindly, but at least be fair with your criticism instead of going LOLOL PS1 GRAPHICS XD and saying "They don't know what they're doing" without goddamn explaining why. Discussions are so goddamn insufferable everywhere, it's all people talk about. The FGC is really filled with abused housewives who will buy yearly upgrades and on-disc scam products, but won't acknowledge a company that wants to give you a rich gameplay experience. I haven't said everything I wanted to yet but it's late and I'm tired so I'll just conclude this.


TLDR: The SNK community is niche enough as it is, and it's too bad that it's filled with ignorant jackasses (I'm being very polite here) who happen to be the loudest and most prominent as well. Be reasonable for a change, will you?





Maou
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"beeves" , posted Fri 11 Dec 08:46:post reply

Oh, I wouldn't be too sad. We just had a spike of about 300 visitors today based on a link on Neogaf alone, so I assume there are still stalwart fans out there somewhere, despite SNK's best efforts. Besides, this particular new thread is pretty positive.

As a rare non-KOF person at the Cafe, I've always observed the many years of criticism of hapless SNK as coming from the place of people who desperately want it to do well despite its exasperating failings. SNK is sort of like everyone's inept ne'er-do-well high school kid with a heart of gold, and these comments are parental and know best. I don't think the mean-spirited detractors you're looking for are here, though I'd be happy to fake it.

As another observation from outside the KOF fold, I can note that whether or not beautiful sprites or weak 3D are more viable business-wise, there's no way that KOFXIV as observed thus far is anything other than a graphical embarrassment. It does not matter if this graphical embarrassment took less time to make than previous games, better or worse. Other gaming options are delivering better and in less time, and the average player will not give a game a pass just because it had fewer resources. This is my reality check.

So why does this matter, especially if they're giving people a lot of characters? Because of a history of strong story- and character-centered atmosphere that uses good art as its vehicle, and because if KOFXIV wants to sell a single copy more than KOFXIII outside of low-spec machines in China, it needs to have characters who look like they're not from Tekken 3 achieve a minimum level of respectability and graphical appeal for people who don't have the many years of happy associations with these characters from better times. Put another way: why would the uninitiated, or anyone really, pay attention to it when there are a great many new fighters, both 2D and 3D, which also play well?





人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は...

[this message was edited by Maou on Fri 11 Dec 08:56]

Iggy
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"Re(1):Seriously, what the hell is going on?" , posted Fri 11 Dec 10:09post reply

I... appreciate what you're saying, TRK, but I also have the feeling you're generalizing a bit.

First, I don't think anyone is clamouring for the return to sprites in this particular Café. We're all aware of how the video game industry works in 2015, and we know that quality sprites is an even worse business decision now than 5 years ago (and it was already a pretty bad business decision then). The people here who champion XIII's looks do so because, even though it was a disaster for SNKP, it's still a graphical masterpiece. You also have to understand that many people here have studied arts for long enough to give a lot of importance to the visual aspect of things, which is an area where SNK used to excel into. I think most of the Café was positive on XII's look, including Athena and Ralf/Clark. We were quite the minority.
The distinction you need to make is between pretty graphics and artistic mastery. No one here wants the game to look like most modern fighters, MKX, SF5 or KI, because these games, even though they have modern graphics, are aesthetically terrible. SF4's overwhelming ugliness will not be easily forgotten, regardless of the amount of polygons each character had. Are the textures of KOF14 improving? Yes. Is it going to fix the fact that their lead 3D artist doesn't have enough skill to tell the story of a character through his motions? Never, and that point is viewed as paramount by some of us here. No amount of money can cover for lack of aesthetic education, and it doesn't seem the game has that much of a budget to begin with.
Speaking of, nobody is talking about the backgrounds, but let's be honest here. We need to prepare for the worst, right? Like, NGBC-tragic? I don't want to think about it. I fell like playing 99 now.

Indeed, 50 characters is huge and all. 2002UM had, what, 60? More? Good. Mugen has more. We're past the point of wanting big rosters for free in KOF. I think everyone agrees that sizing down to 16 is a good thing for SF5, even though most fan-favourite didn't make it. Not only because it allows the game to be prettier, but also because it allows the game to be more focused. A new KOF cannot get customers with roster alone: it needs to give a reason to play the new game over 2002UM. 13 had amazing art direction. 11 had the crazy tag system. 98 and 2002 are better games. Even 2000 and 2001 try interesting things with their mechanics, and 2000 is gorgeous. Maybe 14 will be a better game as well, but until the game is finalized a cautious approach is not a bad idea.
You're allowed to be enthusiastic, no fashion police is going to gun you down, but the concerns many people have voiced in the Café are reasonable as well. Jojo ASB had 41 brand new characters, plus their stands, amazing 3D models, a rather good graphic design, but still ended up being a mediocre fighting game. Its only quality over Miraihe no Isan is the formidable roster. And KOF cannot have a formidable roster in a world where 2002UM exists. That's the problem with raising the bar too high (and the same thing happens to Jojo EOH now: it has 54 characters, but after ASB it's just "OK" and "We need at least 10 characters more"). Meanwhile, Smash needs Cloud to have people talk about it again.

The main reason old fans are unimpressed by KOF 14 is that they are not hungry for new shiny things at any price. They're old enough to remember the good old games, and they know that, if KOF14 underdelivers, they can still play these games from the past which still play perfectly fine now. What KOF14 needs to do is to convince us that it has qualities beyond its roster, that it outperforms the old games on at least some areas, and it hasn't for the moment. It doesn't mean we're not going to buy the game at launch to make up our own opinion, it means the reason that allow you to be excited for the game just aren't there for people with different perspectives.

On a personal note, I have never understood the serious KOF players. Probably because I'm old, but KOF has always been the vulgar cash-in that got popular by dumbing-down fine mechanics and bastardizing characters. No one from South Town got any better when appearing in KOF, and several characters actually suffered severe brain damage (Mai, Joe, Yamazaki, the Sakazaki family...). Then, when they finally made everyone into a moron, they started doing the same to their own characters (Poor Athena, Shermie catching people with her boobs...).
My main issue is: if one wants to play a mechanically solid fighter, why not pick RB2? KOF is fun, it has some great characters, but it's a game that needs the help of the visuals and the atmosphere to be enjoyed along with friends. Focusing on the mechanics never made it any good in a world where at least 3 Fatal Fury games are more solid than all KOF released between 94 and 2003. And I don't even like FF! And then we could also play SSS, SS0S or games made by other companies... KOF really needs all of its most superficial aspects if it wants to earn a place on the sofa. SNKP should have called it a day and turned NGBC into its own series. Actually, I think I would have been more excited if KOF14 had been NGBC2 with 50 characters from the whole SNK legacy. When you're dumb, you need to go dumb all the way.
You could say "but the company needs to keep making games, and KOF is their most popular franchise, you want the company to die!" and I would answer "SNK died in 2001. SNKP is a different company. I do not care much for it, sorry".





nobinobita
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"Re(1):Seriously, what the hell is going on?" , posted Fri 11 Dec 11:09post reply

quote:
I understand that my positivity is like Charlie Sheen's to some people here, but whatever, I'll just say my thing because I didn't expect KOFXIV discussions in the cafe to be so depressing. This bothers me the most because this board has been around for so long and there are barely any dedicated forums (or people) left to discuss this game. I didn't think it would turn out like this. I started following SNK games fanatically since my cousin hooked me up with an emulator in 2002 and have been a fan ever since and bought many of their products, so I'm not a longtime fan as most of you people are. But still, there are many of you here and on other sites who are in serious need of a reality check.


This is such a stupid situation that spans across multiple sites and communities, normally I'd use more profanity and address people specifically, but I respect the Professor for all the work he has done during all these years for the SNK community and I don't want to ruin the mood here too much. Besides, my years of arguing on the internet are a thing of the past, it's way too stressful.


I've said before that gameplay matters more than graphics, but most SNKP fans turned into a bunch of pathetic casuals/Twitch chat trolls who only harp about the looks (that are improving every time it appears in public) and don't even bother to talk about the fact that we get 50 goddamn fighters. It's barely acknowledged, exactly what the inebriated Christ is going on? We all love SNK characters,

-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --


If it makes you feel any better, I earnestly, from the bottom of my heart think that Street Fighter V has infinitely more offensive art than KOF14. Most of my friends are super pumped for that game too, while ragging on KOF14, so I also feel like I'm taking crazy pills!

I used to get super worked up bout these franchises, but as Iggy has pointed out, if the games don't appeal to me, I can always just go back to the old ones.

I used to have a sense of loyalty to these franchises. But then I realised, the people who actually made the games I cared about aren't around anymore. For instance, Street Fighter V is the first time a SF game has an art lead that never worked under Akiman or anyone trained by Akiman. I care more about the individual careers of Akiman, Okamoto and Ikeno than Capcom as a company. So as long as they are up to new and interesting things I'll be happy.

When I think about following creators instead of brands, I actually feel a lot less jaded!






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kofoguz
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"Re(2):Seriously, what the hell is going on?" , posted Fri 11 Dec 13:38post reply

Oh boy! Everybody has real solid arguments here. TRK I understand you and your points about DLC con. I also hate to hear when people ignorantly want Capcom to buy SNK to keep the IP's alive, or they needed to have XRD style. If I had a dime everytime I see it on some comment, I would be a millionaire now. And I consider myself ignorant. I have no real knowledge how companies run. Still dont know who is who and so on. I only know what I observe from this cafe and other sources I like to follow. Even I know Capcom wont be interested in other IP's their own gems are buried in deep. And XRD style is easy when you have 12-14 characters. And they just add two more characters and voila it's a sequel. It doesnt work for KOF. I know this as a fact as much as any fighting game fan. KOF XII did exactly that. Real fancy sprite work and had around 22 characters and everybody was up in arms. I migt told it before If it was any other fighter, it might be considered as a masterpiece. Think about Garou MOTW2 with the same roster number in glorious sprite art. It doesnt even have to have a story or a boss. Instant hit! Or any other Fighting IP; AOF, WH, LB, SS. They would be definitely put as masterpiece, not a barebones lackluster! So as a KOF fan I wished they didnt do a ambitious HD sprite project with KOF. Oh and by the way I rather have Yoshi's Wooly World's art direction than XRD one. Yes Xrd is beautiful and such but I want different titles to introduce different art styles.

Also I understand your frustration because of other forums. I lurk in NeoGaf and it was really annoying to see 16 pages of "OMG, graphic sucks"posts that insistingly blocking "Ok, they suck we know can we allowed to talk about other aspects we are interested in" posts. I was also wondering what members here meant by "producer sounds like he doesnt know what he is doing" comment but then guess comment was about the producer talking about things with so "big doe eyed" attitude and kind of wishful thinking. I loved producers ambitious stance and am happy that finally SNKP has a spokesperson again since Falcoon.

I agree with about backgrounds. And I care about them. I hated how SVC has thematically right, when looked at standalone each is beautiful style backgrounds become extremely boring when you see deserted environments again and again and again. NGBC also have similar taste though not everything is ruined, still have deserted backgrounds except for a few cameos and cool cool toon bg. But I dont agree on the 99 backgrounds. I think background had a spirit fitting to the game. Rainy stage is a masterpiece. The worst one for me the museum one and I love it dearly because it fits with the theme.In KOFXIV I am sorry but other than the Aquarium one, none of the stages are promising. The first one is a hot mess and the stadium one looks like a bad copy of previous stadium stage. It lacks theme, color and liveliness. Also mostly crowded with unnecessary details. But this all can change.

It's crazy how awful and ugly SFIV's art direction and how it was accepted as ok. I do like SFV's better because I like stop motion. But I am not studying art like Nobinata, after tasting mud of SFIV I can see no problem/difference with the SFV's sugarcoated mud! But KOFXII sprites were bludgeon to death by FGC.

KOF had peaked in different aspects but not at the same time.
-Graphics were beautiful in 94-96 and XII-XIII.
-We have tourney worthy games 98-02-XIII and the UMs.
-We have champions of roster size in each iteration except for KOF XII. Still the smallest roster size title was still the champion of its time.
-Also we have even nicher fan fovurite titles such as 97, 99, 03 and XI. We never had it all at the same time. The closest thing was KOFXIII it had graphics, gameplay, story and roster. Roster was still considered missing since no exclusively new characters were introduced.
But one thing that they excel is characters, their interaction with each other and relation to the story.Those little details. The moment I understand Mai is in love with Andy. The wedding dress. That is what KOF does best and dont think any other fighting game (company) is no wehere close yet.

So in short, to tell you the truth at first I wasnt excited when I see the trailer.Because I dont like 3D like I love 2D. I am not an expert player so even though I was superglad the gameplay is focused (no expert, yes, but it needs to play like KOF) the excitement werent there yet. What made me excited was Chang's Climax move. Finally they're using that wedding dress. Now I am excited what kind of details we will see. Also really wondering how much they can fix the graphics. Angel gives me more optimistic stance.

Also I wonder what is next. There is a 3D Samurai Spirits coming (garou as well? ). So they need to dip on 3D eventually to excel on it. But I still want some 2D masterpiece. SNK can do it seeing how crazily unstable and unpredictable they are. Creat a new IP (Geese's own fighting game as the young hero) or pick an existing IP. Just have graphically cutting edge 8 characters and sell new ones as DLC. They deserve it.



Spoiler (Highlight to view) -
How I wish to see NGBC back T_T

End of Spoiler







Spoon
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"Re(2):Seriously, what the hell is going on?" , posted Fri 11 Dec 13:55post reply

I am 100% with following IPs/brands even if the original creators aren't involved, because it has been demonstrated that others are capable of adding interesting new things to the world/setting/characters/whatever established by the original creators. The IP/brand defines a certain flavor that the thing will have that I want. It certainly sets expectations, both in terms of kind of experience and quality.

Example 1:
The ArcSys Hokuto No Ken game clearly had no new writing from Buronson, did not feature a single new piece of art from Tetsuo Hara, and did not have any new music from either TOM*CAT or Nozomi Aoki. None of them are even listed in the ending credits as a special thanks. But that game was 100% awesome, both as a fan of crazy fighting games and as a fan of HnK. In fact, I wouldn't have loved it half as much if I wasn't the rabid HnK fanboy I was.

Example 2:
Jagi Gaiden is neither written nor drawn by Buronson or Tetsuo Hara. Jagi Gaiden is singularly the best contribution to HnK after the original TV anime, both in terms of recasting how we look at Jagi as well as in being a fascinating fusion of seinen/shounen. Maybe 2nd best, depending on how fondly I am thinking about MARVELOUS DEADLY FIST BLOW KOs.

Example 3:
Counter-Strike GO was made without the founder of Counter-Strike, Gooseman. It has been a significant upgrade to Counter-Strike, even including its missteps.

Example 4:
None of the Devil May Cry sequels were made with Kamiya at the helm. Devil May Cry 3 is roundly considered the best overall entry in the series, and it was not made by the Devil May Cry 1 team, Kamiya, nor the same art directors. On the flip side, the art director of DMC3 was Ikeno, which means that if all you ever did was follow Ikeno, you still would've gotten around to playing DMC3. Dante in each of DMC1, 3, and 4 was designed by a different person, but they all maintain an essential Dante-ness, even when somebody as notable as Ikeno is not the one handling his design.

So I think there absolutely is value in following an IP or brand that you care about when they have quite historically produced a lot of good things, even with different people. Different people, including previously unheard of people, can absolutely bring something new and good into the thing, even when it is no longer part of the original artist's oeuvre. Following specific creators has plenty of value, but doing so exclusively also has the possibility of narrowing your horizons in the way that just following the IP/brand could.





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"Re(3):Seriously, what the hell is going on?" , posted Fri 11 Dec 14:14post reply

quote:
The IP/brand defines a certain flavor that the thing will have that I want. It certainly sets expectations, both in terms of kind of experience and quality.


To follow my own point in a manner which hasn't already been elaborately and exhaustively examined above, I'd say the literal one-word way of looking at the most reactions to the new KOF is "uncharitable".

In a very literal sense, it's 100% accurate, because the one time we were charitable with KOF was with 2001 because the company had literally just be resurrected and had no time and no money to kick out a KOF. But we do not expect to need to be charitable with KOF, we expect KOF to wow us with its own merits, of which it has historically had many. Especially recently, KOF redefined its own standards of artistic excellence in a huge positive way, and now we have to be charitable with how it has redefined its artistic standards in a huge negative way.

We are not happy with needing to be charitable with KOF.





Professor
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"Re(4):Seriously, what the hell is going on?" , posted Fri 11 Dec 20:54:post reply

Whoa, a lot of talk has been going on during the past half a day!
I can feel the SNK Love in the air!

OK, so talking about aesthetics, here's a food of thought to crunch on.

...What if you were told that the staff working on KOF XIV's character motions is a guy that did them for the Street Fighter 4 series?
...What if you were told that the same guy did character sprite art for games as old as Fatal Fury 1 in the ye old NeoGeo days?

It's just an intriguing thought that a pixel artist from the old days did those tweened motions in SF4 and now he's doing them for SNKP.

Either way, I think there's enough seasoned graphic devs at SNKP right now who realize their game in its current state is artistically subpar to modern games, and I'm sure the renderings will be improved over time and over the course of additional iterations. In that sense, it seems plausible to think of KOF XIV as the Windows Vista for the next batch of KOFs. It might end up being bad, but it'll still be the stepping stone for XV or XVI where things will be more refined.

Let's be honest; making 50 characters in just 2 years of development time is plain crazy. Personally, I'll be picking up the game regardless of quality to support the company so that they can make a better version on their next release but it's still hard to keep a blind eye on its current state of graphics. I just hope that the netcode isn't as bad as before, otherwise with its new Easy Beat combo system Rush combo system, it could very well end up being the next Jojo ASB where you have a bunch of popular characters but all you do is just keep jumping and mashing the square button with top tiers because things are so laggy.


quote:

On a personal note, I have never understood the serious KOF players.

I can probably explain this.
In general, many of the core players, at least in the Japanese scene, don't care about the characters. They see them as something akin to chess peices to see who's the best at playing the games. That's why character-specific players are so rare and most people pick top tiers. In that sense, they have a mindset that's really matching with E-sports and it may sort of help in explaining why they often win tournaments in other fighting games.

There's still a pretty hardcore player base for the Fatal Fury series here, but comparing them to KOF is sort of like apples and oranges at this day in age because the game mechanics and player mentality are quite different.





[this message was edited by Professor on Fri 11 Dec 21:36]

Ishmael
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"Re(5):Seriously, what the hell is going on?" , posted Sat 12 Dec 03:00post reply

Good grief, there's a lot of material in this thread. First off thanks to everyone who took the time and energy to contribute, it made for engaging reading. Since I'm writing this while working on other matters my thoughts are going to be much more disjointed and brief than these posts deserve. Sorry about that.

KoF XIV: As far as gameplay goes I'm feeling cautiously optimistic about XIV which is a massive improvement from the debut. The new game mechanics sound like they could be fun and the positive early reports are encouraging. Many things can happen between now and the release date but I at least can now see what they are trying to make. Still, those good points are never going to overshadow the sloppy visuals. I realize that the producers are going for quantity over quality at this point but it's frustrating that more often than not KoF games are built on compromises.

I also hope that those in charge are thinking about how the distribution of fighting games have changed. The vague comments about public balance tests and unknown tournament support are a bit worrying. Simply tossing the game onto shelves and waiting to see if it sinks or swims isn't a sound strategy anymore. If they are smart SNKP is looking at how modern game companies are supporting their fighters in both positive (the willingness of NRS to constantly tweak their games) and negative (the constant patching of NRS games drives players bananas since they are never playing the same game twice) ways.

quote:
I am 100% with following IPs/brands even if the original creators aren't involved, because it has been demonstrated that others are capable of adding interesting new things to the world/setting/characters/whatever established by the original creators. The IP/brand defines a certain flavor that the thing will have that I want. It certainly sets expectations, both in terms of kind of experience and quality.


This is probably another topic for another thread but I do agree with this sentiment. Seeing new interpretations of familiar work can be really interesting. While I appreciate the contributions that the creators of a material provide I'm also not going to automatically discount something just because it's being done by others. It would be like dismissing that [url=https://youtu.be/-Gbs67ApxL4
]Batman of Shanghai short because Bill Finger wasn't personally involved. Collaborative mediums, be it movies, comics, video games or whatever, is often a shared rather than singular vision. While I greatly enjoy following the work of artists I also like seeing how their creations live on. There's no one correct way to appreciate artistic expression.

Going along with that, there's no one way to enjoy a fighting game. It's a shame I'm probably not going to be able to enjoy the visual aspect of KoF XIV since it looks rough and will never get better. Still, I'm hoping for fun character moments, a game engine that's can be monkeyed around with and maybe some interesting tournaments to watch. Speaking of which...

quote:
In general, many of the core players, at least in the Japanese scene, don't care about the characters. They see them as something akin to chess peices to see who's the best at playing the games. That's why character-specific players are so rare and most people pick top tiers. In that sense, they have a mindset that's really matching with E-sports and it may sort of help in explaining why they often win tournaments in other fighting games.


That's an interesting observation. It helps explain that why a game with such a large roster is often played in such a mercenary way. The promises of a 50 character roster sounds great but I know that most tournaments are going to feature teams of Iori and two other overpowered assholes. Oh well, as was noted earlier tournament play is only one part of the equation when it comes to fighting games.

In the end I don't know much of anything other than that KoF needs to take a hike and NGBC 2 should be green-lit.





Fygee
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"Re(5):Seriously, what the hell is going on?" , posted Sat 12 Dec 04:16post reply

quote:
Whoa, a lot of talk has been going on during the past half a day!
I can feel the SNK Love in the air!

OK, so talking about aesthetics, here's a food of thought to crunch on.

...What if you were told that the staff working on KOF XIV's character motions is a guy that did them for the Street Fighter 4 series?
...What if you were told that the same guy did character sprite art for games as old as Fatal Fury 1 in the ye old NeoGeo days?

It's just an intriguing thought that a pixel artist from the old days did those tweened motions in SF4 and now he's doing them for SNKP.

Either way, I think there's enough seasoned graphic devs at SNKP right now who realize their game in its current state is artistically subpar to modern games, and I'm sure the renderings will be improved over time and over the course of additional iterations. In that sense, it seems plausible to think of KOF XIV as the Windows Vista for the next batch of KOFs. It might end up being bad, but it'll still be the stepping stone for XV or XVI where things will be more refined.

Let's be honest; making 50 characters in just 2 years of development time is plain crazy. Personally, I'll be picking up the game regardless of quality to support the company so that they can make a better version on their next release but it's still hard to keep a blind eye on its current state of graphics. I just hope that the netcode isn't as bad as befor

-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --


I will say that I haven't seen anyone complain about the animations, and they look pretty damn solid to me.

Really, I think the biggest thing they need to work on is the character's faces. The rest of the models (aside from the hair) look fine to me, and the textures on their clothes also look perfectly fine. If they can fix the faces and add some detailed textures to them, then problem solved.

Some other things like improved lighting effects would be gravy, but as long as they get the graphical mashed potatoes right, I'll be a happy camper.

First post here in many years by the way. :P





sibarraz
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"Re(6):Seriously, what the hell is going on?" , posted Sat 12 Dec 11:32post reply

I feel like some of the criticism really comes from the new fans that the saga made after the release of KOF XII, which was the first entry of the series to get a relative "mainstream" success and it was the first try of lots of players who never knew, or cared for the saga. That being said, those criticism are spot on, the game truly felts like something made quick, and until we don't see the 50 characters, that excuse will not work either if all the fighters are as ugly as Andy.

In the other hand, this last PSX really rised my hopes for the game since the game actually looked fun with polished mechanics (unlike xii) and some new characters looked better that the original release, so I'm still hoping that in later stages of developments will be capable of at least releasing something that would have looked great on the last gen. In the end I don't care for others people feelings, I will start to worry if the core of SNK fanbase hates the game since that could be the final nail in the coffin of SNK "traditional" game development.

In other topic, I recently bought the Neo Geo Humble Bundle, since SNKP released KOF 2002UM/98 UM I was expecting to see some humble bundle from snk with some steam games, but I never expected to see a release with lots of roms with their own front end and without steam. even less a neo geo emulator built for browser.

In one hand, the the roms had little to no work on it. It was really only putting the nebula emulator with a rom downloaded from a torrent and a frontend where you don't have many option. You can't even map the buttons which could be a little confusing since the layout that they used for they keyboards isn't a traditional one (The D button is alone in the second row of the keyboard, upside the other 3 botons)

Even though this could be a deal breaker for me, I still think that this bundle is awesome, just for the fact that FINALLY snk made a collection with the best of their catalog without using the same games from 1990-1994 that they ALWAYS include on those packages or releases from now plataforms.

It was a nice surprise to see games like Twinkle Star Sprites, Sengoku 3, Shock Troopers, and Neo Turf Masters, plus the release for the first time outside the Neo Geo of SSV SPECIAL. If you want to show to a friend how great and special the catalogue of the console was, I think that this bundle will be a great choice since all the games included are great.

I even felt in love again with the company, the last time I left to a side the neo geo games because I wanted to play newer experiences, but this bundle made me replay some masterpieces that I shouldn't had ignored.

Also, the games are well emulated, the metal slug games run better on Nebula that in the Awful steam ports that DotEmu did for Steam and Iphone





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"Re(7):Seriously, what the hell is going on?" , posted Sat 12 Dec 14:27post reply

Apologies to the other hardworking cafe-ers in this thread; as much as I'd love to join in the conversation about whether or not to be mean to KoFXIV, I'm too lazy to write walls of text about my analysis of old SNK, SNKP or KoFXIV. It'll have to suffice to say that my confidence in the game is a work in progress that started low with the initial trailer.

With that out of the way, I'd now like to go back to that interview to highlight this:

quote:

- Are you keeping KOF98 and KOF2002 in mind when doing that? Those two games are well praised by hardcore players.
Yes, and of course KOF13 as well. Although let's be honest, when you play KOF98 now, you realize that its controls aren't really that great (laughs).



What...? Of all the criticisms that have ever been leveled at KoF98, this is by far the newest and strangest one to me. I've heard "unbalanced," "buggy," even the occasional "ugly" but bad controls? I wish the interviewer had prodded this statement a little more before moving on because when a person important to the future of KoF says something like this about one of the best in the series, you kind of want to understand where it's coming from. Is this based on some known consensus of the game in Japan that I'm not aware of?





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"Re(8):Seriously, what the hell is going on?" , posted Sat 12 Dec 15:42post reply

quote:
What...? Of all the criticisms that have ever been leveled at KoF98, this is by far the newest and strangest one to me. I've heard "unbalanced," "buggy," even the occasional "ugly" but bad controls? I wish the interviewer had prodded this statement a little more before moving on because when a person important to the future of KoF says something like this about one of the best in the series, you kind of want to understand where it's coming from.


I was scratching my head over this one too, but I think it's for small reasons, like how players needed to pull off some tricks for even basic combos, like holding on to a button so that special moves won't come out when you did a certain motion. The hitstops (cancelable window) were quite short too, at least by today's standards.

Then again KOF13's basic combos weren't nessesarily easy either. I don't think the producer's played much of 13 at all though, so he may not know. I do wonder how good his understanding of the games are though, compared to some other dev staffs that they have. Keep in mind that Hee Sam Woo who was semi-finalist at one of the EVO tournaments is an employee at the company.


I'm a bit relieved that some people mentioned how the backgrounds are stale in kof14! Personally I feel there's no depth compression and things in the background look way too alienated from the player characters. Another thing, despite how KOF13's stages were criticized a lot for the obese spectators, I still loved the way they moved so well. And especially the animals, like the Tucan and lizards in the Jungle stage. Animals have always been animated so well in the KOF series like the chickens back in 97.





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"Re(8):Seriously, what the hell is going on?" , posted Sat 12 Dec 15:45post reply

quote:
What...? Of all the criticisms that have ever been leveled at KoF98, this is by far the newest and strangest one to me. I've heard "unbalanced," "buggy," even the occasional "ugly" but bad controls? I wish the interviewer had prodded this statement a little more before moving on because when a person important to the future of KoF says something like this about one of the best in the series, you kind of want to understand where it's coming from. Is this based on some known consensus of the game in Japan that I'm not aware of?



The KoF controls have some pretty embarrassing history across the game eras; one of the main things that it's completely impossible to forget is that when you move behind the enemy at high speed (like running behind a jump or behind a roll); the controls "replicate"(for example, if you hold db to press a weak kick, the machine "assumes" that you are holding db and df at the same time). When you are good, that happens all the time (since it's an opportunity to combo from light kicks); and it's hard as hell to get what you want because the machine creates whatever direction it feels like; if your character has a df slide or a HCF or a dp or a d, d move with the button you are using, you are royally screwed and needs tons of practice to reduce the randomness and it's impossible to negate it.

There are a bunch of other stupid nuisances like that (like 1f normal throws eating up control inputs even when they don't actually throw).






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"Re(9):Seriously, what the hell is going on?" , posted Sat 12 Dec 18:14post reply

Hello, I'm a long time lurker =D

Regarding KoF XIV what bothers me is that it's not clear what they're aiming for.
If they're aiming at new fans they're using a totally wrong strategy, since the graphics looks terrible and a cast of 50 playable characters could be very disorienting.
If they're aiming at the old school fans I think they got it totally wrong. Speaking as a fan of the character and the story aspects of the game, the KoF CR pachislot looks a million times more appealing than XIV, and that's ironically sad...
In my opinion making XIV with recicled sprites from XII-XIII adding just 5-6 characters would have been a better option than what they're doing now...
One of the main strenght point of KoF was the ability to deliver a rooster with a mix of old fan favorites as well as new cool characters. XII-XIII failed in this regard, since we had just one inedited character and two newcomers from the original Fatal Fury... they need to deliver that now like never before: they need new cool characters to attract new fans as well as old favourites for their loyal fanbase. At this point I'm afraid they can't do that, the characters in XIV right now looks too generic and lost much of their original charisma...
The point is not how many characters you can deliver but the quality of the characters in itself as well as how much the rooster looks cohesive.





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"Re(10):Seriously, what the hell is going on?" , posted Sat 12 Dec 19:03post reply

quote:
If they're aiming at new fans they're using a totally wrong strategy, since the graphics looks terrible
Even the KOF fans AND developers realize this.
quote:
and a cast of 50 playable characters could be very disorienting.
How is it "disorienting"? Especially when there's KOF2k2UM.
quote:
making XIV with recicled sprites from XII-XIII adding just 5-6 characters would have been a better option than what they're doing now...
They could, but do you realize how long it takes just to make one character sprite set? Do you also understand what little payoff it would be to hold off a game for AT LEAST two years just to have maybe 9 new characters at best when not only is dot art a niche thing despite the hipster trend, but the fact that KOF was considered by many a casual crowd "too hard" that it was rather off-putting to them, making KOF less viable financially? At least consider the more realistic point of view, here.
quote:
they need to deliver that now like never before: they need new cool characters to attract new fans as well as old favourites for their loyal fanbase. At this point I'm afraid they can't do that, the characters in XIV right now looks too generic and lost much of their original charisma...
...All we've seen are a handful of returning members. This just goes back to the remark about graphics.
quote:
The point is not how many characters you can deliver but the quality of the characters in itself as well as how much the rooster looks cohesive.
True, and you can't really expect much cohesiveness in a KOF game, since KOF games are notoriously large rosters. On the other hand, I admit I do miss those times back in 94 where teams were split up by nationality, even if some were questionable.

Are you drinking, by the way?





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"Re(10):Seriously, what the hell is going on?" , posted Sat 12 Dec 19:04post reply

quote:
Hello, I'm a long time lurker =D

Regarding KoF XIV what bothers me is that it's not clear what they're aiming for.
If they're aiming at new fans they're using a totally wrong strategy, since the graphics looks terrible and a cast of 50 playable characters could be very disorienting.
If they're aiming at the old school fans I think they got it totally wrong. Speaking as a fan of the character and the story aspects of the game, the KoF CR pachislot looks a million times more appealing than XIV, and that's ironically sad...
In my opinion making XIV with recicled sprites from XII-XIII adding just 5-6 characters would have been a better option than what they're doing now...
One of the main strenght point of KoF was the ability to deliver a rooster with a mix of old fan favorites as well as new cool characters. XII-XIII failed in this regard, since we had just one inedited character and two newcomers from the original Fatal Fury... they need to deliver that now like never before: they need new cool characters to attract new fans as well as old favourites for their loyal fanbase. At this point I'm afraid they can't do that, the characters in XIV right now looks too generic and lost much of their original charisma...
The point is not how many characters you can deliver but the quality of the characters in itself as well as how much the rooster looks cohesive.



Welcome to the MMCafe BBS Doctor!
Hope you like it here.

Also, I should say welcome back to Fygee as well!


Personally, the thing with KOF13 was that the game brought me back with its graphics. The Fatal Fury and AOF characters felt as skinny as toothpicks in the traditional KOF graphics, but in 13 they felt a lot more like their original games. In that sense, I'm wondering how they'll look in KOF14 after reading the interview.


quote:
There are a bunch of other stupid nuisances like that (like 1f normal throws eating up control inputs even when they don't actually throw).


I never realized this. Was it situational?





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"Re(2):Re(10):Seriously, what the hell is goin" , posted Sat 12 Dec 20:38post reply

quote:
How is it "disorienting"? Especially when there's KOF2k2UM

I was talking about new fans, I specificated that in the first post
quote:
They could, but do you realize how long it takes just to make one character sprite set? Do you also understand what little payoff it would be to hold off a game for AT LEAST two years just to have maybe 9 new characters at best when not only is dot art a niche thing despite the hipster trend, but the fact that KOF was considered by many a casual crowd "too hard" that it was rather off-putting to them, making KOF less viable financially? At least consider the more realistic point of view, here.

My point was that right now their not having any payoff for their choice, since they got all that negative feedback on the internet right now, they're doing just a bit better than the XII fiasco... XII was defended by die hard fans for the beauty of its graphics, XIV for the large rooster and the gameplay. General public is bashing it and I don't see in which way it can attract casual gamers right now, if that was their target...
I'm not a great fan of XII-XIII art style, I was saying that what they're doing is so bad that it was better to recicle sprites. By the way they kept the franchise on hold for five years now so what I was saying was reasonable, 5-6 new characters means draw one character per year...
Of course right now the best option is going 3D, but not like this
quote:

...All we've seen are a handful of returning members. This just goes back to the remark about graphics.

Yes, we've seen only returning characters, some have being redisgned (Iori, Andy, Chang) and to me they look generic/boring, just my opinion.
quote:
Are you drinking, by the way?

No, if I wrote something weird it's beacuse English is not my first language and it's actually very hard to express myself...

quote:
Welcome to the MMCafe BBS Doctor!
Hope you like it here.

Thank you Professor!





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"Re(3):Re(10):Seriously, what the hell is goin" , posted Sun 13 Dec 03:28post reply

I don't know what is going to happen with KoF XIV but the franchise is still able to generate page views and discussion as this thread shows. Perhaps there's some life left in the old dog yet after all. It even managed to pull in a new poster: Welcome Doctor!





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"Let's go to South Town" , posted Sun 13 Dec 03:56:post reply

quote:
No, if I wrote something weird it's beacuse English is not my first language and it's actually very hard to express myself...
Not to worry, probably around 50% of the Cafe is non-native English speakers, and it works great! It's particularly apt for this thread, since from what I can tell, one of the things that originally drew people from far and wide to the Cafe is a shared love for SNK. At 5,500+ views in two days, this new thread seems to fit the bill.
quote:
If they're aiming at new fans they're using a totally wrong strategy, since the graphics looks terrible and a cast of 50 playable characters could be very disorienting.
As someone who only knows Samurai Spirits and Metal Slug, I'd agree. I've traditionally felt the tug of KOF despite it seeming overwhelming as an outsider because of the beautiful art and the characters people seem to love, but here I just see a slew of characters who all look ugly. Even the gorgeousness of Guilty Gear is incomprehensible to my Street Fighter- and Soul Calibur 1&2-adled mind, so what hope does KOFXIV in expanding its audience in this state?





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"Re(2):Re(10):Seriously, what the hell is goin" , posted Sun 13 Dec 04:20post reply

quote:
There are a bunch of other stupid nuisances like that (like 1f normal throws eating up control inputs even when they don't actually throw).



I never realized this. Was it situational?



It's timming based & situation and easier to do with regular throws; after years of playing there are guys that can sort of aim for it (like inputing a regular throw after a knock down), and it became a major pain since they "tilted" you and it became harder to jump.






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"Re(10):Seriously, what the hell is going on?" , posted Sun 13 Dec 08:50:post reply

While I admire snkp effort put into kof xii and xiii, I don't see how reusing the sprite will be a better option. Is any of you expecting to sell better than xiii? The last sales figure for kof xiii was its debut sales in japan which was 21,525 on the ps3, we have no clue what it sold elsewhere. The whole blazblue series as of 2012 sold 1.7 million across a couple games means one game sold more than what kof xiii sold. It took six years to get to kof xiii. Even then several characters were unfinished, most win pose were static, no special intro.I am playing older kofs and they feel more a live than kof xiii. Are you telling that snkp can go back and work on the 36 characters on top of the 9 new characters. Who is to say snkp won't cut corners. The kof xiv made with sprites will still be sub hd and with the standards of fighters much higher now, this is not go flying without the game costing less than 30. Tekken 7, SF V, MK X, Smash 4 are running at 1080p 60 fps, besides fans why would people want less for their gaming hardware. The chance of it getting with evo as a main game when games like SFV, Sf IV, MVC3U, Smash 4, Meele, MKX. KI, GG XRD, Tekken 7 are just as viable. Is snkp going to address that the game was hard for new comers to the series. I don't see this as a better choice its just as bad.

If kof xiv had less characters I don't think it would look better. The major fighting game makers in japan are all using unreal engine, snkp is not.Unless they gets unreal engine 4 and more skills programmers, you have to be delusional to think it look any where near SFV or Tekken 7. The older kofs were colorful it popped out, i want to see vibrant colors in kof xiv and not this wash out look. Sknp still needs to apply lighting and shaders. Snkp wants to attract new audience, but they don't have
tools or staff to make it look the competition. If they cancel this game its not like they are going to sprites. Outside of mobile games what else are they good for beside being dead. This what they decided and i hope they are serious enough for the challenges that will face them. I hope they considered releasing a betas to test the netcode and flesh out the single player elements, and be active in the tournament scene. They need to be confident in their product.





[this message was edited by Mrkarate23 on Sun 13 Dec 10:25]

Doshin
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"Re(3):Re(10):Seriously, what the hell is goin" , posted Sun 13 Dec 10:45post reply

quote:
My point was that right now their not having any payoff for their choice, since they got all that negative feedback on the internet right now, they're doing just a bit better than the XII fiasco... XII was defended by die hard fans for the beauty of its graphics, XIV for the large rooster and the gameplay. General public is bashing it and I don't see in which way it can attract casual gamers right now, if that was their target...
You must understand that it is in really extremely early development, compared to our first previews of KOFXII. So what we see is of course going to be trashed. It's sad that they decided to show it so early, but it seems like Sony has something to do with it, in my opinion.

If they were to go the sprite route, they would simply add in maybe 6 characters, and take a couple years of development time to manage such a feat. On top of that, ratings board submissions and test phases and publishing. That's a lot of time that uses up a thing called money, and these devs aren't getting paid by commission, they're getting paid by the length of time (which is also why deadlines are often in place). It's also time they're not making money from it by not having released the game, yet.

SNKPlaymore (or whoever is overlooking the budgeting), I imagine, looked at and weighed the two options and decided which would be more cost effective in the long run. It's as simple as that. It's all about optimizing workload/time and money. They can roll out KOF with 50 characters, very good graphics (eventually) and nice gameplay in the same amount of time, maybe less, that they would have to be able to add in a handful of new sprites for KOF, with less of a budget than doing the latter and easier post-production fine-tuning. It's also highly modular when it comes to 3d graphics due to use of vectors rather than pixels, which is not the case for pure raster graphics. So when the next generation comes up, they can up the amount of geometry, make the appropriate tweaks and refurbish the textures, and voila. Also, they can learn how to manage shaders better in their offtime which is an excellent thing to learn for stylistic purposes. They can later find a way to build a synthesis algorithm that takes all the above, and rasterizes the images appropriately and make 2d sprites from that. You just can't get that flexibility with sprites alone.

As for what kind of fans they're looking for, I'm sure they're looking specifically at the KOF fans, casual and hardcore. They appear to be somewhat aware that KOF is still a niche franchise compared to giants like SF and Tekken. At the same time, they don't want to add only a few more characters and then it turns out it still doesn't attract the casual crowd because it looks like pixel-based games from the PS2 era to them, or that it's too hard still. It sucks, but them's the ropes.





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"Re(4):Re(10):Seriously, what the hell is goin" , posted Sun 13 Dec 22:27post reply

One last thing to take into consideration regarding "what is SNKP aiming at": China.
Everyone has pointed at the fact the game is still very early in development. Yet the loadings are surprisingly fast for an alpha version (especially if it loads all 6 characters in one go).
So I wouldn't be surprised if the ugliness of the graphics were not only because of lack of skills, but also because the framework of the project is "the game must run on any computer able to run LoL".

Because let's be honest: SNKP doesn't need to make a game that appeal to the US (or even Japan)'s tastes. The game would cost ten times more and would only sell a couple dozen thousands without creating any growth for the franchise. Evo is a nice little thing, but they won't make a living there.
China, on the other hand? They probably have more potential customers there than Street Fighter worldwide. And I'm not sure how many computers in China can run SF5 decently.

Regardless of what the old grumpy people, art nazis or hyperactive twitch monsters think, the current KOF14 might be the best business decision SNKP has made since 5 yea.... 10.... the NGP... the Hyper Neo... the Neo Geo itself??? Maybe? When did SNK did any kind of smart business decision, again?
It's just that they finally understood they won't make a living with the likes of us.





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"Re(5):Re(10):Seriously, what the hell is goin" , posted Mon 14 Dec 05:14post reply

quote:
One last thing to take into consideration regarding "what is SNKP aiming at": China.
Everyone has pointed at the fact the game is still very early in development. Yet the loadings are surprisingly fast for an alpha version (especially if it loads all 6 characters in one go).
So I wouldn't be surprised if the ugliness of the graphics were not only because of lack of skills, but also because the framework of the project is "the game must run on any computer able to run LoL".

Because let's be honest: SNKP doesn't need to make a game that appeal to the US (or even Japan)'s tastes. The game would cost ten times more and would only sell a couple dozen thousands without creating any growth for the franchise. Evo is a nice little thing, but they won't make a living there.
China, on the other hand? They probably have more potential customers there than Street Fighter worldwide. And I'm not sure how many computers in China can run SF5 decently.



I know I hit this point before, because another mmcafer immediately pointed out that the game has only been announced for PS4 so far. There has been no announcement of it for any other platform, namely PC and mobile. Now, maybe the premium market audience which actually owns PS4s somehow aligns with the same age demographic that actually cared about KOF, that's entirely possible and not something I know the numbers for. But at this moment, no PC/mobile announcement to me reads as limited initial interest in the game in China.





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"Re(5):Re(10):Seriously, what the hell is goin" , posted Mon 14 Dec 06:08post reply

quote:
China.


I totally forgot that. That's a good point. Eventhough I would want better style or 2D sprites I think it's high time they need to have legs on 3D skills. Plus as someone above (honestly don't remember who) mentioned their Pachinko models looks much better since well before Ledo, SNK was focusing on Pachinko and the talent over there now in gaming division. So I dont believe we will see wonders, we will see improvements since we saw some late videos.

Though I hope going 3D doesnt mean they quit 2D completely. Still hoping they would use skills they gained from XII-XIII for 8 rostered new or old IP.

quote:
At 5,500+ views in two days, this new thread seems to fit the bill.

Wait, we can see how many people check the thread.That's news for me.





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"Re(6):Re(10):Seriously, what the hell is goin" , posted Mon 14 Dec 06:15post reply

quote:

I know I hit this point before, because another mmcafer immediately pointed out that the game has only been announced for PS4 so far. There has been no announcement of it for any other platform, namely PC and mobile. Now, maybe the premium market audience which actually owns PS4s somehow aligns with the same age demographic that actually cared about KOF, that's entirely possible and not something I know the numbers for. But at this moment, no PC/mobile announcement to me reads as limited initial interest in the game in China.


Even if this version itself is ps4 only for ever and ever; the next version is gonna be the usual copipaste fix build on top of this engine; and to be honest is only natural to expect that at one point and probably quite soon, they will make a chinese market only budget version for either QQ or for their utterly bad & shady arcade boards.






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"People's Republic of Fighters" , posted Mon 14 Dec 07:53post reply

quote:
Even if this version itself is ps4 only for ever and ever; the next version is gonna be the usual copipaste fix build on top of this engine; and to be honest is only natural to expect that at one point and probably quite soon, they will make a chinese market only budget version for either QQ or for their utterly bad & shady arcade boards.


I wonder when the initial talks for the sale of SNKP started? When XIV started in 2014 the rank and file programmers wouldn't have known what was going on but I wonder if the resources of this game were used as a selling point during the negotiations and for keeping it going after the sale. Remember how much you loved seeing KoF96 sprites for years? Well, get ready because you ain't seen nothing yet!





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"Re(1):People's Republic of Fighters" , posted Mon 14 Dec 08:14post reply

quote:
Remember how much you loved seeing KoF96 sprites for years? Well, get ready because you ain't seen nothing yet!



The irony is that the current competitive games which are super-popular and on PC pretty actually have done visual overhauls for their old characters in the game over the years. World-beater League of Legends recently did so for one of their oldest and most neglected characters. DOTA2's crowdfunded prizepool for the world championship included a vote on which character would receive a visual update, which wound up being quite underwhelming in spite of a few laughs it gave us. The funniest thing of all? After the characters have gotten visual re-works, old cosmetics you bought for them either get busted, feel sub-par, or get deprecated. In some cases, you'll have people intentionally rocking a skin that makes them look like their old ugly selves.

This is actually happening right now:
In the year 20XX, somebody will, in a deliberate act of irony, play with the equivalent of the up-rezzed Morrigan sprite in spite of the original company having finally acceded to fan demand and given it an overhaul.





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"Re(7):Re(10):Seriously, what the hell is goin" , posted Mon 14 Dec 08:22post reply

quote:

I know I hit this point before, because another mmcafer immediately pointed out that the game has only been announced for PS4 so far. There has been no announcement of it for any other platform, namely PC and mobile. Now, maybe the premium market audience which actually owns PS4s somehow aligns with the same age demographic that actually cared about KOF, that's entirely possible and not something I know the numbers for. But at this moment, no PC/mobile announcement to me reads as limited initial interest in the game in China.

Even if this version itself is ps4 only for ever and ever; the next version is gonna be the usual copipaste fix build on top of this engine; and to be honest is only natural to expect that at one point and probably quite soon, they will make a chinese market only budget version for either QQ or for their utterly bad & shady arcade boards.



I think the central point is, why didn't they just do that in the first place? Why even bother with going through the motions of making a PS4 version for a market that isn't interested in the IP, while also hampered by technological and know-how inferiority with the genre champs on that platform? If the whole discussion of the sale of KOF to a Chinese stakeholder is "KOF is big in China", wouldn't the shareholders/etc. be more pleased with a product that's actually going to be relevant in the Chinese market?





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"Re(2):People's Republic of Fighters" , posted Mon 14 Dec 10:38post reply

quote:
Wait, we can see how many people check the thread.That's news for me.

It is a secret! You must master the Ougi/Secret Technique! What you need to do is highlight the top of the opening post subject line like this to see it. Prof pointed out one time how you can do this to see total BBS visitors, too. It spiked with this thread for a day. We're...being watched!
quote:
In the year 20XX, somebody will, in a deliberate act of irony, play with the equivalent of the up-rezzed Morrigan sprite in spite of the original company having finally acceded to fan demand and given it an overhaul.
I would love to actually see a Morrigan lookalike appear, then have them keep using it in successive updates until it becomes as un-funny as Dan!

To your point about the Chinese market, I'm still puzzled by who they're aiming for right now. If two-generation-old graphics are to enable the game to run on simpler Chinese machines, why (as mentioned) isn't it a PC launch? Not even 1.5 million PS4's have sold in Japan as of mid-2015, so that's not the market unless there's a magical one-to-one console-to-game selling ratio. As far I know, the market isn't in the US, either? Are they hoping to cobble together fans from around the world in the same way that SNK attracts people to the Cafe globally? I don't get it. Then again, maybe they don't, either, which might be part of their challenge.





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nobinobita
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"Re(3):People's Republic of Fighters" , posted Mon 14 Dec 12:13:post reply

quote:
Wait, we can see how many people check the thread.That's news for me.
It is a secret! You must master the Ougi/Secret Technique! What you need to do is highlight the top of the opening post subject line like this to see it. Prof pointed out one time how you can do this to see total BBS visitors, too. It spiked with this thread for a day. We're...being watched!
In the year 20XX, somebody will, in a deliberate act of irony, play with the equivalent of the up-rezzed Morrigan sprite in spite of the original company having finally acceded to fan demand and given it an overhaul. I would love to actually see a Morrigan lookalike appear, then have them keep using it in successive updates until it becomes as un-funny as Dan!

To your point about the Chinese market, I'm still puzzled by who they're aiming for right now. If two-generation-old graphics are to enable the game to run on simpler Chinese machines, why (as mentioned) isn't it a PC launch? Not even 1.5 million PS4's have sold in Japan as of mid-2015, so that's not the market unless there's a magical one-to-one console-to-game selling ratio. As far I know, the market isn't in the US, either? Are they hoping to cobble together fans from around the world in the same way that SNK attracts people to the Cafe globally? I don't get it. Then again, maybe they don't, either, which might be part of their challenge.



Being on console keeps the brand alive. It's like why Disney will make a Winnie the Pooh movie every decade with a modest budget. It won't make as much money as a Pixar flick, but it will go on to make much more in Merchandise.

The recent KOF mobile game is probably the most profitable KOF game ever. Whether they plan to port those KOFXIV assets to other platforms or not, I'm guessing they're not planning on putting much money into the console game. It probably ins't expected to make much profit. It's just there to remind people that KOF still exists.

quote:
China, on the other hand? They probably have more potential customers there than Street Fighter worldwide.


Yup! KOF is really really really popular in Chinese speaking territories. Historically all those arcade machines are probably bootlegs though. So it's nice they can finally make some $$$ off of mobile and online games.






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[this message was edited by nobinobita on Mon 14 Dec 12:15]

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"KOF14 to be 'The most easy to play KOF ever'" , posted Thu 17 Dec 16:53:post reply

New KOF14 Producer Interview from 4Gamer.
I'm doing a summary translation this time around since the interview doesn't feature that many things which require nuances.

http://www.4gamer.net/games/317/G031749/20151216086/

Summary:
- The concept for KOF14's development is "The most easy to play KOF ever"
- They want to make the game so that it plays naturally for fans of 98, 02, and 13 which were the most popular.
- Since Producer Oda was in the FF/AOF dev team, he wasn't really involved with the KOF series up until now. This will be the first time that he's on a KOF project from its plot stages.
- SNKP's been away from console development for quite some time now, so this will be the beginning for them to build up their 3D knowledge and skills
- When asked "If KOF14 succeeds, could we be seeing the comeback of other franchises such as Fatal Fury, Art of Fighting, or Samurai Shodown?", Oda replied "If everyone supports us, we might be able to bring things all the way there."
- When asked about Trailers 1 and 2, Oda said the renderings were mostly the same but they changed the lightings amongst other various tweaks. They want to continue improving the game's quality
- As reported earlier, all 50 characters will be playable at launch. 16 teams (3 characters each) + 2 characters.
- The game is roughly 70% done. They'll be starting to work on game balance.
- The game is designed to play like KOF13 just during MAX mode where you can use EX moves and 3 levels of Supers that can be canceled in their order of hierarchy. Oda says that with enough studying it's possible to juggle opponents like in KOF13.
- For beginners, there's the automatic and simple "Rush Combo" system
- The devs are still tweaking the game's Just Defense system through trial and error





[this message was edited by Professor on Thu 17 Dec 17:18]

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"Re(1):KOF14 to be 'The most easy to play KOF" , posted Thu 17 Dec 17:29:post reply

quote:
New KOF14 Producer Interview from 4Gamer.
I'm doing a summary translation this time around since the interview doesn't feature that many things which require nuances.

http://www.4gamer.net/games/317/G031749/20151216086/

Summary:
- The concept for KOF14's development is "The most easy to play KOF ever"
- They want to make the game so that it plays naturally for fans of 98, 02, and 13 which were the most popular.
- Since Producer Oda was in the FF/AOF dev team, he wasn't really involved with the KOF series up until now. This will be the first time that he's on a KOF project from its plot stages.
- SNKP's been away from console development for quite some time now, so this will be the beginning for them to build up their 3D knowledge and skills
- When asked "If KOF14 succeeds, could we be seeing the comeback of other franchises such as Fatal Fury, Art of Fighting, or Samurai Shodown?", Oda replied "If everyone supports us, we might be able to bring things all the way there."
- When asked about Trailers 1 and 2, Oda said the renderings were mostly the same but they changed the lightings amongst other various tweaks. They want to continue improving the game's quality
- As reported earlier, all 50 characters will be playable at launch. 16 teams (3 characters each) + 2 characters.
- The game is roughly 70% done. They'll be starting to work on game balance.
- The game is designed to play like KOF13 just during M

-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --


Awesome, XIII is one of the 3 most popular KOFs? I wonder what the criteria was. Sales? Overall fan feedback?

In any case, I can continue to wait in vain, hoping with all my heart for a new Samurai Shodown in the style of KOFXII and XIII






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[this message was edited by nobinobita on Thu 17 Dec 17:30]

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"Re(2):KOF14 to be 'The most easy to play KOF" , posted Thu 17 Dec 18:51post reply

At this point everything that had to be said on this and the other thread about KOFXIV has already been said, so allow me to ponder about more heartwarming things:

quote:
In any case, I can continue to wait in vain, hoping with all my heart for a new Samurai Shodown in the style of KOFXII and XIII


Holy cow, those SS sprites look AMAZING! I wouldn't mind playing a mugen like that!





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"Re(2):KOF14 to be 'The most easy to play KOF" , posted Thu 17 Dec 19:03post reply

This isn't directly related, but could become relevant within a few years, depending how things turn out - yesterday Extra Credits posted a video about China's Sesame Credit system, which reminded me of something I read about it before - namely, how the system penalizes the use of video games.
I have no idea how this is bound to play out for SNKP considering their Chinese associations - the system punishes importing foreign goods and games, which would work against them, considering how China's one of their big markets - on the other hand, the system being partially run by Tencent, with whom they have associated with more in the past few years, not to mention the new owners of the company.

Maybe it's not to late to refocus on Korea and the west in case the ambiguity of the situation doesn't work out well for them?...





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"Re(2):KOF14 to be 'The most easy to play KOF" , posted Thu 17 Dec 22:12post reply

quote:
In any case, I can continue to wait in vain, hoping with all my heart for a new Samurai Shodown in the style of KOFXII and XIII

Give me that plus Last Blade and Garou and we are good to go :)





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"Re(3):KOF14 to be 'The most easy to play KOF" , posted Fri 18 Dec 01:06post reply

quote:
In any case, I can continue to wait in vain, hoping with all my heart for a new Samurai Shodown in the style of KOFXII and XIII
Give me that plus Last Blade and Garou and we are good to go :)



I will pay everything for Last Blade 2!!





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"Re(2):KOF14 to be 'The most easy to play KOF" , posted Fri 18 Dec 04:30post reply

quote:
Awesome, XIII is one of the 3 most popular KOFs? I wonder what the criteria was. Sales? Overall fan feedback?


They are probably evaluating tournament presence and overall community acceptance, which are both more or less good.

........... The interviewed points made me feels chills rather than hope for the future






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nobinobita
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"Re(3):KOF14 to be 'The most easy to play KOF" , posted Fri 18 Dec 14:19:post reply

quote:
This isn't directly related, but could become relevant within a few years, depending how things turn out - yesterday Extra Credits posted a video about China's Sesame Credit system, which reminded me of something I read about it before - namely, how the system penalizes the use of video games.
I have no idea how this is bound to play out for SNKP considering their Chinese associations - the system punishes importing foreign goods and games, which would work against them, considering how China's one of their big markets - on the other hand, the system being partially run by Tencent, with whom they have associated with more in the past few years, not to mention the new owners of the company.

Maybe it's not to late to refocus on Korea and the west in case the ambiguity of the situation doesn't work out well for them?...



There's a lot confusion going on around the Sesame credit system. Alibaba and Tecent have rolled out 2 separate credit systems. Neither of these are associated with the government system that's being proposed for the future.

More info here:
https://www.techinasia.com/china-citizen-scores-credit-system-orwellian

That Extra Credits video is just spreading misinformation and fear mongoring. It's the kind of information that people WANT to be true because it confirms their existing biases and also paints an exciting distopian sci-fi future scenario haha.

Thanks for posting it though! It still brings up a lot of interesting points.

On a semi related note ...

I recently found out why Arcades died out in Thailand. About a decade ago Galaxy Group, one of the larger corporations in Thailand successfully lobbied to put huge limitations on the importation of foreign arcade machines. You can't import an arcade game into Thailand that's less than 10 years old. Suddenly I realised why Guitar Hero was the most recent arcade game I'd seen.

This was probably meant to foster the growth of local devs. But there's just one problem: THERE ARE NO LOCAL ARCADE GAME DEVS IN THAILAND. This bone headed decision killed off most arcades.

The interesting thing is, Galaxy Group was historically the largest importer of arcade games in Thailand. I'm not clear on why they intentionally killed off the industry they founded here. Maybe they saw the death of arcades coming anyways and decided to end it early? Maybe they were overstocked on machines and wanted to become the only source in the country? I dunno, but it's scary to think how a single uninformed law can torpedo an entire industry.

In any case, I really hope whatever actually happens in China, it won't put huge limitations on video games like this. When you have stupid laws like that, it just ensures that people rely on piracy rather than official means to get their fix.

Oh one more thing to keep in mind. Chinese people aren't so credit card crazy as Americans. Most people still prefer to spend cash. It's likely that if the new credit system punishes you for purchasing games, people will just pay cash for their games. Even if it's an online game, you can just go to the convenience store and pay cash to recharge your account. Same with mobile games etc. I really resent Extra Credits use of the word "obedient" to describe the Chinese (especially given the current state of partisan politics in the US), because the people there have been subverting government imposed limitations for centuries, millnenia. That's just how things work in a culture with such a long history of crushing bureaucracy.






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[this message was edited by nobinobita on Fri 18 Dec 14:25]

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"Re(4):KOF14 to be 'The most easy to play KOF" , posted Fri 18 Dec 18:27post reply

quote:
There's a lot confusion going on around the Sesame credit system. Alibaba and Tecent have rolled out 2 separate credit systems. Neither of these are associated with the government system that's being proposed for the future.

More info here:
https://www.techinasia.com/china-citizen-scores-credit-system-orwellian



Thanks for the clarification - I guess some unreliable translations must have lead to the mistaken impression that different systems were one and the same.





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"Re(4):KOF14 to be 'The most easy to play KOF" , posted Sat 19 Dec 00:24post reply

Some gameplay video of Counter of Fighters. I really hope the in-game announcers are modified before the game is released. Also, wow, Kyo's can-can kick knocks his opponent into orbit!

Also, thanks to Nobi for giving a good summary of everything that's wrong with the misinformation out there about Sesame credit. The Extra Credit video spun a scenario out of an outsider game studies view without taking into consideration any social or economic factors or even making certain they had all their facts straight.

quote:
Oh one more thing to keep in mind. Chinese people aren't so credit card crazy as Americans. Most people still prefer to spend cash. It's likely that if the new credit system punishes you for purchasing games, people will just pay cash for their games. Even if it's an online game, you can just go to the convenience store and pay cash to recharge your account. Same with mobile games etc. I really resent Extra Credits use of the word "obedient" to describe the Chinese (especially given the current state of partisan politics in the US), because the people there have been subverting government imposed limitations for centuries, millnenia. That's just how things work in a culture with such a long history of crushing bureaucracy.

The big things these doomsday scenarios are forgetting is that the people involved are very resourceful. Even though the government's system is only theoretical I'm certain there are already people in China who are figuring out ways to circumvent the process or ginning the results in their favor. If you want to look at this situation through the narrow scope of games the citizens of China are going to figure out the limitations of the game engine and cheat like crazy.





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"Re(5):KOF14 to be 'The most easy to play KOF" , posted Sat 19 Dec 03:58post reply

China honestly seems more capitalist than the United States does. Regulation only goes as far as your money there, and the extents to which people will go to make a buck are at once horrifying and horrifyingly brilliant. That credit system, if it works at all the way it has been claimed, is going to get subverted so fast into something hilariously distorted. There will literally be influence farmers and influence peddlers at various scales, including influence enclaves.





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"Ancient artifacts discovered at SNKPlaymore" , posted Fri 25 Dec 20:52post reply

I hope they weren't giving them out as Xmas gifts for the staff, the stuff are certainly historical.





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"SNKPlaymore Exec interview" , posted Tue 29 Dec 00:20:post reply

Famitsu.com's posted their interview with SNKP Executive and Chief of Gaming division Yutaka Noguchi.

....He looks young because he probably is. Afaik he's about the only Japanese worker at SNKP that's using modern sites like LinkedIn for example (which btw tells us that he became chief pretty recently in 2013).

http://www.famitsu.com/news/201512/28096392.html


I'm dead busy with year-end commitments right now but here's an overview of what's written ----

- New Pachislot regulations are one of the main reasons why SNKP decided to switch back to gaming. New releases of Pachislot machines were going to need huge changes, and when they laid down their business plans they decided it may be better to focus their resources back to gaming
- Noguchi: "Even as of now, we're better known as a game company than a pachislot company. People still talk about us (as a game company) when we say our name."
- When SNKP took their IPs into consideration, they decided that going back into the gaming business and taking advantage of their IP would probably be better. Also, their smartphone and Steam stuff were doing well and it helped push things in that decision
- Noguchi's heard from many people that they're happy SNKP is back in gaming. He says it's a market where they can hear the user's voices more directly, but it's also a harsh market that consumers will go away unless the games are actually fun even if it's based on a popular IP. He hopes they'll create fun games with the fans becuase that should be enjoyable for their development staffs as well.
- They're focusing on the PS4 since it's selling well throughout the world. They'll be focusing on KOF at first but want to make better use of their other IPs as well and to further raise their value. They have over 200 IPs in terms of titles
- They've been out of the gaming scene for a while so they're basically starting off from scratch together with returning dev members
- KOF14's main dev members are old staffs from SNK's golden days.
- Noguchi : "A lot of staff are coming back, saying 'hey, if it's a new KOF'....".
- In addition, old game staff(s) that've been working in the Pachislot division have also returned
- They also have talented staff members that've been the fans/players of KOF, and Noguchi hopes the new and old staffs will cause a synergy effect in development
- Right now in terms of console games, SNKP is focusing on KOF14's development. Their contact at SCEA is a fan from the NeoGeo era who's been requesting for some hardcore titles, and so they've been working together which is one of the reasons why some PS4 ports are in progress.
- SNKP released the Hunble Bundle 25th anniversary set because they know their titles are well known overseas
- Noguchi predicts the Smartphone game market will still continue to grow, and SNKP will continue to focus on it. He comments that the Metal Slug series is not just popular in Japan, USA, Europe, but also Middle and South America, and southeast asia.
- Metal Slug Attack is one of the main titles they'll be focusing on in 2016
- In the old days SNK used to develop for arcades and then port to consoles, but Noguchi realizes that times have changed. KOF14 is being developed for console. He says that personally he'd like to release titles for the arcades as well.
- They're going to put more effort into their licensing business.
- As one of their plans, they're going to issue out licenses that'll fit the needs of various regions. For example with Asia, they licensed KOF98 and a spinoff-app based on the game's world view was released by a third party (KOF98OL by Tencent). They're also hoping to license out characters, like say if Iori is popular in China and Terry is popular in North America, they'll allow them to come out in those region's games and whatnot
- When asked about any collaborations with Japanese companies like "Capcom vs SNK", Noguchi laughed and commented that they've just restarted their game business and there's still a far way to go.





[this message was edited by Professor on Tue 29 Dec 05:24]

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"Re(1):SNKPlaymore Exec interview" , posted Wed 30 Dec 02:00post reply

Thanks for the summary Professor! Interesting that they admitted that one of the reasons for getting back into the game business was because of the new pachislot regulations. Are the new laws that bad? Or were SNKP's pachislots such a minor presence in the market that they decided it wasn't worth the effort to get up to date with the laws and that games were now less of a losing proposition?





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"KOF'94 character article" , posted Fri 1 Jan 08:41post reply

From shmupulations, as usual.

Among the delightful anecdotes is this gem:

Also, in his win pose he says “san kyuu!” (thank you) in that funny voice. When Benimaru’s designer first heard that voice, it was so far from his original image of the character that he got enraged and couldn’t do any work for the rest of the day.





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"Re(1):KOF'94 character article" , posted Sat 2 Jan 12:56post reply

quote:
From shmupulations, as usual.

Among the delightful anecdotes is this gem:

Also, in his win pose he says “san kyuu!” (thank you) in that funny voice. When Benimaru’s designer first heard that voice, it was so far from his original image of the character that he got enraged and couldn’t do any work for the rest of the day.



Interesting information!

I knew that Yuri wasn't originally going to be in KOF'94, but from what I can understand in this article, Mai wouldn't be in it either? Considering her huge popularity ever since the FF2 days, that's surprising...





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"Re(2):KOF'94 character article" , posted Sun 3 Jan 06:20post reply

I think, rather than Mai alone being a specific case, this peek into the developers' thought process hints how distant the KOF team was from Fatal Fury as a whole. Hell, it seems even Kim was only brought into the game to appeal to the Korean market.

Fatal Fury's creator Takashi Nishiyama was the producer of KOF'94, but there are old rumors about bickering between FF and SS developers, so I am not sure about the relationship between the different teams and whether if affected their collaboration on a crossover project.





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"Re(3):KOF'94 character article" , posted Sun 3 Jan 18:22post reply

Finally had a chance to read this. Now I really want to see what kind of expression the "cool" Sie made before he was damned into goofiness.

quote:

Fatal Fury's creator Takashi Nishiyama was the producer of KOF'94, but there are old rumors about bickering between FF and SS developers, so I am not sure about the relationship between the different teams and whether if affected their collaboration on a crossover project.



It's certainly interesting to hear that originally Takuma, Kim and Mai weren't going to be in the game, and Yuri would have been on Team Mexico. I wonder if the imbalance between Garou and RnK characters on the planned roster was a sour point?





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"Re(4):KOF'94 character article" , posted Sun 3 Jan 21:13post reply

quote:
Finally had a chance to read this. Now I really want to see what kind of expression the "cool" Sie made before he was damned into goofiness.


One of his unused designs made him look like Sie from KOF XII/XIII.





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"Re(5):KOF'94 character article" , posted Sun 3 Jan 21:55post reply

quote:
Finally had a chance to read this. Now I really want to see what kind of expression the "cool" Sie made before he was damned into goofiness.

One of his unused designs made him look like Sie from KOF XII/XIII.



Well of course both are based on his Psycho Soldier design (2k version) so that's not surprising. I was referring to the pose that was changed in 94 (a change that was "booed" by the female staff) which we will probably never see.





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"Re(6):KOF'94 character article" , posted Mon 4 Jan 04:36post reply

Man, that interview make the development of the game sound like a fun time. I wonder if it was like that..

I had heard that working at SNK was very stressfull on those days, are there any kind of info about how where the working conditions back then?





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"Re:KOF Playable At The Taipei Game Show 2016" , posted Thu 7 Jan 00:11post reply

The King of Fighters XIV To Be Playable At The Taipei Game Show 2016
Taipei Game Show 2016 will be held from January 29th to February 2nd in Taipei, Taiwan.





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"Re(1):Re:KOF Playable At The Taipei Game Show" , posted Thu 7 Jan 00:52post reply

Apparently Lost Saga is still recruiting SNK characters - this time it was Galford's turn, but it's hard to find official information, because apparently only in the Korean version, and that can't be accessed outside Korea - still:
* Official source
* pictures of the male and female version, as characters in LS are basically suits and movesets, so in-game heads tend to be different based on the player
* Gameplay video





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Loona
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"Incoming Chinese KoF series?" , posted Sun 10 Jan 07:47post reply

I found this was Twitter, and unless Google Translate is being incredibly misleading, it looks like a Chinese company has plans for KoF animated and live-action series... Can't be worse than the Gorden Chan movie, can it?...





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"Re(1):Incoming Chinese KoF series?" , posted Sun 10 Jan 11:29post reply

quote:
Can't be worse than the Gorden Chan movie, can it?...
Can you think of a video-game based live action movie or series that was actually good? I'm seriously asking.

People typically cite something like Mortal Kombat 1 as an enjoyable video game-based live action movie, even though hardly resembled the source material. Even I'll raise my hand on that one.

But besides that, I can't recall one live action adaptation that clicked with me personally.





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"Re(2):Incoming Chinese KoF series?" , posted Sun 10 Jan 11:49post reply

quote:
Can't be worse than the Gorden Chan movie, can it?...Can you think of a video-game based live action movie or series that was actually good? I'm seriously asking.

People typically cite something like Mortal Kombat 1 as an enjoyable video game-based live action movie, even though hardly resembled the source material. Even I'll raise my hand on that one.

But besides that, I can't recall one live action adaptation that clicked with me personally.


Not sure if they count, but the Web series of Street Fighter is pretty good as well as the web series of Mortal Kombat that spanned 2 seasons. At least, its more like, "finally something done better then its old attempts". I actually like Max Payne film but many others did not. Maybe because I never played the game as much :D





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"Re(2):Incoming Chinese KoF series?" , posted Mon 11 Jan 10:43post reply

quote:
Can't be worse than the Gorden Chan movie, can it?...Can you think of a video-game based live action movie or series that was actually good? I'm seriously asking.


I remember Silent Hill being passable, although "good" is a stretch. It can only dream of reaching "good" when viewed specifically as a video game adaptation, because that genre has such a horribly low bar. Viewed as a horror film, it might have trouble reaching "mediocre."

How was Gyakuten Saiban? I remember people having hopes for it, but I never saw it myself. I don't even know if it ever came out.


Mind, it is hard to imagine any new KOF film being worse than the Gorden Chan film. I can only hope that the people involved with that project were deliberately trying to ape Street Fighter as a "so bad it's good" film with intentionally terrible casting, intentionally terrible writing, a script written by someone who knew absolutely nothing about the subject matter, etc... (That, quite honestly, is the only way I can see that film's version of Rugal existing. It was so completely wrong on every level that it could only be deliberate. Even someone who knew absolutely nothing about Rugal would have created a more accurate version than that film delivered. I can only see it as a deliberate attempt to recreate the magic of Raul Julia as M.Bison, performed by people who should never again be let near the film creation process.)





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"Re(3):Incoming Chinese KoF series?" , posted Mon 11 Jan 12:14:post reply

KOF doesn't suffer quite as much as SF does when it comes to its characters being put into a setting outside of the ring, but especially with real people acting the parts it's still quite a stretch.

When the characters aren't fighting, and not fighting for long stretches, it feels "weird" for the characters. When they are fighting constantly, trying to come up with excuses for it over and over again start to wear thin. When we put them into more ordinary clothes around more ordinary people, their iconic appearance which is so strong makes that feel not right. When they're in their iconic appearances going around "ordinarily" dressed people, they feel out of place and weird.

If they're going to make a movie which is necessarily punctuated by lots of individual fights but needs to somehow sell a ton of strongly unique characters, I think they need to adopt a different narrative structure for the story. Whether you want to call it Tarantino-esque or Kurosawa-esque or Waiting For Godot-esque, I think it'd work better if they just put all the characters into a bar and have them drinking together as the overarching story conceit, in which each person could recount a vignette and the other characters could either laugh at it or toast it or be embarrassed about it or tell them they are full of shi* and how that isn't how it went down. The KOF/SF characters are a bunch who have been around each other for over two decades, and trying to squeeze all of them inside a wholly linear story makes for a cumbersome experience. You could even set the bar years and years ahead of the stories they are recounting, such that they can laugh at their old fashions and rivalries, see how their relationships have changed (or not), and just not stoically be their caricatured selves all the time. Just imagine them recounting that time they totally saved the world, and how it was totally cool, but man Guile just got here and a car drove past him in the rain and now his hair is ruined but it's ok and Chun is buying the next round because she won the bet about how late Guile would be but she she cheated by using the NSA tracker via INTERPOL on her smartphone, meanwhile Hakan is in the men's room having a man to man talk with whoever it is that is about to be married and is having cold feet about commitment, and everybody has to let Ryu pay for a few drinks out of unspoken courtesy even though he's hobo poor and Ken could afford to buy the whole establishment.

Alternatively, what I'm saying is I would totally watch My Dinner With Andore.





[this message was edited by Spoon on Mon 11 Jan 12:15]

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"Re(3):Incoming Chinese KoF series?" , posted Mon 11 Jan 13:32post reply

quote:
I can only hope that the people involved with that project were deliberately trying to ape [the Street Fighter movie]
They did, it was just the wrong one.





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"Re(4):Incoming Chinese KoF series?" , posted Mon 11 Jan 20:28post reply

quote:
I think it'd work better if they just put all the characters into a bar and have them drinking together as the overarching story conceit
So you're saying a movie about the cover art of KOF98?
To be honest, I'm surprised classy Ralf hasn't been made a costume in a KOF MI at least.
Not on the scan: the kyokugen team haggling the buffet because, wow, free food.
Also, Yashiro was trying his luck with absolutely all the chicks at that party. I like how Heidern arrived late and had to change in his party clothes midway through.





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"Re(2):Incoming Chinese KoF series?" , posted Mon 11 Jan 20:41post reply

quote:
Can't be worse than the Gorden Chan movie, can it?...Can you think of a video-game based live action movie or series that was actually good? I'm seriously asking.

People typically cite something like Mortal Kombat 1 as an enjoyable video game-based live action movie, even though hardly resembled the source material. Even I'll raise my hand on that one.

But besides that, I can't recall one live action adaptation that clicked with me personally.



Prince of Persia was alright, and MK had the benefit of its game borrowing from Enter the Dragon, whose structure it could then recycle for its own movie adaptation.


As for KoF's viability to handle non-fight scenes, between Shinkiro's slice-of-life body of work and all the material in official team backstories for each game, drama CDs and story elements from FF and AoF they could get a lot of ground covered - maybe they could borrow Lost's structure of using flashbacks in the middle of episodes to flesh out everyone's circumstances as they move through the tournament - that show had a pretty big cast, and that was a neat way to make it work. And unlike Lost, there's at least some notion of what a (season) ending looks like using the games as templates.

The biggest issue would probably be how they'd handle the passage of time or lack thereof, but between compressing some events (94 and 95, for example, like ReBout did in a way) and hinting at the time-twisting shenanigans of the Ash saga early on could help make it work (say, having a calendar's displayed year change in a background between cuts during some character conversation, without specific attention being brought to it).





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"Re(3):Incoming Chinese KoF series?" , posted Mon 11 Jan 22:33post reply

quote:
How was Gyakuten Saiban? I remember people having hopes for it, but I never saw it myself. I don't even know if it ever came out.



The characters surprisingly looked quite spot-on, but they failed to deliver on impact. The energy you could feel bursting at every reveal or when the tables are turned in the trials wasn't as effective as in the game. Everytime it felt like 'I should be wowed at this point but...'.

I was very pleased to see Shu Takumi's brief cameo when they

Spoiler (Highlight to view) -
win the trial at the end of the movie

End of Spoiler

though, it felt rewarding!





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"Street Fighter Nights" , posted Tue 12 Jan 00:45post reply

quote:
Guile just got here and a car drove past him in the rain and now his hair is ruined but it's ok and Chun is buying the next round because she won the bet about how late Guile would be but she she cheated by using the NSA tracker via INTERPOL on her smartphone, meanwhile Hakan is in the men's room having a man to man talk with whoever it is that is about to be married and is having cold feet about commitment, and everybody has to let Ryu pay for a few drinks out of unspoken courtesy even though he's hobo poor and Ken could afford to buy the whole establishment.

Alternatively, what I'm saying is I would totally watch My Dinner With Andore.
Actually, I would 120% watch this series. While I don't remember what the Street Fighter II V (not 5, vee) series from the 1990's was like, it sadly probably wasn't enough like this.





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"Re(4):Incoming Chinese KoF series?" , posted Tue 12 Jan 01:27post reply

quote:
KOF doesn't suffer quite as much as SF does when it comes to its characters being put into a setting outside of the ring, but especially with real people acting the parts it's still quite a stretch.

When the characters aren't fighting, and not fighting for long stretches, it feels "weird" for the characters. When they are fighting constantly, trying to come up with excuses for it over and over again start to wear thin. When we put them into more ordinary clothes around more ordinary people, their iconic appearance which is so strong makes that feel not right. When they're in their iconic appearances going around "ordinarily" dressed people, they feel out of place and weird.


I think video games have developed an unwarranted reputation for being hard or impossible to adapt into a live film. It isn't the fault of video games that most live action adaptations are awful; it is the fault of Hollywood (and elsewhere) being stuck to certain processes and beliefs that pretty much doom any video game adaptation from the very start.

I remember when Silent Hill was reviewed, some film critics responded to sections of bad writing with pretty much "it was based on a game, so it was to be expected" or "I guess if we knew the source material then that would make more sense". No, bad writing is bad writing regardless.

If a video game film has characters performing some nonsensical actions for no apparent reason, it isn't a nod to video game puzzle design, it is bad scripting. Just like it is bad scripting when the same stuff happens in non-video game films. The same goes for relying on an unbelievable string of coincidences. Or throwing in an over-explanatory info-dump at some point because the script never bothered to explain important information in a more reasonable manner elsewhere.

There is a common excuse that fighting games have no story. Fighting games are just a bunch of people gathering for a tournament, and Hollywood has to create a feature-length story from scratch because it doesn't exist in the source. I've heard this sentiment voiced by various actors and writers. Directors have mentioned it. It comes up when film critics review films.

It just happens to be false.

Most fighting games have too much story, at least for the kind of films that Hollywood wants to produce. In addition to the main storyline featuring the boss and certain major characters, every character has their own story. Some of these stories are thin, little more than hooks, but each is still enough to build a film around. These stories cover a multitude of genres, as well.

Which is where the film industry has a problem. The film industry doesn't want to make a romantic comedy about Mai Shiranui, an espionage thriller about Nina Williams, or a film about Chun-Li avenging her father. (Yes, I remember that Legend of Chun-Li exists.) The film industry wants to make "Street Fighter", "Mortal Kombat", "The King of Fighters, or whatever.

But even then, the film industry doesn't want to make the existing main storylines of a game. It doesn't, for example, want to make the KOF story of Kyo, Iori, and Chizuru uniting to stop Orochi. No, it wants to feature specific characters regardless of their existing stories. So a KOF film can't just be about Kyo, Iori, and Chizuru uniting to stop Orochi. It has to feature Mai as well. And Rugal. And Terry Bogard. Since those characters don't fit together, they get new stories.

Which leads back to the big issues with the film industry that extends far beyond video games... Source material is pretty much the least important element of the Hollywood filmmaking process. Scripts are written and movies are made to established formulas, regardless of the source. Casting can be completely wrong for a multitude of reasons. And there are some really awful writers, along with bad directors and poor actors, in the industry, though the process is so adept at destroying whatever is originally input that any accountability for individual dearths of talent can be largely hidden. And the lower priority a film is, the worse it can get.

Comic books shared a similar Hollywood position for decades. The big differences are that comic books had a few accepted mainstream hits to go with the garbage and schlock, and that Marvel has in recent years shown a largely line-wide success through putting actual concern, effort, and talent into the process. But even now, Sony continues to produce complete garbage while clinging to the Spider-Man license, Fox misfires badly as much as it produces something acceptable with the X-Men license, and DC film-wise has been a trainwreck outside of Batman.





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"Re(5):Chinese KoF series Premiering Q1 2016." , posted Thu 14 Jan 05:13:post reply

quote:
KOF doesn't suffer quite as much as SF does when it comes to its characters being put into a setting outside of the ring, but especially with real people acting the parts it's still quite a stretch.

When the characters aren't fighting, and not fighting for long stretches, it feels "weird" for the characters. When they are fighting constantly, trying to come up with excuses for it over and over again start to wear thin. When we put them into more ordinary clothes around more ordinary people, their iconic appearance which is so strong makes that feel not right. When they're in their iconic appearances going around "ordinarily" dressed people, they feel out of place and weird.

I think video games have developed an unwarranted reputation for being hard or impossible to adapt into a live film. It isn't the fault of video games that most live action adaptations are awful; it is the fault of Hollywood (and elsewhere) being stuck to certain processes and beliefs that pretty much doom any video game adaptation from the very start.

I remember when Silent Hill was reviewed, some film critics responded to sections of bad writing with pretty much "it was based on a game, so it was to be expected" or "I guess if we knew the source material then that would make more sense". No, bad writing is bad writing regardless.

If a video game film has characters performing some nonsensical actions for no apparent reason, it isn't a nod to video game puzzle design, it is bad s

-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --

King of Fighters Animated Adaptation Premiering Q1 2016 on Streaming Services

In other news,
snk-playmore chief samurai shodown part of revived gaming divisions future plans

My bizarre VS. wish list:
Soul Caliber vs Samurai Spirits, by Namco Bandai
Last Blade vs Blaz Blue, By SNK Playmore
Arc Sys vs SNK, by Arc Systems
Garou vs Virtua Fighter, by SNK Playmore
Bangai-0 vs Metal Slug, by Treasure Inc.





Long Live!

[this message was edited by neo0r0chiaku on Thu 14 Jan 05:13]

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"Re(6):Chinese KoF series Premiering Q1 2016." , posted Thu 14 Jan 07:24post reply

quote:
Chinese website Tencent Games reported that Chinese game publisher 37Games' planned animated adaptation of SNK Playmore's The King of Fighters fighting game series is slated to premiere on streaming sites and services sometime in the first quarter of 2016 (April-June)


That doesn't sound right, isn't 1st quarter January to March?...
Even then it was just announced, so this seems a bit too fast to be credible, unless it's been in the pipeline for a long time, for all I think I know about working on animation...





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"Re(7):Chinese KoF series Premiering Q1 2016." , posted Thu 14 Jan 07:48post reply

quote:
That doesn't sound right, isn't 1st quarter January to March?...


Quote says April to June.

Some groups define Q1 as Jan-Mar, while others use it for Apr-Jun.





Professor
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"Ah, so he didn't quit!" , posted Fri 15 Jan 19:28post reply

MISSION ALL OVER !





Neo0r0chiaku
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"Re:Complete Breakdown of rumored list" , posted Sun 17 Jan 07:12post reply

YuKi from the forums of cyberfanatix has compiled and created a very exceptional detailed breakdown of the rumored list.
here
It has quotes from some of our fellow members of the cafe. Maybe we should start our speculations again before the Taiwan show commences! Cafe is getting more attention:)





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"Re(1):Re:Complete Breakdown of rumored list" , posted Sun 17 Jan 09:50post reply

Is it too late to follow up on the supposed list source?

The time frame of the leak is not altogether wrong. Even if SNKP closed their pachislot division, XIV was in development for an undisclosed length of time, probably since that recruitment ad a couple of years ago on the official website. Even now when I look at the CG for the Samurai Spirits pachislot I see some similarities in the modeling, movement, even the choice of music. (As well as our reactions to said modeling, lol)

To say that SNKP might use their pachislot and mobage IPs in KoF isn't terribly far-fetched either. The recent shmupilations interview about '94 reminds us that KoF began with SNK throwing all their IPs into a soup and seeing what floated to the top. And since they haven't added many gaming IPs in the last 5-10 years, why not? I know very little about pachislot development, but I'm sure those IPs took some amount of work to create and maintain, so it'd be a shame to let that go to waste. Instead of promoting them, now KoF becomes a way to preserve them, saving them from the dissolution of the pachinko division.





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"Re(2):Re:Complete Breakdown of rumored list" , posted Sun 17 Jan 10:11post reply

Fun question:
What are some seminal IPs that originated in pachislot? Let's say that we'll also allow IPs that had no real popularity until they were used in pachislot.

I am not engaged with pachislot, so I don't know the answer to this question. But this is true for all kinds of genres that I have never really paid attention to that have never had a mainstream crossover success... unless there are some things I know about that I never knew came from pachislot!





Professor
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"Re(3):Re:Complete Breakdown of rumored list" , posted Sun 17 Jan 12:46:post reply

quote:
Fun question:
What are some seminal IPs that originated in pachislot? Let's say that we'll also allow IPs that had no real popularity until they were used in pachislot.

I am not engaged with pachislot, so I don't know the answer to this question. But this is true for all kinds of genres that I have never really paid attention to that have never had a mainstream crossover success... unless there are some things I know about that I never knew came from pachislot!



If we're just talking about SNK, not much. They have Dragon Gal and Sky Heart, and they're really minor.

If we're talking about Pachislot/Pachinko in general, the biggest example I think is Hammerin' Harry (Daiku no Gen-san). Technically speaking he's originally from a videogame, but his wideknown recognition came from the pachi market. Some other well known franchises would be Koei Tecmo's Rio series, and Daito's Ossu! Banchoseries holy I didn't know there was a budget anime for it.

All in all though, I don't think the pachi market made that many big original IPs. They mostly borrow licenses from anime and games.





[this message was edited by Professor on Sun 17 Jan 12:50]

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"Re(2):Re:Complete Breakdown of rumored list" , posted Sun 17 Jan 23:57post reply

quote:
The time frame of the leak is not altogether wrong. Even if SNKP closed their pachislot division, XIV was in development for an undisclosed length of time, probably since that recruitment ad a couple of years ago on the official website. Even now when I look at the CG for the Samurai Spirits pachislot I see some similarities in the modeling, movement, even the choice of music. (As well as our reactions to said modeling, lol)

That's true, XIV could have been in at least the early phases way back when they were running those dodgy looking CG character pics. Perversely, this makes me want them to use the ugly and odd Terry design they came up with around that time. I'm saying this as a player who always plays the elder Bogard brother but I'm totally hoping Pachi Terry makes it into the next KoF.





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"Re(3):Re:Complete Breakdown of rumored list" , posted Mon 18 Jan 01:35:post reply

Regarding the rumored list, I remembered something a little bit amuzing. Since we're on the talk of Japanese stuff with pachi, may as well mention this as well.

One of the characters in the rumored roster is a "Handicapped Boxer", which I'm not sure how accurate that Chinese-to-English translation was. That character actually became a bit of a subject between Jp fans, reason being that it's extremely taboo to feature handicapped people as a topic in Japan.

I recall how back when Katawa Shoujo was announced, it was a bit of a hot topic since the game probably wouldn't have been able to come out if it were in Japan-- at least not as a commercial product given the risks of various handicap associations making a fuss and bringing the game to a recall. So when the rumored KOF14 list came out, people were scratching their heads over how SNKP plans to pull it off, if the roster turns out to be legit.

I think the fans have too much time in their hands though. If Jojo had N'Doul, it can't be that hard to throw in handicapped characters into videogames.





[this message was edited by Professor on Mon 18 Jan 03:02]

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"Re(4):Re:Complete Breakdown of rumored list" , posted Mon 18 Jan 05:46post reply

quote:
If Jojo had N'Doul, it can't be that hard to throw in handicapped characters into videogames.


Not only N'doul: it has Johnny...
But maybe Jojo is a bit different, because it has a gensaku. If I were an association looking for a fight to pick, I'd rather criticize a videogame (because it's still fair game) than Shûeisha.





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"Re(4):Re:Complete Breakdown of rumored list" , posted Mon 18 Jan 07:31post reply

quote:
Regarding the rumored list, I remembered something a little bit amuzing. Since we're on the talk of Japanese stuff with pachi, may as well mention this as well.

One of the characters in the rumored roster is a "Handicapped Boxer", which I'm not sure how accurate that Chinese-to-English translation was. That character actually became a bit of a subject between Jp fans, reason being that it's extremely taboo to feature handicapped people as a topic in Japan.

I recall how back when Katawa Shoujo was announced, it was a bit of a hot topic since the game probably wouldn't have been able to come out if it were in Japan-- at least not as a commercial product given the risks of various handicap associations making a fuss and bringing the game to a recall. So when the rumored KOF14 list came out, people were scratching their heads over how SNKP plans to pull it off, if the roster turns out to be legit.

I think the fans have too much time in their hands though. If Jojo had N'Doul, it can't be that hard to throw in handicapped characters into videogames.



Is it particular kinds of handicaps that are particularly taboo? It seems like characters that are blind and/or deaf have long been common tropes across the different Japanese entertainment media, and in the western world those certainly count as disabilities.





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"Re(5):Re:Complete Breakdown of rumored list" , posted Mon 18 Jan 13:59post reply

quote:
Regarding the rumored list, I remembered something a little bit amuzing. Since we're on the talk of Japanese stuff with pachi, may as well mention this as well.

One of the characters in the rumored roster is a "Handicapped Boxer", which I'm not sure how accurate that Chinese-to-English translation was. That character actually became a bit of a subject between Jp fans, reason being that it's extremely taboo to feature handicapped people as a topic in Japan.

I recall how back when Katawa Shoujo was announced, it was a bit of a hot topic since the game probably wouldn't have been able to come out if it were in Japan-- at least not as a commercial product given the risks of various handicap associations making a fuss and bringing the game to a recall. So when the rumored KOF14 list came out, people were scratching their heads over how SNKP plans to pull it off, if the roster turns out to be legit.

I think the fans have too much time in their hands though. If Jojo had N'Doul, it can't be that hard to throw in handicapped characters into videogames.


Is it particular kinds of handicaps that are particularly taboo? It seems like characters that are blind and/or deaf have long been common tropes across the different Japanese entertainment media, and in the western world those certainly count as disabilities.



Times have changed indeed... I remember when it was perfectly OK for a Japanese videogame to throw elderly people in wheelchairs out the window of a skyscraper. I feel so old.






A Talking about Japanese History sword in hand

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"Early days of SNK" , posted Tue 19 Jan 03:49post reply

shmplations.com just released another translated article, this time from Toshiyuki Nakai about the early days of SNK - this one covers games like Athena, some work circumstances, and even some bits on using the G-Mantle outfit for promotional events.





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"Benimaru de-Polnareffs for KoF XIV" , posted Wed 27 Jan 17:22post reply

New trailer featuring Robert, Benimaru and K'
Robert appears to have acquired a moustache... he always seemed like more of a goatee. Then again, I think his father had a moustache too.





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"Re(1):Benimaru de-Polnareffs for KoF XIV" , posted Wed 27 Jan 21:28:post reply

quote:
New trailer featuring Robert, Benimaru and K'
Robert appears to have acquired a moustache... he always seemed like more of a goatee. Then again, I think his father had a moustache too.


Uhmmm...I'm very likely to lose any hint of rationality talking about KOF and SNK/SNKP games in general, but I'd still try and give this thread a shot. I'd be hyped for a new KOF even if it had Atari 2600 graphics, so I don't care about the PSX/2/3 tier thing xD Beni and Terry's XDZW models look flashier than XIV models? I acknowledge it to Jade Studio, but I don't care, as long as KOFXIV plays like numbered KOF.

As for the art direction, I find it very alike to Dead or Alive, which is fine to me. As soon as I started playing KOF:MI I thought the same about it. I knew from the beginning KOF was gonna get a DoA-like art direction in case the numbered series was to make the shift from 2D to 3D, so it came to me as no surprise. The only thing I'm really gonna miss is hand drawn official art: while SFV is getting a whole lot of it, that doesn't seem to be the case with KOFXIV. Such a shame.

I wish I could hear more music, because I think we're gonna get a blast of an OST if all the other tracks are on par with that Esaka? remix.

2D gameplay is a huge relief: while I really like the MI spinoffs, I've always hoped the main series didn't shift to a hybrid gameplay. There's this competitive player, Laban, who played the PSE demo a lot and wrote an insane report on the SRK forums. He's a huge OG '98 fan, and he kept comparing XIV to OG '98 with some 2002 (maybe more UM than OG) and XIII elements in said report, except for the floaty jumps. Other PSE goers were satisfied from a gameplay standpoint. So, I'm confident XIV will play great.

I don't care about sales, as long as XIV sells enough to keep SNKP alive and kicking.

EDIT: Dreamcancel is hinting at the Taipei Game Show demo possibly sporting Mandarin voice acting, because it was revealed in the SCET conference that the TpGS demo build will be a Traditional Chinese version. Your thoughts? I find it unlikely, since the Chinese audience have always loved KOF with Japanese voices, but SNKP is under a Chinese juggernaut now...we'll see.





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Wed 27 Jan 21:39]

neo0r0chiaku
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"Re(2):Benimaru de-Polnareffs for KoF XIV" , posted Wed 27 Jan 22:24:post reply

quote:
New trailer featuring Robert, Benimaru and K'
Robert appears to have acquired a moustache... he always seemed like more of a goatee. Then again, I think his father had a moustache too.

Uhmmm...I'm very likely to lose any hint of rationality talking about KOF and SNK/SNKP games in general, but I'd still try and give this thread a shot. I'd be hyped for a new KOF even if it had Atari 2600 graphics, so I don't care about the PSX/2/3 tier thing xD Beni and Terry's XDZW models look flashier than XIV models? I acknowledge it to Jade Studio, but I don't care, as long as KOFXIV plays like numbered KOF.

As for the art direction, I find it very alike to Dead or Alive, which is fine to me. As soon as I started playing KOF:MI I thought the same about it. I knew from the beginning KOF was gonna get a DoA-like art direction in case the numbered series was to make the shift from 2D to 3D, so it came to me as no surprise. The only thing I'm really gonna miss is hand drawn official art: while SFV is getting a whole lot of it, that doesn't seem to be the case with KOFXIV. Such a shame.

I wish I could hear more music, because I think we're gonna get a blast of an OST if all the other tracks are on par with that Esaka? remix.

2D gameplay is a huge relief: while I really like the MI spinoffs, I've always hoped the main series didn't shift to a hybrid game

-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --

The gameplay looks to be more legit for me. I remember when MI was announced, people said the same thing they are saying now,"Forget the graphics and hope for same KOF style gameplay." Deja Vu if you ask me. Its just that you expect that SNKP would have learn by now after MI. As such, fans would expect more and better.
I hope they make good numbers in sales and everyone approves as well. Will be a tough cookie to crack since SFV is being released around the same time. Again, this is Deja Vu from 1994 when Street fighter had only 8+4 characters while KOF released 24 characters. At the moment, SFV has 16 and KOf 50!!! Its the battle of who is the best fighting game company rivalry once more! If this repeats itself, then we may again go through the excitement and era of the 90's fighting game scene for the rest of the 2010's years!





Long Live!

[this message was edited by neo0r0chiaku on Wed 27 Jan 22:28]

kofoguz
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"Re(3):Benimaru de-Polnareffs for KoF XIV" , posted Thu 28 Jan 00:17post reply

I wonder if the alternative costumes would be present? Or classic costume packs DLC for later?





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"Re(4):Benimaru de-Polnareffs for KoF XIV" , posted Thu 28 Jan 00:53post reply

Looking at the game as it stands now I wonder who decided to release those initial videos for XIV. Yes, the game still has so many rough edges you could accidentally cut yourself on it but at least XIV now looks like something which is a far cry from the launch trailer. The SNKP faithful will buy it regardless but here's to hoping those initial images didn't permanently poison the well.

I'm also wondering just how many people in KoF wear leather pants. The percentage seems much higher than the norm. Do they all shop at the same store?





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"Re(5):Benimaru de-Polnareffs for KoF XIV" , posted Thu 28 Jan 20:36:post reply

Rumors to be taken with a pinch of salt - the only other thing in his post history is that he was accurate about SNKP revealing a game at TGS which turned out to be XIV, and the Terry webm he posted then didn't appear to mach anything in the pachislot footage one could find on Youtube, so there's that.

Edit: nevermind - the Terry clip the guy used last time appears to have come from this FF pachinko from a few years ago, not the more recent KoF one.





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[this message was edited by Loona on Thu 28 Jan 22:14]

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"Re(6):Benimaru de-Polnareffs for KoF XIV" , posted Thu 28 Jan 23:03post reply

quote:
Rumor
You're right; it's definitely meant to be taken with a grain of salt.





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"Re(5):Benimaru de-Polnareffs for KoF XIV" , posted Thu 28 Jan 23:36post reply

quote:
Looking at the game as it stands now I wonder who decided to release those initial videos for XIV. Yes, the game still has so many rough edges you could accidentally cut yourself on it but at least XIV now looks like something which is a far cry from the launch trailer. The SNKP faithful will buy it regardless but here's to hoping those initial images didn't permanently poison the well.


I don't know. It still looks like a last-gen console title, but the gradual improvements in the trailers at least has the SNKP faithful talking about how the game is now looking better.

The initial rough state reveals gave fans time to come to terms with the reality of the state of the game, and the game means to show some visible improvement to fans. If SNKP had waited to reveal trailers, then the title might have seen a similar negative backlash, but with less time for fans to come to terms with its state before release.

As for non-fans, I just don't see the game currently being shown to be that visually appealing to a non-SNK/KOF crowd even now.





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"Re(6):Benimaru de-Polnareffs for KoF XIV" , posted Fri 29 Jan 03:17post reply

quote:
As for non-fans, I just don't see the game currently being shown to be that visually appealing to a non-SNK/KOF crowd even now.

I agree, if the game had been shown for the first time in the current state, we would be tearing these visuals into pieces. They only look palatable because we saw their ugly girlfriend some time prior.

I am still extremely worried for the release of the game. SNK doesn't have a history of releasing polished games (proper debug was conducted in a rush, in the last few days, and whatever happened, happened) and I can see it becoming a real problem. The game is huge, and they have barely showed 15% out of it. For a game supposed to be released later this year, it's quite worrying.





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"Re(7):Benimaru de-Polnareffs for KoF XIV" , posted Fri 29 Jan 03:29post reply

quote:
I am still extremely worried for the release of the game. SNK doesn't have a history of releasing polished games (proper debug was conducted in a rush, in the last few days, and whatever happened, happened) and I can see it becoming a real problem. The game is huge, and they have barely showed 15% out of it. For a game supposed to be released later this year, it's quite worrying.

I just hope it doesn't become a KOFXII-like issue where they release this "as-is" in a rush to make the deadline, and then release a polished version with more characters sometime next year. We also had something similar with MvC3 to UMvC3. The complaints are predominantly about the graphics at this point. And if they're not listening to the loudest complaint of them all, the people complaining in question as well as other fans will feel quite a bit of disconcert.





neo0r0chiaku
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"Re(8):Benimaru de-Polnareffs for KoF XIV" , posted Fri 29 Jan 04:33post reply

quote:
I am still extremely worried for the release of the game. SNK doesn't have a history of releasing polished games (proper debug was conducted in a rush, in the last few days, and whatever happened, happened) and I can see it becoming a real problem. The game is huge, and they have barely showed 15% out of it. For a game supposed to be released later this year, it's quite worrying.
I just hope it doesn't become a KOFXII-like issue where they release this "as-is" in a rush to make the deadline, and then release a polished version with more characters sometime next year. We also had something similar with MvC3 to UMvC3. The complaints are predominantly about the graphics at this point. And if they're not listening to the loudest complaint of them all, the people complaining in question as well as other fans will feel quite a bit of disconcert.


A debate among others is did SNK make the right decision with coming out with KOF XII and XIII with the higher than expectation 2-D graphics that everyone in the gaming scene agreed as a masterpiece? Reason for this question is what if they came out with KOFXII (or any other fighting game for that matter) with a 2-D graphics style that was new but nothing extraordinary, just a simple 2-D art style, and focus solely on fighting system, vs mode, and network mode. It could have been a digital release. That way, it will improve as time progresses (DLC, new versions, new releases, other fighting games, etc.). Fans around the world will start returning and will grow. Profit will be generated and return in investment is successful. After that, maybe around this present timeline, release a fighting game masterpiece they originally created with KOFXIII? Maybe it was too early for them to have released KOF XII and XII at the state it was in. It was not ready for the masses and the fan base support was not enough for SNKP. It’s probably why we expect more but they do not have the man power, money, and infrastructure to create a game like that again.





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Mrkarate23
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"Re(8):Benimaru de-Polnareffs for KoF XIV" , posted Fri 29 Jan 12:29post reply

quote:
I am still extremely worried for the release of the game. SNK doesn't have a history of releasing polished games (proper debug was conducted in a rush, in the last few days, and whatever happened, happened) and I can see it becoming a real problem. The game is huge, and they have barely showed 15% out of it. For a game supposed to be released later this year, it's quite worrying.
I just hope it doesn't become a KOFXII-like issue where they release this "as-is" in a rush to make the deadline, and then release a polished version with more characters sometime next year. We also had something similar with MvC3 to UMvC3. The complaints are predominantly about the graphics at this point. And if they're not listening to the loudest complaint of them all, the people complaining in question as well as other fans will feel quite a bit of disconcert.






Snkp knows about the graphics otherwise they would not bother continue to change things, I mean Kyo face has change through out the teaser trailers, lighting has change, and they recently apply some kind of skin shaders.They are doing something but it wont be enough for a lot of people, snkp has to work with what they got.

Are fans and detractors expecting some mega change that makes it look like the competitors before release?

Any of you expecting them to extend development time on a new engine for it to look good?

What are you expecting for the game to suddenly look good?

The producer acknowledge that the team was not experience and shows with how kof looks. I get it its on snkp for not having the tools and the skilled staff needed to have productions values of a fighting ganme by namco, wb or capcom. Snkp mistakes was to go hire anyone they could get and use their own engine. As a result we have kof xiv to show. They probably should have pony up thee cash to contract cyberconnect and ect... the results would have being different.

I honestly want to know. I sound like I am repeating myself unless snkp move development to another engine such as unreal 3 or 4, have the capital, and a skill team to have their vision realize, I just cant see it looking as good as sfv or mkx. Building a game of that caliber is expensive even for capcom other wise street fighter v would have came much later than soon. Even if snkp dropped that kind of money to create a product on par with the competition, they will end up loosing big time.

This game is due or die for their game development, if they cant produce a decent game what was their point of developing kof xiv. Their mobile venture have being doing well for them, maybe they should stick to that since they are out of their league in todays market. With the advent of delaying games and day one patch, cant see why it would make no sense for them to release a broken game out in this day in age.





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"Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Fri 29 Jan 18:42post reply

SNKP had a stage presentation for KOF14 at the Taipei game show today. Needless to say there wasn't any English, so here's coverage for anyone interested.

http://www.mmcafe.com/news/posts/10090.html





Hasukii
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"Re(1):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Fri 29 Jan 19:01post reply

quote:
SNKP had a stage presentation for KOF14 at the Taipei game show today. Needless to say there wasn't any English, so here's coverage for anyone interested.

http://www.mmcafe.com/news/posts/10090.html



無需追加DL looks like no more / no need download content to me





Who did this to these dogs ???

Professor
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"Re(2):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Fri 29 Jan 19:08post reply

quote:
SNKP had a stage presentation for KOF14 at the Taipei game show today. Needless to say there wasn't any English, so here's coverage for anyone interested.

http://www.mmcafe.com/news/posts/10090.html


無需追加DL looks like no more / no need download content to me



I realized that too and fixed it! Thanks for the heads up.





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"Re(1):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Fri 29 Jan 19:30post reply

quote:
SNKP had a stage presentation for KOF14 at the Taipei game show today. Needless to say there wasn't any English, so here's coverage for anyone interested.

http://www.mmcafe.com/news/posts/10090.html



Gatoray posted the presentation on Youtube, with its simultaneous English translation.





...!!

Professor
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"Re(2):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Fri 29 Jan 20:03post reply

quote:
SNKP had a stage presentation for KOF14 at the Taipei game show today. Needless to say there wasn't any English, so here's coverage for anyone interested.

http://www.mmcafe.com/news/posts/10090.html


Gatoray posted the presentation on Youtube, with its simultaneous English translation.



I didn't know there was a simultaneous translation. Not to bang on the translater, but holy cripes that's bad translations. Missing out on details is acceptable but the translator is simply mistranslating because she's not getting the context, lol.





Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(1):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Fri 29 Jan 22:09:post reply

quote:
SNKP had a stage presentation for KOF14 at the Taipei game show today. Needless to say there wasn't any English, so here's coverage for anyone interested.

http://www.mmcafe.com/news/posts/10090.html



Great English summary, I really appreciate it.

There are those two faces in one of the slides...the left one looks like Kyo with his previous hairstyle to me, the right one is so blurry I can't even take a wild guess (Mature in her XII suit maybe?)

Online...this word strikes fear in my heart, way more than "graphics". I know a Steam version with good netcode is to be taken for granted (sort of) about a year later its PS4 release -kinda like GGXrd -Sign--, but since KOFXIV looks destined to stay PS4 only for a while, I'd rather see it get a top notch netcode since its PS4 release...but well, I know hoping for a good -let alone great- netcode in KOFXIV on PS4 is a dream in a dream.

Does any of you have enough knowledge of game development economy to tell me if it's true that licensing a game engine is more expensive than building your own? Sadly, saying SNKP is on a tight budget is an euphemism I guess...





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Fri 29 Jan 22:20]

Loona
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"Re(2):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Sat 30 Jan 01:27post reply

Oda posted about the game's new reveals at the official PlayStation blog





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neo0r0chiaku
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"Re(3):Shoryuken interview with Oda" , posted Sun 31 Jan 14:48post reply

quote:
Oda posted about the game's new reveals at the official PlayStation blog



More info from ODA during an interview with Shoryuken. Here





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Lord SNK
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"Re(4):KOF14 devs acqknowledge visual complain" , posted Mon 1 Feb 00:34post reply

Thanks Professor for the translation of the new interview.
(Also I'd like to report a small typo here:
quote:
- Reconfirming what he said numersou times, Oda stated that VIX will feature a new storyline.

)

So they know that the graphics sucks and they are working on polishing it, a miracle can still happen, right?

But the most interesting thing is that he mentions "new characters and SNK characters"!
Are they adding other chararaters that aren't from FF/AOF?





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"Re(5):KOF14 devs acqknowledge visual complain" , posted Mon 1 Feb 01:50post reply

quote:
So they know that the graphics sucks and they are working on polishing it, a miracle can still happen, right?



Of course not, like hell. In order for the game to really improve how it looks, they should get rid of the current graphic engine, and do a new one from scratch (and by another staff, else it will end close to what we have).

What they are actually doing is making patches and fixes on top of the current graphic engine so that "it looks better", but that "it looks better" it's an euphemism rather than an statement.






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"Re(2):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Mon 1 Feb 14:04post reply

quote:

Does any of you have enough knowledge of game development economy to tell me if it's true that licensing a game engine is more expensive than building your own? Sadly, saying SNKP is on a tight budget is an euphemism I guess...



Generally licensing an engine these days is much cheaper than building your own.

Anyone/Any company who makes less than $100,000/year can use Unity for free. You are free to develop and sell your games as you please. All that they require for the free version is that every game begins with a splash screen that says "made with Unity" (which these days telegraphs that you are using the free version and wouldn't look good for a high profile company).

Once you make more than $100,000/year you must get the pro version which costs a one time $1500 fee and then an additional $1500 each to export to iOS or Android devices. So if you're making a mobile game you're looking at spending $4,500 (Alternatively you can pay $75/month per Mobile device license too)

Developing your own engine internally will cost a lot more than $4,500 worth of time to a group of developers.

I'm not familiar with Unreal, but I believe they also a free model in addition to the pro license. I think there's a free version for students, and if you want to sell your game there's a small monthly fee. However I've heard they might also take a percentage of your games profits, which may be unappealing to a bigger developer.

In any case, the amount of time you save using Unity or Unreal will generally way outweigh the time it takes to develop an engine from scratch. However, a company might still want to develop their own engine because:

1) There are specific things they need their engine to do that would be more difficult to implement with Unity or Unreal

2) They want to develop their own engine to use internally across multiple titles, thereby saving money in the long run (plus all the benefits of the above)

3) If Unreal requires revenue sharing (which I'm not sure of, just something I've heard in passing) and you expect your game to sell mega millions, you might not want to share such a large cut

I'm not a programmer though, so I'm sure Spoon and other folks can explain this way better than I could.






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nobinobita
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"Re(6):KOF14 devs acqknowledge visual complain" , posted Mon 1 Feb 14:15post reply

quote:
So they know that the graphics sucks and they are working on polishing it, a miracle can still happen, right?


Of course not, like hell. In order for the game to really improve how it looks, they should get rid of the current graphic engine, and do a new one from scratch (and by another staff, else it will end close to what we have).

What they are actually doing is making patches and fixes on top of the current graphic engine so that "it looks better", but that "it looks better" it's an euphemism rather than an statement.



When a game looks bad, it's never cos of the graphics engine, but how a developer is using it.

KOF looks bad because of the plasticky lighting, the more generic overall look of the characters and the sub par poses.

Just like Street Fighter V with its much superior technology looks horrific because of poor art direction, terrible character design choices, generic lighting full of gaudy Instagram-like filters, and poor poses.

Games have looked beautiful since at least the NES era. You can't blame the engine, just poor execution (which is often the result of poor planning, being rushed, or lots of corporate meddling etc, not necessarily cos the artists aren't capable--though that's often the case too!)






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Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(3):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Mon 1 Feb 17:25post reply

quote:

Does any of you have enough knowledge of game development economy to tell me if it's true that licensing a game engine is more expensive than building your own? Sadly, saying SNKP is on a tight budget is an euphemism I guess...


Generally licensing an engine these days is much cheaper than building your own.

Anyone/Any company who makes less than $100,000/year can use Unity for free. You are free to develop and sell your games as you please. All that they require for the free version is that every game begins with a splash screen that says "made with Unity" (which these days telegraphs that you are using the free version and wouldn't look good for a high profile company).

Once you make more than $100,000/year you must get the pro version which costs a one time $1500 fee and then an additional $1500 each to export to iOS or Android devices. So if you're making a mobile game you're looking at spending $4,500 (Alternatively you can pay $75/month per Mobile device license too)

Developing your own engine internally will cost a lot more than $4,500 worth of time to a group of developers.

I'm not familiar with Unreal, but I believe they also a free model in addition to the pro license. I think there's a free version for students, and if you want to sell your game there's a small monthly fee. However I've heard they might also take a percentage of your games profits, which may be unappealing to a bigger developer.

In any case, the amount of time you save u

-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --


Being a long time lurker, I knew your lenghty, interesting insights about video game art and industry, but receiving one of them as an answer is a pleasant surprise. Thank you!!

Besides remembering how SNK(P) has never been totally reasonable in terms of development and marketing choices -making the HNG64 a 3D system? Whatever...-, the only scenario I can think of is that SNKP is dead sure about selling a ton copies of KOFXIV in China -I've learned not to believe media stereotypes, but I've never heard of the Chinese as a population who can lightheartedly spend all the money required for a current gen console and a brand new game on day one- and wanna take advantage of this revenue to develop new 3D titles in other franchises, as Oda hinted in the SRK interview. Hence the decision of building their own engine instead of licensing UE. Time will tell...if most characters only have their "basic moves", it's a long road before KOFXIV is released.





Ore no...kachi da!!

Lord SNK
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"Re(7):KOF14 devs acqknowledge visual complain" , posted Tue 2 Feb 04:27post reply

quote:

Of course not, like hell. In order for the game to really improve how it looks, they should get rid of the current graphic engine, and do a new one from scratch (and by another staff, else it will end close to what we have).

What they are actually doing is making patches and fixes on top of the current graphic engine so that "it looks better", but that "it looks better" it's an euphemism rather than an statement.



quote:

When a game looks bad, it's never cos of the graphics engine, but how a developer is using it.

KOF looks bad because of the plasticky lighting, the more generic overall look of the characters and the sub par poses.

Just like Street Fighter V with its much superior technology looks horrific because of poor art direction, terrible character design choices, generic lighting full of gaudy Instagram-like filters, and poor poses.

Games have looked beautiful since at least the NES era. You can't blame the engine, just poor execution (which is often the result of poor planning, being rushed, or lots of corporate meddling etc, not necessarily cos the artists aren't capable--though that's often the case too!)



Nobinobita, I remember your post some times ago with the analysis of the trailer, Kyo poses, etc.

I know that it's almost impossible that the game could change drastically if it's really to be released in the next months, but a man can still dream
(that's why I said "miracle")





Professor
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"Re(5):KOF14 devs acqknowledge visual complain" , posted Tue 2 Feb 04:35post reply

quote:
Thanks Professor for the translation of the new interview.
(Also I'd like to report a small typo here:
- Reconfirming what he said numersou times, Oda stated that VIX will feature a new storyline.
)


Ah typos! Fixed, thanks!





neo0r0chiaku
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"Re(5):KOF14 devs acqknowledge visual complain" , posted Tue 2 Feb 04:47post reply

quote:
Thanks Professor for the translation of the new interview.
(Also I'd like to report a small typo here:
- Reconfirming what he said numersou times, Oda stated that VIX will feature a new storyline.
)

So they know that the graphics sucks and they are working on polishing it, a miracle can still happen, right?

But the most interesting thing is that he mentions "new characters and SNK characters"!
Are they adding other chararaters that aren't from FF/AOF?


If that is the case, it makes me wonder that we will not see another Neo-Geo Battle Coliseum. XIV would be that and KOF in a mixed bag.
Maybe the miracle can be that SS, Garou, and LB will be XIII graphics and gameplay. Only if what he says is true about other franchises are not going fully 3-D and XIV backlash on graphics really goes sour.





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"Re(3):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Tue 2 Feb 10:28post reply

quote:
I'm not familiar with Unreal, but I believe they also a free model in addition to the pro license. I think there's a free version for students, and if you want to sell your game there's a small monthly fee. However I've heard they might also take a percentage of your games profits, which may be unappealing to a bigger developer.


Unreal Engine 4's standard model is a quarterly fee, which is 5% of the gross after the first $3000 that quarter. Epic says it is willing to negotiate other terms, if a company would prefer an upfront fee instead of paying royalties.

Unity's Free Edition isn't really a legal option for most businesses, as the free version's license restricts use for organizations that gross over $100,000 a year or has a budget of over $100,000 a year. There are also apparently restrictions on sharing development between Free and Paid licensed copies. (I know at least one group in the past admitted to buying a single paid license for its benefits while having others work using free license copies.)

For serious game development, Unity may be easier to get going with, but it also potentially brings some performance issues to the table. Unity's ease of use comes with the cost of it being easy to do things in really inefficient ways, until/unless you learn a better way to do it. Unity can also have performance and graphics issues with integrated graphics solutions (Intel HD) and some laptop graphics cards, beyond what people might expect.





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"Re(4):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Tue 2 Feb 10:31:post reply

quote:
I'm not familiar with Unreal, but I believe they also a free model in addition to the pro license. I think there's a free version for students, and if you want to sell your game there's a small monthly fee. However I've heard they might also take a percentage of your games profits, which may be unappealing to a bigger developer.


Unreal Engine 4's standard model is a quarterly fee, which is 5% of the gross after the first $3000 that quarter. Epic says it is willing to negotiate other terms, if a company would prefer an upfront fee instead of paying royalties.

Unity's Free Edition isn't really a legal option for most businesses, as the free version's license restricts use for organizations that gross over $100,000 a year or has a budget of over $100,000 a year. There are also apparently restrictions on sharing development between Free and Paid licensed copies. (I know at least one group in the past admitted to buying a single paid license for its benefits while having others work using free license copies.)

For serious game development, Unity may be easier to get going with, but it also potentially brings some performance issues to the table. Unity's ease of use comes with the cost of it being easy to do things in really inefficient ways, until/unless you learn a better way to do it. Unity can also have performance and graphics issues with integrated graphics solutions (Intel HD) and some laptop graphics cards, beyond what people might expect.

I'm fairly certain both Unreal and Unity had extra costs in the past for supporting console development, but I've no idea what their arrangements are these days.





[this message was edited by Baines on Tue 2 Feb 11:48]

Spoon
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"Re(3):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Tue 2 Feb 10:45post reply

quote:

engine costs




If you are, say, Ubisoft, and you have a really particular engine need (open world game with high-end rendering capable of handling large crowds of AI entities inside a 3D environment that however complex is mostly static) upon which you will be building a multi-game franchise property, it can make sense to develop your own engine. Making an engine for AAA content is EXTREMELY expensive. It is expensive along multiple dimensions. It costs time and money to acquire a vast amount of very smart domain experts, it costs time and production expertise to identify exactly what it is that the product needs that merits the creation of this engine, it costs a lot of time and money to build the engine, and while the engine is being built NOBODY CAN ACTUALLY MAKE REAL STUFF WITH IT. That last part is really huge. You could have genius designers on your team that are not actually able to do anything meaningful on it for years while its being made.

EA has largely unified their entire games business under Frostbite. Their sports games use it, their TPS/FPS games use it, and RTS that was being planned used it, etc. Ubisoft has more than one in-house engine. Konami (hahahaha) has FOX Engine, which was intended to serve as their new engine for their Pro Evo Soccer franchise, Metal Gear, and whatever else... except that I don't even know how much longer they'll be making PES for, let alone any kind of non-mobile game.

Unity and Unreal have a number of differences and advantages/disadvantages.

Unreal has a much more open license: even at the free/nobody/student level, you have source code access to the engine. That's amazing and honestly a serious selling point. Unity absolutely does not have this for the free user, and some key technological components of Unity are not on the level of some other engines out there. Unity's networking architecture is largely sealed off from the user, and was not very good but has been overhauled recently. Unity's character animation module is also sealed off, and sophisticated animation blending on it is kinda hacky to build, as well as being a clumsy tool with regards to interrogating its state. Unity does not have a very good built-in shader/material creation tool, so everybody who wants something more sophisticated than the simplest of the simplest stuff for 3D objects gets Substance Designer. And so on.

All of that sounds pretty crappy, but what Unity does have is a Component architecture that is really quite easy to learn (and easy to abuse). If you've never used a game engine before, Unity is certainly the easier one to get into compared to Unreal. Unreal has a long history of being built for online games unlike Unity, so Unreal's architecture is better set up for that.

Synchronized online play for a complicated game with a lot of users, by the way, is an incredibly expensive feature. By "expensive" I mean it has substantial design costs, extremely substantial engineering costs, and substantial art costs.

Great looking games are absolutely possible with both engines, but as nobi says, design has to meet the challenge of the constraints. One of the fundamental problems with how KOFXIV looks right now is a manifold problem of character modelling, character texturing, character posing, and character shading. That sounds like everything! But it's got particulars to it: they are using a simple lighting model (this is not a crime! Not everything in the world has to use physically-based/accurate rendering!) on characters with little differentiation in how the shading is handled on the clothing and the hair, with the shading on both dialed to a fairly high specularity value. The result of that is that the hair and clothes look like they are made of the same stuff, and that stuff is plastic/vinyl. Now, vinyl pants might be totally okay for Iori or Benimaru, but vinyl EVERYTHING including their hair makes them look homogeneous. PS2-era onwards, hair having a very distinct shading model from the rest of the characters is commonplace. Whether or not that shading is good, at the very least it creates differentiation.

In older 3D games (think PSX), specularity was dialed down or set to zero on many things, and the effect was achieved through careful texture painting. Some games had contrivances to help this. Good example: House of the Dead 1 has a first boss which is a big armoured dude in a room featuring an enormous overhead skylight. The contrivance of him always facing the camera and always being in the middle of the room allowed them to paint his textures in such a way that it looked like he was brightly lit overhead, with prominent highlight/blowout and sharply defined shadow edge. Take a look at this video. He creates a bold, dramatic figure that has a look clearly defined by the lighting suggested by his environment in a game that has absolutely primitive lighting technology. This is the kind of design effort that is more than just "is this an appealingly-modelled character model" or "is this a well-painted texture". The issue of pose choices we've been over lots of times, and while nobi has plenty of misgivings over SF4/5, the complexity and uniquely customized rigs enable them to make characters move and pose in ways that are very distinct from each other. Even if not all their poses/animations are good, they are at least distinct. This isn't always possible, though, and with SNK's goal of releasing 50 characters on launch, having 50 highly complex and uniquely rigged characters would probably be asking for way too much. But if they are going to try to maximize the value they are getting from what rigs they have, then they need to look deeper into how they design the motions for them so that they have good snap.

nobi have you played Fire Emblem Awakening or watched its combat animations?. The combat animations in that game are of course strongly inspired by the superb GBA sprites, but the snappy timing they achieve in recreating those animations in 3D feels really good. This is another topic we've gone over before, but it's quite worth examining in the era of 60fps HD 3D games. So far the best explanation of this I have seen anywhere is in Shirobako.


Wow, that's a lot of text!





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"Re(5):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Tue 2 Feb 22:20post reply

Apparently Akihiko Ureshino is not involved in XIV's story, or at least development.

AFAIK he's been involved with the games since 1996, and it's fairly common for him to post characters and outfits from all sorts of SNK series and artworks - I wonder if whomever will take up lore duties will be able to measure up to his work. On one hand the new Chinese bosses want a "Marvel system" where a lot of lore and history to draw from is valuable, but on the other hand a lot of the press and talk about the games often focuses on gameplay and disregards the story...





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Professor
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"Re(6):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Wed 3 Feb 00:32post reply

quote:
Apparently Akihiko Ureshino is not involved in XIV's story, or at least development.

AFAIK he's been involved with the games since 1996, and it's fairly common for him to post characters and outfits from all sorts of SNK series and artworks - I wonder if whomever will take up lore duties will be able to measure up to his work. On one hand the new Chinese bosses want a "Marvel system" where a lot of lore and history to draw from is valuable, but on the other hand a lot of the press and talk about the games often focuses on gameplay and disregards the story...



Thanks, I've frontpaged this.

On a different note if 4 characters get unveiled per month it'll be around October that we'll know the full lineup lol.





nobinobita
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"Re(4):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Wed 3 Feb 00:41:post reply

quote:

engine costs



If you are, say, Ubisoft, and you have a really particular engine need (open world game with high-end rendering capable of handling large crowds of AI entities inside a 3D environment that however complex is mostly static) upon which you will be building a multi-game franchise property, it can make sense to develop your own engine. Making an engine for AAA content is EXTREMELY expensive. It is expensive along multiple dimensions. It costs time and money to acquire a vast amount of very smart domain experts, it costs time and production expertise to identify exactly what it is that the product needs that merits the creation of this engine, it costs a lot of time and money to build the engine, and while the engine is being built NOBODY CAN ACTUALLY MAKE REAL STUFF WITH IT. That last part is really huge. You could have genius designers on your team that are not actually able to do anything meaningful on it for years while its being made.

EA has largely unified their entire games business under Frostbite. Their sports games use it, their TPS/FPS games use it, and RTS that was being planned used it, etc. Ubisoft has more than one in-house engine. Konami (hahahaha) has FOX Engine, which was intended to serve as their new engine for their Pro Evo Soccer franchise, Metal Gear, and whatever else... except that I don't even know how much longer they'll be making PES for, let alone any kind of non-mobile game.

Unity and Unreal have a numbe

-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --


Thanks for that great explanation! I wouldn't be able to make games without the existence of Unity :D

I don't have any experience with Fire Emblem. I always enjoyed the sprites in the older games, and I've been a longtime fan of Yusuke Kozaki (even since he was just a humble amateur artist who went by KYMG!)

That clip from Shirabako is great! Really really good explanation. It's funny, the older I get the less I care about high frame rates. Like, I've been animating exclusively in SPINE for the last year (its a GREAT program!) so when its exported to the game engine, it can go as high as 60fps. But i honestly just prefer how it looks at lower frame rates. There's a punchiness to figuring out how to make stuff look awesome at 8fps that's totally lost with super smooth tweens.
quote:

In older 3D games (think PSX), specularity was dialed down or set to zero on many things, and the effect was achieved through careful texture painting. Some games had contrivances to help this. Good example: House of the Dead 1 has a first boss which is a big armoured dude in a room featuring an enormous overhead skylight. The contrivance of him always facing the camera and always being in the middle of the room allowed them to paint his textures in such a way that it looked like he was brightly lit overhead, with prominent highlight/blowout and sharply defined shadow edge.


YO. Have we talked about this before? Cos this is one of those things I like to get on a soap box about. Stylized 3d looks SO MUCH BETTER when you don't rely on realtime lighting! Just use local colors!

It's the reason why Megaman Legends has aged better than just about any other 3d PSOne game! There isn't any cheap/fake/distracting lighting. Just nice, flat colors that let you focus on the exact shapes the artists intend for you to see.

Ever since I started making mobile games in 2007 I've told all my clients "you know this game will look so much better if you turn off the lighting engine" But they never listened! Thankfully it's common practice now though.

Look at how great these new games look!
https://twitter.com/FlorianVltmn/status/693229052484788224

It's so clean people often mistake it for cel shading haha.

You can get awesome results with painterly textures too. Like Remember Usavich?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kGI-Ealzs84

Very very subtle lighting, the textures do all the work, giving it a hand made feel. I think this will be a new trend in Indie games in the near future. Basically just PS2 graphics but in hi-def haha.

**I should note that in alot of the examples I've posted there IS lighting, its just suuuuper subtle. Very well done!






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[this message was edited by nobinobita on Wed 3 Feb 01:58]

Izek
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"Re(7):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Wed 3 Feb 01:02post reply

quote:
Thanks, I've frontpaged this.

On a different note if 4 characters get unveiled per month it'll be around October that we'll know the full lineup lol.



That roster size lol. I know people are hating on the game's visuals but I'm too busy being excited for the ginormous character count and the super solid looking gameplay. Really liking what they are doing with the system mechanics.

Oh and it feels so good to come to MMCafe and see the front page updated with new news all the time now :)





Just a Person
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"Re(8):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Wed 3 Feb 03:15post reply

quote:
Thanks, I've frontpaged this.

On a different note if 4 characters get unveiled per month it'll be around October that we'll know the full lineup lol.


That roster size lol. I know people are hating on the game's visuals but I'm too busy being excited for the ginormous character count and the super solid looking gameplay. Really liking what they are doing with the system mechanics.

Oh and it feels so good to come to MMCafe and see the front page updated with new news all the time now :)



I don't even think XIV looks as bad as many people say. Sure, it's not the best-looking fighting game from nowadays, but it looks okay in motion. And with 50 characters in its roster, things look promising.

My only complaint about it is the way some characters look (not in terms of graphics, but in terms of design). But it's nothing that can't be fixed with alternate outfits, I guess (and hope).





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"Re(9):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Wed 3 Feb 04:24post reply

quote:
Thanks, I've frontpaged this.

On a different note if 4 characters get unveiled per month it'll be around October that we'll know the full lineup lol.


That roster size lol. I know people are hating on the game's visuals but I'm too busy being excited for the ginormous character count and the super solid looking gameplay. Really liking what they are doing with the system mechanics.

Oh and it feels so good to come to MMCafe and see the front page updated with new news all the time now :)


I don't even think XIV looks as bad as many people say. Sure, it's not the best-looking fighting game from nowadays, but it looks okay in motion. And with 50 characters in its roster, things look promising.

My only complaint about it is the way some characters look (not in terms of graphics, but in terms of design). But it's nothing that can't be fixed with alternate outfits, I guess (and hope).



DLC for buff Kyo would be hilarious.





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"Re(9):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Wed 3 Feb 12:46post reply

quote:
My only complaint about it is the way some characters look (not in terms of graphics, but in terms of design). But it's nothing that can't be fixed with alternate outfits, I guess (and hope).

I wouldn't even be angry if the alt. outfits were paid DLC, personally. Obviously, some people will be bitter, but it's cosmetics and I follow a Harada philosophy on that. And maybe I'm alone on this, but for the love of god, please don't make the alts as ridiculous as MI. You might as well turn those designs into separate characters.





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"Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 4 Feb 19:30post reply

quote:
DLC for buff Kyo would be hilarious.



Not to mention alternate muscle proportions for the likes of Ralf, after the Xi to XII clash...


In unrelated news, there's a Kickstarter for a supposed Fatal Fury fan film, but it feels odd on multiple accounts:
* the first reference they make in the video isn't even to the games, it's to the animation
* the description at the same time mentions Fatal Fury 2 and the "revenge for Jeff" plot point from the original game, which doesn't really add up
* according to their site they cast a(n anime) Krauser, but no Geese, which kinda misses the point
* the Krauser in question not only looks too young, the poster art gives him a glowing red eye a la KoF Rugal...
* their Terry looks more like an Andy - which apparently isn't cast,but of course they tossed in a Mai front and center in the poster
* speaking of Mai, their KS video on Youtube is titled in a doubly misleading way, calling itself "Mai Shiranui in Real Life (New KOF 2016)"...
* it doesn't help that most of the video and blurb is mostly them mentioning Fatal Fury and terry a lot while asking for money

It all feels very dodgy... on the other hand, who the hell tries to reach a large audience by promising the public something related to Fatal Fury?...

At this point I feel like these attempts in Spanish have a lot more love for the source material put into them, clumsy and low budget as they are...





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Professor
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"Re(2):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 4 Feb 20:16post reply

quote:
In unrelated news, there's a Kickstarter for a supposed Fatal Fury fan film, but it feels odd on multiple accounts:


This is interesting-- I'll frontpage it thanks. As far as the project's legitimacy goes I think it's genuine, though some things in the project are just plain odd.

On a side note, I'm tempted to make the pun that the actor's name for Terry is Jeff.





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"Re(4):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 4 Feb 21:17post reply

quote:
Spoon's insanely long -but interesting- discussion about 3D engines and art

The praise I gave nobi the other day is for you as well, of course. Such an educational post. And written in a way that people illiterate in 3D game design -like me LOL- can understand without a hitch.

quote:
I wouldn't even be angry if the alt. outfits were paid DLC, personally. Obviously, some people will be bitter, but it's cosmetics and I follow a Harada philosophy on that. And maybe I'm alone on this, but for the love of god, please don't make the alts as ridiculous as MI. You might as well turn those designs into separate characters.



I agree. I had a little of a bitter history with costume DLC: I immediately bought the whole first wave of DLC costumes for vanilla SFIV and DoA5, cause I was sure for some reason that those were gonna be the only DLC costumes ever...man was I wrong. I stopped buying them at once.

After that, I made my mind to only buy DLC that add to the gameplay -ie. characters...I'll be crazy enough to buy the DLC chars for SFxT one day-, but the only cosmetic DLC I'd actually buy are those for my favorite character -say, Kyo in KOF, Ken in SF, Hitomi in DoA- and those that add some gimmick to the game, like DoA5LR's destroyable outfits LOL xD DLC music is something I wanna think about on a per-game basis, I still haven't bought any for my games as of now...





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shindekudasai
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"Re(5):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 4 Feb 23:20post reply

quote:

After that, I made my mind to only buy DLC that add to the gameplay -ie. characters...I'll be crazy enough to buy the DLC chars for SFxT one day-, but the only cosmetic DLC I'd actually buy are those for my favorite character -say, Kyo in KOF, Ken in SF, Hitomi in DoA- and those that add some gimmick to the game, like DoA5LR's destroyable outfits LOL xD DLC music is something I wanna think about on a per-game basis, I still haven't bought any for my games as of now...



I agree in theory, but in some cases I'm compelled to get everything just because I want to support the continued production for the game (as well as enjoying the hell out of the added gameplay elements). Case in point, I grabbed the last batch of Smash Bros DLC last night and I am absolutely thrilled to add Knuckles to the cast, even if it's just a costume, because of all the effort that went into supporting a game I love for over a year with NEW - not held back - content.

For KOF though, we'll see how it goes. I don't think I would want to buy a bunch of outfits at Maximum Impact levels of ridiculousness, but I would absolutely grab classic outfits or character tributes.





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"Re(6):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Fri 5 Feb 05:01post reply

quote:
I agree in theory, but in some cases I'm compelled to get everything just because I want to support the continued production for the game (as well as enjoying the hell out of the added gameplay elements). Case in point, I grabbed the last batch of Smash Bros DLC last night and I am absolutely thrilled to add Knuckles to the cast, even if it's just a costume, because of all the effort that went into supporting a game I love for over a year with NEW - not held back - content.

For KOF though, we'll see how it goes. I don't think I would want to buy a bunch of outfits at Maximum Impact levels of ridiculousness, but I would absolutely grab classic outfits or character tributes.



Will to support a developer is something I wasn't thinking about when writing that post, but it happens to me too sometimes...I bought the Steam KOF Triple Pack although I don't have any access to Windows right now xD (long, long story...)





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shindekudasai
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"Re(7):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Fri 5 Feb 06:36post reply

quote:
I bought the Steam KOF Triple Pack although I don't have any access to Windows right now xD (long, long story...)



I know that feel. I was without a PC from 2012 to 2015 , bought XIII on Humble Bundle long after it came out and long before I'd be able to play it. Still haven't been able to touch XII and on the fence about going through the hassle of buying a PS3 to play the few games I want that I can't get on Steam. I feel like I'm always playing catch-up to what everyone else is talking about here!





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"Re(2):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Sat 6 Feb 00:27post reply

Hello fighters. I just registered today but I'm a lurker on this forum.

http://i.imgur.com/Dem5JWz.png [Image Attached]

Maybe I'll support the upcoming Fatal Fury fan film.





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"Re(3):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Sat 6 Feb 03:14post reply

quote:
Hello fighters. I just registered today but I'm a lurker on this forum. Maybe I'll support the upcoming Fatal Fury fan film.



Hello SideEffect, and welcome to the BBS!
It's interesting to see that KOFXIV's producer Oda is giving his thumbs up--I'm sure that he's happy that the series he's worked on is getting a fan film.





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"Re(3):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Sat 6 Feb 03:35post reply

quote:
http://i.imgur.com/Dem5JWz.png [Image Attached]
Maybe I'll support the upcoming Fatal Fury fan film.

Sounds cool. On the other hand, SNKPlaymore is notorious for sending those lawyers out, even if Oda himself seems to endorse it.





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"Steam sale on SNKPlaymore games until 2/12" , posted Tue 9 Feb 08:57post reply

quote:

Will to support a developer is something I wasn't thinking about when writing that post, but it happens to me too sometimes...I bought the Steam KOF Triple Pack although I don't have any access to Windows right now xD (long, long story...)



Speaking of the Triple Pack, SNKplaymore games are on sale on Steam

Triple Pack is $6.99

Metal Slug Bundle(1,3,X) for $3.99

[url=http://store.steampowered.com/search/?publisher=SNK Playmore]SNKPlaymore Publisher Page

Where you can also get discounts on all the Metal Slug Defense stuff.





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"The Mystery of the F-40 Ferrari" , posted Tue 9 Feb 09:30post reply

I was overviewing MMCafe for layout glitches etc when I realized something via the Southtown Map.

- Art of Fighting 1 takes place in 1978, AOF2 in 1979.
- Robert drives a Ferrari F-40.
- That car didn't exist until a decade later in 1987.

I can only assume that the devs didn't think about props when they were fiddling around with the story's timeline.





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"Re(1):The Mystery of the F-40 Ferrari" , posted Tue 9 Feb 19:42post reply

quote:
I was overviewing MMCafe for layout glitches etc when I realized something via the Southtown Map.

- Art of Fighting 1 takes place in 1978, AOF2 in 1979.
- Robert drives a Ferrari F-40.
- That car didn't exist until a decade later in 1987.

I can only assume that the devs didn't think about props when they were fiddling around with the story's timeline.



Saiki/Ash-induced time paradox!





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Loona
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"Re(1):The Mystery of the F-40 Ferrari" , posted Tue 9 Feb 19:42post reply

quote:
I was overviewing MMCafe for layout glitches etc when I realized something via the Southtown Map.

- Art of Fighting 1 takes place in 1978, AOF2 in 1979.
- Robert drives a Ferrari F-40.
- That car didn't exist until a decade later in 1987.

I can only assume that the devs didn't think about props when they were fiddling around with the story's timeline.



Saiki/Ash-induced time paradox!





...!!

chazumaru
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"Re(1):The Mystery of the F-40 Ferrari" , posted Tue 9 Feb 22:55post reply

The gangs behind cheap Hong-Kong South Town knock-offs of Italian luxury brands are simply that well organised, and can get the fakes out a few years ahead of the real stuff. I am presently wearing fake Gucci jeans from the year 2019.

What I hope to figure out one day is why San Francisco was already part of the United States in Samurai Spirits.





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Spoon
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"Re(2):The Mystery of the F-40 Ferrari" , posted Wed 10 Feb 03:28:post reply

quote:
What I hope to figure out one day is why San Francisco was already part of the United States in Samurai Spirits.



Is it actually mentioned that SF is part of the US? I had little access to SamSho story material back in the day, but I remember at some point hearing that Earthquake was from Spanish Texas. Texas didn't join the Union until the 1800s, so they managed to get that detail about the USA correct.


EDIT:
DISREGARD THE ABOVE HAHHAHA

Texas, USA

SF, USA





[this message was edited by Spoon on Wed 10 Feb 03:32]

Professor
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"New Samurai Shodown...?" , posted Thu 11 Feb 13:02post reply

http://hadoken.net/samurai-shodown-revival/





Loona
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"Re(1):New Samurai Shodown...?" , posted Thu 11 Feb 21:59post reply

quote:
http://hadoken.net/samurai-shodown-revival/



IIRC at one point SNKP's recruitment page had a 3D model of Rimururu in it, and the resies was actually mentioned as part of recruitment efforts from some time ago, so it's not quite news but hey, it's a date.


In other news, Trademark Bot is mentioning some SNKP titles - maybe for Steam or something?
Art of Fighting
Baseball Stars
Garou Mark of the Wolves
King of the Monsters
Neo Turf Masters
Shock Troopers
Twinkle Star Sprites





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Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(1):New Samurai Shodown...?" , posted Thu 11 Feb 23:31post reply

3D SS? Bracing myself for the very same backlash KOFXIV is getting...sigh.





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"Re(2):New Samurai Shodown...?" , posted Fri 12 Feb 00:17post reply

quote:
3D SS? Bracing myself for the very same backlash KOFXIV is getting...sigh.



The track record for 3D SS games has been abysmal but maybe this time they will finally get it right. If nothing else SS Sen lowered the bar so much that anything will be an improvement.





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"Re(2):New Samurai Shodown...?" , posted Fri 12 Feb 00:24post reply

quote:
In other news, Trademark Bot is mentioning some SNKP titles - maybe for Steam or something?
Art of Fighting
Baseball Stars
Garou Mark of the Wolves
King of the Monsters
Neo Turf Masters
Shock Troopers
Twinkle Star Sprites



All the same titles that were in the Neo Geo 25th Anniversary humble bundle recently as shoddily packaged romsets ... could just be renewing late or, as you said, adding them to Steam. Here's hoping they come up with a better interface if they do. At least the Metal Slug ports let you change your button configuration.





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Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(3):New Samurai Shodown...?" , posted Fri 12 Feb 00:36post reply

quote:
The track record for 3D SS games has been abysmal but maybe this time they will finally get it right. If nothing else SS Sen lowered the bar so much that anything will be an improvement.

So, you think visuals in a possible new SS would only be compared to the rest of the franchise instead of KOFXIV? That could be a relief...sort of xD





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"Re(4):New Samurai Shodown...?" , posted Fri 12 Feb 01:06post reply

quote:
So, you think visuals in a possible new SS would only be compared to the rest of the franchise instead of KOFXIV? That could be a relief...sort of xD

Except the NG64 games were technically awful, but had a very solid artistic direction that tried to do the best with the little polygons they had.
The big problem of KOF14 is the weak artistic direction. And it's a much, much more important aspect of SS than of any other of their franchises (except Last Blade of course).
Also, maybe they should finish the huge project that KOF14 seems to be before they launch another one? Maybe? If only to learn from their mistakes?





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"Re(1):New Samurai Shodown...?" , posted Fri 12 Feb 02:29post reply

I'd prefer a new Last Blade over another SS reboot.

But honestly, I'm still waiting on that Garou sequel. Memories of Stray Wolves made me hungry for more.





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"Re(2):New Samurai Shodown...?" , posted Fri 12 Feb 04:23post reply

quote:
I'd prefer a new Last Blade over another SS reboot.

But honestly, I'm still waiting on that Garou sequel. Memories of Stray Wolves made me hungry for more.



I would prefer too a new Last Blade, but imho it's better if they do experiments on SS for the moment....





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"Re(2):New Samurai Shodown...?" , posted Fri 12 Feb 09:34post reply

quote:
http://hadoken.net/samurai-shodown-revival/


IIRC at one point SNKP's recruitment page had a 3D model of Rimururu in it, and the resies was actually mentioned as part of recruitment efforts from some time ago, so it's not quite news but hey, it's a date.


In other news, Trademark Bot is mentioning some SNKP titles - maybe for Steam or something?
Art of Fighting
Baseball Stars
Garou Mark of the Wolves
King of the Monsters
Neo Turf Masters
Shock Troopers
Twinkle Star Sprites



those games appeared on steamdb 2 months ago





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"Re(3):New Samurai Shodown...?" , posted Tue 16 Feb 21:29post reply

Humm, the renderings are starting to look better for KOFXIV, or at least their faces.
It looks like the devs are trying to match them to Ogura's art style.





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"Re(4):New Samurai Shodown...?" , posted Wed 17 Feb 00:23post reply

quote:
Humm, the renderings are starting to look better for KOFXIV, or at least their faces.
It looks like the devs are trying to match them to Ogura's art style.



True, but I'm afraid hoping for in-game models on par with player select ones is a dream in a dream.

Even more depressingly, animations aren't on the same level with any last gen or current gen competitor...if I had the money, I'd pay 3D animators experienced and numerous enough to redraw all the animations in KOFXIV so they get XIII quality on time (did somebody speculate a September 2016 release date for XIV?), not for me, but to persuade those who only would buy the game if it had better graphics.

Really, all the hating on the visuals is pissing me off to no end, especially because I can't do shit about it, except buying KOFXIV brand new and day one -by the way, I hope for some jam-packed Japanese collector's edition, maybe Ledo is willing to give it a shot.

Nothing against you Cafers, cause your critique is reasonable and focused on art direction more than mere visuals. My rant's against those who can only yell "SHITTY GRAPHICS UGLY GAME I WON'T BUY IT UNLESS IT GETS AS GOOD AS MKX OR KI", which sadly are the majority of the gaming market and will make KOFXIV bomb miserably...unless it gets 98OL tier revenue in China.

Come to think of it, what do Japanese and Chinese KOF fans think about visuals in XIV? I remember reading somewhere that Japanese fans got excited about the 50 chars roster, but posted character shading "suggestions" on Twitter on the other hand.





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"Re(5):New Samurai Shodown...?" , posted Wed 17 Feb 01:02:post reply

quote:
Come to think of it, what do Japanese and Chinese KOF fans think about visuals in XIV? I remember reading somewhere that Japanese fans got excited about the 50 chars roster, but


For Japan, It's divided.

1/The hardcore players that play the series for its system rather than the graphics don't really care as long as it's fun. With some of the more extreme players, they don't care if it's just stick figures on the screen, or even no graphics (just hitboxes). It partially explains why they only pick top tiers.

2/The more casual players and character specialists care about graphics and they're not happy with 14. Ironically, it'll probably be mostly this layer of players that buys the game because a good chunk of the hardcore players only play at the arcades and probably won't go through buying a console.


My personal take on the game is that it'll be the Windows Vista of the next generation of kofs.





[this message was edited by Professor on Wed 17 Feb 01:05]

kofoguz
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"Re(6):New Samurai Shodown...?" , posted Wed 17 Feb 12:24post reply

I just realized the artist who is responsible for faces possibly watched too much hannibal !





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"Re(5):New Samurai Shodown...?" , posted Wed 17 Feb 15:08post reply

quote:
Come to think of it, what do Japanese and Chinese KOF fans think about visuals in XIV?


I asked a few players from Hong Kong and the answer was "the feedback has mostly been negative".

Here's my take on why I won't buy KOF XIV (or SFV): I don't see buying a new console (+ new arcade stick) and a new game as a wise decision when I already have access to dozens of good fighting games. In fact, I think buying something just because it is new to simply be stupid. Especially buying something just because it is released by SNKP or Capcom. Just because I'm a fan of games like SSF2X, 3S and KOF98 doesn't mean I'm going to take my chances and spend hundreds of Euros just to play a new fighting game that doesn't look even remotely attractive. Back before SFIV was released I heard a lot of friends etc say that fighting games are stupid. I didn't agree with them back then because things were different, but if I look at the "FGC" now I also find myself thinking that fighting games are stupid. Yet I don't feel like I am being negative. I'm just concentrating on what I know is good and sticking with that without taking risks with new products that are not aimed for people like me. If for some reason XIV and SFV turn out to be well received games by people whose opinions I respect after the prices have gone down I'm willing to give them a try. But before that happens I'm completely indifferent.





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Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(6):New Samurai Shodown...?" , posted Wed 17 Feb 19:26post reply

Okay, now I got a good understanding of how the KOF preview material is being received in Japan and HK, thank you a bunch!! KOF Vista? Sad yet funny to me xD





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Loona
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"Re(3):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 00:21post reply

quote:
In unrelated news, there's a Kickstarter for a supposed Fatal Fury fan film, but it feels odd on multiple accounts:

This is interesting-- I'll frontpage it thanks. As far as the project's legitimacy goes I think it's genuine, though some things in the project are just plain odd.

On a side note, I'm tempted to make the pun that the actor's name for Terry is Jeff.



Good grief, they're already halfway funded...

Looks like they also have a Twitter account that none of the pages related to the project reference. Whomever's managing that probably never used Twitter for himself, the usage and list of followed accounts is weird as well, must have picked up some really weird tips about it online...

I noticed that the Café news post was updated regarding the initial video's title - did they get in touch with you about it Professor?...





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Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(4):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 00:46post reply

Ummm...looks like the Twitter of a KOF fan who's also into filmmaking, with some ads thrown here and there to spread the word on this project he/she wanna see completed. Nothing professional IMO. I have no expectations, but I still should follow this fan movie more closely anyway, who knows what it could turn out to be.

https://twitter.com/HBJohnXuandou/status/699974795031543809 <<< one hour from the time of this tweet? It's half an hour from now...let's see if it's true.





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Loona
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"Re(5):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 01:21post reply

quote:

https://twitter.com/HBJohnXuandou/status/699974795031543809 <<< one hour from the time of this tweet? It's half an hour from now...let's see if it's true.



And here it is, the new trailer

Looks like Tizoc decided Dinosaurs descend from birds and not the other way around.

Also, it's interesting that Terry's going for a look closer to FF1's red jacket with actual sleeves, which is a nice departure from using the FF2 look yet again without going for the Garou look that more casual fans might not recognize.





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Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(5):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 01:22:post reply

quote:
Ummm...looks like the Twitter of a KOF fan who's also into filmmaking, with some ads thrown here and there to spread the word on this project he/she wanna see completed. Nothing professional IMO. I have no expectations, but I still should follow this fan movie more closely anyway, who knows what it could turn out to be.

https://twitter.com/HBJohnXuandou/status/699974795031543809 <<< one hour from the time of this tweet? It's half an hour from now...let's see if it's true.



EDIT: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UtzuUWN9zg
It's here. The only thing I didn't like is

Spoiler (Highlight to view) -
Tizoc's ugly ass dinosaur costume.

End of Spoiler

Everything else, I LOVE it. But please keep in mind I have no standards when it comes to KOF and SNK/SNKP as a whole.





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Thu 18 Feb 04:44]

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"Re(6):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 01:49post reply

Random Thoughts:

I now want all cosplayers to dress as Tizocosaurus Rex.

Speaking of fan imitations, Leona is still getting her style from Black RX.

Ugh, I forgot how much I could not stand Angel's voice. Between the constant squeaking and a move list that required Toxico's FAQ for me to even begin to fathom I know who is not going to have a regular slot on my team.

In a morbid way I was really hoping for ugly old pachislot Terry but I guess I'll have to settle for Terry with a new jacket. I wonder where he buys his customized caps?





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"Re(6):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 01:49post reply

And now there's also a blog post about the reveal - and it covers the new stages too. Looks like Tizoc's going for a face/heel turn a la Raiden/Big Bear.





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Just a Person
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"Re(7):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 02:05post reply

I'm glad to see Ralf and Clark looking like normal people instead of steroid mountains, and King with a normal-sized head (hopefully Yuri will have the same luck whenever she's announced). Tizoc's new identity, though... yeah, not my favorite right now.

Nevertheless, KOF XIV seems to be improving with each new trailer. It still needs A LOT of improvements, but it is in the right track.





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"Re(8):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 02:58:post reply

This trailer had me pretty excited that I was somehow able to disregard the graphic level while watching it. I even laughed at the dinosaur part. And if you're not happy with the dinosaur changeup, just know that with the use of 3D, it's now easier for SNKP devs to create alternate costumes!

(EDIT: Rewatching, I forgot the tail-whip move. That's clearly not doable in Tizoc's original costume.)

Also, I think I know that twitter guy as being associated with that HitBox device. I don't know much else, but I recognized his name.





[this message was edited by Doshin on Thu 18 Feb 03:00]

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"Re(9):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 03:36post reply

One thing that smells of the good old SNK: they never had any issue with releasing a game with characters at widely different level of completion. New Griffon Mask looks like he received three times the attention of Ralf and Clark combined, and it shows. Good! It will remind me of Shiki vs Bison in SvC Chaos!
The church stage looks nice, too.

The fact the moves have no impact hurts Angel the most. She's now firmly in Momoko (was it even her name?) territory, in that it doesn't make sense that whatever she's doing hurts her opponent.





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"Re(8):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 03:42:post reply

quote:
I'm glad to see Ralf and Clark looking like normal people instead of steroid mountains, and King with a normal-sized head (hopefully Yuri will have the same luck whenever she's announced). Tizoc's new identity, though... yeah, not my favorite right now.

Nevertheless, KOF XIV seems to be improving with each new trailer. It still needs A LOT of improvements, but it is in the right track.


I was actually pretty impressed with the trailer. Not only with Tizoc's new identity, the animations and especially the effects are standing out making the game look good. So it makes me wonder, will people still complain about the graphics of the characters? Obviously, everything else graphics wise looks real good.
On the roster note, I really rather see more new or characters rarely used in the KOF universe. If the change to 3-D is major, the roster should as well.

quote:

The fact the moves have no impact hurts Angel the most. She's now firmly in Momoko (was it even her name?) territory, in that it doesn't make sense that whatever she's doing hurts her opponent.


Maybe she knows the human pressure points to inflict serious damage! lol





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[this message was edited by neo0r0chiaku on Thu 18 Feb 03:48]

TheRedKnight
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"Re(9):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 03:46post reply

I'm surprised how positive some of the reactions to the new trailer were. The game still doesn't look like a proper KOF game. For example Clark's DM looked like he was on a nice little Sunday stroll in the park.

King Of Dinosaurs did make me laugh though.





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Professor
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"Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 04:06post reply

I wake up for the restroom past midnight and I see this, sweet. Looks like Terry and Griffon are both getting a lot of love, which sort of makes sense given that the staffs that created the birdhead wrestler are working on the game. Get in the Ring!





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"Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 04:13:post reply

quote:
I'm surprised how positive some of the reactions to the new trailer were. The game still doesn't look like a proper KOF game. For example Clark's DM looked like he was on a nice little Sunday stroll in the park.


The earliest trailers set standards so low that everything since has been an improvement. That visible improvement is creating an almost artificial sense of positivity.

When watching the trailer, I was thinking about how I wished they bring Iori and Kyo up to the visual standards of the newer characters... It took me a moment to realize how silly that thought was, as it isn't that the new characters are good. It is just that they are better than the first characters.





[this message was edited by Baines on Thu 18 Feb 04:15]

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"Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 04:14post reply

quote:
One thing that smells of the good old SNK: they never had any issue with releasing a game with characters at widely different level of completion. New Griffon Mask looks like he received three times the attention of Ralf and Clark combined, and it shows. Good! It will remind me of Shiki vs Bison in SvC Chaos!
The church stage looks nice, too.

The fact the moves have no impact hurts Angel the most. She's now firmly in Momoko (was it even her name?) territory, in that it doesn't make sense that whatever she's doing hurts her opponent.



This game is looking kinda like "King of Fighters: Minimum Impact" right now.

I was going to comment on this too. Angel's ridiculous twisty-flip off the opponent's head looks so... gentle. As for Clark, maybe SAB now stands for "Soft Argentine Backmassage"?

Some serious work needed on both the sound and animation for hits. The game is just not selling these big hits.





/ / /

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"Re(2):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 05:11:post reply

quote:

The earliest trailers set standards so low that everything since has been an improvement. That visible improvement is creating an almost artificial sense of positivity.



Yeah, I should have said that the amount of positivity in the reactions surprised me.

Speaking of artificial sense of positivity, I'm fairly sure that if Capcom gets their SFV servers working by this weekend no one's going to remember how limp and floppy the launch was.

EDIT: I watched the trailer for the third time and only now noticed that Benimaru has new moves.





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[this message was edited by TheRedKnight on Thu 18 Feb 08:02]

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"Re(3):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 08:22post reply

quote:

The earliest trailers set standards so low that everything since has been an improvement. That visible improvement is creating an almost artificial sense of positivity.


Yeah, I should have said that the amount of positivity in the reactions surprised me.

Speaking of artificial sense of positivity, I'm fairly sure that if Capcom gets their SFV servers working by this weekend no one's going to remember how limp and floppy the launch was.

EDIT: I watched the trailer for the third time and only now noticed that Benimaru has new moves.



At least they're willing to add a few new things. It shows they're willing to do more than simply have their artists try to copy the moves/animations from old games.

Note to devs, please play some Capcom vs. SNK 2 and give Vice her anti-air sleeve (i.e., the Deicide Slayer... so metal). Or do something else with the damn sleeves.

BTW, does KOF XIV have "powered up" special moves/EX moves or no?





/ / /

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"Re(4):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 08:45post reply

quote:

The earliest trailers set standards so low that everything since has been an improvement. That visible improvement is creating an almost artificial sense of positivity.


Yeah, I should have said that the amount of positivity in the reactions surprised me.

Speaking of artificial sense of positivity, I'm fairly sure that if Capcom gets their SFV servers working by this weekend no one's going to remember how limp and floppy the launch was.

EDIT: I watched the trailer for the third time and only now noticed that Benimaru has new moves.


At least they're willing to add a few new things. It shows they're willing to do more than simply have their artists try to copy the moves/animations from old games.

Note to devs, please play some Capcom vs. SNK 2 and give Vice her anti-air sleeve (i.e., the Deicide Slayer... so metal). Or do something else with the damn sleeves.

BTW, does KOF XIV have "powered up" special moves/EX moves or no?



The coolest custom combo any of the snake-handed characters have ever done in any game is Vice's repeated Deicide Slayer juggle in CvS2.





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"Re(5):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 09:18post reply

quote:

The coolest custom combo any of the snake-handed characters have ever done in any game is Vice's repeated Deicide Slayer juggle in CvS2.



I always wished they would make a super out of that move that alternated sides; think a snake-arm version of T. Hawk's Ultra 2.

Damn I love grapplers. Very happy with Claw's pile-driving options in SFV right now.





/ / /

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"Re(4):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 09:37post reply

quote:

BTW, does KOF XIV have "powered up" special moves/EX moves or no?



It has EXes, but you need to have the max gauge bursted on, aka "they are so predictable due to needing prior build up that everyone including your young infant cousin can see them coming, thus they are unusable in real life just like math" type of moves, meh.

Another demerit of having almost no animation at all, it's that it's harder to fore-read moves due to lack of mobility "disguising" the moves (like, moves come out of nowhere as their "build up animation" is basically the same as the neutral stance; the SF series is a major sinner at this); this really hampers the yomi stage since you have much less info to confirm if your read was right or wrong. This is a stark contrast of XIII, which if the the first kof that tried to give some sort of sense to attack flow speed.



...... Everything looks atrocious sands the dino mask.






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Spoon
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"Re(6):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 09:53post reply

quote:

The coolest custom combo any of the snake-handed characters have ever done in any game is Vice's repeated Deicide Slayer juggle in CvS2.


I always wished they would make a super out of that move that alternated sides; think a snake-arm version of T. Hawk's Ultra 2.




That's actually exactly what that juggle does in CvS2. It's far from efficient but it looks awesome.





Mosquiton
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"Re(7):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 10:57post reply

quote:

The coolest custom combo any of the snake-handed characters have ever done in any game is Vice's repeated Deicide Slayer juggle in CvS2.


I always wished they would make a super out of that move that alternated sides; think a snake-arm version of T. Hawk's Ultra 2.



That's actually exactly what that juggle does in CvS2. It's far from efficient but it looks awesome.



I think I might have done this a few times myself but I have never really been into A-groove-ism.

If it were a proper super, I would imagine she could finish off the move with something like the mid-air super from KOFXIII (which is essentially the final slam from Withering Surface). Or maybe the Orochi eye NEOMAX.

In an alternate life, I might have created the Mugen character "Ultimate Nightmare Vice," an S-tier monster on SaltyBet.





/ / /

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"Re(8):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 18:09post reply

Greetings Professor and fellow KOF players! Have not been active for a long time.

The 6th teaser definitely looks great with more revealed players and graphics improvements! I'm pretty impressed by it.

To be honest, I was quite disappointed with when XIV was announced. It went 3D (Max Impact) and the graphics were unacceptable for me. It seem like a unfinished product made by a 3rd party company. I was drawn to KOF because of their character's design and presentation.

Well, there are actually some arguments on the graphics. As posted previously, hardcore players wouldn't actually care about the graphics. However, to draw in new 'blood', especially on the a new gen console. There has to be a benchmark. I wouldn't mind if they reused the sprites from XIII. It was beautiful for me. Nonetheless, they have made improvements with each teaser, hopefully the end product will look beautiful.

Gameplay wise, they took out the drive meter & HD combos, which is a unique system for KOF. Not sure if it's a good idea? Since it's simplified system, I assume for now that the combos will not be fanciful as before. Not a fan of auto-combo especially for KOF. Let's see what the finalized version looks like.

Lastly, are we going to see the return of Yashiro, Chris & Shermie? There's a leaked roster sometime back, but is it legit?





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"Re(9):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 20:08post reply

quote:

This game is looking kinda like "King of Fighters: Minimum Impact" right now.

I was going to comment on this too. Angel's ridiculous twisty-flip off the opponent's head looks so... gentle. As for Clark, maybe SAB now stands for "Soft Argentine Backmassage"?

Some serious work needed on both the sound and animation for hits. The game is just not selling these big hits.



I barely touched Angel in the games she was in, so I don't recall if that move of hers ever had that much impact. Still, if they applied an effect to it like Gato's neck breaker it'd be an instant improvement - or at least something similar but toned down, if the move is supposed to be followed up by something else (then somthing lighter like Mary's bone cracks could work).

quote:

Lastly, are we going to see the return of Yashiro, Chris & Shermie? There's a leaked roster sometime back, but is it legit?



Apparently the whole leak got posted on the shoryuken.com forums ages ago and got no reactions then, but it's scarily accurate so far.





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"Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show roundup" , posted Thu 18 Feb 23:02post reply

Starting to look like a game and not a demo! I feared Terry's redesign more than any other but ... it looks good? I like the direction with the voice acting as well, sounding much more "serious" than before (aside from cutesy characters like Kula).





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"Re(2):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show r" , posted Fri 19 Feb 00:19post reply

Looks like a KoF RPG is in the works, based on a mention between some other Korean gaming news





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"Re(2):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show r" , posted Fri 19 Feb 00:36post reply

A couple random thoughts.

Not for defending SNKP at any cost -they don't pay me for damage control, so I'm not doing it xD-, but I think music is too loud in these teasers. If music volume was lower, maybe hit sounds would get a bit more impactful (but still less than optimal).

I love the church ruins stage because it looks dramatic and melancholic, and I hope this hints at an equally dramatic plot.

The accuracy of the leak so far is scary indeed...I would have bet nothing in its favor before December 5th!! I only started believing the leak when Angel was revealed: seeing her in a canon KOF game was more shocking to me than Orange Is The New Chang. I see lots of people don't want it to be true because it includes pachislot chars and concepts possibly weirder than Falcoon's creations, all while keeping faces like Yashiro, Shermie, Chris, Mary and Vanessa away from KOF, but that's the way it is for fighting games. Street Fighter V is upsetting fans of Sagat, Sakura and Blanka, KOFXIV is upsetting fans of the characters I've just mentioned.

(I still don't believe the Pachislot Team part anyway)





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"Re(3):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show r" , posted Fri 19 Feb 04:19post reply

Had the leaks mentioned King of Dinosaurs/Tizoc??





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"Re(4):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show r" , posted Fri 19 Feb 04:35:post reply

quote:
Had the leaks mentioned King of Dinosaurs/Tizoc??


Yes, here you are the SRK message (Loona had linked it in this thread a while ago)





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[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Fri 19 Feb 04:37]

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"Re(5):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show r" , posted Fri 19 Feb 04:42post reply

quote:
Had the leaks mentioned King of Dinosaurs/Tizoc??

Yes, here you are the SRK message (Loona had linked it in this thread a while ago)



Loona:...should we expect a Korean KOF98OL with KOFXII cast? LOL. (I'm actually curious about this thingy)





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"Re(5):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show r" , posted Fri 19 Feb 06:59post reply

quote:
Had the leaks mentioned King of Dinosaurs/Tizoc??

Yes, here you are the SRK message (Loona had linked it in this thread a while ago)



Thanks!
The leak it's too much precise!
"Tizoc with a dinosaur mask and tail"

I also noticed in the list a cyborg boxer, could it be Rocky?





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"Re(6):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show r" , posted Fri 19 Feb 08:01post reply

quote:
Had the leaks mentioned King of Dinosaurs/Tizoc??

Yes, here you are the SRK message (Loona had linked it in this thread a while ago)


Thanks!
The leak it's too much precise!
"Tizoc with a dinosaur mask and tail"

I also noticed in the list a cyborg boxer, could it be Rocky?




Frontpaged it, thanks everyone.





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"Re(6):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show r" , posted Fri 19 Feb 09:17:post reply

quote:
Had the leaks mentioned King of Dinosaurs/Tizoc??

Yes, here you are the SRK message (Loona had linked it in this thread a while ago)


Thanks!
The leak it's too much precise!
"Tizoc with a dinosaur mask and tail"

I also noticed in the list a cyborg boxer, could it be Rocky?


Someone said it could be a revived cyborg version of Rick Strowd. He is a boxer now. Anybody knows what happened to him in RB2?





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[this message was edited by neo0r0chiaku on Fri 19 Feb 09:18]

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"Re(6):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show r" , posted Fri 19 Feb 19:56post reply

quote:
Had the leaks mentioned King of Dinosaurs/Tizoc??

Yes, here you are the SRK message (Loona had linked it in this thread a while ago)

Isn't this list exactly the same as the one that surfaced aged ago, that got revived when we saw Prisonner Chang?
Except that list was organized by team, while this one is one solid paragraph. I don't think there's anything new in it, is there? My memory is fuzzy.

As long as CYS don't get botched by this graphic style, they can include anyone they want, really.





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"Re(7):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show r" , posted Fri 19 Feb 21:34post reply

quote:
Loona:...should we expect a Korean KOF98OL with KOFXII cast? LOL. (I'm actually curious about this thingy)



You're talking about the RPG thing? The one illustration/slide about that had a "94-XIII" bit, but no idea if it referenced the history of the series or the cast they might draw from.
However it turns out, I hope it eventually goes beyond Asia to make it easier to promote the series and help lure some licensing deals and talent - that sort of visibility seems like the sort of phenomenon that eventually made SF Capcom USA's business, which in turn made it easier to spread around the world.

quote:
I also noticed in the list a cyborg boxer, could it be Rocky?



One leak said something about a handicapped or one-armed boxer, the other mentioned a cyborg, so I only expect a single arm to be artificial, while Rocky seems to be more extensively modified - I'm not really expecting him.

Maybe they'll try something similar to K9999's move where he uses his arm like a shotgun for a while, to take advantage of the prosthetic.

quote:

Someone said it could be a revived cyborg version of Rick Strowd. He is a boxer now. Anybody knows what happened to him in RB2?



Rick seemed pretty fine by the end of RB2


quote:
Isn't this list exactly the same as the one that surfaced aged ago, that got revived when we saw Prisonner Chang?
Except that list was organized by team, while this one is one solid paragraph. I don't think there's anything new in it, is there? My memory is fuzzy.

As long as CYS don't get botched by this graphic style, they can include anyone they want, really.



I'm not sure if this one's older - but it's been unmodified for about half a year and it's been pretty spot-on - and no CYS in it, so at most they could get a cameo in a story section involving Iori's undead teammates.





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"Re(6):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show r" , posted Fri 19 Feb 23:11:post reply

Lord SNK, Professor: you're welcome ^^

I don't think cyborg boxer is Rocky because maybe Maxima's first concept is based on Rocky -I kinda remember reading such a thing some years ago-, but you never know...

I'm curious about the masked girl. I love when SNK(P) makes characters who don't look suited for fighting, such as Lucky or Chizuru, they always intrigue me at least. I'll actually do some research about Sichuan Opera these days.





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[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Fri 19 Feb 23:12]

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"Re(7):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show r" , posted Fri 19 Feb 23:35post reply

quote:
I'm curious about the masked girl. I love when SNK(P) makes characters who don't look suited for fighting, such as Lucky or Chizuru, they always intrigue me at least. I'll actually do some research about Sichuan Opera these days.



Chizuru barely looks like she needs to fight since she can just outnumber an opponent with her abilities, but Lucky was actually based on Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, just playing up the basketball factor for visual distinction.





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"Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Sat 20 Feb 00:12:post reply

Welp, I can't seem to access the Orochinagi forum threads and I can't remember my old password when ON was down and I registered here (I even forgot the e-mail so that account is pretty dead now). So I had to register a new account - this is PenPen from Orochinagi, by the way (and yes, I was the one who uploaded the KOF XIII HK loketests).

So uh, I went to the C3 show (with anime/games/figures and wahtnot) and took a few videos secretly, but not many of the Sony Playstation people really cared, and there wasn't a lot of people playing. So the match quality was kind of poor. The kiosk doesn't have any sticks for us so people had to use the gamepad (I suck with the pad).

Overall I think the game plays pretty well for now, and Robert, King and Billy are playable. I got into Max mode a few times but only managed to do some SDMs, but haven't tried them out enough. Obviously graphics is not the strong suit of this game, at this point. It plays smooth, and plays decently well for me, but needs some getting used to as I'm not hitting sprites anymore. I can't describe it well...it's kinda like an adjustment that I had to go through with the old KOF sprites to KOF XII/XIII transition. And some animation changes with the 3D models versus the sprites that I needed to get used to. Speaking of animations, all female characters have boob jiggles. I can't hear if there's any music.

Robert feels like a mix of old and new, I'd say mostly from stuff in KOF XIII, but his spinny kick is the KOF 98 version instead of his XIII version. His f+A goes a bit farther than you are usually used with.

King is pretty simple. No air fireballs this time, but you can still cancel light attacks into her slide, into Tornado Kick. She also his her qcbx2+K super from 98.

Billy felt very much like his KOF XIII version. Moves are almost exactly the same to me versus XIII.

As for others, I tried out Kyo mostly, some Kula, Robert, Billy, maybe a game of Iori, King, and Chang.

Also videos! I had some videos taken as said above. Unfortunately my phone would almost set itself on fire after some extended recording, but the quality of the players there wasn't all that impressive, so it's not really good. Anyway, here they are.

Vidya 1
Vidya 2
Vidya 3
Vidya 4
Vidya 5
Vidya 6

The whole show itself was something that I wasn't interested in. So eh, left after I got around 2 hours in there. Got to play a round of SF V though.

I really don't see myself going there to record more though - so that would be all I would have.





rer

[this message was edited by penpen35 on Sat 20 Feb 02:58]

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"Re(8):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show r" , posted Sat 20 Feb 00:19post reply

Loona: I know the Hakim concept thing, I was talking about his basketball player looks only :D

As for KOF All Star, my hopes are the same as you: launched globally -I see Net Marble's main target for this game is Japan, but I really hope it's not their only target- and useful in promoting the franchise while waiting for KOFXIV.

Iggy:, you're right, but the SRK forum post is worth reading because English translations of the list format leak don't say anything about dino Tizoc and tend to say "handicap boxer" instead of "cyborg boxer" and "Palace Wan Team" instead of "Official Team". Handicap and Palace probably are mistranslations...





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"Re(1):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Sat 20 Feb 01:14post reply

quote:
Also videos! I had some videos taken as said above. Unfortunately my phone would almost set itself on fire after some extended recording, but the quality of the players there wasn't all that impressive, so it's not really good. Anyway, here they are.


Thanks for the videos! I haven't had the chance to form a solid opinion about what's on display but I can say with certainty that I like the whale.





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"Re(1):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Sat 20 Feb 01:42:post reply

quote:
Welp, I can't seem to access the Orochinagi forum threads and I can't remember my old password when ON was down and I registered here (I even forgot the e-mail so that account is pretty dead now). So I had to register a new account - this is PenPen from Orochinagi, by the way (and yes, I was the one who uploaded the KOF XIII HK loketests).



Hi Penpen, and welcome back to the MMCafe BBS!

Thanks very much for your report from the show!
I hope you won't mind if I post up a news on it-- I'm sure a lot of people will be interested.


At first I was wondering why King's air Venoms were taken out but from checking out the videos, it probably would've given her too much space control in this game-- its speed still seems a lot slower than KOF13.

Also, her VA seems to have changed. This certainly doesn't sound like the Nakoruru/BlueMary voice actress.





[this message was edited by Professor on Sat 20 Feb 03:36]

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"Re(2):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Sat 20 Feb 01:52post reply

Thanks for the videos!
They firmly confirmed me into my opinion of finding it very difficult to form any kind of opinion on the... product.
Will I get used to it after a while? I think I got used to the lack of impact strength in SvC and NGBC in the end, at least superficially, so... hum.





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"Re(2):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Sat 20 Feb 01:55:post reply

quote:
Welp, I can't seem to access the Orochinagi forum threads and I can't remember my old password when ON was down and I registered here (I even forgot the e-mail so that account is pretty dead now). So I had to register a new account - this is PenPen from Orochinagi, by the way (and yes, I was the one who uploaded the KOF XIII HK loketests).


Hi Penpen, and welcome to the MMCafe BBS!

Thanks very much for your report from the show!
I hope you won't mind if I post up a news on it-- I'm sure a lot of people will be interested.


At first I was wondering why King's air Venoms were taken out but from checking out the videos, it probably would've given her too much space control in this game-- its speed still seems a lot slower than KOF13.



Professor, I don't mind - go ahead!

It does seem slower than KOF XIII. I think I could get a better feel with a stick, but well, the kiosk doesn't have that luxury, sadly.

Iggy: It plays fine to me but it's really hard to say if I like it or not(I don't plan to buy a PSquadruple just for this game). It's just really weird to see 3D models doing things in KOF and hitting them feels...subdued?





rer

[this message was edited by penpen35 on Sat 20 Feb 02:00]

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"Re(3):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Sat 20 Feb 03:24post reply

Speaking of the speed: watching the videos reminds me that I have forgotten a lot about KOF2002 and 98.
14 is slower than 13 for sure, but what about compared to the classic ones?
It's hard to tell from the vids... it almost feels like the movements (walk, jump) are a bit slower than the attacks...? The general speed feels uneven.
Also, I missed that piece of info: does the game still has 4 types of jumps?





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"Re(4):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Sat 20 Feb 03:37post reply

quote:
Speaking of the speed: watching the videos reminds me that I have forgotten a lot about KOF2002 and 98.
14 is slower than 13 for sure, but what about compared to the classic ones?
It's hard to tell from the vids... it almost feels like the movements (walk, jump) are a bit slower than the attacks...? The general speed feels uneven.
Also, I missed that piece of info: does the game still has 4 types of jumps?



There are the 4 types of jumps, yeah. Just that the players are mostly pretty bleh and they're using a gamepad.





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"Re(4):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Sat 20 Feb 04:00post reply

quote:
Speaking of the speed: watching the videos reminds me that I have forgotten a lot about KOF2002 and 98.
14 is slower than 13 for sure, but what about compared to the classic ones?
It's hard to tell from the vids... it almost feels like the movements (walk, jump) are a bit slower than the attacks...? The general speed feels uneven.
Also, I missed that piece of info: does the game still has 4 types of jumps?



Based on the impressions of people who played it at the PSX event, the speed of the game feels fine. In general people were very positive on the gameplay, especially the old school players.

Some felt that the jump felt/looked a little floaty but that's about it. The devs said that that was done on purpose (probably taking complaints regarding XIII being too aggressive and fast with jump pressure into account) and they are still adjusting things.

The actual timing on the moves and combos is actually surprisingly spot on with the 2D games. There are comparison vids on youtube with the same combos being done in XIV and XIII and the pace the animation/hit stop moves at is almost exactly the same.





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"Re(5):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Sat 20 Feb 04:03post reply

Thanks for posting, PenPen - as a non-casual-but-still-not-great player it's nice to see how this game may actually play in my home.

I find it interesting (as everyone has pointed out) there isn't a lot of impact for the grapples (at least what we've seen with Clark and Angel), yet they still implemented a bit of a freeze-frame/screen shake for Kyo's DM.





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"Re(3):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Taipei Game Show r" , posted Sat 20 Feb 10:14post reply

quote:
Orange Is The New Chang.


I didn't watch more than one episode of this show but big props on this, Micky.

Also want to thank penpen for the vidyas.

Really enjoying this thread, so much interesting info, so many insightful opinions. This board is great!





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"Re(1):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Sun 21 Feb 18:14post reply

Penpen: thank you a lot for your report and videos!! I'm intrigued by Robert's slightly extended f+A, he's my favorite in the Ryuuko No Ken main duo -just like Ken in SF LOL- so news about his changes are most welcome to me ^^ The Neptune Hotel stage is growing on me now that your videos give us quite a good look at it.

Mosquiton: I don't even know how that came through my mind since I haven't watched OITNB xD It's a title that definitely gets stuck in your head though.

Randomness corner: from the latest teaser, I don't like Leona's face anymore. At all. What the hell they did to her?? I really used to like her a lot in the previous teasers. Now I feel like watching all the teasers back to back, I wanna personally keep track of all the changes they made to fighters' looks.





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"Re(2):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Mon 22 Feb 00:35post reply

Someone in 4chan revealed some details from the leaked roster.

The summaries was given by SAB CA on neo gaf, so I will copy paste them here

- The last boss is compared to an MK Soulnado: He can go anywhere in any point and time, and pluck people into the games realm. Canon Dream match times!

- Alice looks like... Alice.

- Dragon Spirit arc involves the new China team ("demon boy, pillow child, Tung Fu Rue")

-Love Heart and Miu Mio could be redesigned for this game?

- Being owned by the Chinese overlords + getting the China team as a lead is a coincidence. This story path was decided before then, since China is the biggest KoF country in the world, and this game was to appear to a worldwide audience.

- Russian Billionaire boss is most likely a "half naked" shirtless dude.

- Official team's mask girl is said to be a Stance character, practices Chinese opera style Bian Lian. Similar to Gen's mask in SFIV alt outfit. Every mask is a different move set. This is unusual, as women don't normally practice this style. She never shows her face.





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"Re(3):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Mon 22 Feb 02:26post reply

quote:
Someone in 4chan revealed some details from the leaked roster.

The summaries was given by SAB CA on neo gaf, so I will copy paste them here

- The last boss is compared to an MK Soulnado: He can go anywhere in any point and time, and pluck people into the games realm. Canon Dream match times!

- Alice looks like... Alice.

- Dragon Spirit arc involves the new China team ("demon boy, pillow child, Tung Fu Rue")

-Love Heart and Miu Mio could be redesigned for this game?

- Being owned by the Chinese overlords + getting the China team as a lead is a coincidence. This story path was decided before then, since China is the biggest KoF country in the world, and this game was to appear to a worldwide audience.

- Russian Billionaire boss is most likely a "half naked" shirtless dude.

- Official team's mask girl is said to be a Stance character, practices Chinese opera style Bian Lian. Similar to Gen's mask in SFIV alt outfit. Every mask is a different move set. This is unusual, as women don't normally practice this style. She never shows her face.


yea after reading the source, this will be a confusing bag of chips roster and story wise. They could have 100 characters from all neo-geo/SNK games and while the rest of the series will be a dream match/arc game if that's the case.





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"Re(3):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Mon 22 Feb 04:25post reply

Thank you sibarraz, very interesting tidbits, no matter whether they'll turn out to be true or not.

A shirtless billionaire sounds very SNK-like, in touch with the tradition of Geese, Krauser and Rugal (I'm assuming the mid-boss is a villain, but I know it could be not -see Kagura).

Masked girl=stance character? I'm even more interested in her now.

Looks like SNKP is getting carried away with the time manipulation thing after KOFXIII. I admit it could lead to plot decision that people could deem as shit, but being a BlazBlue fan, I don't mind :D

Chinese Hero Team could have been planned before Ledo's buyout of SNKP? Sounds like a premonition on SNKP's part that they could be acquired by a Chinese conglomerate, just to keep the time shenanigans thing going on LOL





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"Re(3):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Mon 22 Feb 04:45:post reply

quote:

- Russian Billionaire boss is most likely a "half naked" shirtless dude.



Hmmm...
first thing I thought of.

quote:

- Official team's mask girl is said to be a Stance character, practices Chinese opera style Bian Lian. Similar to Gen's mask in SFIV alt outfit. Every mask is a different move set. This is unusual, as women don't normally practice this style. She never shows her face.



This is the coolest thing I've heard about the game so far. Since there's no New Face Team (at least according to the leaks) I'll settle for a character with new faces.





/ / /

[this message was edited by Mosquiton on Mon 22 Feb 04:47]

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"Re(4):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Mon 22 Feb 09:44post reply

quote:

- Russian Billionaire boss is most likely a "half naked" shirtless dude.


Hmmm...
first thing I thought of.


Thanks for the info Sibarraz, I've posted it on the site.

If the potential leak does end up to be true, it'll be interesting to see how the middle boss and last boss get mixed into the storyline.





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"Re(4):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Mon 22 Feb 11:34post reply

quote:

- Russian Billionaire boss is most likely a "half naked" shirtless dude.


Hmmm...
first thing I thought of.


Though it reminded me this bilionaire.
Maybe related somehow.

Also this storyline gives me hope. Characters like Chizuru's hot relative (Reiji the redhead guy) might find himself a way to involve into mainline KoF.





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"Re(5):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Mon 22 Feb 13:36post reply

Wow, it is so weird to see them revisiting the Dragon Spirit stuff now. Wasn't that introduced in KOF '99? And it was never resolved, right?

I am glad to see things coming along nicely with the character models and animations.

I hope it improves everytime we see it.

It is funny that we now have more characters announced for KOF14 than SFV has playable now.





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"SNK Entertainment what??" , posted Mon 22 Feb 16:04post reply

I don't get it if SNK Entertainment is SNKP's new name, a subsidiary of SNKP that replaces their pachinko business or whatever else, but here you are the news...Professor and anyone gifted with some Japanese knowledge, please shed some light on it :D Famitsu article





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"Re(5):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Tue 23 Feb 00:11post reply

quote:
Characters like Chizuru's hot relative (Reiji the redhead guy) might find himself a way to involve into mainline KoF.
I always thought of those characters as being owned by the company or companies responsible for the KOF EX series. I looked at it as kind of like Arika and SFEX, and that is why these characters never resurfaced in any future SNK media.





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"Re(3):Hong Kong C3 Show Stuff" , posted Tue 23 Feb 00:57post reply

quote:
- The last boss is compared to an MK Soulnado: He can go anywhere in any point and time, and pluck people into the games realm. Canon Dream match times!



My favorite thing about DC comics is how they handle their multiverse - it's pretty interesting to see SNK acknowledging and using the concept more seriously.

I wonder if this means KoF will now trump any possibility of a NGBC sequel, or if somewhere down the line they'll dabble in some meta fun a la Ambush Bug or World's Funnest.

For now I'd settle for them having that licensing SNK Entertainment site in English, to make the prospect of deals outside Asia a little less unlikely...





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"Re(1):SNK Entertainment what??" , posted Tue 23 Feb 02:02post reply

quote:
I don't get it if SNK Entertainment is SNKP's new name, a subsidiary of SNKP that replaces their pachinko business or whatever else, but here you are the news...Professor and anyone gifted with some Japanese knowledge, please shed some light on it :D Famitsu article

Is that new member of rumoured southtown team or Geese with an alternative White suit? Also in the opening segment you can see a lotvof Miu Miu that might mean they dont really want those franchises to be buried in Pachi cemetery!





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"Re(1):SNK Entertainment what??" , posted Tue 23 Feb 15:30:post reply

quote:
I don't get it if SNK Entertainment is SNKP's new name, a subsidiary of SNKP that replaces their pachinko business or whatever else, but here you are the news...Professor and anyone gifted with some Japanese knowledge, please shed some light on it :D Famitsu article



Sorry I couldn't pick up on it earlier, the news has been all over the place but it's been a busy day. Anyway you might already know but SNK Entertainment is a new wholly owned subsidiary of SNKP.

SNKP never had a subsidiary of that name but for some reason though, the company claims that they're "reopening" it.

I can only assume they're trying to imply that they're brining back the old SNK.. which isn't convincing, given that this new company doesn't make games. They'll basically run SNKP's licensing businesses, and also work as a production studio that creates videos and helps out on advertisement.

Bottom line, they're trying to go B2B with what experience they already have in making games and pachis.





[this message was edited by Professor on Tue 23 Feb 17:52]

Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(2):SNK Entertainment what??" , posted Tue 23 Feb 23:12:post reply

No problem Professor!! I don't wanna get my hopes too high, but I'm getting the feeling that SNKP is growing more and more serious about re-estabilishing themselves as a somewhat relevant video game company...I actually see it as a desperate struggle, given all the backlash KOFXIV is getting and the dormant state of their other IPs, except Metal Slug which looks in good shape on the mobile business side.





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[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Wed 24 Feb 04:54]

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"Re(3):SNK Entertainment what??" , posted Wed 24 Feb 01:13post reply

I really hope KoF14 is good since I'm going to have to buy a copy if it gives me moments like this.





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"Re(4):SNK Entertainment what??" , posted Wed 24 Feb 18:42:post reply

quote:
I really hope KoF14 is good since I'm going to have to buy a copy if it gives me moments like this.



Oh well, that screen looks climatic...I love how SNKP is teasing bits of the game everyday. Ah! I thought about hits impact a little more, my final opinion is that I find sound effects good, they just need a slightly higher volume. They surely are underwhelming in their current state.

So, Markman suggested that Lupe's next foray against a top player should be on KOFXIV at EVO...does he mean EVO 2017? xD I got in "KOFXIVCONFIRMEDFOREVO2016!!!!!!!!!111ONEONE" MAX mode for a second.

Back to reality, Lupe measured his KOF skills based on how fast he beat time trial in XII...!! *face on keyboard*





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[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Thu 25 Feb 00:35]

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"Re(5):SNK Entertainment what??" , posted Thu 25 Feb 00:18post reply

quote:


So, Markman suggested that Lupe's next foray against a top player should be on KOFXIV at EVO...does he mean EVO 2017? xD I got in "KOFXIVCONFIRMEDFOREVO2016!!!!!!!!!111ONEONE" MAX mode for a second.



There will most likely be a playable demo of XIV at EVO this year.





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"Re(6):SNK Entertainment what??" , posted Thu 25 Feb 01:40:post reply

That's for sure, I wanted my post to focus on the silliest possibilities for the lulz :D I was wondering how many characters the EVO demo could include, given for granted that it has to feature the full Garou Densetsu team for Lupe's convenience...about half of the complete roster?

On a different note, ARE YOU OKAY??





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[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Thu 25 Feb 16:21]

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"Re(7):SNK Entertainment what??" , posted Thu 25 Feb 05:59post reply

quote:
On a different note, ARE YOU OKAY??


Billy's crotch lights up when he takes damage? That's a game mechanic I didn't expect.





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"Re(8):SNK Entertainment what??" , posted Thu 25 Feb 16:29post reply

quote:

Billy's crotch lights up when he takes damage? That's a game mechanic I didn't expect.


After the shocking discovery that Iori isn't the guy Kyo is cheating on Yuki with -(here), you can expect anything from KOFXIV xD





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neo0r0chiaku
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"Re(9):KOF XIV exhibition at KVO?" , posted Fri 26 Feb 22:07post reply

KOF World Facebook page made a post about an exhibition of KOF XIV at this event I believe.
From Facebook page:
【お知らせ】家庭用格闘ゲームの総合ファンイベント ‪#‎KSB2016‬ にて「KOF XIV」の体験会及びエキシビジョントーナメントの開催が決定。詳しくは⇒KVO2k





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"Re(10):KOF XIV exhibition at KVO?" , posted Fri 26 Feb 22:46post reply

I have this feeling that xxx1999shingo1999xxx whatever is back.





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"Re(10):KOF XIV exhibition at KVO?" , posted Fri 26 Feb 22:52post reply

Japanese promotion at last I hope there are 3 characters more compared to the C3 build, and the church ruins stage. It'd especially make sense if K' and Maxima were among the additions to the demo roster.





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Professor
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"Re(10):KOF XIV exhibition at KVO?" , posted Sat 27 Feb 11:31post reply

quote:
KOF World Facebook page made a post about an exhibition of KOF XIV at this event I believe.
From Facebook page:
【お知らせ】家庭用格闘ゲームの総合ファンイベント ‪#‎KSB2016‬ にて「KOF XIV」の体験会及びエキシビジョントーナメントの開催が決定。詳しくは⇒KVO2k




Sorry I'm a bit late on the news but yeah, it's been announced.

Given that Osaka is SNK's homeground and its fighting game scene is more close knit than that of Tokyo, there's no question that KVO organizers have ties to the company. Iirc Umezono (one of the guys behind the Yatagarasu series) was involved in the KVO series.





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"Re(2):Re(10):KOF XIV exhibition at KVO?" , posted Sat 27 Feb 18:24post reply

I didn't know SNK/SNKP had never promoted a game this way in Japan...they're going all out for sure. Feels like a last resort scenario to me.





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kofoguz
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"Re(2):Re(10):KOF XIV exhibition at KVO?" , posted Sat 27 Feb 18:30post reply

quote:
KOF World Facebook page made a post about an exhibition of KOF XIV at this event I believe.
From Facebook page:
【お知らせ】家庭用格闘ゲームの総合ファンイベント ‪#‎KSB2016‬ にて「KOF XIV」の体験会及びエキシビジョントーナメントの開催が決定。詳しくは⇒KVO2k



Sorry I'm a bit late on the news but yeah, it's been announced.

Given that Osaka is SNK's homeground and its fighting game scene is more close knit than that of Tokyo, there's no question that KVO organizers have ties to the company. Iirc Umezono (one of the guys behind the Yatagarasu series) was involved in the KVO series.

Proffessor just to be clear, can we assume we will see full build (with every characters) at the event? It might not be the final product I believe, last tweaks and all.





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"Re(3):Re(10):KOF XIV exhibition at KVO?" , posted Sun 28 Feb 01:20post reply

quote:
Proffessor just to be clear, can we assume we will see full build (with every characters) at the event? It might not be the final product I believe, last tweaks and all.

There is no reason to believe they would show such a build, nor that such a build exists.
They'll show the best they have, with the characters that are somehow ready.





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"Re(4):Re(10):KOF XIV exhibition at KVO?" , posted Sun 28 Feb 12:01post reply

It would make no sense for them to blow their load that early.

They will be generating hype with reveals all the way up to release.





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"Re(3):Re(10):KOF XIV exhibition at KVO?" , posted Mon 29 Feb 00:30:post reply

quote:

Proffessor just to be clear, can we assume we will see full build (with every characters) at the event? It might not be the final product I believe, last tweaks and all.



KVO is in April so it's a bit too early. Though hopefully in summer, they'll announce a release date.





[this message was edited by Professor on Mon 29 Feb 02:21]

kofoguz
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"Re(4):Re(10):KOF XIV exhibition at KVO?" , posted Mon 29 Feb 04:43post reply

quote:

Proffessor just to be clear, can we assume we will see full build (with every characters) at the event? It might not be the final product I believe, last tweaks and all.


KVO is in April so it's a bit too early. Though hopefully in summer, they'll announce a release date.

Thanks. I was confused what to think about it since there was a 2016 February release date with the first reveal. Though I dont think they will be able to release before September for a moment I thought the possibility of an KVO drmo build with every characters. This being SNK adds fuel to the confusion.





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"Re(5):Re(10):KOF XIV exhibition at KVO?" , posted Mon 29 Feb 05:02post reply

quote:
It would make no sense for them to blow their load that early.

They will be generating hype with reveals all the way up to release.


And I am liking this approach. This will have everyone talking and talking more. Even people not familiar with the series will be curious to know what all the talk amongst KOF fans is about. Generating more gamers into the new game. This is a good PR approach. Now what would be nail in the coffin is if they purposely released the trailers when the actual final product is far better then what we have seen. I say keep giving us little by little as time progresses.





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"Re(6):Re(10):KOF XIV exhibition at KVO?" , posted Tue 1 Mar 20:57:post reply

KVO KOFXIV entry form
It's the game that completes the second day roster, right next to SFV and KI, as you can see in the KVO homepage.

I'd like to add that d3v once said in the SRK forums that tournament organizers from his region -he's from Philippines I think- somewhat know KOFXIV won't be tournament material before the end of the year...

LINK

...so? Plans for KOFXIV suddenly changed? I know the KVO build isn't final, but still, it's KOFXIV at a tournament way before late 2016.





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[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Wed 2 Mar 00:40]

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"Re(7):Re(10):KOF XIV exhibition at KVO?" , posted Wed 2 Mar 12:26post reply

quote:

...so? Plans for KOFXIV suddenly changed? I know the KVO build isn't final, but still, it's KOFXIV at a tournament way before late 2016.




It seems realistic considering the game probably won't be out until later in the year.
KVO is taking place in SNKP's local area so they probably felt secure in allowing the event to use a build in progress.





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"Re(8):Re(10):KOF XIV exhibition at KVO?" , posted Wed 2 Mar 17:28post reply

Otto!! I forgot news were talking about an "exhibition" instead of a "proper" tournament all this time :P Anyway, I'm happy to see it featured as one of the main games, despite being a WIP build ^_^





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"Re(9):Re(10):KOF XIV exhibition at KVO?" , posted Thu 3 Mar 09:39post reply

I'm not sure how I feel about that Fatal fury fan film getting funded on Kickstarter - quite a few things still feel pretty off about it, but on the other hand, it's something that might help signal to SNKP that there's some interest in the series out there...

Oddly, checking the Youtube video at the Cafe news news items and the account that pasted it, it's no longer possible to see any listed videos there, but I recall being able to do so before... weird, as many things about the project are...
Let's see if the donations still add up to the total after the remaining 7 hours pass...





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"Re(10):Re(10):KOF XIV exhibition at KVO?" , posted Thu 3 Mar 10:14post reply

quote:
I'm not sure how I feel about that Fatal fury fan film getting funded on Kickstarter - quite a few things still feel pretty off about it, but on the other hand, it's something that might help signal to SNKP that there's some interest in the series out there...

Oddly, checking the Youtube video at the Cafe news news items and the account that pasted it, it's no longer possible to see any listed videos there, but I recall being able to do so before... weird, as many things about the project are...
Let's see if the donations still add up to the total after the remaining 7 hours pass...



Yeah, I hate to be a cynic but something feels kind of scam-ish about the whole thing. That video with the 2 girls reading some badly-written script in perfect commercial English is hilarious yet troubling. And the goal was $10k to produce how much footage? I mean sure, Robert Rodriguez filmed El Mariachi on a budget of $7k but should I be making this comparison...? *watches video again*

All the same, it's not my money so let's see what comes of it!





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"Disappearing Embers videos" , posted Thu 3 Mar 12:02:post reply

quote:
Oddly, checking the Youtube video at the Cafe news news items and the account that pasted it, it's no longer possible to see any listed videos there, but I recall being able to do so before... weird, as many things about the project are...
Let's see if the donations still add up to the total after the remaining 7 hours pass...


That's disturbing-- they were visible when I wrote the article. The videos are still there though. You can check them from the link below:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZiUBWC3zRY&list=UUVMsZFLIO9jql7o_thqkl3g





[this message was edited by Professor on Thu 3 Mar 12:02]

Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(1):Disappearing Embers videos" , posted Thu 3 Mar 16:56post reply

I've been feeling there's something fishy about this so-called fan movie all the time, and the hiding of the videos makes me a bit more suspicious than before...but I also keep forgetting to check the "official" sources to keep up with the news on this project. Big props to the Cafe, it's the only fighting games site -among the ones I know and visit regularly at least- still keeping an eye on this story.





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"Re(1):Disappearing Embers videos" , posted Thu 3 Mar 20:03post reply

quote:
Oddly, checking the Youtube video at the Cafe news news items and the account that pasted it, it's no longer possible to see any listed videos there, but I recall being able to do so before... weird, as many things about the project are...
Let's see if the donations still add up to the total after the remaining 7 hours pass...

That's disturbing-- they were visible when I wrote the article. The videos are still there though. You can check them from the link below:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZiUBWC3zRY&list=UUVMsZFLIO9jql7o_thqkl3g



Maybe it's just related to the YouTube browser interface - checking it on my phone later last night it was possible to see the Videos tab for the account's page with the old videos still there - it's just odd (or, well, another oddity about the whole thing).





...!!

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"Re(2):Disappearing Embers videos" , posted Sun 6 Mar 07:31post reply

Anyone know if these Garou and LB2 matches will be streamed or videos of them will be posted online somewhere?





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"Re(3):Disappearing Embers videos" , posted Sun 6 Mar 11:58post reply

quote:
Anyone know if these Garou and LB2 matches will be streamed or videos of them will be posted online somewhere?



http://www.twitch.tv/gamenewton





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"Re(4):Disappearing Embers videos" , posted Sun 6 Mar 16:31:post reply

I wonder if the "keep on shining" motto owes to this...regardless, good to know it's getting live streaming!!

EDIT: some KOFXIV event in Tokyo on April 26th. Maybe a loketest?





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[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Mon 7 Mar 17:21]

Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(5):Disappearing Embers videos" , posted Wed 9 Mar 18:44:post reply

Sorry for double posting, but KOFXIV will be playable at the Playstation Arena event at Nexon Arena, Seoul, on March 20th.
I wonder what's for dinner what build will be available: the same as C3 in Hong Kong, or a new one with more playable characters?

Besides, I've been investigating on a certain matter lately, only to find myself stuck with no answer: what are the differences between the various revisions of the NeoGeo MVS bios? Minor bugfixes? Supposed better anti-piracy protection? (I don't know if SNK's anti-piracy measures all boil down to there's something at bios level) I'd be really happy if some document existed about it.





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Wed 9 Mar 18:56]

Professor
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"Re(6):Disappearing Embers videos" , posted Wed 9 Mar 19:18post reply

quote:
Sorry for double posting, but KOFXIV will be playable at the Playstation Arena event at Nexon Arena, Seoul, on March 20th.
I wonder what's for dinner what build will be available: the same as C3 in Hong Kong, or a new one with more playable characters?



Posted it, thanks for the heads up!





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"Re(7):Disappearing Embers videos" , posted Wed 9 Mar 20:12post reply

Every time I see this thread with the "Disappearing Embers" title, I'm surprised that we have a dedicated Dark Souls 3 thread here.





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"Re(7):Disappearing Embers videos" , posted Wed 9 Mar 22:14:post reply

quote:
Posted it, thanks for the heads up!


No problem, I'm happy when I can contribute something to the Cafe :D

So, SNKP has established a pattern: one playable showing a month, along with a teaser trailer. We got USA, Taiwan, Hong Kong -okay I know nothing about the Asian market, but does Taiwan counts as China as well marketing wise, given how recent the Chinese console ban lift is?-, and next on the map are South Korea and Japan.

Do you guys think KOFXIV will be shown in other countries too? I honestly think not. Some Latin American countries have console market issues in the form of insane import taxes or something if I remember well, and I think Europe just doesn't love KOF and SNK/SNKP enough to get such an event, even as part of a Sony-sponsored, multi-game thing. But I'd love to be proven wrong.

In case there are no scheduled exhibitions in May and June -E3 looks in trouble...-, I guess they'll make up for it by releasing more than one teaser a month, like they did before December.





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Wed 9 Mar 22:15]

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"Re(8):Disappearing Embers videos" , posted Wed 9 Mar 22:23:post reply

quote:
Posted it, thanks for the heads up!

No problem, I'm happy when I can contribute something to the Cafe :D

So, SNKP has established a pattern: one playable showing a month, along with a teaser trailer. We got USA, Taiwan, Hong Kong -okay I know nothing about the Asian market, but does Taiwan counts as China as well marketing wise, given how recent the Chinese console ban lift is?-, and next on the map are South Korea and Japan.

Do you guys think KOFXIV will be shown in other countries too? I honestly think not. Some Latin American countries have console market issues in the form of insane import taxes or something if I remember well, and I think Europe just doesn't love KOF and SNK/SNKP enough to get such an event, even as part of a Sony-sponsored, multi-game thing. But I'd love to be proven wrong.

In case there are no scheduled exhibitions in May and June -E3 looks in trouble...-, I guess they'll make up for it by releasing more than one teaser a month, like they did before December.


Don't want to sound too political, but Taiwan is not Chinese Taipei just yet(Hopefully that does not happen) like Tibet is definitely not part of China.
I think they will maybe, and a big maybe, go to Mexico. Its a market for them but the risk is where the presentation would be held. They will most likely go to Brazil if its outside of Asia.





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[this message was edited by neo0r0chiaku on Thu 10 Mar 01:52]

Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(9):Disappearing Embers videos" , posted Thu 10 Mar 02:12:post reply

I meant everything only from a marketing standpoint indeed, and I know my reasoning -and the way I wrote it- can come up as a bit convoluted ^^;

Mexico? I'd be VERY happy if the game was promoted there, given how SNKP is seemingly catering to their Mexican fans with the supposed Lucha Libre team and the Guanajato stage ^^ But then again, it's not the most likely place outside Asia.





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Thu 10 Mar 02:12]

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"Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Thu 10 Mar 20:02:post reply

So new daily screenshot displays a giant hand. I liked the idea of rumouredobvious Tung Fu Rue and possible Chon Rei and Chon Shu team (speculations that they were referred/mistarnslated as tattooed devil boy and pillow child) leaked roster doesnt show any other SNK characters iirc Oda said there will be SNK characters as well. I am happy with them. They were pretty good in NGBC.

Edit : Also if devil boy and pillow child are indeed Chon twins, we can assume leaker is not that familiar with the characters in the SNK univrrse. This opens doors to more fun speculations. That would be a good surprise if third member of prisoner team is someone like Alfred which Yasuyuki Oda is posting illustrations of him a lot lately, for example. I know it is farfetched but since Cody can be put in jail why not Alfred? Maybe he landed his plane into traffic while drunk piloting?





[this message was edited by kofoguz on Thu 10 Mar 20:19]

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"Re(2):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Thu 10 Mar 21:50post reply

quote:
So new daily screenshot displays a giant hand. I liked the idea of rumouredobvious Tung Fu Rue and possible Chon Rei and Chon Shu team (speculations that they were referred/mistarnslated as tattooed devil boy and pillow child) leaked roster doesnt show any other SNK characters iirc Oda said there will be SNK characters as well. I am happy with them. They were pretty good in NGBC.

Edit : Also if devil boy and pillow child are indeed Chon twins, we can assume leaker is not that familiar with the characters in the SNK univrrse. This opens doors to more fun speculations. That would be a good surprise if third member of prisoner team is someone like Alfred which Yasuyuki Oda is posting illustrations of him a lot lately, for example. I know it is farfetched but since Cody can be put in jail why not Alfred? Maybe he landed his plane into traffic while drunk piloting?



Oda used a Franco Bash avatar based on his RB2 ending on Facebook for ages and that doesn't resemble any leaked character description unless the design changed a lot - it's perfectly OK and even healthy for the guy to show fondness for older SNK stuff without necessarily making a point to include it in his current project. Mind you, I'm all for a renewed Chonrei appearance in a game, I just doubt XIV will be it.

Speaking of returning character, Whip and Heidern finally become playable in Metal Slug Defense.
It still puzzles me that Metal Slug Attack as a Japanese-only Twitter account of its own while for all I know MSD has been a bit of an international money maker for a while...





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kofoguz
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"Re(3):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Thu 10 Mar 22:48post reply

quote:
So new daily screenshot displays a giant hand. I liked the idea of rumouredobvious Tung Fu Rue and possible Chon Rei and Chon Shu team (speculations that they were referred/mistarnslated as tattooed devil boy and pillow child) leaked roster doesnt show any other SNK characters iirc Oda said there will be SNK characters as well. I am happy with them. They were pretty good in NGBC.

Edit : Also if devil boy and pillow child are indeed Chon twins, we can assume leaker is not that familiar with the characters in the SNK univrrse. This opens doors to more fun speculations. That would be a good surprise if third member of prisoner team is someone like Alfred which Yasuyuki Oda is posting illustrations of him a lot lately, for example. I know it is farfetched but since Cody can be put in jail why not Alfred? Maybe he landed his plane into traffic while drunk piloting?


Oda used a Franco Bash avatar based on his RB2 ending on Facebook for ages and that doesn't resemble any leaked character description unless the design changed a lot - it's perfectly OK and even healthy for the guy to show fondness for older SNK stuff without necessarily making a point to include it in his current project. Mind you, I'm all for a renewed Chonrei appearance in a game, I just doubt XIV will be it.

Speaking of returning character, Whip and Heidern finally become

-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --
That's all speculation. Im not banking on it especially Alfred part. But still there might be more non kof characters.





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"Re(3):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Thu 10 Mar 23:51post reply

quote:
So new daily screenshot displays a giant hand. I liked the idea of rumouredobvious Tung Fu Rue and possible Chon Rei and Chon Shu team (speculations that they were referred/mistarnslated as tattooed devil boy and pillow child) leaked roster doesnt show any other SNK characters iirc Oda said there will be SNK characters as well. I am happy with them. They were pretty good in NGBC.

Edit : Also if devil boy and pillow child are indeed Chon twins, we can assume leaker is not that familiar with the characters in the SNK univrrse. This opens doors to more fun speculations. That would be a good surprise if third member of prisoner team is someone like Alfred which Yasuyuki Oda is posting illustrations of him a lot lately, for example. I know it is farfetched but since Cody can be put in jail why not Alfred? Maybe he landed his plane into traffic while drunk piloting?


Oda used a Franco Bash avatar based on his RB2 ending on Facebook for ages and that doesn't resemble any leaked character description unless the design changed a lot - it's perfectly OK and even healthy for the guy to show fondness for older SNK stuff without necessarily making a point to include it in his current project. Mind you, I'm all for a renewed Chonrei appearance in a game, I just doubt XIV will be it.

Speaking of returning character, Whip and Heidern finally become

-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --


It baffles me that SNKP has 2 similar games simultaneously, they should had find a way to move users from defense to attack.

Attack is a fun game, I somehow like the grind system, but this game is way more pay 2 win than defense, plus the fct that they used a cloud save system that would be archaic even for 2009 standards baffles me





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"Re(4):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Fri 11 Mar 00:29post reply

quote:
It baffles me that SNKP has 2 similar games simultaneously, they should had find a way to move users from defense to attack.

Attack is a fun game, I somehow like the grind system, but this game is way more pay 2 win than defense, plus the fct that they used a cloud save system that would be archaic even for 2009 standards baffles me


It bothers me more that MSA requires being online to even work (and that some MSD events/features have required this too in recent times). I've enjoyed played MSD on my daily commute, but I don't want to have to worry about having to consume my phone's budget to play the game - if the game needed to be online to update, i just did that when I got home, and in the following day would keep playing as usual.

I guess MSD grew more than they expected and they felt it was wise to restructure the whole thing into a new game with a few extra features...

At the same time, AFAIK they never introduced more DLC units to the Steam version of MSD.





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"Re(3):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Fri 11 Mar 00:43post reply

quote:
Whip and Heidern finally become playable in Metal Slug Defense.



It's too bad Whip isn't in XIV's roster. Her attacks would look so much better in 3D.





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"Team Bishonen" , posted Fri 11 Mar 01:31post reply

I guess tying your shirt around your waist is the new thing in fighting games.





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"Re(4):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Fri 11 Mar 01:32post reply

quote:
Whip and Heidern finally become playable in Metal Slug Defense.


It's too bad Whip isn't in XIV's roster. Her attacks would look so much better in 3D.



The whip itself would probably be tricky to animate well at their level of experience...

Meanwhile, new XIV trailer with Tung, Choi and Chin.

Nice to see Tung wearing something with a bit more texture on it, and Choi returning to the stripes, although the pants seem to fit the prisioner theme of the leak.
Is it me or Chin's proportions look taller/more human? Maybe it's the new clothes...





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"Re(2):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Fri 11 Mar 01:39:post reply

IT. WAS. TUNG. You cant imagine how happy I am. Tung is one of my fondest video game memories: fighting games have always been my favorite genre because I see them as interactive shonen anime, and when I first played the Super Famicom port of Garou Densetsu, the combination between Tung's transformation after a couple hits taken and the ever growing rain during the match took the anime-fighting games relationship to a whole new level in my eyes. So, after being a bonus character in XI, welcome again Tung ^_^

Besides, I love how SNKP finally brought Choi Kreuger in, after partly discarding the outfit in '94. I also dig Chin's new outfit, kinda in line to his "well covered" NESTS saga appearance but somewhat different. Don't get me started about Choi's babbling in the end of the teaser, I always get a good laugh from his antics xD

Aaand we get to hear a very brief new bit of the theme song, which I warmly welcome. I have a strong tendency not to like this music style, but I love the infamous KOFXIV song for some reason...





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Fri 11 Mar 02:08]

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"Re(5):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Fri 11 Mar 03:11:post reply

quote:
Whip and Heidern finally become playable in Metal Slug Defense.


It's too bad Whip isn't in XIV's roster. Her attacks would look so much better in 3D.


The whip itself would probably be tricky to animate well at their level of experience...

Meanwhile, new XIV trailer with Tung, Choi and Chin.

Nice to see Tung wearing something with a bit more texture on it, and Choi returning to the stripes, although the pants seem to fit the prisioner theme of the leak.
Is it me or Chin's proportions look taller/more human? Maybe it's the new clothes...



Before my mind goes a bit crazy about how this storyline and timeline will be presented, where does or where would the Fatal Fury Real Bout series takes place in conjunction with KOF? During or after the Orochi Saga?

On another note, can it be possible that Vanessa may well be the Cyborg Boxer? Her fighting style is boxing and based on her background as an assassin, this could fit the profile for her.





Long Live!

[this message was edited by neo0r0chiaku on Fri 11 Mar 03:12]

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"Re(5):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Fri 11 Mar 04:21post reply

quote:

Nice to see Tung wearing something with a bit more texture on it, and Choi returning to the stripes, although the pants seem to fit the prisioner theme of the leak.
Is it me or Chin's proportions look taller/more human? Maybe it's the new clothes...



Choi surely is wearing the same orange prisoner outfit, he has his top tied around his waist.
I like this type of details.
Probably he seems taller because his pose it's less "hunched" this time?





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"Re(6):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Fri 11 Mar 04:46post reply

quote:
Whip and Heidern finally become playable in Metal Slug Defense.


It's too bad Whip isn't in XIV's roster. Her attacks would look so much better in 3D.


The whip itself would probably be tricky to animate well at their level of experience...

Meanwhile, new XIV trailer with Tung, Choi and Chin.

Nice to see Tung wearing something with a bit more texture on it, and Choi returning to the stripes, although the pants seem to fit the prisioner theme of the leak.
Is it me or Chin's proportions look taller/more human? Maybe it's the new clothes...


Before my mind goes a bit crazy about how this storyline and timeline will be presented, where does or where would the Fatal Fury Real Bout series takes place in conjunction with KOF? During or after the Orochi Saga?

On another note, can it be possible that Vanessa may well be the Cyborg Boxer? Her fighting style is boxing and based on her background as an assassin, this could fit the profile for her.



Well considering that in KOF you had ryo and his posse that on the RB timeline are like 20 years older than everyone else, I think that is not worthy to mix both timelines





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"Re(6):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Fri 11 Mar 18:35post reply

quote:
Before my mind goes a bit crazy about how this storyline and timeline will be presented, where does or where would the Fatal Fury Real Bout series takes place in conjunction with KOF? During or after the Orochi Saga?



They're clearly different timelines at this point - the ages of the AoF cast, Geese being alive, someone like B. Jenet not being a child while Geese lives and the like of Sho Hayate running around clearly mean actual dates don't matter too much in the KoF series - the Ash story was pretty much about time being messed with as is...

With the Chinese inclinations the story is rumored to have, it would be neat if it turned out the power of the Jin scrolls from FF would be to enable the creation of the KoF timeline so Geese could be alive there, providing an explanation other than pride as for why he's smiling as he falls to his death in the Real Bout ending...

quote:

On another note, can it be possible that Vanessa may well be the Cyborg Boxer? Her fighting style is boxing and based on her background as an assassin, this could fit the profile for her.



From my understanding Vanessa's more of a spy/agent than an actual assassin - but anyway, I wouldn't expect her design to change too much, she's one of those characters that keeps getting requested but don't appear all that much (like Yamazaki and Oswald), so renewing their design in a big way doesn't seem as important as with recurring guys like Robert.





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"Re(7):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Fri 11 Mar 19:53post reply

Random doubt: does Chin's fire breath look more like a special or a super? Given how he seems to fight XII-XIII style and the number of hits, I think we saw the standard version of a fire breath super.

quote:
They're clearly different timelines at this point - the ages of the AoF cast, Geese being alive, someone like B. Jenet not being a child while Geese lives and the like of Sho Hayate running around clearly mean actual dates don't matter too much in the KoF series - the Ash story was pretty much about time being messed with as is...

With the Chinese inclinations the story is rumored to have, it would be neat if it turned out the power of the Jin scrolls from FF would be to enable the creation of the KoF timeline so Geese could be alive there, providing an explanation other than pride as for why he's smiling as he falls to his death in the Real Bout ending...



I had always been sure the KOF timeline had been thought as a completely separate thing from the Garou Densetsu one from the beginning, but now I'm a bit confused...what if KOF was originally conceived as a reboot of the Gekka/Ryuuko/Garou storyline with added stories and characters, and only a couple years later -I'd dare to say during the development of KOF96- it turned into its own alternate timeline? Nice speculations by the way ^^

The development story, as I remember it, is more or less like this: after making Ryo a dream match secret character in FFS, KOF was conceived as a crossover beat'em up putting FF and AOF characters together, all of them retaining their age from their respective franchises of origin, then the idea was shifted to a versus fighting crossover game, all with no intention of integrating it in the Garou timeline. Is it correct?

Sorry for my nonsense xD





Ore no...kachi da!!

Professor
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"Re(8):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Fri 11 Mar 20:29:post reply

quote:
Random doubt: does Chin's fire breath look more like a special or a super? Given how he seems to fight XII-XIII style and the number of hits, I think we saw the standard version of a fire breath super.

They're clearly different timelines at this point - the ages of the AoF cast, Geese being alive, someone like B. Jenet not being a child while Geese lives and the like of Sho Hayate running around clearly mean actual dates don't matter too much in the KoF series - the Ash story was pretty much about time being messed with as is...
-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --


KOF was initially in development as a team-based fighting game with an original cast but the devs decided to throw in characters from other SNK franchises (bear in mind that FF was SNK's major franchise back during that time). Iirc the AOF/FF dev team never really had contact with the KOF devs during the creation of KOF94 and they didn't know of much details--KOF was basically conceived to be a parallel title as far as both sides were concerned.

And from the way KOF14 is looking, it'll probably take on the same route with time manipulation and maybe even characters from other dimensions.


On a different note, it almost feels as though the 3D artists for KOF14 gave the glossy look to the characters on purpose to resemble the old-style pixel art from the earlier years. As many fans probably know, the first titles were developed by ex-Irem staffs so the characters had an almost metallic gloss to them, sort of like R-Type and other shmups.





[this message was edited by Professor on Fri 11 Mar 20:50]

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"Re(9):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Fri 11 Mar 20:51post reply

KOF 14 may be the worst-looking fighting game of this generation, but it does look fun in motion. And Chin, Choi and Tung are all great additions.

I hope SNKP will show Yuri soon (and that this time she has a normal-sized head and a body that doesn't make her look like a 12 year-old girl, like in XIII). I'd also like to see her in the Ladies Team with Mai and King, while Ryo and Robert would be joined by either Marco Rodriguez or Karman Cole, but eh, can't have everything (and who knows, maybe this could happen in a KOF 15). The important thing is, according to the leaked list, at least she's in the game.





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"Re: Storyline Possibility - Final Version" , posted Fri 11 Mar 23:18:post reply

quote:
Random doubt: does Chin's fire breath look more like a special or a super? Given how he seems to fight XII-XIII style and the number of hits, I think we saw the standard version of a fire breath super.

They're clearly different timelines at this point - the ages of the AoF cast, Geese being alive, someone like B. Jenet not being a child while Geese lives and the like of Sho Hayate running around clearly mean actual dates don't matter too much in the KoF series - the Ash story was pretty much about time being messed with as is...

With the Chinese inclinations the story is rumored to have, it would be neat if it turned out the power of the Jin scrolls from FF would be to enable the creation of the KoF timeline so Geese could be alive there, providing an explanation other than pride as for why he's smiling as he falls to his death in the Real Bout ending...


I had always been sure the KOF timeline had been thought as a completely separate thing from the Garou Densetsu one from the beginning, but now I'm a bit confused...what if KOF was originally conceived as a reboot of the Gekka/Ryuuko/Garou storyline with added stories and characters, and only a couple years later -I'd dare to say during the development of KOF96- it turned into its own alternate timeline? Nice speculations by the way ^^

The development story, as I remember it, is more or less like this: after making Ryo a dream match secret character in FFS, KOF was conceived as a crossover beat'em up put

-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --


Even before KOF 14 was announced, most people would assume that the majority of the recurring characters are either old as fart or training their students. However, let me try one last shot as to what this new storyline would be.

With Prisoner Chang, Choi, and the new prisoner, you would think this story should happen before KOF 94. Reason why is before KOF 94, Kim caught them and put them under his rehab project. Another reason is Kim Master and his wife. With Tung and the possibilities of both Jin brothers, you would think the story should take place during the Orochi saga. Reason is, most of the Real Bout characters were brought into the KOF series in 97. However, with K and his team, in addition to other characters introduced during the NEST saga, you would think this story should take place during or after the NEST saga. Then you have Geese. In which he has been behind the scenes and commanding Billy. With the Jin brothers and Tung being included it would mean that he either returned from the dead, immortal, or just been alive the whole time.

The big speculation is no one that was introduced or connected with the ASH saga is present with this roster. That raises big questions here. What if this is another arc and timeline after NEST? But what about the characters I mentioned before?

What if this new prisoner has been keeping secretly in contact and commanding Chang and Choi all these years? The new prisoner finally escapes or shows his face and brings Chang and Choi back into his command. Let not forget Chang and Choi has protested and always tried to break free from Kim’s rehab project. For this reason, his Master and the Masters wife are brought in to stop this threat. It would be a big risk to bring Kim’s sons into the mix. The same can be said with Terry and Andy entering to stop Geese. They probably did not want to risk bringing in Hokotamaru and Rock so that they can finally settle the score with Geese. With this in mind, these guys had to stop training or finished training with their students.

So I would think the question we would need to ask SNK soon is, does this storyline take place after the ASH saga?

With Tung and the Jin brothers, this can also give the possibility of a new generation of fighters coming soon. Tizoc aka KOD, is also a good hint that some of the Garou characters will also be coming soon. What if Kim, Terry, Andy, and Ryo, finally finished training their students and explain to them to observe the current KOF to prepare them to enter future tournaments.

I can also see that a new Garou game may come before KOF 15. That way, it would be an easier transition to bring them into KOF 15. But like I have been repeating myself, these are what if’s.

How does that sound? Can this be a good possibility?





Long Live!

[this message was edited by neo0r0chiaku on Fri 11 Mar 23:21]

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"Re(9):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Sat 12 Mar 06:00post reply

Thank you Professor for these clarifications ^^ I guess the "KOF initially conceived as a beat'em up" thing isn't true. Who came up with such a rumor in the past?

Neo0r0chiaku, I find your speculation fascinating, I especially like this "new generation" motif. Personally, I hope everything takes place after the Ash saga and Shen and Oswald show up in story mode, because the Dragon Pills affair is connected with the Dragon Spirit side story if I remember well and I think the extent of memory erasure in KOFXIII only covers events in the XIII tournament, but still, your theory is interesting. I guess SNKP is keeping storyline talk for last, after revealing all the characters, gameplay system and modes, so it's gonna take some months before we get to know more.

Nitpicking corner: do I remember well there's only one winpose per character in the demo builds we've seen so far? Reading the rumor that the acting mask girl should take her mask off during her winpose reminded me of this. Besides, there was no special intro before Kyo vs Iori rounds in the demos. I know ranting about intros and winposes is insane when the game has way more serious issues, but I can't help ^^;





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"Re(9):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Sat 12 Mar 11:55:post reply

quote:


On a different note, it almost feels as though the 3D artists for KOF14 gave the glossy look to the characters on purpose to resemble the old-style pixel art from the earlier years. As many fans probably know, the first titles were developed by ex-Irem s



Thank you for this. The other day while watching that pic with all the roster I had the feeling that those models looked very "snk-esque" but I could not really tell what was. The glossy models really make those models look like 94/95. Kof 94 was developed by ex-irem? I didn't know that, I knew that Metal Slug was made by ex Irem, but not KOF, was there some exodus of employees on Irem or what?

By the way, I gave up with SNK timelines as a whole yesterday when I was watching a tournament of Buriki One and realized that on that game that is based on 1999, Ryo has 32 years, screwing with the AOF/FF and KOF timelines at the same time





[this message was edited by sibarraz on Sat 12 Mar 11:56]

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"Athena mobile game quietly canceled?" , posted Sat 12 Mar 13:00post reply

I know we have been getting a steady flow of good KOF XIV news, but I just remembered that Athena iOS game that had THIS banner on the SNK website.

I don't see any mention of it on snkplaymore.co.jp anymore. I don't recall any official statement from SNK about the halt of the development of the game either like how they did with Rhythm of Fighters.

Did I miss something or did SNK hope it would just drop off the radar since there wasn't anything to show to begin with.





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"Re(1):Athena mobile game quietly canceled?" , posted Sat 12 Mar 13:27post reply

quote:
I know we have been getting a steady flow of good KOF XIV news, but I just remembered that Athena iOS game that had THIS banner on the SNK website.

I don't see any mention of it on snkplaymore.co.jp anymore. I don't recall any official statement from SNK about the halt of the development of the game either like how they did with Rhythm of Fighters.

Did I miss something or did SNK hope it would just drop off the radar since there wasn't anything to show to begin with.



If I had to guess maybe was the second.

Besides Metal Slug Defense/Attack, SNK experience on mobile hasn't been very good, halting ROF and BB I guess that they didn't had enough faith to overpopulate the market. What happened to that RPG with lolis that they already released?





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"Re(2):Athena mobile game quietly canceled?" , posted Sun 13 Mar 00:15post reply

quote:
Besides Metal Slug Defense/Attack, SNK experience on mobile hasn't been very good, halting ROF and BB I guess that they didn't had enough faith to overpopulate the market. What happened to that RPG with lolis that they already released?



You mean Sister Quest? According to its Twitter account it still appears to be active and Japan-only. Along the way it managed to include some SNK crossovers, mostly SS girls in it for a while.

I hope the Athena game isn't entirely dropped, just out of focus due to bigger stuff on the horizon - I was pretty intrigued by how it used the Asamiya name, but the classic/heavently design from the older game, then the characters appear to be different for the most part...





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"Re(3):Athena mobile game quietly canceled?" , posted Sun 13 Mar 02:33:post reply

First, I had forgot to comment on Professor's "KOf94 character look in XIV" theory. Getting to know 94 was developed by ex-Irem staffs comes as a big, pleasant surprise to me. I've always looked up to the Irem legacy in SNK, but now I look up to it even more.

As for the mobile Athena game, I stumbled upon its game page a couple weeks ago if I remember well -I was browsing the entire games list at the SNKP official site-, and I thought "who knows how development is going for this game...". Glad to see I'm not the only one who would like to get some news about it.





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Sun 13 Mar 05:20]

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"Re:KOF XI Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs" , posted Sun 13 Mar 02:59:post reply

Oh my! This put a smile of enjoyment on my face the whole way through! Pretty cool!

The King Of Fighters XIII All Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs

@LORD SNK, have you noticed this before on what they show at minute 2:20?





Long Live!

[this message was edited by neo0r0chiaku on Sun 13 Mar 03:00]

Lord SNK
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"Re(1):Re:KOF XI Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs" , posted Sun 13 Mar 04:05:post reply

quote:
Oh my! This put a smile of enjoyment on my face the whole way through! Pretty cool!

The King Of Fighters XIII All Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs

@LORD SNK, have you noticed this before on what they show at minute 2:20?



I played XIII but I didn't noticed half of them!
Like Kushnood Butt, everyone surely saw him, but Malin peeking right behind him, never noticed her!

This is pretty cool. Thanks for the link!





[this message was edited by Lord SNK on Sun 13 Mar 04:10]

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"Re(1):Re:KOF XI Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs" , posted Sun 13 Mar 11:51post reply

quote:
Oh my! This put a smile of enjoyment on my face the whole way through! Pretty cool!

The King Of Fighters XIII All Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs

@LORD SNK, have you noticed this before on what they show at minute 2:20?



I discovered lots of new cameos, I always assumed that eiji was on the kyokugen dojo but never could find him

Also I had never found until now

Tizoc
Cheng
Todoh





Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(2):Re:KOF XI Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs" , posted Sun 13 Mar 17:45:post reply

If I remember well, I had spotted half the cameos before watching the video. I saw it more or less when it was uploaded, but it's nice seeing it as a topic of discussion here, thank you ne0r0!! ^^ The amount of guests SNKP managed to cram into the stages is awesome.

Seriously broken hearted seeing Adel as a cameo instead of an actual playable character though...I really wanted him and that concept team -maybe all related to Betty?- from the XII artbook to make the cut in XIII. At least, there's a whole story mode path written for the purpose of completing his gaiden...

...except this is somewhat creepy to me given that they're brother and sister. Please, tell me I'm not the only one who finds that hug -and Rose's whole oniisama obsession for Adel- ambiguous This reminds me I got something to ask about the Japanese dialogue in the second ending in Code Of Princess...





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Sun 13 Mar 17:47]

Professor
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"Re(10):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Sun 13 Mar 23:26:post reply

quote:
Kof 94 was developed by ex-irem? I didn't know that, I knew that Metal Slug was made by ex Irem, but not KOF, was there some exodus of employees on Irem or what?


Irem closed its videogame business in 1994 so its staff probably started moving out to various companies a bit earlier.


quote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uXnwRY8Jo1Q

Nice video. I think it's missing Esaka stage which has Haoumaru, Shingo, and Kyoko.

Btw it seems get missed out by a lot of people but there's an easter egg in various stages when the ground gets shaken with certain moves. For example in the sumo stage, the label on the wooden gate in the middle of the stage will randomly flip and do a fortune telling. In the UK stage, the female police officer will look back and she'll be either normal or ugly.





[this message was edited by Professor on Sun 13 Mar 23:29]

Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(2):Re(10):Re(10):Giant hand means..." , posted Mon 14 Mar 15:46post reply

Cool :D I vaguely remember the policewoman, but I had never paid attention to the Japan stage sign. I hope KOFXIV will be full of such little details by the time of its release...by the way, as soon as I first saw Terry in the 6th KOFXIV teaser I thought "REAL BOUT!!" upon reading "Get in the ring" on his jacket :P





Ore no...kachi da!!

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"Re(1):Re:KOF XI Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs" , posted Mon 14 Mar 18:42post reply

quote:
Oh my! This put a smile of enjoyment on my face the whole way through! Pretty cool!

The King Of Fighters XIII All Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs

@LORD SNK, have you noticed this before on what they show at minute 2:20?



Wow thank you so much for posting this! I'm surprised at how many of these I missed. I mean some of them are so blatant too! Ah what a delicious glimpse at what could have been if they kept on with this style and this team.

Oh man, I'd give anything for a Samurai Shodown vs Last Blade in this style TT___TT






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"Re(2):Re:KOF XI Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs" , posted Mon 14 Mar 21:23post reply

quote:
Oh my! This put a smile of enjoyment on my face the whole way through! Pretty cool!

The King Of Fighters XIII All Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs

@LORD SNK, have you noticed this before on what they show at minute 2:20?


Wow thank you so much for posting this! I'm surprised at how many of these I missed. I mean some of them are so blatant too! Ah what a delicious glimpse at what could have been if they kept on with this style and this team.

Oh man, I'd give anything for a Samurai Shodown vs Last Blade in this style TT___TT

Especially Seeing Moriya and Charlotte I agree with you more. 8 to 12 characters with the same style and DLC would be I think practical.Imagine Workd Heroes with deathmatches and KOFXII mechanics which was interesting on its own but not very suitable for KOF.





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"Re(3):Re:KOF XI Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs" , posted Tue 15 Mar 00:55:post reply

I remember to ask you a question at last: what's so insanely time consuming in the XII-XIII spriting process? I guess it's the lighting and shading part?

As for XIV, well, here you are a piece of my childhood. SNKP sure is bringing my obsession with the first Tung Fu Rue battle back. Not only they're striking some chords with my heart, they're playing them in a beautiful symphony.

And since the Garou Densetsu 1 days, I've always liked Andy better than Terry. I admit Terry is iconic and Andy's not, it's just a matter of fighting style.

The same screen plus a couple winposes





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Tue 15 Mar 02:28]

Professor
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"Re(2):Re:KOF XI Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs" , posted Tue 15 Mar 01:13:post reply

quote:
Wow thank you so much for posting this! I'm surprised at how many of these I missed. I mean some of them are so blatant too! Ah what a delicious glimpse at what could have been if they kept on with this style and this team.


Nobi: Here's something that might interest you as well-- a comparison beteween old neogeo games and possible influences from Akira.

http://u-a-c-me.doorblog.jp/archives/46776647.html


quote:
I remember to ask you a question at last: what's so insanely time consuming in the XII-XIII spriting process? I guess it's the lighting and shading part?

The lightings and shadings certainly contribute to it since there's a lot of intermediate colors used in the sprites. Fundamentally though, KOFXII/XIII's pixel art still uses a lot of traditional, manual dotting by hand despite that it's based on a 3D model. That's to say, the artist adds in details by drawing/editing dot-by-dot which allows the graphic to have a more blended natural look. Its style is different from just simply filling a line art with colors, which ends up looking more like a coloring book.

http://www.mmcafe.com/news/pics/spritecomparison1.jpg





[this message was edited by Professor on Tue 15 Mar 01:46]

Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(3):Re:KOF XI Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs" , posted Tue 15 Mar 01:57:post reply

quote:
The lightings and shadings certainly contribute to it since there's a lot of intermediate colors used in the sprites. Fundamentally though, KOFXII/XIII's pixel art still uses a lot of traditional, manual handdotting despite that it's based on a 3D model. Its style is different from just simply filling a line art with colors.

http://www.mmcafe.com/news/pics/spritecomparison1.jpg



...how could I forget the main reason is the amount of "handmade" work? >_< Sorry to bother you with another question, but would a similar look be possible with a quicker method? I guess not for 2 reasons:

1) SNKP would adopt it from the beginning (unless it requires knowledge from books or other resources SNKP didn't wanna buy for their employees...sigh)

2) I saw a XII style sprite tutorial on DeviantArt and the author says it takes 7 hours for a single frame. SEVEN FREAKING HOURS. So, if there was a quicker way, the MUGEN scene would be oversaturated with XII style characters IMO, but I've only seen a couple if I remember well.

SNK's obsession with Akira is almost unhealthy xD But I consider it part of its crazy charm ^^





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Tue 15 Mar 02:03]

neo0r0chiaku
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"Re(4):Re:KOF XI Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs" , posted Tue 15 Mar 03:15:post reply

quote:
I remember to ask you a question at last: what's so insanely time consuming in the XII-XIII spriting process? I guess it's the lighting and shading part?

As for XIV, well, here you are a piece of my childhood. SNKP sure is bringing my obsession with the first Tung Fu Rue battle back. Not only they're striking some chords with my heart, they're playing them in a beautiful symphony.

And since the Garou Densetsu 1 days, I've always liked Andy better than Terry. I admit Terry is iconic and Andy's not, it's just a matter of fighting style.

The same screen plus a couple winposes



Even though SNK's games like KOF was not up to par with other 2-D games in terms of graphics, what made the games stood out more in replace of the sprites were the graphic effects of the games. By that I mean the effects of the characters supers and special moves. They made very detailed effects that had its unique style in replace of the coloring and pixels they were not able to process and produce with the limited hardware. Not only that, the backgrounds! It was full of motion up until 1999. Many crowds of people and movement plus the team mates on the side. It makes me wonder why they stop with the team mates on the side with their reactions to hits, wins, lost, and helping a dizzy team mate. 1999 had a good concept with the scenery changing every round. Yet another feature as to why they stop this. It was only evident in the home version of 2002.





Long Live!

[this message was edited by neo0r0chiaku on Tue 15 Mar 03:19]

Lord SNK
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"Re(5):Re:KOF XI Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs" , posted Tue 15 Mar 04:26post reply

quote:
Not only that, the backgrounds! It was full of motion up until 1999. Many crowds of people and movement plus the team mates on the side. It makes me wonder why they stop with the team mates on the side with their reactions to hits, wins, lost, and helping a dizzy team mate.


I loved the team mates showing back there and cheering you.
I think they removed them from '99 and following games because fighters' sprites became bigger and generally more animated, as the Neo Geo memory was always the same they had to cut somewhere.





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"Re(5):Re:KOF XI Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs" , posted Tue 15 Mar 07:34:post reply

quote:
Insane attention to special effects and backgrounds

One of the reasons I love to have frequent sessions with classic SNK games, along with top notch -or at least fun and fascinating- gameplay. And I agree with Lord SNK as for why compromises were made on a certain point, for example Garou with its reduced roster -compared to RB2- and its small, yet insanely animated characters.

Speaking of stages, there's a SNKP stage which has a very special place in my heart...KOFXI's White Town. It's nothing less than a view in front of a cathedral church in Ostuni, a little, beautiful town just about 60km away from where I live, whose real nickname is "la città bianca" (white town, literally). Everything was painstakingly reproduced except some minor details. It's not the most popular Italian place in the world, so I wonder how it got into the game...some SNKP staff member had a vacation there? Regardless, seeing a place so close to me featured in my favorite video game franchise is such a joy. Besides, it's funny how the italian phrase "va in qualche luogo?" ("is he going somewhere?") got into the bonus artwork of Ash walking a dog :D

The real thing VS the KOF stage (the in-game camera is past those tables in the real life picture)





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Tue 15 Mar 07:36]

Neo0r0chiaku
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"Re(6):Re:KOF XI Stage Cameos - Easter Eggs" , posted Tue 15 Mar 11:07:post reply

quote:
Insane attention to special effects and backgrounds
One of the reasons I love to have frequent sessions with classic SNK games, along with top notch -or at least fun and fascinating- gameplay. And I agree with Lord SNK as for why compromises were made on a certain point, for example Garou with its reduced roster -compared to RB2- and its small, yet insanely animated characters.

Speaking of stages, there's a SNKP stage which has a very special place in my heart...KOFXI's White Town. It's nothing less than a view in front of a cathedral church in Ostuni, a little, beautiful town just about 60km away from where I live, whose real nickname is "la città bianca" (white town, literally). Everything was painstakingly reproduced except some minor details. It's not the most popular Italian place in the world, so I wonder how it got into the game...some SNKP staff member had a vacation there? Regardless, seeing a place so close to me featured in my favorite video game franchise is such a joy. Besides, it's funny how the italian phrase "va in qualche luogo?" ("is he going somewhere?") got into the bonus artwork of Ash walking a dog :D

The real thing VS the KOF stage (the in-game camera is past those tables in the real life picture)


Pretty sweet there! I like it when they create stages of actual locations. I think 2002 made many in that regard.

On a prediction note here, I guarantee that Joe, Yuri, Goro, Kim and/or Ramon will be revealed next. After that, Mai, Vice, Mature, Athena, Sie, and Geese will follow suit. I believe they will show the newbies last.





Long Live!

[this message was edited by Neo0r0chiaku on Tue 15 Mar 11:16]

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"KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Tue 15 Mar 12:34:post reply

https://twitter.com/meemeeshion/status/709573063185072128

So, normally I will say that this is totally fake, but with SNKP leaks, I really don't know what to believe anymore

Something about the artworks doesn't convince me, and Alice looks weird

If is fake, kudos for the guy that took the time to do all those artworks





[this message was edited by sibarraz on Tue 15 Mar 12:35]

Doshin
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"Re(1):KOF 14 roster leaked? Again?" , posted Tue 15 Mar 12:42post reply

quote:
https://twitter.com/meemeeshion/status/709573063185072128

So, normally I will say that this is totally fake, but with SNKP leaks, I really don't know what to believe anymore

Something about the artworks doesn't convince me, and Alice looks weird

If is fake, kudos for the guy that took the time to do all those artworks

That Alice looks kind of inconsistent, I agree. Not to say this puts doubt in my mind about the actual text leak, though.





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"Re(1):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Tue 15 Mar 12:43post reply

quote:
https://twitter.com/meemeeshion/status/709573063185072128

So, normally I will say that this is totally fake, but with SNKP leaks, I really don't know what to believe anymore

Something about the artworks doesn't convince me, and Alice looks weird

If is fake, kudos for the guy that took the time to do all those artworks



Alice is definitely a copy and paste of Garou pachislot art. Maybe it's just a placeholder. But I like what I see.





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"Re(2):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Tue 15 Mar 15:09post reply

SF5 is barely out and KOF already has a rival to Laura. Sasuga, SNK.

I assume Kyo is going to be the focus again, if those 'official invitation' team designs are any indication. That bug-eyed girl with the huge forehead doesn't exactly scream main character.





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"Re(3):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Tue 15 Mar 15:17:post reply

I happened to be lurking a 4chan thread being posted on by that supposed leaker person.

EDIT: Nevermind. It's just the pachinko image. Nothing to be excited about...my daftness with the whole pachinko thing got me. Supposedly the significance of it was just to show what Alice will be wearing in-game.





[this message was edited by Doshin on Tue 15 Mar 15:29]

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"Re(2):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Tue 15 Mar 15:19:post reply

If this is fake it's extremely well-done. I've seen a lot of SNK official and fan art and the only portion of any of that which I recognize is the Alice render. The more persistent art style looks vaguely Ogura-ish to me, though I could easily be wrong. That's consistent with what we know about the development of KoFXIV, since it's likely that they're using familiar SNK artists.





[this message was edited by Gojira on Tue 15 Mar 15:21]

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"Re(1):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Tue 15 Mar 15:21post reply

quote:
https://twitter.com/meemeeshion/status/709573063185072128

So, normally I will say that this is totally fake, but with SNKP leaks, I really don't know what to believe anymore

Something about the artworks doesn't convince me, and Alice looks weird

If is fake, kudos for the guy that took the time to do all those artworks



List wise, its OK for me even if its fake or real

To be honest I'm awaiting more on KOFIVX than SFV, but please made the net code "SOLID" so fans and enjoy more online gaming than suffer





Who did this to these dogs ???

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"Re(2):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Tue 15 Mar 15:42post reply

quote:
https://twitter.com/meemeeshion/status/709573063185072128

So, normally I will say that this is totally fake, but with SNKP leaks, I really don't know what to believe anymore

Something about the artworks doesn't convince me, and Alice looks weird

If is fake, kudos for the guy that took the time to do all those artworks


Alice is definitely a copy and paste of Garou pachislot art. Maybe it's just a placeholder. But I like what I see.

I think new member of Prisoner Team is looking very similar to the unused concept from KoFXIII. OLD alien looking like boss concept. I'll post a picture If I found one.





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"Re(3):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Tue 15 Mar 18:12:post reply

Uhmmm...Alice is undoubtedly from Garou Densetsu pachinko art, and the inconsistency of the new teenage singer girl -even compared with other big eyed girls, like Athena- looks suspicious to me. Not to mention the blatant recycle of XIII player select screen assets!! (but netMarble used the whole set of XIII character select artworks to reveal their KOF All Star mobile game, so who knows...) Lastly, Alice's silhouette looks too much a blatant counterpart of Dizzy's first reveals for GGXrd -Rev-. So, I'm very cautious about it, but I still hope it's real, because I've always liked the leaked roster since the beginning -I find it varied and colorful-, I like the artworks -hand drawn stuff at long last...- and 3 chars caught my attention:

1) Kim's master looks so badass, could have a "Mr. Karate" variation of Kim's style
2) her wife, woah she's hot, has a kinda mysteryous look in her eyes
3) Chang and Choi's boss...so weird, yet so fucking badass. He really looks like a psycho jail riot leader to me. If he's for real, I can't wait to try him. And his sky blue beard reminds me of Hakan...sublte jab at him from SNKP? LOL

As for chars that impressed me less than them, but I still find interesting...
1) pretty latin girl looks very pretty indeed, and Freeter is definitely right saying she's SNKP's Laura, but based on looks alone, Kim's master's wife managed to impress me more for some reason, despite my innate love for latinas
2) the supposed Brazilian ninja is yet another Asian portrayal of Zorro hahaha. As a huge Kaiketsu Zorro fan, I actually dig it
3) the third South Town team member looks like a shameless Kurahadol (one of the first One Piece enemies) ripoff, with Shibasaki hints as well...typical Japanese depiction of a Western butler I guess?
4) Mature doesn't have an eyepatch anymore because her hair is more than enough to cover her eye LOL

As a final note, how silly the 19600 combinations marketing stunt is? xD We all know we're gonna see the same edit team on both sides all the time in tournament play and pro matches :P But I also get that it could appeal to the most casual of players in some way.





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Tue 15 Mar 21:43]

Professor
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"Re(4):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Tue 15 Mar 18:30:post reply

Leaving aside whether it's legit or not--which we'll know in due time once SNK relases some images of the new original characters, here's my take on the pic.

- Midboss Antonov looks like a blatant Ripoff between Isaac Asimov and the Russian from Terraformers who's also named Asimov

- A kensou fan was mentioning that the character's hair has never looked like that, so it's not really something that a fanartist could draw by referencing past official artworks

- I don't think Alice's CG was taken from Pachislot assets; it may be a new render.

- Muimui's been redrawn to look older

- The prisoner team boss looks like he was inspired from someone, but I can't finger on who...





[this message was edited by Professor on Tue 15 Mar 21:58]

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"Re(5):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Tue 15 Mar 20:03post reply

The russian boss reminds me of Duke's alternate look from the Maximum Impact games.

The prisoner leader reminds me of Kal Drogo from Game of Thrones, crazy cult leader edition (which is guess is the kind of strong figure Chang and Choi could respect after dealing with Kim) - I'm curious to see him interacting with Kim's master, I wouldn't be surprised if there was either a backstory or a future there.

The master's wife looks like a solid design with the sobriety of Chizuru and maturity of Vanessa - the latter gets requested a lot, but maybe this new lady will fill the void (and be ignored by whatever outrage monger decides to pick on KoF for its female designs after just noticing Mai and her likely physics).

Looks like Nakoruru's going for one of her cloak outfits here?...

I'm sad that Ryo looks the same, after so many classic designs got tweaked - must be ever look like a bland orange stain on screen when there are finer takes on him like his Wild Ambition Mr Karate look?

Odd that we see more of the 1st member of Tung's team (likely new protagonist? I expect the official invite guys to be antagonists), since for everyone else we mostly see the faces, but his takes less than half of the picture...


Also Professor, in the new news item Alice is referred to as Tanaka, but wasn't it Alice Garnet Nakata?





...!!

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"Re(5):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Tue 15 Mar 21:52post reply

quote:
- I don't think Alice's CG was taken from Pachislot assets; it may be a new render.
You might be right. I couldn't find this particular render through any searches. The pachislot does use a similar (or even same) model, but the pose itself is somewhat different. Hint: look at the way the shoulders are oriented.

So the render is possibly more special than I thought?





Professor
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"Re(6):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Tue 15 Mar 22:02:post reply

quote:
- I don't think Alice's CG was taken from Pachislot assets; it may be a new render.You might be right. I couldn't find this particular render through any searches. The pachislot does use a similar (or even same) model, but the pose itself is somewhat different. Hint: look at the way the shoulders are oriented.

So the render is possibly more special than I thought?



Well the thing which captured my interest is that

1- the render looks like it was specifically posed to look good in a vertically rectangular box (a la character select icon)

2- the render seems to match with the silohuette


Loona: Fixed Alice's name, thanks!


We'll move on to the next thead once the discussions on the pic phases out.





[this message was edited by Professor on Tue 15 Mar 22:03]

neo0r0chiaku
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"Re(6):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Tue 15 Mar 22:07:post reply

quote:
The russian boss reminds me of Duke's alternate look from the Maximum Impact games.

The prisoner leader reminds me of Kal Drogo from Game of Thrones, crazy cult leader edition (which is guess is the kind of strong figure Chang and Choi could respect after dealing with Kim) - I'm curious to see him interacting with Kim's master, I wouldn't be surprised if there was either a backstory or a future there.

The master's wife looks like a solid design with the sobriety of Chizuru and maturity of Vanessa - the latter gets requested a lot, but maybe this new lady will fill the void (and be ignored by whatever outrage monger decides to pick on KoF for its female designs after just noticing Mai and her likely physics).

Looks like Nakoruru's going for one of her cloak outfits here?...

I'm sad that Ryo looks the same, after so many classic designs got tweaked - must be ever look like a bland orange stain on screen when there are finer takes on him like his Wild Ambition Mr Karate look?

Odd that we see more of the 1st member of Tung's team (likely new protagonist? I expect the official invite guys to be antagonists), since for everyone else we mostly see the faces, but his takes less than half of the picture...


Also Professor, in the new news item Alice is referred to as Tanaka, but wasn't it Alice Garnet Nakata?


Is it me or the girl singer on the Official Invitation team looks like the artist from Odin Sphere drew? Or maybe even a character alike from that game? Did not know the Ninja is Brazilian based on what one cafe member stated. The Latin girl looks Brazilian indeed. But would not be a Latin girl if she is Brazilian. Second comes to mind is Columbia so I would think she is Columbian based on her looks! The cyborg boxer would probably hail from Venezuela, Ecuador, or Colombia. I would say Venezuela. Someone did say a while ago that the 3rd South Town member was Geese’s butler but denied that prediction. The guy from the leak does indeed look like a butler. So he must be, like what Sebastian Michaelis always quotes, "one hell of a butler."

I wonder, if they defeat this non-human species boss, will the alternate world characters disappear? Maybe not but maybe they will not return to the KOF tournaments. I think this 3rd villain fits well and completes the crazy personalities that Chang and Choi have combined.

Does anyone know what ending in KOF XIII everyone is referring to for the hooded man? I tried to look at all the endings but was not clear to me.

16 new characters + 2 new boss Characters > SFV characters lol





Long Live!

[this message was edited by neo0r0chiaku on Tue 15 Mar 22:13]

Doshin
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"Re(7):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Tue 15 Mar 22:41post reply

quote:
2- the render seems to match with the silohuette
I can't recall the silhouette, to be honest. If you don't mind, could you show it to me?

Also, this came from that JohnXuandou person on 4chan about the little inconsistencies in art style:
quote:
There are two artists on the team. One is Eisuke Ogura who did all of XIII's art and the other is a new artist. The new artist I knew beforehand did Athena's art. Alice's art is placeholder art from the Fatal Fury pachinko game because she did not get a redesign.
He seems to be rather insistent that this is all real.





Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(7):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Tue 15 Mar 23:01:post reply

quote:
Brazilian ninja

I called him Brazilian ninja because he's called like this in at least a couple versions of the text report of the leak. Between the two guys in the South America team, the masked one looked more "ninja-like" to me.

If I remember well, the hooded man isn't part of any ending, but he's featured in the together with the whole "Those from the distant land" crew





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Tue 15 Mar 23:04]

Professor
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"Re(8):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Tue 15 Mar 23:27:post reply

quote:
I can't recall the silhouette, to be honest. If you don't mind, could you show it to me?
http://www.mmcafe.com/news/posts/10133.html

I dearly hope it's not unreleased asset from Garou Premium slot; She has a very similar pose in an asset used in the site, but it's not the same and doesn't match with the icon either (different facial angle).


quote:
Does anyone know what ending in KOF XIII everyone is referring to for the hooded man? I tried to look at all the endings but was not clear to me.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8F4U7coh-QE#t=25s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqzNhQhLVwA#t=6s





[this message was edited by Professor on Tue 15 Mar 23:38]

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"Re(9):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Wed 16 Mar 00:19post reply

Random observations on this possible leak:

There are a lot of bearded middle aged men in that roster. Considering I usually think of original KoF characters as young people who dress in fashions that are twenty years out of date this is a big change.

The idol singer girl has eyes the size of dinner plates. Wait, isn't being an idol Athena's shtick? Perhaps there will be a subplot about them fighting it out to secure fans and recording contracts. It will be like the Iori/Orochi team grudge from KoF97 only more grounded in reality.

I would like to see more of Opera Mask Girl and Kim's Master's Wife since they look promising. I would also like some names for these characters since "Kim's Master's Wife" is an awful designation.





neo0r0chiaku
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"Re(9):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Wed 16 Mar 01:34:post reply

quote:

Does anyone know what ending in KOF XIII everyone is referring to for the hooded man? I tried to look at all the endings but was not clear to me. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8F4U7coh-QE#t=25s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqzNhQhLVwA#t=6s


hhhmmm, maybe my prediction will be right after all. She did state that she failed and had to start all over again. Meaning go back in time to start over their plan. So, yes, indeed this might take place after the NEST saga and everything in the ASH arc has disappeared. The hooded man from Saiki's group will have a more direct intervention role. However, based on this leak, his design on his clothes does not match the designs presented in KOF XIII.

On the latest roster leak, they may be right about the legit part but this concept art is truly "Concept" art and is not final. I think the designs and looks of these new characters will looks entirely different then its final version. I just hope SNKP keep on giving us little by little because it will make it all the better.

50 characters is way enough to keep a game running for one year. Its not SFV or GG where DLC will help the game last longer and for multiple years. Lets remember that KOF happens, or at least should, once a year. 50 for one year, that is enough(even for two years). No need for DLC as that will kill off the original roster itself.





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[this message was edited by neo0r0chiaku on Wed 16 Mar 01:40]

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"Re(10):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Wed 16 Mar 01:38post reply

quote:
I would also like some names for these characters since "Kim's Master's Wife" is an awful designation.



You will however get a lot of mileage depending on what is a possessive and what is a contracted verb in that designation.





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"Re(2):Re(10):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Wed 16 Mar 04:00post reply

quote:
You will however get a lot of mileage depending on what is a possessive and what is a contracted verb in that designation.
It would at least answer the question of whether or not Kim would make a good bride for Master.





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"Re(2):Re(10):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Wed 16 Mar 04:02:post reply

"Kim's Master's Wife" or not, the white streak in her hair reminds me of Chae Lim. While it's not like that kind of thing is hereditary (is it?), if there's not some relation it'd be an odd coincidence. I don't quite recall the story of Chae Lim aside from her being one of Kim's more devoted students, but could it be an Eddy Gordo/ Christie thing where she's the daughter/granddaughter of his master?





[this message was edited by Gojira on Wed 16 Mar 04:06]

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"Re(3):Re(10):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Wed 16 Mar 04:58post reply

quote:
I don't quite recall the story of Chae Lim aside from her being one of Kim's more devoted students, but could it be an Eddy Gordo/ Christie thing where she's the daughter/granddaughter of his master?



Maybe we can get a rival Korea team in XV with Jhun, Chae Lim, and May Lee and find out.





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"Re(4):Re(10):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Wed 16 Mar 19:12:post reply

Sorry for sounding too much of a conspiracy theorist but...what if SNKP or Leyou has been in complete control of the leaks all the time in order to get the audience more interested to KOFXIV? Even without believing the leaked player select mockup from yesterday, the amount of information correctly leaked is just scary...

Clark carelessly kicking his way to getting crushed by beast Tung xD





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[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Wed 16 Mar 19:13]

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"Re(7):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Wed 16 Mar 21:20post reply

quote:
The Latin girl looks Brazilian indeed. But would not be a Latin girl if she is Brazilian.


Why not? Brazil is part of Latin America, after all.

The new characters look interesting. None of the returning ones made me interested (not even Yuri, and she's always been my favorite), but depending on how the newcomers look and play, this may be one of the coolest entries in the franchise, even with the bad graphics.

(by the way, Mature and Vice will return AGAIN? I thought dead characters only returned in dream matches, but if they're returning in a game with a story for the second time, maybe Yashiro, Shermie, Chris and Rugal will have their chance in a KOF XV or XVI... maybe even Goenitz)





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"Re(8):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Wed 16 Mar 21:57:post reply

quote:
(by the way, Mature and Vice will return AGAIN? I thought dead characters only returned in dream matches, but if they're returning in a game with a story for the second time, maybe Yashiro, Shermie, Chris and Rugal will have their chance in a KOF XV or XVI... maybe even Goenitz)


Reading the KOFXIII Yagami team prologue, I'd say SNKP either retconned their death for XIII or have always thought of the Hakkeshu as creatures who can raise from the dead at will...





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[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Wed 16 Mar 21:58]

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"Re(9):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Thu 17 Mar 02:06post reply

quote:
Reading the KOFXIII Yagami team prologue, I'd say SNKP either retconned their death for XIII or have always thought of the Hakkeshu as creatures who can raise from the dead at will...



Either of these choices would be a wise one. That way, it will be possible to use the Orochi-related characters outside of dream matches, and most of the KOF fanbase would probably be happy with that. I know I would, at least.





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"Re(10):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Thu 17 Mar 03:37post reply

quote:
Either of these choices would be a wise one. That way, it will be possible to use the Orochi-related characters outside of dream matches, and most of the KOF fanbase would probably be happy with that. I know I would, at least.



I totally agree, they definitely are some charismatic characters...but a quick glance at the KOF XIV hashtags harshly brought me back to reality. Someone expressed his wish for a good netcode, which is rare among KOFXIV-related thoughts. What about the netcode? I'd like to repeat that I'm absolutely not willing to wait for the inevitable Steam edition in order to get a GOOD online experience. But hell, the majority of people are too busy talking shit about XIV because of its subpar graphics to actually care about such a trivial issue as netcode reliability...





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"Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 00:22post reply

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3QhWr2Qz5c

I was not expecting THAT.
On the good side of things: characters keep improving, and that KOF96 stage is nice.





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"Re(1):Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 00:47post reply

KoF14 has been struggling to find a visual identity. This trailer has made me realize that some sick part of me now wants the entire game to look like it erupted out of Kyary Pamyu Pamyu's head.

Other pointless points:

I still hate Angel's voice but I'm glad that Billy Kane continues to sound like a talking goat.

Someone needs to animate Terry's hair.

It's good to see that a person on staff recognizes that KoF96 had the best stages of the series.





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"Re(2):Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 01:01post reply

So it would be her?

I like the idea, very KOF-ish, but I think it's a potentially good design missing the mark in practice. I am almost regretting Falcoon at this rate...





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"Re(3):Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 02:25post reply

Bao/Sylvie/Mignon for XV, they can be team "dealwithit"





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"Re(2):Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 02:36:post reply

quote:
KoF14 has been struggling to find a visual identity. This trailer has made me realize that some sick part of me now wants the entire game to look like it erupted out of Kyary Pamyu Pamyu's head.

Other pointless points:

I still hate Angel's voice but I'm glad that Billy Kane continues to sound like a talking goat.

Someone needs to animate Terry's hair.

It's good to see that a person on staff recognizes that KoF96 had the best stages of the series.



Getting Kim ready for S. Korea presentation this weekend. Sylvie Paula Paula fights like a mix of Brightman from Megaman NT and Mighty No.3 Dynatron.
So glad to see Boss team stage from 96. Hope they use the boat also. Kim's team stage from 96 was also amazing in that game. I still think 94 had the best stages in the series. Love what they did with Vice here.

Edit: oh my, will you look at this The real Sylvie!
Another lawsuit for SNK. lol Maybe she will do the intro to the game!





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[this message was edited by neo0r0chiaku on Fri 18 Mar 02:45]

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"Re(3):Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 03:40:post reply

I'm actually not completely offended by whatever that is yet. Yeah she looks like an absolute troll with the megaphone pose but the fact she's only one of 50 kind of makes it not a big deal.

And of course if there was any doubt about the leaked roster image before there's no way that any merely wishful fan fabrication would have accurately predicted this.

Edit: Oh yeah I forgot I was going to comment on Kyo, whose face changed yet again yet no matter how much they try they just can't seem to nail his look. They even added eye shadow this time for some reason so he's starting to resemble L from Death Note





[this message was edited by Gojira on Fri 18 Mar 04:21]

Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(1):Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 03:54post reply

It's fucking Kyary!! And it's the first entirely new character revealed in an official teaser, just a couple days after the player select mockup/pitch/whatever leak. I love it when SNK/SNKP rips celebrities off so blatantly, SNK wackyness at its best. But what really had my jaw drop is that I actually find her fighting style interesting. She looks like a child yet she's such a fierce fighter. Those lightning nets she uses to smash her opponent into the ground.



Spoiler (Highlight to view) -
...lightning? In before pedo jokes involving her and Benimaru

End of Spoiler



I would have never bet a cent on it, because characters like her -Platinum The Trinity, I'm looking at you- usually have styles that don't click with me.

Vice looks more psycho and perverted than ever -someone made a screen where she clearly looks like she's licking the floor instead of howling LOLOLOL-, and unsurprisingly there's Kim just in time for the Korean event.

My only gripe with the teaser is Kyo's new look...talk about a digital botox overdose. They're making him look worse and worse each teaser.

A good thing, for me that I've always liked the leak, is that the video makes 2 important steps in the direction of confirming the roster picture: Sylvie is a huge eyed blondie and Vice's outfit is just the one in her portrait.

As for "old" characters, KoD crashing his opponent into the camera is an absolute delight. I just hope his fall to the ground is actually seen in the full game like in Garou, instead of happening offscreen.

There's a lot of nostalgia going on in the stages, now we have one from 2000 (sort of) and 2 from '96, and I love it.

But the part I like the best is Vice's full moon phrase in the end. Fantastic. (what if the next teaser was actually scheduled for the next full moon? LOL)





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"Re(1):Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 03:57post reply

quote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3QhWr2Qz5c

I was not expecting THAT.
On the good side of things: characters keep improving, and that KOF96 stage is nice.



That leak is completely legit, isn't it?

I have to agree that the game does look like it keeps getting gradually better. I'm convinced that they are trying, and while the railway doesn't look quite sturdy enough to support the Hype Train, I have purchased a seat on the "Cautious Optimism Train" and hope to disembark at "Pleasantly Surprised" station.

Of course they just earned some big points with me because Vice looks really good! Her new costume looks like a successful hybrid of the new and old costumes. She has the KOFXIII-style Mayhem->Splash, but I'm guessing they haven't decided whether to do old-school snake arm (throw) or KOFXIII-style snake-arm (pull opponent to you leaving them standing). Hoping for the former. And still secretly hoping for the CvS2 anti-air snake arm, although seeing Splash makes it feel like a longshot.

I'm into the new final hit of Negative Gain (I'm assuming they still follow the rule of threes and this is the third hit). I actually always kind of thought that move could use a little something extra. Her cinematic SDM (or whatever the kids call them these days) actually looks like it has some impact... it looks miles better than poor Clark's who moves through the air like some kind of dirigible.

So yeah, not bad. I have to wonder if Vice has a fan on the dev team and is getting a little extra love... she does open and close the second half of the trailer with quotes. Anyway, I'm now on board. I will play this game later on the night of the full moon.

Oh. New character. Well, it's clear what they're going for and she's not awful. One of many characters, at any rate.

ONE LAST THING:

Could someone educate me on Tung Fu Rue? I'm kind of interested. Essentially, what's his playstyle usually been like, and what might he do in this KoF? I have not played a lot of Fatal Fury and I skipped KOF 11, so looking through my own personal lens of experience, he kind of looks like SF's Yun as an old guy using DBZ's Master Roshi as a stand. Accurate? Not accurate?





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"Re(1):Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 04:01post reply

quote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3QhWr2Qz5c

I was not expecting THAT.
On the good side of things: characters keep improving, and that KOF96 stage is nice.



Holy cripes, that's totally unexpected! That... agh forget it, total brainfreeze.

It seems to resemble the icon in the screenshot leak.





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"Re(3):Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 04:20post reply

quote:
So it would be her?

I like the idea, very KOF-ish, but I think it's a potentially good design missing the mark in practice. I am almost regretting Falcoon at this rate...



Me too, I hope the other new characters have a little bit less "eccentric" design.





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"Re(8):KOF 14 roster leaked?" , posted Fri 18 Mar 05:22:post reply

quote:
by the way, Mature and Vice will return AGAIN? I thought dead characters only returned in dream matches

In XIII they're spirits haunting Iori -- and in his ending they suggest they're not ready to leave him alone any time soon.

EDIT: Meant to say XIII.





[this message was edited by aderack on Fri 18 Mar 05:25]

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"Re(2):Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 05:25post reply

quote:
Tung's fighting style

Mosquiton, I'd say your definition of Tung is right, but unlike from Yun, he has a mid range projectile. It looks short ranged, but Its hitbox is quite longer than you'd think. I wonder if it will keep this property in KOFXIV...





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"Re(1):Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 06:05post reply

quote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3QhWr2Qz5c

I was not expecting THAT.
On the good side of things: characters keep improving, and that KOF96 stage is nice.

Well at first, like everyone else, I was shocked and confused, as I was the same when I first saw KOD. Like KOD, she grew up on me, for several reasons.
First she is based on a real person.
And then she got the joke character part covered. It would be hard to top that.
By comparison she made Mignon,Bao, Momoko, Choi, Chang and everybody else, hell even Hyane look like serious, respected politicians. I actually chuckled when I saw Kula tries to be cute. (Pfft grow up girl!).
She uses elektromagnetism. "Lost" viewers know most important main actor in the show was electromagnetism. I am not a scientist to know how plausible her power is but I believe her power is related to the story and might actually open doors for some scifi elements. I was expecting water wielding pratogonist this time, since in kof many elements (mostly fire) are already used, poison, darkness, lightning, light, earth, etc. Maybe they bring back Leona's water using father Gaidel, in the next chapter to conclude her story maybe?
Anyway seems like Masked girl with stances will be the main pratogonist and I am ok with that. And Sylvie Paula Paula using a new element exciting. I eish somehow shd voild do some interaction with people that has metal weapons.
Also since we have the ancestor dinosaurs, why shouldnt we have the evolution of it; chickens!
It is obvious from the costume but also from her elektromagnetism throw it can be seen that she mimics chickens' walking and eating. I find it cool since Griffon is out, we need more birds!

I am still not sold on Vice dress though. But glad old moves of her an other characters are coming back or being updated with new styles, especially on Chin's case.

Glad theyre continuing remaking classic stages.But Im not so sure where is the masquerade/ball stage is from.Is it new? Though it reminds me of TFTP crews unfinished team's background. The one where Saiki collected energy. Or similar one in MI series.





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"Re(2):Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 06:54post reply

quote:
Could someone educate me on Tung Fu Rue? I'm kind of interested. Essentially, what's his playstyle usually been like, and what might he do in this KoF? I have not played a lot of Fatal Fury and I skipped KOF 11, so looking through my own personal lens of experience, he kind of looks like SF's Yun as an old guy using DBZ's Master Roshi as a stand. Accurate? Not accurate?



He had 4 versions along the time, ffs, rbffs, rbff2 and neogeobattle colliseum/kof 11, so it's difficult to predict how he will come up this time. But the trailler shows some classic moves

-midrange projectyle Shou Ha(ffs [1]6p, rbff2 and ngbc 236a)
-"power tackle" rush punch Shin Shippu (214p)
-"the hulk" antiair/combo tool Geki Ha (mash P in ffs/rbffs, 236S and hold S in rbff2)
-thousand kicks...this move didn't show up since ffs. It used to be a command throw with the command [1]9k from close, but he comboed it too easily in trailer 7. So i expect the command or proprieties to have changed.
-"super spin" Senpu Gouken (6 426ks in rbff2)
-super with invul at the start with overhead at the end - Super Geki Ha (6 426s in rbff2)

Maybe he have one more move from past incarnations or something new not showed yet, but this is not guarantee.

Things from the past include a diagonal projectyle of rbffs, dp of rbff2 and a divekick from neogeobattle colliseum.





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"Re(3):Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 09:59post reply

quote:
Mosquiton, I'd say your definition of Tung is right, but unlike from Yun, he has a mid range projectile. It looks short ranged, but Its hitbox is quite longer than you'd think. I wonder if it will keep this property in KOFXIV...



I'm starting to think I might like this character...

quote:
Could someone educate me on Tung Fu Rue? I'm kind of interested. Essentially, what's his playstyle usually been like, and what might he do in this KoF? I have not played a lot of Fatal Fury and I skipped KOF 11, so looking through my own personal lens of experience, he kind of looks like SF's Yun as an old guy using DBZ's Master Roshi as a stand. Accurate? Not accurate?


He had 4 versions along the time, ffs, rbffs, rbff2 and neogeobattle colliseum/kof 11, so it's difficult to predict how he will come up this time. But the trailler shows some classic moves

-midrange projectyle Shou Ha(ffs [1]6p, rbff2 and ngbc 236a)
-"power tackle" rush punch Shin Shippu (214p)
-"the hulk" antiair/combo tool Geki Ha (mash P in ffs/rbffs, 236S and hold S in rbff2)
-thousand kicks...this move didn't show up since ffs. It used to be a command throw with the command [1]9k from close, but he comboed it too easily in trailer 7. So i expect the command or proprieties to have changed.
-"super spin" Senpu Gouken (6 426ks in rbff2)
-super with invul at the start with overhead at the end - Super Geki Ha (6 426s in rbff2)

Maybe he have one more move from past incarnations or something new not showed yet, but this is not guarantee.

Things from the past include a diagonal projectyle of rbffs, dp of rbff2 and a divekick from neogeobattle colliseum.



Thanks for this old-school info dump, I appreciate it. It looks like this guy has used almost every tool in the book at some point. I will definitely have to check him out. I'd love for him to have the mid-range projectile in this one, I'm a big fan of stuffing attacks from that distance.





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"Re(4):Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 17:52post reply

From the Korean PlayStation blog

Vice has Deicide, but the picture is intentionally ambiguous so we don't know if it's old school style or XIII style.

Story wise, Sylvie could be part of the remnants of NESTS, and what remains of the organization could have something to do with the tournament organizer. Sylvie's affiliation would explain why she's so fierce compared to Athena, and reminds me how somebody had speculated she could be a rival to her. Also, this focus on NESTS made me think "maybe ne0r0 has made the right timeline guess?"





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"Re(5):Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 18:45post reply

quote:
From the Korean PlayStation blog

Vice has Deicide, but the picture is intentionally ambiguous so we don't know if it's old school style or XIII style.

Story wise, Sylvie could be part of the remnants of NESTS, and what remains of the organization could have something to do with the tournament organizer. Sylvie's affiliation would explain why she's so fierce compared to Athena, and reminds me how somebody had speculated she could be a rival to her. Also, this focus on NESTS made me think "maybe ne0r0 has made the right timeline guess?"



I figure associating Sylvie with NESTS primarily justifies keeping K's team around (while giving Ramon a reason to stay close to Angel to investigate her ties to them) while making sure just a garish design has villainous associations, which is fine with me. The way she smiles looks forced, which could be part of her persona, and it's hopefully intentional and not an issue with the devs' ability to model faces.

Loving how Vice's brutality shines through with the extra camera work, and the new outfit is a nice compromise between her previous designs - it could do without the cleavage, but my focus tends to gravitate to her hands anyway.


Regarding Tung, I miss his full giant transformation mode from FF1 - IIRC in RBS he had an attack or two where he just grew his arm for a strong attack, so I guess if that sort of thing makes it back too I'd be OK with it. He could do without an attack from the same came where he fires an anti-air projectile from his mouth though, that always feels odd.





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"Re(5):Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 19:33post reply

quote:
From the Korean PlayStation blog

Vice has Deicide, but the picture is intentionally ambiguous so we don't know if it's old school style or XIII style.

Story wise, Sylvie could be part of the remnants of NESTS, and what remains of the organization could have something to do with the tournament organizer. Sylvie's affiliation would explain why she's so fierce compared to Athena, and reminds me how somebody had speculated she could be a rival to her. Also, this focus on NESTS made me think "maybe ne0r0 has made the right timeline guess?"



I coincendently picked up on the news albiet from another site-- translation of her profile is up.

Tung is an interesting character-- it's like the developers just threw in a bunch of nice moves when they initially reinvented him for FFSpecial, but his arms and legs were short as a Welsh Corgi that he was considered pretty weak back then iirc.





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"Re(6):Pamyu Pamyu" , posted Fri 18 Mar 19:47:post reply




LONGTHREAD TOO LONG, MOVE TO NEXT!

http://www.mmcafe.com/cgi-bin/forums/bbs/messages/13585.shtml







[this message was edited by Professor on Fri 18 Mar 19:47]