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Professor
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"SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Millenium?" , posted Fri 7 Aug 00:22post reply

Can someone fluent in Chinese do a brief translation or so on these articles? thanks.

http://game.donews.com/201508/2899257.shtm
http://www.yicai.com/news/2015/08/4666326.html






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"Re(1):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Millenium" , posted Fri 7 Aug 01:00post reply

quote:
Can someone fluent in Chinese do a brief translation or so on these articles? thanks.

http://game.donews.com/201508/2899257.shtm
http://www.yicai.com/news/2015/08/4666326.html



I saw this one too on Twitter: http://tech.sina.com.cn/i/2015-08-06/doc-ifxftkpe2767906.shtml





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"Re(2):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Millenium" , posted Fri 7 Aug 01:08post reply

quote:
Can someone fluent in Chinese do a brief translation or so on these articles? thanks.

http://game.donews.com/201508/2899257.shtm
http://www.yicai.com/news/2015/08/4666326.html


I saw this one too on Twitter: http://tech.sina.com.cn/i/2015-08-06/doc-ifxftkpe2767906.shtml




Edit: Running Google Translate on the game.donews.com URL, a part of it seems to compare the potential of the SNK IPs in a way similar to Marvel's - sounds overly ambitious, and frustrating if it means any efforts are kept in China or Asia... it's probably better to wait for a proper translation, but curious none the less...





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"Re(3):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Millenium" , posted Fri 7 Aug 02:18post reply

Reuters confirms it, but doesn't provide a translation of the larger release document.





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"Re(4):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Millenium" , posted Fri 7 Aug 02:28post reply

Dream Cancel has a more eloquent translation and recap.





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"Re(5):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Millenium" , posted Fri 7 Aug 04:39post reply

quote:
Dream Cancel has a more eloquent translation and recap.



I read much to the same effect on NeoGAF, but I seriously trust anything linked to from this site much more than from that one for reasons rational and sentimental.

I can't wait to see Andy Seto's work canonized! /s

Developing a unified cross-media presence demands a ton of capital but can be incredibly powerful. Trying to make a legitimately good SNK property themed movie sounds like a challenge, though.





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"Re(6):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Millenium" , posted Fri 7 Aug 04:48post reply

quote:
Trying to make a legitimately good SNK property themed movie sounds like a challenge, though.


Plenty of Chinese characters to go around.


Anyways, SNKP hasn't released anything in a long time, this could only help them. I mean, look at the release schedule for the mainline KOF games, not counting ports and remakes:

'94: KOF94
'95: KOF95
'96: KOF96
'97: KOF97
'98: KOF98
'99: KOF99
'00: KOF2000
'01: KOF2001
'02: KOF2002
'03: KOF2003
'04: -
'05: KOF XI
'06: -
'07: -
'08: -
'09: KOF Beta
'10: KOF XIII
'11: -
'12: -
'13: -
'14: -
'15: -


Definitely puts things into perspective, something had to happen.

10 years fly by so fast. *shrug*





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"Re(5):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Millenium" , posted Fri 7 Aug 04:58post reply

Having a diverse portfolio is a good thing and you can't get much more diverse than chicken meat and video games.

Looking at the people now running SNK the IP's are probably going to get a lot more online and mobile attention in the near future. Trying to grow everything into a cottage industry like Marvel has done sounds ambitious but I'm certain the stockholders love that kind of talk. But whatever happens this is certainly the start of a new chapter for SNK.





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"Re(6):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Millenium" , posted Fri 7 Aug 05:33post reply

quote:
Having a diverse portfolio is a good thing and you can't get much more diverse than chicken meat and video games.

Looking at the people now running SNK the IP's are probably going to get a lot more online and mobile attention in the near future. Trying to grow everything into a cottage industry like Marvel has done sounds ambitious but I'm certain the stockholders love that kind of talk. But whatever happens this is certainly the start of a new chapter for SNK.



I remember in the previous time this possible acquisition came up, I posited the possibility of them combining SNK's IP with Digital Extreme's success in making 3D PC online F2P action game Warframe. If the same stakeholders are still involved (I haven't had a chance to parse through the ownership chain of the deal that has actually gone through with SNK), I'm still wondering if it'll happen.





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"Re(5):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Millenium" , posted Fri 7 Aug 05:43post reply

This is probably the biggest corporate change for SNK since the dark Azure days. And well, this could spell good or bad things for SNK's IPs.

For one, it's not like SNKP have been doing much with most of their IPs lately, this will shake them up surely. It always seemed that SNKP's problems post-reform was that they didn't have enough resources to dedicate towards all their different game series. And if they were going to put their investment on 2 or 3 games at a time, they'd better be ones that can most pay back their investment, and that ended up being mostly KOF/Samurai Shodown/Metal Slug/cross-overs that included those characters.

And when "HD" consoles came about and SNKP wanted to work on "HD" sprites, it seems costs were so high that even making a new HD Samurai Shodown or Metal Slug was unfeasible. Heck, they kinda barely we able to make a KOF with the new sprite set as they had to offload KOF XII to us just to be able to get back some money and go back straight into making KOF XIII. So I feel having more capital behind them would make it easier for SNK to vary-up their projects, to be able to make more than just a single major entry (like a KOF or a Sam Sho or even a new IP) every few years.

What worries me though is that Ledo seems squarely interested in SNK's IPs, and not the developer or the talent in Osaka. They talk about following the "Marvel formula", which of course is like the gold standard now for creative IPs, but Marvel still makes a lot of comic books, even if they're making a fraction of the money they make in movies etc. I hope Ledo understands that they have to keep the core of SNK running, and not just spin everything into mobile/browser/pachinko stuff (Does China have pachinko btw? I know gambling is illegal besides macau. Although it really doesn't matter either way since they can rely on pachinko sales in Japan anyways)





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"Re(7):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Millenium" , posted Fri 7 Aug 07:23post reply

Hum, I'd be a lot more worried about what would happen as a result of the sale, if not for how miserable and meager SNKP's output has been for the last decade. Sure, we got XIII, but that's pretty much it. I'm amazed they've managed to continue bringing out Neo Geo Station games during any portion of that time, even. My guess is that we'll just see SNKP's characters folded into other games, but I might just be overly optimistic.

Coincidentally, over on Facebook just the other day somebody brought up that old chestnut of Capcom being in danger of being sold from at least last year as though it was new news.





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"Re(6):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Millenium" , posted Fri 7 Aug 07:37post reply

quote:
pachinko in china


I think if the analogy is instead "source of entertainment that is a gambling replacement that particularly appeals to an older audience that is not into regular video games either for reasons of income, technical disposition, or generational tastes/gap", I'm not sure what it would be.

But if I had to guess it might well just be "F2P smartphone games". My mom's coworkers who are granny-aged nurses are into F2P crop-growing smartphone games. Games which don't operate as a service have historically been an incredibly tough money-making proposition in China.

Sitting down and playing games at a PC cafe is also a radically different experience in mainland China vs. Japan. But as proven by LoL and DOTA/DOTA2, there is an enormous appetite for PC gaming in China, they just need to find something that resonates with the audience. It's especially interesting to note that Warcraft 3 DOTA was hugely successful in China, but that Starcraft never really gained esports traction in China, even at the height of Starcraft's popularity. China absolutely has regional tastes.

Meanwhile, Xiao Hai and Dakou may suddenly be frothing at the possibilities.





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"Re(7):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Millenium" , posted Tue 11 Aug 04:14post reply

My guess is this acquisition happened because SNKP has proved that their properties can get users in the F2P space (Metal Slug Defense, for example), even if they don't monetize particularly well.

What worries me is I know SNKP is working on a couple actual video games right now, and what will happen to those? Will the new owners keep that going in order to boost the IP's profile, or cancel them because they may not be profitable, and definitely cost a lot of money?

This comes at a weird time, because SNKP has finally gotten back a lot of the key SNK staff who could actually make some proper games happen over there, and they've been working along those lines for around a year.

I wonder whether the management will change significantly - like I know that with the old guard, there'd be no way you could do something like acquire the remaining NGPC prototypes, or other near-completed games. But with new management, who knows??





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"Re(8):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Millenium" , posted Tue 11 Aug 10:06post reply

quote:
My guess is this acquisition happened because SNKP has proved that their properties can get users in the F2P space (Metal Slug Defense, for example), even if they don't monetize particularly well.

What worries me is I know SNKP is working on a couple actual video games right now, and what will happen to those? Will the new owners keep that going in order to boost the IP's profile, or cancel them because they may not be profitable, and definitely cost a lot of money?

This comes at a weird time, because SNKP has finally gotten back a lot of the key SNK staff who could actually make some proper games happen over there, and they've been working along those lines for around a year.

I wonder whether the management will change significantly - like I know that with the old guard, there'd be no way you could do something like acquire the remaining NGPC prototypes, or other near-completed games. But with new management, who knows??



I'm hoping that the new owners are wise to the fact that characters in an IP are extremely powerful in making a game captivating with recent examples of LoL and DOTA2, and that those characters need to be put in an environment where they can amply demonstrate their characteristics.

I have no idea just how much money Marvel makes from comics these days, but I'm sure it isn't a sneeze on what their movies do. But, the comics serve as key story and character development grounds whose content can then be incorporated into the blockbuster movies. I'd love it if it were the case that they could have a multi-stream approach to that game-wise, where less-profitable games are still made for the sake of establishing fascinating characters in entirely new molds/game styles, which might then be incorporated in their more mainstream megahit title. You know, like KOF once was.





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"Re(8):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Millenium" , posted Tue 11 Aug 10:17post reply

I don't see them canceling new projects, but I do wonder what it could mean for markets outside of China. I'm not terribly familiar with game IPs in China, but that may just be because I can't recall hearing about any actually releasing outside of China. That is a bit worrying to me.





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"Re(9):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Millenium" , posted Tue 11 Aug 16:37post reply

Marvel movies do well because they are Hollywood action movies. Guardians of the Galaxies features characters that the vast majority of American superhero comic book readers don't give a poo about, but still made big buckets of money because it was a big budget hollywood action movie.

If anything the KoF IP is more valuable than Marvel in the sense that Chinese audiences will actually recognize them from their childhood. Like when Doraemon finally got a theatrical release in China, it outdid all of the dreamworks and pixar movies to come out there because audiences recognized the Blue Future Cat of their childhood.

What they'll do with that IP... my guess is they'll make mobile games that resemble what's already in the top 10 in China:
https://www.appannie.com/apps/ios/top/china/overall/?device=iphone

Would be nice if they had the original SNK artists working on whatever games they make, but that is unlikely.





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"SNK Playmore president makes public statement" , posted Tue 18 Aug 13:51:post reply

Yesterday at their Beast Busters Pachislot conference, SNKPlaymore president Koichi Sotoyama made an official statement regarding their acquisition by Ledo Millenium.


"On August 6, we made a capital alliance with Ledo Millenium, a subsidiary of Perfect World Corp based in China which operates and develops online games. The target is to strengthen our entertainment business including Pachislot and Games, and to further expand our IP-based license businesses in the Chinese market.

... The Pachislot market is currently suffering from a massive decline of users in their 20's, and it is important that we develop new machines targeted towards the younger range audience. We are a Pachislot maker as well as a Videogame maker. We will do our best to make Pachislot fans out of videogame fans."


So he's calling it a "capital alliance".
If it's correct that Ledo acquired a whopping 81% share, I'm assuming he's trying to avoid saying "we got bought out" for various reasons.

Also, keep in mind this was a Pachislot annoucement so he'll naturally make comments inclined towards the Pachislot market.





[this message was edited by Professor on Tue 18 Aug 14:12]

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"Re(10):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Milleniu" , posted Tue 18 Aug 15:49post reply

quote:

If anything the KoF IP is more valuable than Marvel in the sense that Chinese audiences will actually recognize them from their childhood. Like when Doraemon finally got a theatrical release in China, it outdid all of the dreamworks and pixar movies to come out there because audiences recognized the Blue Future Cat of their childhood.



China is a BIG place, but China isn't the whole world. Winning big in China would undoubtedly be huge, and it'd be interesting to see how well it can do in Latin America, where SNK historically had quite a bit of popularity. I think in aggregate calling it more valuable than Marvel is a bit of a stretch, though. SNK is certainly not a strong brand in the USA, and I'd be really surprised if it was a force in the major European markets like the UK.

Doraemon however absolutely did do great in China, and while it may sit behind Kung Fu Panda 2 in total gross, for a movie franchise debut its total performance is on par with the first Avengers movie in China. That's amazing by any stretch, and solidly beats the franchise debuts of any number of major Marvel heroes. In China, Doraemon is easily as big as any one of Marvel's franchises, movie-wise.

So an alternative question is this: is any one of, or even all of, SNK's stable of characters as big of a cultural powerhouse in China as Doraemon? I don't actually know the answer to that question, but personally I lean towards "not at this moment". I hope that the people running it are canny enough to make seriously good stuff with it.

Actually, deep down maybe what I really want is just an action-noir movie about Seth and Vanessa made by the Korean film industry.





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"Re(2):Re(10):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Mi" , posted Tue 18 Aug 17:11post reply

I have my doubts that pachinko can be peddled to a new audience, but it's not like there isn't a precedent of SNKP slightly expanding their games'setting in that kind of machines, like th one with a extended cast for Cham-Cham and that other one where LB's Akari has aged up a bit...

quote:
Actually, deep down maybe what I really want is just an action-noir movie about Seth and Vanessa made by the Korean film industry.


Since the focus seems to be on China so far, I'd like to see them play to thir strength and make something between a modern-day wuxia film or Kung-Fu-Hustle-alike with the Chinese KoF cast - the lingering story with Kensou and the Hizoku sounds decent to work off of, and I'm sure they could pull some entertaining moments out of characters like Chin and Shen Woo.





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"Re(3):Re(10):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Mi" , posted Tue 18 Aug 18:06post reply

quote:
I have my doubts that pachinko can be peddled to a new audience
I wonder what the Japanese audience thinks of such a remark. Unsurprisingly, at least western SNK fans would be cynical about it as SNK's pachinko fetish is a joke to them, and comments like this would only serve to further cement the notion that SNK IPs are indeed "dead".





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"Re(4):Re(10):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Mi" , posted Tue 18 Aug 21:09:post reply

quote:
I have my doubts that pachinko can be peddled to a new audienceI wonder what the Japanese audience thinks of such a remark. Unsurprisingly, at least western SNK fans would be cynical about it as SNK's pachinko fetish is a joke to them, and comments like this would only serve to further cement the notion that SNK IPs are indeed "dead".



Generally speaking, a lot of the gaming audience even within Japan tend to see Pachinko and Pachislot as brainded entertainment for the lower income and it tends to also have a negative vibe because it's gambling. I think the generation shift is heavily contributing to the decline of pachi parlors at least in the city-side. In the country side where the only common form of entertainment was DVD rental shops and Pachi parlors, the market is getting killed by smartphones because it's totally ubiquitous.





[this message was edited by Professor on Tue 18 Aug 21:10]

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"Re(5):Re(10):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Mi" , posted Wed 19 Aug 00:38post reply

Not to be mean, but I am not sure how SNK franchises could help attracting users in their 20's.
I must have missed a Disney Tsum Tsum × Jin Fuuha collaboration or two.





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"Re(6):Re(10):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Mi" , posted Wed 19 Aug 01:56post reply

quote:
Not to be mean, but I am not sure how SNK franchises could help attracting users in their 20's.
I must have missed a Disney Tsum Tsum × Jin Fuuha collaboration or two.



I'm going to guess that these days the primary exposure to SNK IP for people who are younger than 28 years old comes in the form of mobile games illicitly using SNK sprites.





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"Re(6):Re(10):SNK Playmore acquired by Ledo Mi" , posted Wed 19 Aug 02:48post reply

quote:
Not to be mean, but I am not sure how SNK franchises could help attracting users in their 20's.
I must have missed a Disney Tsum Tsum × Jin Fuuha collaboration or two.



Call Saigado, he has plenty of work to do.





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"Re(1):SNK Playmore president makes public sta" , posted Wed 19 Aug 03:12post reply

quote:
Yesterday at their Beast Busters Pachislot conference, SNKPlaymore president Koichi Sotoyama made an official statement regarding their acquisition by Ledo Millenium.

There's yet another Beast Busters game out there? Maybe being bought out by Leyou is a blessing in disguise since an intervention obviously had to be staged in order to keep SNKP from making more Beast Busters.





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"Re(1):SNK Playmore president makes public sta" , posted Wed 19 Aug 09:35post reply

quote:
If it's correct that Ledo acquired a whopping 81% share, I'm assuming he's trying to avoid saying "we got bought out" for various reasons.




It's not even "we got bought," it's "we sold ourselves."

I guess it's good to hear where his priorities lie - they've got to make sure they exploit more young people through gambling, and this is the way to do it! lovely.





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"New SNK Game Archives on PS3(JP)" , posted Wed 19 Aug 16:37post reply

• Metal Slug Complete
• Garō Densetsu Battle Archives 2
• Fūun Super Combo
• The King of Fighters Neowave





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"Re(2):SNK Playmore president makes public sta" , posted Thu 20 Aug 05:32post reply

quote:
If it's correct that Ledo acquired a whopping 81% share, I'm assuming he's trying to avoid saying "we got bought out" for various reasons.



It's not even "we got bought," it's "we sold ourselves."

I guess it's good to hear where his priorities lie - they've got to make sure they exploit more young people through gambling, and this is the way to do it! lovely.



Note to self: brandon summonable via notions of whoring and gambling





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"Re(3): president exodus makes public statemen" , posted Thu 20 Aug 05:58:post reply

quote:
Note to self: brandon summonable via notions of whoring and gambling

But then, Iggy and Kikoken could have told us that. Also, Vanillaware will do!

For when these summoning incantations work: you've been a very bad Brandon for sensibly running away leaving and for ditching Insert Credit again except for that one 25,000 word piece, but we still love you and would never punish you at least until safely after you put Gunhouse on a platform I own.





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"SNKP settles with Square Enix" , posted Wed 26 Aug 16:04:post reply

Square Enix made a public release today saying that the "High Score Girl" incident with SNKPlaymore has been settled effective August 24. Judging from the timing and the press release, it seems natural to assume that its new majority shareholder Ledo Millenium may have intervened.

This is good news as Square Enix is the parent company of Taito that runs the NesicaLive arcade distribution system. It's still got a much larger market penetration than the Sega Aime.



SQUARE ENIX AND SNK PLAYMORE ANNOUNCE
AMICABLE SETTLEMENT OF DISPUTES


Tokyo, Japan (August 26, 2015) – Square Enix Co., Ltd. (the “Company”) today announces that the Company and SNK Playmore Corporation (“SNK Playmore”) have reached an amicable settlement on criminal complaint and civil lawsuits regarding the comic series “HIGH SCORE GIRL” published by the Company (collectively, the “Disputes”). The settlement became effective on August 24, 2015.

1. Outline of the Disputes
SNK Playmore brought a criminal complaint against the Company and its employees to Osaka Prefectural Police Headquarters on May 26, 2014, claiming that “HIGH SCORE GIRL” allegedly infringed SNK Playmore’s copyright. The Company consequently brought a lawsuit to seek a declaratory judgment that the Company did not infringe SNK Playmore’s copyright to the Osaka District Court on October 8, 2014 followed by a countersuit to the same court filed by SNK Playmore against the Company to seek an injunction of the publication on March 16, 2015.
Today, the Company and SNK Playmore announced that both companies and Ledo Millennium Co., Ltd. (“Ledo”), a major shareholder of SNK Playmore, have reached an agreement on August 24, 2015 that the Disputes must be resolved promptly to enable the creation of new business opportunities utilizing each company’s content. Based on this agreement, the Company and SNK Playmore agreed to settle the Disputes. In accordance with the settlement agreement, SNK Playmore has withdrawn the criminal complaint against the Company, and the Osaka District Public Prosecutors' Office has accepted the withdrawal on August 24, 2015.

Both companies and Ledo will pursue developing and providing content that meets customers’ expectations through the creation of new business opportunities.

2. Major Conditions of the Settlement
1 ) SNK Playmore to withdraw the criminal complaint,
2 ) Square Enix and SNK Playmore to withdraw civil lawsuits, and
3 ) Square Enix to proceed with the publishing and sales of “HIGH SCORE GIRL.”

3. Future Forecast
The effect of this settlement on the Company’s financial performance is insignificant.



http://www.jp.square-enix.com/company/en/news/2015/html/29f3f88b06bd45b92ff586fcc6afc546.html





[this message was edited by Professor on Wed 26 Aug 16:26]

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"KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Tue 15 Sep 16:32post reply

It looks like Maximum Impact HD.
The dream is dead.





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"Re(1):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Tue 15 Sep 16:46post reply

quote:
It looks like Maximum Impact HD.
The dream is dead.

Ehhh. They really should work on those models a bit more, they look kind of cheap and lazy. Especially considering the console it debuts on, AND the fact that it's competing with a game like SFV, which actually looks pretty good, banana hair aside.





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"Re(2):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Tue 15 Sep 17:02post reply

Graphics and art style are average, sure. But at this point, content matters. SFV and Xrd aren't really bursting with a huge amount of characters because a huge amount of the budget is spent on the graphics, hopefully XIV will be a different story.

Now, if the game is shaping up to be bad and has a <30 roster with head swaps, then it's time to truly panic.





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"Re(2):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Tue 15 Sep 17:03:post reply

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2wU_1y3NkQ

Wow it looks so PS3
or not even!





[this message was edited by Professor on Tue 15 Sep 17:14]

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"Re(3):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Tue 15 Sep 17:20post reply

quote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2wU_1y3NkQ

Wow it looks so PS3
or not even!


Hell, it looks like something out of Dead or Alive 2. Who were they planning on impressing with these graphics?

True, the content matters the most, but thinking wholistically, the graphics are part of that content, even if it's merely a presentational aspect of it.

What's sad is that there are so many people surprised it's not 2D, but we've known for a long while that SNKPlaymore was pursuing this direction for a long while. And their website even said that they were trying to recruit 3D artists, right? So the surprise anyone following SNKPlaymore has is hard to understand.





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"Re(3):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Tue 15 Sep 17:34post reply

quote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2wU_1y3NkQ

Wow it looks so PS3
or not even!



It's not impressive, but I still much prefer how it looks to SFV (or IV) :3






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"Re(4):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Tue 15 Sep 17:50:post reply

GET HYPE

Edit: Trailer reaction

Edit 2: I'm sorry, I can't. I literally can't process how things got to this point. Who would have thought that outsourced pachinko CGs would raise expectations beyond what they could show for 5 seconds.





[this message was edited by Gojira on Tue 15 Sep 18:07]

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"Re(5):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Tue 15 Sep 18:15:post reply

quote:
Who would have thought that outsourced pachinko CGs would raise expectations beyond what they could show for 5 seconds.




"Pachinko CG"


That's the perfect name for this art style!

Official site


Only a PS4 version is confirmed, but there's no way they'll refuse to release a PC port.

...or a neutered mobile version.





[this message was edited by the real kap on Tue 15 Sep 18:25]

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"Re(6):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Tue 15 Sep 18:28post reply

they added a official site
Put a flashion glasses and i would confuse this kyo with a persona char/ male idol

sincerely, i can't care less about graphics. The problem for me is the "for ps4" part.

If it was for pc, it would even be for the best, as low-mid range pcs would be able to run (as long as there's a way to desactivate some lightning sources/ particles).

If to this day half of pc players of sf4 deactivate the whole stages/pick trainning stage , i can only imagine what sfV pc gonna be like.





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"Re(6):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Tue 15 Sep 18:37post reply

The teaser looks so bad that no one even cares how Iori has a new costume and has his flames back.





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"Re(7):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Tue 15 Sep 18:50post reply

quote:
The teaser looks so bad that no one even cares how Iori has a new costume and has his flames back.


it's just that this is old info. It was already visible that he got a new outfit when his miniature was in the main snk site (after kyo/ pachi terry/ pachi haohmaru, before they changed it to leona)





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"Re(7):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Tue 15 Sep 20:17post reply

quote:
The teaser looks so bad that no one even cares how Iori has a new costume and has his flames back.



It really looks terrible





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"Re(4):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Tue 15 Sep 21:14post reply

quote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2wU_1y3NkQ

Wow it looks so PS3
or not even!

Hell, it looks like something out of Dead or Alive 2. Who were they planning on impressing with these graphics?

True, the content matters the most, but thinking wholistically, the graphics are part of that content, even if it's merely a presentational aspect of it.

What's sad is that there are so many people surprised it's not 2D, but we've known for a long while that SNKPlaymore was pursuing this direction for a long while. And their website even said that they were trying to recruit 3D artists, right? So the surprise anyone following SNKPlaymore has is hard to understand.


I agree is a bad idea for it to be only on the PS4. Not only for the cheap graphics, they can lose a significant amount of money if they do not perform well. However, If the gameplay far exceed our expectations and the online mode is perfect as a donkeys back, then maybe it can survive and succeed. In short, if I was SNK Playmore, I would spend every little penny on the gameplay and online mode. I would not even focus on the story, because based on KOF history, this is suppose to be a dream match title before starting a new arc correct?





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"Re(7):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Tue 15 Sep 22:11post reply

quote:
The teaser looks so bad that no one even cares how Iori has a new costume and has his flames back.



SNK had, from the start, the chance to make an Xrd that looks better than an Xrd. Of course we all knew that they weren't going to take it.

This basically looks at the level of SSSen, meh. And we can expect the game engine & balance to be all screwed up, because that always happens when they try to move things into a whole new direction (even if that new direction is making things as they were before).






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"Re(5):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Tue 15 Sep 22:13:post reply

Remember the days when SNK games were graphic powerhouses that couldn't be run on regular home consoles?

How are SNKP planning on releasing KoF14? Is it going to be some sort of freemium title? They would have to be bananas to think they can charge full price for a game that looks this rough in 2016. Even in the genre of fighters they are not only competing against the mainstream titles but all those smaller fighters such as Skullgirls and Rising Thunder. If your game is getting shown up by a small but determined indie developer it may be time to sit down and re-think the entire project.





[this message was edited by Ishmael on Tue 15 Sep 22:15]

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"Re(6):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Tue 15 Sep 22:24post reply

Maybe my opinion is influenced by the fact that I'm not a huge KOF fan (I do like the KOF games, though), but I don't think the teaser was that bad. It's too short to let me have an opinion about the graphics - and even if they are indeed outdated, if KOF XIV follows the SFV/KI/MKX lead (that is, 3D graphics with 2D gameplay), the fluidity of the animations should be more important than the graphics themselves. As long as it plays well, I'm sure the KOF fanbase will enjoy it and support it.

Now, I wonder if it will still be a team-based fighting game, and hope that in this case, the teammates will be in the background cheering for their friend like in the first games.

(oh, and also hope that SNKP doesn't allow to destroy King's and Yuri's clothes anymore; leave the perverted fanservice to Dead or Alive)





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"Re(6):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Wed 16 Sep 00:32post reply

quote:
Remember the days when SNK games were graphic powerhouses that couldn't be run on regular home consoles?

How are SNKP planning on releasing KoF14? Is it going to be some sort of freemium title? They would have to be bananas to think they can charge full price for a game that looks this rough in 2016. Even in the genre of fighters they are not only competing against the mainstream titles but all those smaller fighters such as Skullgirls and Rising Thunder. If your game is getting shown up by a small but determined indie developer it may be time to sit down and re-think the entire project.



I don't think there was ever a chance that SNKP would have produced something as gorgeous as Xrd (and if they went in a similar direction they would be rightly accused of ripping Xrd off), so I can't imagine anyone here is truly surprised at how it's come to pass. I'm more and more approaching these storied fighting game franchises from an anthropological perspective since I rarely have time to actually play anything these days, so I'll just be sitting back and observing where this whole thing goes.

That was barely even a teaser trailer though, wasn't it?





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"Re(7):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Wed 16 Sep 00:52post reply

quote:
Maybe my opinion is influenced by the fact that I'm not a huge KOF fan (I do like the KOF games, though), but I don't think the teaser was that bad.
the fluidity of the animations should be more important than the graphics themselves.
I also have no real familiarity with SNK, but I was baffled. It was like trying to place a mismatched memory at first: I was thinking "Hmm, this looks so visually familiar but I feel like I haven't seen it for a while...OH, it's PS2 graphics!"

I'm pretty sure that PR is in the business of making things look better than they are, and if that's the best possible thing they can show, KOF may be destined for self-parody. If smoothness is their salvation, it'd better be the most fluidly animated game of all time---I'm talking on the level of what Tobal 2's 60fps was during PS1.





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"Re(4):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Wed 16 Sep 01:03post reply

quote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2wU_1y3NkQ

Wow it looks so PS3
or not even!


It's not impressive, but I still much prefer how it looks to SFV (or IV) :3



I'm really curious to see you expand on this opinion, even if it's sheer dislike for recent SF aesthetics.

I wonder if there's some way to apply some artistic direction to the current content to improve the graphics shown so far, maybe some combination of color, textures and shading work, but 3D isn't really a topic I'm that versed in (and I wonder if SNKP's new Chinese overlords are willing to pay for someone with that kind of know-how).





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"Re(5):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Wed 16 Sep 03:02post reply

There's unsourced claims that this game is due out in January, from websites like Destructoid. However, the official website simply has the schedule of 2016, without a specified month. Perhaps these blogging...I mean journalist...websites need to doublecheck their facts before they post in such a haste fashion.





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"Re(5):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Wed 16 Sep 03:08post reply

If the defining shading trait of the SFV characters is "clay action figure" then the defining shading trait of this snippet is "oily plastic shine either because we want to somehow look shiny and fresh or because we don't really understand specular".





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"Re(6):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Wed 16 Sep 04:06post reply

quote:
There's unsourced claims that this game is due out in January, from websites like Destructoid. However, the official website simply has the schedule of 2016, without a specified month. Perhaps these blogging...I mean journalist...websites need to doublecheck their facts before they post in such a haste fashion.



I believe this just arose from certain stream rips of the trailer containing a snippet from the next game being shown. No idea what it was but apparently it was important enough that they had to get the date out of the way immediately, and some people took it as part of the KoF teaser.

Normally a date 4 months off wouldn't be so believable, but with that quality I guess even the journalistic professionals thought "it's possible"





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"Re(5):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Wed 16 Sep 04:33post reply

As much as I'm glad a new real KOF exist, I feel like disregarding it's graphical artsyle as something unimportant does a disservice to the series and to SNK's legacy (that is considering that you do think that it's not a great looking game. You are still free to think otherwise of course). Sure, it will probably look better when it's being played right in front of our eyes. And even if it didn't, it could still be a great game to play. KOF2002 had ugly stages and UI and music but it turned out to be one of the best in the series and helped rejuvenate KOF after 2001 and the whole SNK->Playmore messy transition (you could argue KOF2002 was SNK's most important title they ever made. And that things would have been very different for them if it failed. But that's another topic).

SNK built it's legacy on amazing 2D spritework that for the longest time could not be replicated accurately outside of Neo Geo Hardware. And KOF exemplified that. Heck that could be said for every great fighting game series out there. It's kinda impossible to find any fighting game series that also didn't have great art design, whether it's Virtua Fighter's super minimal design, which nicely contrasts with Tekken's informed and very detailed design, or Vampire's splendid reimagining of classic monsters, or Street Fighter's uncanny ability to represent command motions and special move attributes into the animation of characters. Like as much as I'm currently way into Guilty Gear, I do hate how Dusts (aka the universal overhead attacks) for most characters do not at all look like they're overheads (nor do they look like something that will launch the other player upwards a few screens). And moves that do look like overheads are not. And moves that have invincibility or at least upper body invincibility do not even look like they do have that. You just have to explicitly learn them.

I do realize that it is 2015 and expecting a new game to have sprites is futile. The last time SNK tried to update their sprite, we got KOF XII, a game that pretty much is a living example of how excruciating making new high-rez spritework using classic dot-style is for a large cast. We got an anemic KOF with one of the lowest roster sizes in the series history, and with many of the characters feeling half finished with several missing moves (albeit a very very pretty game, probably even prettier than XIII).

And I can't expect them to follow Arc System Work's path with Xrd. As pretty as that game looks, the amount of work it requires is clearly visible just by looking at the cast size. Nearly 2 years of updates consisting of the Arcade Release, Console release, and now Revelator and the game's cast size is STILL less than vanilla Guilty Gear XX/X2. And while it's ok for 1 on 1 fighters, team fighters like KOF need a huge cast to function.

But it's not like SNK never had experience making 3D fighters. They had several, whether it's the Hyper Neo Geo 64 titles or Maximum Impact or even the dreadful Samurai Shodown Sen. But KOF XIV just looks bad. Am I asking too much? Have I become the entitled sort of fan that I always dreaded to be? I just expected better from them, much much better, that's all.





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"Re(7):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Wed 16 Sep 04:39post reply

quote:
the fluidity of the animations should be more important than the graphics themselves
But the animations look bland... Having the camera so close to the characters shows even more that there is no real interaction between the attacker and the target. After the amazing progress the guarding animations achieved in SF5... The background looks terrible as well...
Why am I focusing on details. The faces are not animated. The shading is terrible. It's hard to say if it looks better or worse than SF4. I hate SF4's look, but I'm tempted to say it does look worse. At least SF4's mission of replicating the way these 2D characters moved in their original game was achieved at the best of the game's limited capacities. This doesn't look like it's even trying. The moves have no fluidity, no impact... KOF games on NGP had more weight.
Maybe if we compare it to MK9 it would have a better chance?
I understand it's designed to work on every cheap PC in China and south-east Asia (I don't believe it's PS4 only, it's only there because it was a Sony event), but still...





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"Re(8):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Wed 16 Sep 05:13post reply

I'm more disappointed by the fact that they had to showcase the poster boys for the umpteenth time just to remind everyone that KOF still exists.

They should at least give Kyo a beard to go along with that plastic look so we can have a Keanu Reeves meme to go with Hot Ryu.





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"Re(8):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Wed 16 Sep 05:28post reply

That anybody thinks with regards to an SNK game that "I'm ok with it looking bad if it plays ok" is really sad.

Being AMAZED by what was being shown technically and artistically was a hallmark of the great SNK games. As Xrd, SFV, MvC3, and MK have shown, there's plenty of room for a diversity of visual styles in fighting games that will be well-received. So I don't know how SNK has decided on this look, because it's a bad look. There's time for them to improve it, but for a first impression it sure isn't going to win them many (any?) new fans.





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"Re(9):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Wed 16 Sep 05:43post reply

quote:
That anybody thinks with regards to an SNK game that "I'm ok with it looking bad if it plays ok" is really sad.
I don't think that many people do. At least, I haven't seen it be such a prevalent sentiment.

Apparently, Orochinagi's Gunsmith found a video that confirms that the January release schedule was, in fact, people jumping the gun and assuming things. He's yet to show anything, but I guess that will come in due time.

Which is good, because if what we're looking at now is going to reflect the resulting product, then I'd rather them take it back and rework everything, because it looks like some kind of joke. They can't compete with even Steam indie games at this rate if they're going to shell something like that out.

Seriously, it looks like some kind of B-grade ecchi "game" developed by some wannabe Yakuza's dev team.





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"Re(10):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Wed 16 Sep 05:49:post reply

quote:
That anybody thinks with regards to an SNK game that "I'm ok with it looking bad if it plays ok" is really sad.I don't think that many people do. At least, I haven't seen it be such a prevalent sentiment.

Apparently, Orochinagi's Gunsmith found a video that confirms that the January release schedule was, in fact, people jumping the gun and assuming things. He's yet to show anything, but I guess that will come in due time.

Which is good, because if what we're looking at now is going to reflect the resulting product, then I'd rather them take it back and rework everything, because it looks like some kind of joke. They can't compete with even Steam indie games at this rate if they're going to shell something like that out.

Seriously, it looks like some kind of B-grade ecchi "game" developed by some wannabe Yakuza's dev team.



It would be funny if that was not actual gameplay and what we saw was CG animation of a cut scene in the game. That would be a nail in the coffin.





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[this message was edited by neo0r0chiaku on Wed 16 Sep 05:52]

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"Re(8):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Wed 16 Sep 08:38:post reply

quote:
Maybe if we compare it to MK9 it would have a better chance?


That trailer still loses to Mortal Kombat 9, because MK9 at least managed to have better graphics.

It looks like SNKP has learned nothing from any other fighting game company's 3D efforts. They didn't go for the 3D-looks-like-2D of Guilty Gear Xrd. They didn't go for Street Fighter's reinvention into 3D (or SF4's reinvention into SF5.) They didn't go for the model quality of Mortal Kombat. They didn't go for the fan-service of Dead or Alive. Etc.

Instead of moving forward, SNKP looks like it is just reaching the beginning of the PS3/360 era. This trailer really feels like what you might expect for a PS3 launch title Maximum Impact 3, and it wouldn't even be impressive viewed as that. Particularly with those overly shiny models.





[this message was edited by Baines on Wed 16 Sep 08:39]

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"Re(1):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Thu 17 Sep 11:10post reply

Oh...








No.





/ / /

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"Re(9):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Thu 17 Sep 21:07post reply

quote:
This trailer really feels like what you might expect for a PS3 launch title Maximum Impact 3, and it wouldn't even be impressive viewed as that. Particularly with those overly shiny models.

If they ever could have picked the cancelled MI3 and continue from there, I believe they might have been just done that. It's funny as a KoF fan, while I am hyped for SFV, there's no wind to move a leaf for me to hype for KOF XIV. OK, I have one attempt for a hope; they're marketing geniuses and they will amaze us with second trailer via artistic miracle of make up for graphics or surprising guests/roster...... That's all optimistic daydreamer of a fanboy with a lot of heart broken by SnkPlaymore could do.





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"Re(10):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Thu 17 Sep 22:49post reply

SNKP canceled Regulation A2 because KOFXII was such a huge money sink, and years later, the reveal of the next mainline KOF has a worse reception than any of the previous MI games. Strange how it goes. And yet, there are a boatload of irrational fanboys who want to have expensive PS2-era resolution sprites. :/

What happened to those millions and millions of dollars they got from Tencent? Did that cheeky bastard Eikichi pocket it for himself? What about their business relation that they were so proud to announce? Everything is just so mismanaged there, it's baffling really.





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"Re(2):Re(10):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Fri 18 Sep 02:26post reply

I know I am a couple of days old on this, but damn.

This art direction is horrible. It is like Beast Busters. This isn't even on the level of Street Fighter IV, let alone SFV.

They had to know going into this announcement that their competition in the "2.5D" genre was Xrd and SFV.

Unless this plays AMAZINGLY well I cannot see it gaining traction.

I kinda wish that they just made 10 or so new sprites in the XIII engine and made it another dream match. Put in the New Face Team and make the Orochi version DLC. Hell, they could have also made Orochi Leona and Iori too. Put Chang and Choi back with Kim and put Billy with Raiden and Hwai Jai (or maybe Blue Mary and Yamazaki with Billy and Kim's XIII team). Throw in one more team and Rugal or Orochi and I would have been content. I know the XIII method was time consuming and costly, but I cannot imagine it being as much as a risk/waste as THIS.





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"Re(3):Re(10):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Fri 18 Sep 03:07post reply

I am new here, don't know how to post without replying to someone.


Even if SNKP did what you suggested it would still not be in their favor. Regardless they would still be competing against xrd and sfv in terms of visuals and appealing amongst the fighting games community and the general gaming public. I cant imaging the amount of effort needed to do this and have have to sold a fraction of what the other games sell. Some characters like clark, king, elisabeth, billy cane and some other characters feel incomplete. On top of that they would need to add a second super to characters who have one, redo the fighting system, rebalance. On top of that create more characters and stages from scratch. Kof xiii sold like 21k in japan, that number is on the low end. Really cant imaging what it sold elsewhere.


My problem with kof 14 is what happened to all of the 3d models they used for kof xii and xiii. Plus the many frames of animation needed to transcribe into 2d pixel art. It beats starting over from nothing. At least with the kof xii models and engine or what ever they were using they can retool and have a presentable game. If they where actively recruiting for the past few years I would have expected more to be shown. Something stinks beside the graphics, its what is going on with this project. Could this be proof of concept, i don't know nor do I care to speculate. SNKP is incompetent to show this, it has a 2016 release date. They really need to inform people of their plans for this game.


If this was canceled, i bet you this would end their console development. I still would see them doing mobile, and what crap their buyers want them to do for the pc market in china, plus pachinkos.





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"Re(4):Re(10):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Wed 23 Sep 18:43post reply

Even with the success of Metal Slug Defense, SNKP is a shadow of its former self. There's no question. I'm not even sure who's still left there. The point is they're a very small company nowadays so to me, presenting something that looks so underwhelming is not too much a surprise to me considering recent events with them.





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"Re(5):Re(10):KOF14 announced on PS4" , posted Fri 25 Sep 22:06post reply

It's sad that Brandon's game was a better testament to the Neo Geo's influence on video games at TGS than the first trailer of KOF14.





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"SNKPlaymore shutting down Pachislot division?" , posted Fri 9 Oct 19:13:post reply

SNKPlaymore will be withdrawing from the Pachislot business, according to an unconfirmed report by Pachinko industry site Pachislot Village. According to the site, SNKPlaymore currently has no new Pachislot cabinets going through approval processes, meaning they don't have anything planned for relase in the next few months. Warranty and support for currently operating machines haven't been announced yet.

With the market declining in Pachislot, SNKPlaymore will be the 5th company this year that's disappeared from the Pachislot industry due to various reasons.

That said, KOF fans don't have much to worry as the company's videogame division will keep on running.


[UPDATE]
According to additional reports by pachislot news site Yugi-Nippon, the company plans on closing down its Pachislot office in Tokyo by the end of October and moving all its functions to Osaka headquarters. Employees at SNKPlaymore's Pachislot division were notified about the decision today and have the option to move to the company's gaming division.




http://www.pachinkovillage.com/news/?p=9705
https://twitter.com/mikakutei/status/652365850758897664

http://www.yugi-nippon.com/?p=3591 (Thx: Loona)





[this message was edited by Professor on Sat 10 Oct 01:41]

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"Re(1):SNKPlaymore shutting down Pachislot div" , posted Fri 9 Oct 19:40post reply

quote:
SNKPlaymore will be withdrawing from the Pachislot business, according to an unconfirmed report by Pachinko industry site Pachislot Village. According to the site, SNKPlaymore currently has no new Pachislot cabinets going through approval processes, meaning they don't have anything planned for relase in the next few months. Warranty and support for currently operating machines haven't been announced yet.

With the market declining in Pachislot, SNKPlaymore will be the 5th company this year that's disappeared from the Pachislot industry due to various reasons.


That said, KOF fans don't have much to worry as the company's videogame division will keep on running and won't be effected.


http://www.pachinkovillage.com/news/?p=9705
https://twitter.com/mikakutei/status/652365850758897664



Well, a few other companies have been licensing their IP for that sort of thing, so they can make some money out of it without the expense of developing hardware...
After years of most announcements being pachislot-related, allow me to celebrate internally.





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"Re(1):SNKPlaymore shutting down Pachislot div" , posted Fri 9 Oct 20:08post reply

quote:
With the market declining in Pachislot, SNKPlaymore will be the 5th company this year that's disappeared from the Pachislot industry due to various reasons.
Hasn't the law on pachinko recently been revised and made more repressive (cap on uses, impossible to trade beads for goods...), at least in Tokyo?
I guess now that pachinko has become more cumbersome and less profitable, they have to find another grey area (or a legal loophole) to keep that branch of their activity profitable, or something else that fits that role in their business model.
(Yeah, it's Friday, I'm all about understatement and careful euphemism today).

Interesting as well that they anticipated the move so well, compared to Konami for example.





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"Re(2):SNKPlaymore shutting down Pachislot div" , posted Fri 9 Oct 21:06post reply

quote:
SNKPlaymore will be withdrawing from the Pachislot business, according to an unconfirmed report by Pachinko industry site Pachislot Village. According to the site, SNKPlaymore currently has no new Pachislot cabinets going through approval processes, meaning they don't have anything planned for relase in the next few months. Warranty and support for currently operating machines haven't been announced yet.

With the market declining in Pachislot, SNKPlaymore will be the 5th company this year that's disappeared from the Pachislot industry due to various reasons.


That said, KOF fans don't have much to worry as the company's videogame division will keep on running and won't be effected.


http://www.pachinkovillage.com/news/?p=9705
https://twitter.com/mikakutei/status/652365850758897664


Well, a few other companies have been licensing their IP for that sort of thing, so they can make some money out of it without the expense of developing hardware...
After years of most announcements being pachislot-related, allow me to celebrate internally.


It is the best news coming from SNKP!





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"Re(1):SNKPlaymore shutting down Pachislot div" , posted Fri 9 Oct 22:24post reply

Victoly, I guess.





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"Re(2):SNKPlaymore shutting down Pachislot div" , posted Sat 10 Oct 00:33post reply

More news: http://www.yugi-nippon.com/?p=3591

Apparently they're closing the pachinko offices and transferring their staff to the game division?





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"Re(3):SNKPlaymore shutting down Pachislot div" , posted Sat 10 Oct 01:16:post reply

quote:
More news: http://www.yugi-nippon.com/?p=3591

Apparently they're closing the pachinko offices and transferring their staff to the game division?



Thanks for the heads up, I've updated the post with that news!

That said, I'm surprised they closed their Tokyo office. They should've just converted it into gaming sales. The company being situated just in Osaka probably doesn't given them much of an edge (or a sense of reality) in business.



quote:
Hasn't the law on pachinko recently been revised and made more repressive (cap on uses, impossible to trade beads for goods...), at least in Tokyo?
I guess now that pachinko has become more cumbersome and less profitable, they have to find another grey area (or a legal loophole) to keep that branch of their activity profitable, or something else that fits that role in their business model.


Laws on Pachislot restrictions are getting pretty heavy that the industry is starting to impose some on itself before the government throws something worse at them. They're sort of like choking their own throat just so that they won't get shot. With Smartphones crushing their market, they're inevidably going to end up as dead as videogame arcades. According to some reports the player population's declined from 30 million at its peak down to less than 10 million.

As for Tokyo, there was a regulation passed last month that bans "equal trading rates", meaning that Pachislot parlors can't refund players at the same rate as they paid per bead. So unless the player wins a lot more than they started off, they'll always be on the losing side.

With some additional restrictions on the way, it's unquestionable that players will have to spend longer at Pachislot and Pachinko machines to recoup with the rates that've been lowered to solve issues with the more addicted players. It pretty much goes completely goes opposite to modern lifestyles.

Pachinko/Pachislot is about the only non-government gambling business in Japan, which is one of the often cited reasons why they're getting hit while horse track betting and others aren't. Of course there's also the issue of the mob...





[this message was edited by Professor on Sat 10 Oct 03:06]

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"Re(4):SNKPlaymore shutting down Pachislot div" , posted Sat 10 Oct 02:39post reply

I have no idea how good of an idea all this is, but I suspect that Konami sticking around in pachislot must be a result of them knowing something that others don't... or having a way of leveraging things that is not feasible for other, smaller players.

pachislot conspiracy





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"Re(5):SNKPlaymore shutting down Pachislot div" , posted Sat 10 Oct 02:55post reply

quote:
I have no idea how good of an idea all this is, but I suspect that Konami sticking around in pachislot must be a result of them knowing something that others don't... or having a way of leveraging things that is not feasible for other, smaller players.

pachislot conspiracy


I'm been under the impression that Pachislot is just a way to dress up Pachinko to make it more appealing to younger folks, kind of like tobacco companies making flavored cigarettes to appeal to teenagers, but I was also under the impression that Pachinko in general was not doing all that well, despite all of this. But then that would make SNKP getting out of the business a rare good business decision on their part. Am I just mistaken?





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"Re(6):SNKPlaymore shutting down Pachislot div" , posted Sat 10 Oct 03:46post reply

I'm guessing with Pachislot market going down and with the Ledo millennium acquisition, SNKP may not have to rely on the Pachinko business as a monetary lifeline that keeps them running, especially now that they've also been successful in the mobile market.

The Ledo statement they made when they bought SNK suggested that they were primely interested in tending and growing SNK's IPs. And I just can't see Pachinko ever being a way to "introduce" new young fans. It's usually to coerce old fans into playing Pachinko (hence why not a lot of modern IP's get the pachinko treatment, it's usually franchises that are 10 years or older, although I was surprised Madoka and Bayonetta got the pachinko treatment given how relatively new they are).





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"Re(7):SNKPlaymore shutting down Pachislot div" , posted Sat 10 Oct 04:08:post reply

quote:
The Ledo statement they made when they bought SNK suggested that they were primely interested in tending and growing SNK's IPs. And I just can't see Pachinko ever being a way to "introduce" new young fans. It's usually to coerce old fans into playing Pachinko (hence why not a lot of modern IP's get the pachinko treatment, it's usually franchises that are 10 years or older, although I was surprised Madoka and Bayonetta got the pachinko treatment given how relatively new they are).


It's hard to take notice since it's rarely talked about in the English side of the internet, but there's actually quite a lot of recent titles that get turned into pachi-- Monogatari series, God Eater, Devil Survivor 2, Stein's Gate for example are a few that comes to my mind for this year. 

That said, whether they're actually a hit is a question I wonder too. It certainly caters to a different kind of audience than the hardcore gamers. When Toheart2 turned into pachi a few years back, I was seriously scratching my head. It's certainly hard to imagine moe otakus going to pachi parlors.


I have a feeling that in the long run, SNKP may end up being a hollow IP holdings company under Ledo.





[this message was edited by Professor on Sat 10 Oct 04:19]

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"Re(8):SNKPlaymore shutting down Pachislot div" , posted Sat 10 Oct 04:28post reply

quote:
It's hard to take notice since it's rarely talked about in the English side of the internet, but there's actually quite a lot of recent titles that get turned into pachi-- Monogatari series, God Eater, Devil Survivor 2, Stein's Gate for example are a few that comes to my mind for this year. 

That said, whether they're actually a hit is a question I wonder too. It certainly caters to a different kind of audience than the hardcore gamers. When Toheart2 turned into pachi a few years back, I was seriously scratching my head.


I have a feeling that in the long run, SNKP may end up being a hollow IP holdings company under Ledo.

I stand corrected. I sometimes speak out of a notion of authority but in most cases I really don't have a clue what I'm talking about.

I suppose with this recent news, the new doomsday scenario for SNKP has changed from "endlessly churning out pachislot machines" to "ceasing to exist as a developer in Japan, merely being another basket of IPs being held by a corporation, only being used in Chinese Market-only online games". And well, at least it's a change of pace.





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"Re(9):Professor shutting down Pachislot" , posted Sat 10 Oct 05:03post reply

quote:
They're sort of like choking their own throat just so that they won't get shot.
PROFESSOR FOR PRESIDENT
quote:
I sometimes speak out of a notion of authority but in most cases I really don't have a clue what I'm talking about.

That's my job! While I've never bothered with panchinko ("try it, it's like pinball with all the fun removed!"), its place in the broader politics of gambling now is interesting. The current government was keen on introducing Singapore-style integrated resorts (tourist-focused casinos situated within family-friendly resorts, even if the former makes all the money), but that casino legalization bill keeps stalling and the new minister in charge of it comes from a party that is "cautious" on the subject (but that's not the same as "against"). Less private gambling, more government-run touristic gambling?





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"Re(10):Professor shutting down Pachislot" , posted Sun 11 Oct 12:53post reply

quote:
I sometimes speak out of a notion of authority but in most cases I really don't have a clue what I'm talking about.

That's my job!
In all fairness, when it comes to the internet, it's EVERYONE'S job.
quote:
I have a feeling that in the long run, SNKP may end up being a hollow IP holdings company under Ledo.
I seem to recall a time SNKPlaymore was going to try being something like that before, possibly under Mr. Mizufune's rule. Am I mistaken?





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"Re(2):Re(10):Professor shutting down Pachislo" , posted Mon 12 Oct 04:26post reply

This last 2 months had been interesting from the company, starting with the resolution of the square enix conflict, the poor reception of KOF XIV and now the news of SNKP closing his pachislots division and move in into gaming, it seems that we had a lot of uncertanity on what will happen in the future.

By the way, anybody could told me just how really popular is the fighting game in China? I doubt that is making LOL numbers but it seems that still has some kind of mainstream following and that they scene is super healthy in the mainland.

Is there a good way to see latest videos of tournaments and the like? and which games are being played?





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"Re(3):Re(10):Professor shutting down Pachislo" , posted Mon 12 Oct 23:08:post reply

quote:

By the way, anybody could told me just how really popular is the fighting game in China? I doubt that is making LOL numbers but it seems that still has some kind of mainstream following and that they scene is super healthy in the mainland.

Is there a good way to see latest videos of tournaments and the like? and which games are being played?

This is something I've been curious about for so long. And I feel like there's not enough information about it, which is unfortunate. There was this hubbub lasy year when China streamed a KOF 97 tournament on Douyu (China's equivalent to twitch) and it got over 500,000 viewers, the most in any fighting game tournament ever by a wide margin.

But it seems that Douyu's viewer count is either intentionally jacked-up or is just inaccurate. Streams for other game tournaments like Dota 2 and LoL are also exuberantly high, higher than it makes sense for it to be the case. I don't have a lot of sources but there're a few reddit topics (one and two) about it.

I can only comment about my personal first-hand impression, but KOF (especially 97 and 2002/2002UM, although 98 does get played, and to a lesser extent 98UM,) are the main games in arcades in Beijing, Guangzhou, and Shanghai (although KOF XIII is completely ignored publicly). So if you are a fighting game player there, you probably started with KOF. Part of that is the nature of console's having mostly being banned in China since 2000 (thus why Nintendo had to get around that loophole with consoles like the iQue). Of course consoles did exist ina blackmarket, with people mainly playing pirated versions of games. Although China has lifted the console ban just last year.

But even in Hong Kong, that's been the case too. Arcade-wise, none of the other fighting games get played, partially because Japanese Arcade manufacturers right now have moved on to digital distribution services like Nesica and Aime, both of which are Japan-only and not supported outside the country, so none of the (at least the newest update of) major fighting games are even available there. As I mentioned, it's certainly an interesting question and I'd love to learn more about it.

[edit] This interview with top Chinese KOF and USF4 player Xiao Hai delves a little into the nature of fighting games in China. I find it interesting that he thinks KOF XIII has more viable characters that can compete than KOF98 given the whole "Mr Karate, EX Iori, and Kims in every top 8" popular sentiment right now with KOF XIII.





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[this message was edited by badoor on Tue 13 Oct 01:46]

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"Re(4):Re(10):Professor shutting down Pachislo" , posted Tue 13 Oct 17:07post reply

quote:
But even in Hong Kong, that's been the case too. Arcade-wise, none of the other fighting games get played, partially because Japanese Arcade manufacturers right now have moved on to digital distribution services like Nesica and Aime, both of which are Japan-only and not supported outside the country, so none of the (at least the newest update of) major fighting games are even available there. As I mentioned, it's certainly an interesting question and I'd love to learn more about it.


IMO* in Hong Kong, it is guaranteed that almost every game center has KOF2002. It is not guaranteed that they will have any other fighting games. Or any other games at all. I've seen dingy little arcades with one Blast City for 2002 sitting in the back after rows of nothing but slotmachines. I'd estimate that about 80% of all arcade cabinets with a fighting game in them have 2002. 2002UM and 98UM can be found also. SSFIVAE2012 cabs are left unplayed, but can be seen in some places. Everything else is a rare sight.

Here's an interesting read about the HK scene:
Street Fighter and The King of Fighters in Hong Kong: A Study of Cultural Consumption and Localization of Japanese Games in an Asian Context

*I of course have not been to every game center in HK, but I've been to about a half of them roughly a year ago. I'm talking about the current situation. About ten years ago I saw more 3S cabinets there than you can find SFIV cabinets now. There used to be a lot of variety, now it's just KOF.





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"Hiroaki shutting down Marvelous" , posted Tue 13 Oct 19:51post reply

I am sure all SNK fans love Hiroaki. But personally, because I am a bad person, I also came to love Hiroaki's perpetual bad luck / "kiss of death" marking the commercial perfomance of every single game he's been involved with since he left SNK. And after a long wait, it seems we finally have a new candidate with Uppers on Vita.





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"Re(1):Hiroaki shutting down Marvelous" , posted Wed 14 Oct 03:06post reply

quote:
I am sure all SNK fans love Hiroaki. But personally, because I am a bad person, I also came to love Hiroaki's perpetual bad luck / "kiss of death" marking the commercial perfomance of every single game he's been involved with since he left SNK. And after a long wait, it seems we finally have a new candidate with Uppers on Vita.



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"KoF98OL cosplay contest" , posted Wed 14 Oct 16:48post reply

Looks like that Chinese mobile version of KoF98 is putting together a Mai cosplay contest - and based on the site's front page, it's not the first time either.





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"Re(5):Re(10):Professor shutting down Pachislo" , posted Wed 14 Oct 17:54post reply

quote:
But even in Hong Kong, that's been the case too. Arcade-wise, none of the other fighting games get played, partially because Japanese Arcade manufacturers right now have moved on to digital distribution services like Nesica and Aime, both of which are Japan-only and not supported outside the country, so none of the (at least the newest update of) major fighting games are even available there. As I mentioned, it's certainly an interesting question and I'd love to learn more about it.

IMO* in Hong Kong, it is guaranteed that almost every game center has KOF2002. It is not guaranteed that they will have any other fighting games. Or any other games at all. I've seen dingy little arcades with one Blast City for 2002 sitting in the back after rows of nothing but slotmachines. I'd estimate that about 80% of all arcade cabinets with a fighting game in them have 2002. 2002UM and 98UM can be found also. SSFIVAE2012 cabs are left unplayed, but can be seen in some places. Everything else is a rare sight.

Here's an interesting read about the HK scene:
Street Fighter and The King of Fighters in Hong Kong: A Study of Cultural Consumption and Localization of Japanese Games in an Asian Context

*I of course have not been to every game center in HK, but I've been to about a half of them roughly a year ago. I'm talking about the current situation. About ten years ago I saw more 3S cabinets there than you can find SFIV cabinet

-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --
Wow! that article you linked is super interesting. It's exactly the sort of thing I was talking about.

And yeah, KOF2002 dominates HK arcades from all the ones I've been to when I was there just over a month ago (and the time before that, around 2 years ago).

Of course this is all talking about the arcade side of things. I'm guessing the console fighting game scene hues much closer to what's globally popular now (Ultra SF4, Tekken etc.).





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"KOF XIV at PlayStation Experience" , posted Fri 23 Oct 03:07:post reply

Well it seems that SNKP next game will make an appearence at the next Playstation Experience Event

http://blog.us.playstation.com/2015/10/22/playstation-experience-2015-exhibitors-list-playable-games/

Hope to see something better than the fiasco from last month





[this message was edited by sibarraz on Fri 23 Oct 03:10]

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"Re(1):KOF XIV at PlayStation Experience" , posted Fri 23 Oct 03:23post reply

quote:
Well it seems that SNKP next game will make an appearence at the next Playstation Experience Event

http://blog.us.playstation.com/2015/10/22/playstation-experience-2015-exhibitors-list-playable-games/

Hope to see something better than the fiasco from last month



The saddest part is that there won't even be tears. People will just walk away and try to get it out of their minds.





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"Re(2):KOF XIV at PlayStation Experience" , posted Fri 23 Oct 23:39post reply

It's going to be playable? Here's hoping something interesting comes out of this but whatever is shown should make for plenty of conversations.





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"Re(3):KOF XIV at PlayStation Experience" , posted Sat 24 Oct 05:30post reply

quote:
It's going to be playable? Here's hoping something interesting comes out of this but whatever is shown should make for plenty of conversations.



I'm hoping that the original trailer being posted was actually a mistake. The real game looks way better!

"Oops! Looks like this trailer hadn't rendered correctly and someone exported it anyway!"

"Stupid interns, this trailer was from a different, canceled project in 2011!"

"Oh man this is embarrassing... an employee with a personal vendetta stole the USB stick with the real trailer on it and swapped in this piece of crap just to make us look bad!"





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"Re(4):KOF XIV at PlayStation Experience" , posted Sat 24 Oct 13:20post reply

quote:
It's going to be playable? Here's hoping something interesting comes out of this but whatever is shown should make for plenty of conversations.


I'm hoping that the original trailer being posted was actually a mistake. The real game looks way better!

"Oops! Looks like this trailer hadn't rendered correctly and someone exported it anyway!"

"Stupid interns, this trailer was from a different, canceled project in 2011!"

"Oh man this is embarrassing... an employee with a personal vendetta stole the USB stick with the real trailer on it and swapped in this piece of crap just to make us look bad!"



https://youtu.be/S_q3fip9U0I?t=165





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"Re(5):KOF XIV at PlayStation Experience" , posted Tue 27 Oct 20:18post reply

Interview in Chinese with the KoF14 producer Yasuyuki Oda - apparently he's a fan of the KoFs since 94, but running Google Translator doesn't reveal a whole lot more.





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":KOF XIV" , posted Tue 27 Oct 20:29post reply

Maybe this was already posted, but Korean fan Gatoray just linked in his twitter a interview (chinese) with Yasuyuki Oda, the producer of kof 14.

Stalking his facebook, looks like he worked in old snk and dimps before.

Btw, gatoray mantains a youtube channel with kof reuploads from nico and streams.





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"Re(1)::KOF XIV" , posted Wed 28 Oct 05:11:post reply

quote:
Maybe this was already posted, but Korean fan Gatoray just linked in his twitter a interview (chinese) with Yasuyuki Oda, the producer of kof 14.

Stalking his facebook, looks like he worked in old snk and dimps before.

Btw, gatoray mantains a youtube channel with kof reuploads from nico and streams.



Director of the dreadded SSF4AE.

http://www.mobygames.com/developer/yasuyuki-oda/credits/developerId,362216/





[this message was edited by Professor on Wed 28 Oct 06:23]

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"Re(2)::KOF XIV" , posted Wed 28 Oct 06:24post reply

quote:
Director of the dreadded SSF4AE.

And designer for SFxTekken. Oh dear lord, I can hear the agony of KOF fans.





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"Re(3)::KOF XIV" , posted Wed 28 Oct 08:22post reply

quote:
Director of the dreadded SSF4AE.
And designer for SFxTekken. Oh dear lord, I can hear the agony of KOF fans.



Why are we still here, just to Psycho Ball?





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"Re(4)::KOF XIV" , posted Wed 28 Oct 16:40:post reply

quote:
Director of the dreadded SSF4AE.
And designer for SFxTekken. Oh dear lord, I can hear the agony of KOF fans.


Why are we still here, just to Psycho Ball?



According to a report by Gamebiz.jp, KOF98OnLine (a smartphone app by Tencent) is dominating the top ranks of Apple's iOS Appstore in Chinese speaking countries. It's currently ranked at #1 in Hongkong and Taiwan, and #2 in China.

It's not 1st place in China because they've had a head start; the app was available since August 10 in China whereas it just got released around the 13th of this month in the other two countries. Still though, it reportedly hasn't dropped from the top 5 in China since its release, which certainly shows the series' popularity there.

Apparently they invited Tencent's app developers along with other involved staff to SNKP's Osaka headquarters and had an interview there with various media outlets from China. The KOF14 interview was a part of that.





[this message was edited by Professor on Wed 28 Oct 16:44]

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"Re(5)::KOF XIV" , posted Wed 28 Oct 17:10:post reply

Surely I can't be the only one that finds it funny that a smartphone RPG battling game that is KOF branded can't merely trade on the KOF brand, but specifically has to invoke the KOF'98 title?





[this message was edited by Spoon on Wed 28 Oct 17:11]

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"Re(6)::KOF XIV" , posted Wed 28 Oct 17:38post reply

quote:
Surely I can't be the only one that finds it funny that a smartphone RPG battling game that is KOF branded can't merely trade on the KOF brand, but specifically has to invoke the KOF'98 title?



It's like Street Fighter 2 in the USA.

Man, I'm glad they finally figured out how to make tons of money off of KOF in Chinese speaking countries. I hope more Japanese companies will realise that they have potentially more fans in China than any other territory (including Japan)






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"Re(7)::KOF XIV" , posted Wed 28 Oct 20:22post reply

Is the app only for iOS? I'm going to HK in a month and I'm curious about trying it out.





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"Re(7)::KOF XIV" , posted Thu 29 Oct 02:37post reply

quote:

It's like Street Fighter 2 in the USA.



I think it's more extreme than that, because we don't see SF4 or SFV or anything else recent containing SF characters being sold as "Street Fighter 2 2015" (and no, Street Fighter 2010 The Final Fight doesn't count as a recent example :p) unless it explicitly is a port of SF2 (e.g. SF2THDR), even though SF4 and SFV trade heavily on SF2 recognition. Consider that a mobile smartphone game is deliberately invoking not just a particular edition, but a particular edition that is tied to a year in the not-yet-fashionably-distant past!





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"SNKP quits Pachislo for good" , posted Mon 2 Nov 20:48:post reply

Announcing the victors, here they are. New regulations and the decline of the pachislo/pachinko-playing population are blamed as the main factors. SNKP will focus on games and the licensing of their IP, as mentioned in the earlier rumor that hinted to this official announcement.

quote:
I think it's more extreme than that, because we don't see SF4 or SFV or anything else recent containing SF characters being sold as "Street Fighter 2 2015"

To be fair, we probably would see that today had SF4 failed. The reason SNKP pushes their past so much is mainly because nothing new has worked. Capcom still regularly releases SFII-related contents, and their most recent mainstream collaboration in Japan (with the super-popular gaming app Monster Strike) used Street Fighter II assets for its promotion (and used SF2 characters only in the event itself) even though it was officially a USF4 event.





Même Narumi est épatée !

[this message was edited by chazumaru on Mon 2 Nov 20:58]

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"Re(1):SNKP quits Pachislo for good" , posted Tue 3 Nov 10:12post reply

Sounds promising. Lets see how well they follow up on this.





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"Re(5)::KOF XIV" , posted Tue 3 Nov 10:41post reply

quote:
Director of the dreadded SSF4AE.
And designer for SFxTekken. Oh dear lord, I can hear the agony of KOF fans.


Why are we still here, just to Psycho Ball?


According to a report by Gamebiz.jp, KOF98OnLine (a smartphone app by Tencent) is dominating the top ranks of Apple's iOS Appstore in Chinese speaking countries. It's currently ranked at #1 in Hongkong and Taiwan, and #2 in China.

It's not 1st place in China because they've had a head start; the app was available since August 10 in China whereas it just got released around the 13th of this month in the other two countries. Still though, it reportedly hasn't dropped from the top 5 in China since its release, which certainly shows the series' popularity there.

Apparently they invited Tencent's app developers along with other involved staff to SNKP's Osaka headquarters and had an interview there with various media outlets from China. The KOF14 interview was a part of that.



Yes it is, I'm also playing on it!
I can tell you is, it is addicting and keeping you busy.
Keep sending 3 times a day of free energy , daily and main quests are good too.

Best of it is, you dont have to spend money on this game as you can gradually get it anyway. Just slow progress.

I would say is , content and game play is way better than Metal Slug Defense.

Maybe I should do a English part ? LOL
But I'm sure English version will be there soon.





Who did this to these dogs ???

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"2nd PV" , posted Wed 4 Nov 12:50:post reply

...

Well, at least it's going to definitely be the 2d playstyle we all love...

...but Chang?

EDIT: Have the 1080p 60fps version of the trailer





[this message was edited by Doshin on Wed 4 Nov 14:25]

neo0r0chiaku
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"Re(1):2nd PV" , posted Wed 4 Nov 13:28post reply

quote:
...

Well, at least it's going to definitely be the 2d playstyle we all love...

...but Chang?



Well, what can you do now! $20 bucks digital download worthy, nothing more in my opinion!





Long Live!

TheRedKnight
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"Re(2):2nd PV" , posted Wed 4 Nov 15:06post reply

Damn you Chang. Your inclusion ruined my joke. I was going to call this The King Of Yes-Asia Fashion Models XIV.

I gave the official trailer a thumbs down.





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"Re(3):2nd PV" , posted Wed 4 Nov 16:25post reply

At first I thought Chang was the one doing the claw swipe and I thought that that was kind of hilarious.

Holy crap, the posture of some of the characters is so bad. Look at Kyo at the super freeze of his Orochinagi super: he's got that computer programmer hunch! It doesn't look like he's ready to dish out righteous fury on the other guy, it looks like he's leerily examining a dead animal dangling on a string. And that's ignoring the animation leading into it, which is weak as hell.

SO BAD UGH

We need that fine gentleman who once described the fine differences between Ryo/Robert/Takuma and the brilliance of Makoto to explain to the world why the character animation in this is so bad.





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"Re(4):2nd PV" , posted Wed 4 Nov 17:56post reply

My positive takeaway from all this: at least poor innocent pachislo players will be spared the worry of a potential KOFXIV pachislo machine.

Athena was the recent topic of a Shmuplations project.





Même Narumi est épatée !

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"Re(1):2nd PV" , posted Wed 4 Nov 20:03post reply

quote:
...

Well, at least it's going to definitely be the 2d playstyle we all love...

...but Chang?

EDIT: Have the 1080p 60fps version of the trailer



Chang is an interesting option, but I wonder how he ended up with a South Town jail uniform (it's about time he dropped the Kim duds anyway) when he's supposed to be under Kim's supervision in Korea - I guess he escaped to the US, got jailed there and was supposed to be extradited later or something. I guess that's one minor plot point getting hinted at.
Leona feels like her XIII self. I like the more camo-ish pants, but the lighter color on her top feels odd (more desert-like gear?).
I'm liking how Iori's super has slashing effects that reference his claw style from XII and XIII, but then again, I like when alternate styles get integrated into a more complete take on a character.

Some people are arguing prisoner Chang is a confirmation or a rumor once posted here (although right now I can't access the page...).





...!!

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"Re(2):2nd PV" , posted Wed 4 Nov 20:12:post reply

quote:
Some people are arguing prisoner Chang is a confirmation or a rumor once posted here (although right now I can't access the page...).



I copied the original post below (from Evil_Yagami) just in case.
I remember us discussing it on MMC last winter.



KOFXIV roster according to the rumor!!

Team 01 : China Team ( 恶魇青年 (??), 糖葫芦 (Tung Fu Rue), 枕头少年 (??) )

Team 02 : Japan Team ( 草蕹京 (Kyo Kusanagi), 二阶堂红丸 (Benimaru Nikaido), 大门五郎 (Goro Daimon) )

Team 03 : Fatal Fury Team ( Terry Bogard, Andy Bogard, 东丈 (Joe Higashi) )

Team 04 : Art of Fighting Team ( 坂崎良 (Ryo Sakazaki), Robert Garcia, 坂崎百合 (Yuri Sakazaki) )

Team 05 : K' Team ( K', Maxima, Kula Diamond )

Team 06 : Kim Team ( 金家藩 (Kim Kaphwan), 他师父 (Kim's Master), 他师母 (Kim's Wife) )

Team 07 : Criminal Team ( 犯人陈 (Prisoner Chang Koehan), 犯人蔡 (Prisoner Choi Bounge), 新人囚犯 (Newcomer Prisoner) )

Team 08 : Women Fighters Team ( 不知火舞 (Mai Shiranui), King, Alice )

Team 09 : Ikari Team ( Ralf Jones, Clark Still, Leona Heidern )

Team 10 : Psycho Soldier team ( Athena Asamiya, 椎拳崇 (Sie Kensou), 摸元斋 (Chin Gentsai) )

Team 11 : Yagami Team ( 八神庵 (Iori Yagami), Mature, Vice )

Team 12 : Mexico Team ( Ramon, Angel, Tizoc )

Team 13 : Palace Wan Team ( 脸谱女 (Acting Mask Girl), 电属性少女歌手 (Teenage Girl Singer with Electric Element), 神秘兜帽男 (Mysterious Hooded Man) )

Team 14 : South Town Team ( Geese Howard, Billy Kane, 营家新人 (??) )

Team 15 : South America Team ( 巴西忍者 (Brazilian Ninja), 残障拳击手 (Handicap Boxer), 拉丁美女 (Pretty Latin Girl) )

Team 16 : Alternate World Team ( 娜可露露 (Nakoruru), Love Heart, 龙娘 (Mui Mui) )

Mid-Boss : ( 中BOSS俄罗斯富豪 (Russian Billionaire) )
Final-Boss : ( 最终BOSS人形态非人类物种 (Non-Human Species) )






Même Narumi est épatée !

[this message was edited by chazumaru on Wed 4 Nov 20:12]

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"Re(3):2nd PV" , posted Wed 4 Nov 21:30post reply

The tweening is so linear you can practically count the keyframes.

I can see why they wanted to hide the animation in the first trailer, but it's funny how they made it look even worse in doing so. These character models were not made for close-ups.





neo0r0chiaku
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"Re(3):2nd PV" , posted Wed 4 Nov 22:27:post reply

quote:
Some people are arguing prisoner Chang is a confirmation or a rumor once posted here (although right now I can't access the page...).


I copied the original post below (from Evil_Yagami) just in case.
I remember us discussing it on MMC last winter.



KOFXIV roster according to the rumor!!

Team 01 : China Team ( 恶魇青年 (??), 糖葫芦 (Tung Fu Rue), 枕头少年 (??) )

Team 02 : Japan Team ( 草蕹京 (Kyo Kusanagi), 二阶堂红丸 (Benimaru Nikaido), 大门五郎 (Goro Daimon) )

Team 03 : Fatal Fury Team ( Terry Bogard, Andy Bogard, 东丈 (Joe Higashi) )

Team 04 : Art of Fighting Team ( 坂崎良 (Ryo Sakazaki), Robert Garcia, 坂崎百合 (Yuri Sakazaki) )

Team 05 : K' Team ( K', Maxima, Kula Diamond )

Team 06 : Kim Team ( 金家藩 (Kim Kaphwan), 他师父 (Kim's Master), 他师母 (Kim's Wife) )

Team 07 : Criminal Team ( 犯人陈 (Prisoner Chang Koehan), 犯人蔡 (Prisoner Choi Bounge), 新人囚犯 (Newcomer Prisoner) )

Team 08 : Women Fighters Team ( 不知火舞 (Mai Shiranui), King, Alice )

Team 09 : Ikari Team ( Ralf Jones, Clark Still, Leona Heidern )

Team 10 : Psycho Soldier team ( Athena Asamiya, 

-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --


Based on this list, this has to be a Dream Match. Some past (really old aged) characters, present (who should be old by now), and new characters that might be the future of the story line for KOF. It can not be a prequel since K team, Leona, Mexico team, come about during the franchise. Can not be a new arc story line since prison team, Tung Fu Rue, Kim's master, and Kim's wife happens before KOF 94. I wish they would have implemented more Garou characters since it continues the story of Fatal Fury. Using the same fighters from previous installments into this migration to 3-D would be best with new protagonists!





Long Live!

[this message was edited by neo0r0chiaku on Wed 4 Nov 22:29]

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"Re(5):2nd PV" , posted Wed 4 Nov 22:32post reply

quote:
My positive takeaway from all this: at least poor innocent pachislo players will be spared the worry of a potential KOFXIV pachislo machine.

That reminds me: I was intrigued to see what 2ch had to say about SNK's new plan of ditching Pachinko and focusing on consumer games.
First, to my surprise, it turns out people remembered who SNK was.
Then, the general opinion was very different from the west's "yeah back to consumer games so great much Shermie". Many posters were saying "not a great loss, their pachinko machines sucked anyway".
It being 2ch, it's difficult to know whether they were pachinko players or pachinko owners (complaining the SNK machine didn't bring enough cash?), but I found it interesting to see what the people actually impacted by the decision thought of it.

As for KOF14, since they are obviously targeting the Chinese market, I guess they were aiming for computer with a very low power level to be able to reach them all?
And as for the shameful ugliness of it all... we've seen in the past that fighting games developed in/for China didn't have... let's say... very high aesthetic standards.





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"Re(6):2nd PV" , posted Wed 4 Nov 23:25post reply

The graphics make me sad, but it's the gameplay, story, and soundtrack that will make or break this as a purchase for me.





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"Re(4):2nd PV" , posted Wed 4 Nov 23:58post reply

quote:

KOFXIV roster according to the rumor!!

No New Face team? That's not a dream at all. Disappointed already!





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"Re(5):2nd PV" , posted Thu 5 Nov 00:12post reply

Has there been any mention of how KoFXIV is going to play? At this point I honestly expect it to be 1v1 instead of a team fighter.





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"Re(6):2nd PV" , posted Thu 5 Nov 01:24post reply

Well, we haven't even seen how the virtual buttons will be displayed on your Android phone yet. Let's not be greedy and ask them to explain the battle system so early.





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"Re(7):2nd PV" , posted Thu 5 Nov 03:09post reply

quote:
Well, we haven't even seen how the virtual buttons will be displayed on your Android phone yet. Let's not be greedy and ask them to explain the battle system so early.



I LOLed






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Spoon
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"Re(8):2nd PV" , posted Thu 5 Nov 03:11post reply

quote:
Well, we haven't even seen how the virtual buttons will be displayed on your Android phone yet. Let's not be greedy and ask them to explain the battle system so early.


I LOLed



I T_Td





nobinobita
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"Re(4):2nd PV - Why KOF14 has crappy poses" , posted Thu 5 Nov 14:54:post reply

quote:
At first I thought Chang was the one doing the claw swipe and I thought that that was kind of hilarious.

Holy crap, the posture of some of the characters is so bad. Look at Kyo at the super freeze of his Orochinagi super: he's got that computer programmer hunch! It doesn't look like he's ready to dish out righteous fury on the other guy, it looks like he's leerily examining a dead animal dangling on a string. And that's ignoring the animation leading into it, which is weak as hell.

SO BAD UGH

We need that fine gentleman who once described the fine differences between Ryo/Robert/Takuma and the brilliance of Makoto to explain to the world why the character animation in this is so bad.



Alright, I'm not the person you’re asking for, but I’m going to tackle this question anyway. Thanks for your comments and for the screen cap. I’ve put it next to the corresponding frame from Kyo’s old sprite that I believe they are referencing for that pose.

http://art-eater.com/?attachment_id=1538

So why does the new pose look so bad? Well here goes…

Spoon you were very right to call that pose weak. It is WEAK WEAK WEAK. Everything about it screams weakness. While the original pose exudes confidence. Here’s why:

-Look at the head. In the original pose, Kyo is looking directly at his opponent. His head is tilted slightly downward. His expression is very focused. It feels predatory. In the new pose his head is starting to turn away from the opponent and it’s angled downward towards the viewer. It feels very unconfident, shy, weak. The 3d model is also pretty expressionless.

Look at the shoulders. In the original pose his front shoulder is turning outward (away from the viewer, following the position of his raised arm). His back shoulder is relaxed. In the new pose his shoulders are turned inward and raised. He is hunching. A very stiff, unconfident pose that also doesn’t quite follow the direction of the arm.

-Look at his arms. In the original pose his raised arm has a smooth curve to it. It’s aggressive, but calm. It’s not full of bravado or machismo, it’s very measured. His back arm is hanging back, relaxed. There’s a nice contrast there. In the new pose his raised arm is bent awkwardly at a 90 degree angle. Visually unexciting. It has zero flow. It’s also very much a defensive, blocking posture. It feels meek. The back arm is also bent and clenched. It’s tense. Nervous. Weak weak weak.


-Look at his chest. The original pose is slightly puffed out. Just slightly. New pose is hunched over.


-Look at his crotch (LOOK AT IT). Original pose is angled oh so slightly outward, ready for action. New pose is pretty straight and stiff. No tilt on the z-axis.


-Look at his legs. First off the original sprite actually looks like he’s wearing pants. There’s flow to the cloth. The 3d model very much looks like a 3d model with a texture on it. The pants follow the contours of his muscles way too much (nice calves). But back to the posing. The original pose is firmly planted on the ground. He isn’t going to budge. The front knee is facing his opponent. Confident. The back leg is straighter, providing more visual contrast and stability. In the new pose his legs feel weak. Both legs are bent, as if they are about to do a little spring and run away. The front knee is pointed more towards the viewer, making it feel a little knock kneed and cowardly. The back leg is bent because whoever posed this doesn’t understand contrast and just puts a bend in everything just because.

So these are a lot of small, specific differences, but they add up to a crucial whole. The original pose conveys so much about Kyo specifically. One way I like to think about poses (especially in the context of a fighting game) is: would this pose fit any other character just as well or better? Think about it. This pose wouldn’t look quite right on another character.

It’s too fancy for Terry or Kim. It’s not flamboyant enough for Benimaru. Too manly for Ash. It’s almost an Iori pose, but it’s not aggressive or evil enough. It’s almost a K’ pose, but it’s too relaxed, that guy’s always tightly wound. It has just the right balance of cool/poise/flashiness/heroic for Kyo, with his fashion model good looks, good nature and regal bloodline.

Now that new pose, even though it has this original pose for reference, it’s just a shallow workmanlike facsimile. It’s missing the subtle decision making, the thought poured into every angle that gives the character life and vitality. Taking that single frame out of context, it looks to me more like a blocking animation than a cool pose that precedes a super.

I hope this makes sense. I’m using a lot of words to describe something that you should really just feel in an instant. That’s the power of good art. This isn’t just nostalgia speaking, these classic 2d fighting games had a ton of expertise put into every frame. That’s why they remain excellent to this day.

Part of the reason the new animation looks bad is because of the very linear tweening as Gojira has pointed out. Another reason is that the key poses themselves just aren't very solid.






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[this message was edited by nobinobita on Thu 5 Nov 15:03]

Professor
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"Re(5):2nd PV - Why KOF14 has crappy poses" , posted Thu 5 Nov 19:20post reply

Thanks for the really detailed breakdown Nobi! It's always great to read your articles.

There's no doubt that SNKP is having issues trying to find good development staff. Even if they secured seasoned planners and directors, if they can't find good technical staff, it's a huge problem.


On a totally different note, the rumored roster that's been reposted was debunked quite a while ago iirc. I'm surprised to see it floating around all over the place.





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"Re(6):2nd PV - Why KOF14 has crappy poses" , posted Thu 5 Nov 19:52post reply

Great write-up Nobi!

quote:
On a totally different note, the rumored roster that's been reposted was debunked quite a while ago iirc. I'm surprised to see it floating around all over the place.



Well, that mention of a prisoner Chang did raise an eyebrow or two.

Saw this yesterday on /r/SNKplaymore: a guy compared the animation speeds between both XIV trailers and XIII, and based on that decided that the new trailer's animation speed was probably wrong, so he put together a corrected version.





...!!

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"Re(6):2nd PV - Why KOF14 has crappy poses" , posted Thu 5 Nov 21:01post reply

quote:
There's no doubt that SNKP is having issues trying to find good development staff. Even if they secured seasoned planners and directors, if they can't find good technical staff, it's a huge problem.
They need a good pose director. Maybe find and hire a fanboy of a certain series or something...
quote:
On a totally different note, the rumored roster that's been reposted was debunked quite a while ago iirc.
And how was that?





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"Re(7):2nd PV - Why KOF14 has crappy poses" , posted Thu 5 Nov 21:23post reply

quote:
On a totally different note, the rumored roster that's been reposted was debunked quite a while ago iirc.

And how was that?



One of the more prominent KOF scene contributors from Taiwan (a11111357) discovered that it was originally a post from an author that makes many groundless rumors. I don't have details since I didn't really follow on it.

If it's true though, it'll be awesome-- a Russian billionaire boss sounds too cool to ignore.





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"Re(5):2nd PV" , posted Thu 5 Nov 21:39post reply

quote:

KOFXIV roster according to the rumor!!
No New Face team? That's not a dream at all. Disappointed already!



Indeed; a KOF dream match can never exist without Yashiro, Shermie and Chris (and their Orochi versions).

What surprises me in this list, though, is: would SNKP be able to finish all these characters in time? Even if the cheap graphics and animations mean they can finish each character faster, that's still a pretty large roster...





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"Re(6):2nd PV" , posted Fri 6 Nov 01:43post reply

Considering Yashiro and Chris of the New Face Team (sure is a weird name now...) were hugely popular (if only because of how strong they were...) in the Chinese sphere during the heyday of KOF98, I'd be really surprised if a KOF designed specifically for Chinese market appeal would leave them out.





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"Re(7):2nd PV" , posted Fri 6 Nov 02:14post reply

Woah Nobi, let me echo what others have said, awesome breakdown.

I think the first time I came across the KOF franchise and actually gave it a memorable glance was in 97/98 when I was at my college arcade and I was looking for some SFA2 competition. Gradually over the years I warmed up to KOF and became a huge fan of the in-game art style. Your write up re-opened my eyes and made me aware of something I knew in the back of my mind-- these guys were masters at their craft. Holy cow did they convey so much in a bundle of pixels.

Maybe its melodramatic but I also think its the truth: This is a lost art. We will never live in such an era again.





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"Re(6):2nd PV" , posted Fri 6 Nov 02:18post reply

Thanks, that's a great breakdown of broken down Kyo. I do, however, have a question; could that pose be done in 3D?

The problem I have with the comparisons of upcoming games with older titles is that 2D and 3D models are totally different beasts. The techniques and cheats that can be done with a 2D character don't always translate to a character that can be viewed from multiple angles. The end result is 3D characters who have weird stances and dislocated shoulders since they are trying to emulate animation that only worked when the character was flat. That apples and oranges difference is why I find direct comparisons of something being released in 2016 to something that ran on a CPS3 board to be so shaky.

So while XIV Kyo is looking ragged can the stylized swagger be captured in something outside of a sprite? Would that require more stylization than the KoF XIV art style would allow? Should he be given new animation that suggests his old body language but accommodates the pluses and minuses of 3D?

(A digression, but I remember an interview with one of the directors of the old Peanuts cartoons in which he complained about how difficult it was to animate the characters since they weren't designed to be consistent from different angles. It makes me wonder how much of a headache it was to create -and possibly watch- the upcoming 3D movie.)

quote:
What surprises me in this list, though, is: would SNKP be able to finish all these characters in time? Even if the cheap graphics and animations mean they can finish each character faster, that's still a pretty large roster...

That's why I don't understand why that rumored list is still floating around; the animators barely seem to have a grip on the four revealed characters but people think that they are going to crank out a fifty character roster? It seems the truly faithful never give up hope.





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"Re(7):2nd PV" , posted Fri 6 Nov 03:13post reply

quote:
Thanks, that's a great breakdown of broken down Kyo. I do, however, have a question; could that pose be done in 3D?



Of course it can. Remember that KoF XII & XIII graphics were first done in 3D models, and then they "painted them over" with pixel art. This game could have perfectly looked way better if they did the same work, but rather than "painted them over", they just kept the 3d and added shading and filtering and what not.

Instead we are getting a Hyper NeoGeo 128 game.






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"Re(8):2nd PV" , posted Fri 6 Nov 04:04post reply

quote:
Of course it can. Remember that KoF XII & XIII graphics were first done in 3D models, and then they "painted them over" with pixel art. This game could have perfectly looked way better if they did the same work, but rather than "painted them over", they just kept the 3d and added shading and filtering and what not.

Instead we are getting a Hyper NeoGeo 128 game.



Are there any pictures of the XII sprites rotated to an angle other than the one shown in game? I suspect from any other angle they are as distorted as the GGXrd models when the camera is switched.





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"Re(7):2nd PV" , posted Fri 6 Nov 04:18post reply

quote:

3D posing


Even in SF4 they had this problem in trying to translate the 2D characters across. There's an interview where they talk about how Guy has to have incredibly weird proportions in order to maintain his SFA appearance. Xrd's approach to it was to just manually force the perspective on every frame of animation.

In this very particular case, it's just a poorly constructed pose. Consider that Tekken and VF characters manage to look good from a variety of camera angles doing all kinds of powerful poses.

quote:
peanuts


A bunch of technology had to be written for this! There's probably a talk about it from SIGGRAPH out there.





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"Re(8):2nd PV - Why KOF14 has crappy poses" , posted Fri 6 Nov 06:08:post reply

That is some sick pose analysis nobi, haha. I could only tell that something was really off.

quote:

If it's true though, it'll be awesome-- a Russian billionaire boss sounds too cool to ignore.



I don't know, the "Kim's Wife" part really makes it sound like a joke. I mean I suppose it could happen, but it always seemed like Kim was meant to have the most traditional nuclear family in the series. If not him then who would amongst them would carry that mantle?





[this message was edited by Gojira on Fri 6 Nov 06:16]

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"Re(8):2nd PV" , posted Fri 6 Nov 10:32post reply

quote:

3D posing

Even in SF4 they had this problem in trying to translate the 2D characters across. There's an interview where they talk about how Guy has to have incredibly weird proportions in order to maintain his SFA appearance. Xrd's approach to it was to just manually force the perspective on every frame of animation.

In this very particular case, it's just a poorly constructed pose. Consider that Tekken and VF characters manage to look good from a variety of camera angles doing all kinds of powerful poses.

peanuts

A bunch of technology had to be written for this! There's probably a talk about it from SIGGRAPH out there.



You're quite right Spoon, I used to work with 3D animation company for a while (although I'm just a pure IT guy).

I had heard about how hard is transforming a 2D animation to 3D.
I even saw the exact animation in 2D form and 3D, it is a complete disaster. The animation team has to adjust to make it look smooth but when I saw it and I felt its a bit weird on it





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hasukii
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"Re(9):2nd PV" , posted Fri 6 Nov 10:53post reply

By the way, I noticed SRK site put a list from here and not credited ?

I meant the translation part though.





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"Re(7):2nd PV" , posted Fri 6 Nov 17:35:post reply

quote:
So while XIV Kyo is looking ragged can the stylized swagger be captured in something outside of a sprite? Would that require more stylization than the KoF XIV art style would allow? Should he be given new animation that suggests his old body language but accommodates the pluses and minuses of 3D?


3D renderings certainly has a huge trouble mimicking 2D art.
That said, I think this case with Kyo is just simply bad tuning/posing.


In fact, it's so bad that I'd say my own take on the pose using a MMD Yahagi model might actually be superior even though I'm total amature. Whoever did that pose seriously didn't understand the concept of body angles.

http://www.mmcafe.com/cgi-bin/imageboard/file/kof14-yahagi_mmcafe.jpg





[this message was edited by Professor on Fri 6 Nov 17:44]

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"Re(9):2nd PV - Why KOF14 has crappy poses" , posted Fri 6 Nov 19:36post reply

quote:
I don't know, the "Kim's Wife" part really makes it sound like a joke. I mean I suppose it could happen, but it always seemed like Kim was meant to have the most traditional nuclear family in the series. If not him then who would amongst them would carry that mantle?



A few characters had such families, but are either widowers (Heidern, Takuma), have no known children of their own (Chin), or spend so much time away from their families they barely count (Saishyu, Ryuhyaku Todoh).
Then again, Kim is practically married to the idea of beating up people with impunity thenks to the power of PR job





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"Re(8):2nd PV" , posted Fri 6 Nov 20:53post reply

quote:
So while XIV Kyo is looking ragged can the stylized swagger be captured in something outside of a sprite? Would that require more stylization than the KoF XIV art style would allow? Should he be given new animation that suggests his old body language but accommodates the pluses and minuses of 3D?

3D renderings certainly has a huge trouble mimicking 2D art.
That said, I think this case with Kyo is just simply bad tuning/posing.


In fact, it's so bad that I'd say my own take on the pose using a MMD Yahagi model might actually be superior even though I'm total amature. Whoever did that pose seriously didn't understand the concept of body angles.

http://www.mmcafe.com/cgi-bin/imageboard/file/kof14-yahagi_mmcafe.jpg



Woah nice pose professor! You are quite good at this! Seriously, you really nailed the nuances of the pose!

Update on the pose:
It's actually copied from KOFXIII (doh!)

It follows that pose a bit better superficially, but it's still missing all the nuances that we've been discussing.

I do feel a little guilty for ragging on it so much. There are lots of reasons why the visuals on a game look terrible outside of lack of ability of an individual artist.

Maybe the character isn't rigged very well. Maybet it was a super rushed job (very likely). Maybe it was optimized for one angle, but then the camera changed later, who knows?

In any case I'm glad people are paying more attention and demanding higher quality from KOF. It would be great if somehow all this backlash against KOF XIV resulted in a resurgance of sales for KOF XIII haha.






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"Re(9):2nd PV" , posted Fri 6 Nov 23:31post reply

quote:
I do feel a little guilty for ragging on it so much


You shouldn't. A KOF game without those subtle nuances has no business calling itself KOF.

It almost reminds me of Udon's attempts at translating the SSF2X sprites to HD and missing all the details that made the originals so great.

Hopefully they can iron everything out by next year. Until then, they should refrain from any more trailers or announcements to avoid further embarrassment.





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"Re(9):2nd PV" , posted Fri 6 Nov 23:40:post reply

quote:
Woah nice pose professor! You are quite good at this! Seriously, you really nailed the nuances of the pose!

Update on the pose:
It's actually copied from KOFXIII (doh!)

It follows that pose a bit better superficially, but it's still missing all the nuances that we've been discussing.


Thanks! I tried out the KOF13 pose as well. Although it's not spot-on to the original sprite, I think it still picks on the main points better than 14's posing.

http://www.mmcafe.com/cgi-bin/imageboard/file/kof14-yahagi_mmcafe2.jpg

The whole point to Kyo's pose is that he's actually twisting his torso with his lower half facing the opponent and upper half facing slightly backwards. It gives him a pose with muscle contraction that looks like he's ready to strike at any moment. I think the guy who did 14's pose is just missing that point, amongst other parts of his body angles





[this message was edited by Professor on Sat 7 Nov 01:03]

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"Re(10):2nd PV" , posted Sat 7 Nov 01:04post reply

quote:
Woah nice pose professor! You are quite good at this! Seriously, you really nailed the nuances of the pose!

Update on the pose:
It's actually copied from KOFXIII (doh!)

It follows that pose a bit better superficially, but it's still missing all the nuances that we've been discussing.

Thanks! I tried out the KOF13 pose as well. Although it's not spot-on to the original sprite, I think it still picks on the main points better than 14's posing.

http://www.mmcafe.com/cgi-bin/imageboard/file/kof14-yahagi_mmcafe2.jpg

The whole point to Kyo's pose is that he's actually twisting his torso with his lower half facing the opponent and upper half facing slightly backwards. It gives him a pose with muscle contraction that looks like he's ready to strike at any moment. I think the guy who did 14's pose is just missing that point, amongst other parts of his body angles


14 pose looks like he has no ribs!





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"Re(10):2nd PV" , posted Sat 7 Nov 02:51:post reply

quote:
The whole point to Kyo's pose is that he's actually twisting his torso with his lower half facing the opponent and upper half facing slightly backwards. It gives him a pose with muscle contraction that looks like he's ready to strike at any moment. I think the guy who did 14's pose is just missing that point, amongst other parts of his body angles



The face is the final nail in the coffin.

KOF 14 Kyo has no tension. No chest muscles, no tension to the right fist, nothing with the neck...

But then there is the face. KOF 13 Kyo has that angry/powerful face. The eyebrows, the mouth, it speaks of a guy who is in control of a lot power and is about to release it. That face is strong enough that it could make up for KOF 14 Kyo's posing (at least if you included the KOF 13 neck work as well.)

KOF 14 Kyo is an emo guy giving his opponent a funny look. KOF 14 Kyo is Derek Zoolander, except Zoolander expressed more emotion.





[this message was edited by Baines on Sat 7 Nov 02:56]

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"Re(2):Re(10):2nd PV" , posted Sat 7 Nov 05:20post reply

I don't know if someone posted this video or not, KOFXIV vs XIII Comparison:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNkGxgMkcBE





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"KOF 20th anniversary" , posted Mon 9 Nov 01:37post reply

So, the 20th anniversary is coming to an end (?), and someone at SNKP thought the best way to celebrate it was to release none other than the American Sports Team itself in Metal Slug Defence.
Brian's special is the helicopter so all is fine.





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"Re(1):KOF 20th anniversary" , posted Mon 9 Nov 07:39post reply

quote:
So, the 20th anniversary is coming to an end (?), and someone at SNKP thought the best way to celebrate it was to release none other than the American Sports Team itself in Metal Slug Defence.
Brian's special is the helicopter so all is fine.

Still cant believe they showed up earlier than Whip and Heidern. Or before than the all any other MS handheld/mobile characters. It must be that the Shermie is too busy being ghost to have time for slapping Brian.





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"Re(2):KOF 20th anniversary" , posted Mon 9 Nov 08:00post reply

quote:
Still cant believe they showed up earlier than Whip and Heidern. Or before than the all any other MS handheld/mobile characters. It must be that the Shermie is too busy being ghost to have time for slapping Brian.

Yeah, at first I thought "that's probably because they celebrate KOF94, and now indeed all the characters from 94 are in except Rugal"... But Mature and Vice already made it so I don't know.

I wonder how Shermie (not Orochi) would work, though. She doesn't have any move that would make her efficient in this game. Does MSD support invincibility frames, in which case her spin kick could have some use?
It would probably be easier to have the NFT being in full Orochi mode, though.





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"Re(3):KOF 20th anniversary" , posted Mon 9 Nov 09:09post reply

quote:
Still cant believe they showed up earlier than Whip and Heidern. Or before than the all any other MS handheld/mobile characters. It must be that the Shermie is too busy being ghost to have time for slapping Brian.
Yeah, at first I thought "that's probably because they celebrate KOF94, and now indeed all the characters from 94 are in except Rugal"... But Mature and Vice already made it so I don't know.

I wonder how Shermie (not Orochi) would work, though. She doesn't have any move that would make her efficient in this game. Does MSD support invincibility frames, in which case her spin kick could have some use?
It would probably be easier to have the NFT being in full Orochi mode, though.



For NFT :(non orochi) Chris is easy. Have his for special attack. for close for long range.
For Shermie HDSM knee attack would be great. Especially overpowered and with invincible frames. For close, her CD attack is perfect. 02 or previous one. For long range let her do her three times.





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"Re(3):KOF 20th anniversary" , posted Mon 9 Nov 20:36post reply

quote:
I wonder how Shermie (not Orochi) would work, though. She doesn't have any move that would make her efficient in this game. Does MSD support invincibility frames, in which case her spin kick could have some use?
It would probably be easier to have the NFT being in full Orochi mode, though.



Some attacks do have invincibility frames, like Leona's moon Slasher, Athena's Shining Crystal Bit, Ralf's Galactica Phantom and Kyo's Orochinagi - those are closer to autoguard invincibility as opposed to dodging-based invincibility, but it's there (and it's fun to se missiles getting punched).
Some characters like Daimon have normal moves as their attacks, so I don't think anyone's completely disqualified - they just seem to be going for characters from 94 and 98 for now.

Maybe later down the line Chizuru, Heidern and Saishyu will get to be a team, their other teammates are already in anyway...





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"Re(4):KOF 20th anniversary" , posted Mon 9 Nov 22:01post reply

quote:
Maybe later down the line Chizuru, Heidern and Saishyu will get to be a team, their other teammates are already in anyway...


True, Heidern is the real last character from 94 not in the game! He is in all the menus, so I forgot he wasn't actually playable.
Who else is missing? The 96 boss team, Rugal and Goenitz... the 97 outlaw... Kasumi... Shingo... And that's not even counting K' and the NESTS guys, or Liz and the Ash generation.

Back to the American Sports Team, the idea of Lucky sending basket balls to people's face and them exploding in gruesome Metal Slug fashion is fascinating. Does Brian land after he's doing the helicopter or does he fly and never comes back? I have hundreds of medals that are gathering dust, I'm seriously considering using them on these losers.





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"Re(5):KOF 20th anniversary" , posted Mon 9 Nov 22:23post reply

quote:

Back to the American Sports Team, the idea of Lucky sending basket balls to people's face and them exploding in gruesome Metal Slug fashion is fascinating. Does Brian land after he's doing the helicopter or does he fly and never comes back? I have hundreds of medals that are gathering dust, I'm seriously considering using them on these losers.



Brian does return from remarkably high flights.

I'd have bought him by now, but my connection got interrupted last time I tried to buy medals, now the game shuts down every time I try to access the medal shop, and today's update clearly hasn't solved that :/





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kofoguz
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"Re(5):KOF 20th anniversary" , posted Tue 10 Nov 03:01post reply

quote:
Back to the American Sports Team, the idea of Lucky sending basket balls to people's face and them exploding in gruesome Metal Slug fashion is fascinating. Does Brian land after he's doing the helicopter or does he fly and never comes back? I have hundreds of medals that are gathering dust, I'm seriously considering using them on these losers.

I already got that sexy motherboxer Heavy D. Couldn't resist him. I didnt see Lucky's basketball explosion. Is it basketball shaped? Cause I think they had a new Jack-o-lantern explosion animation for Halloween soldier so that would be great.

I wonder if they use new assets for a new MetalSlug game? Or a new Pocket Fighter type of game.





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"Re(6):KOF 20th anniversary" , posted Tue 10 Nov 04:29post reply

I wasn't even aware that this game had gotten more KOF characters besides the Ikari Warriors and Iori's team...

I don't even know how useful these characters are, but they look so cool! I don't think it was necessary to include clothing damage to King and Yuri, though. Nevertheless, hopefully the other people from the Orochi saga (Heidern, Rugal, Eiji, Kasumi, the New Faces, etc.) will eventually make it to Metal Slug Defense as well.





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"new Metal Slug game" , posted Fri 20 Nov 23:26post reply

Seems similar to Clash of Clans?
I am not a specialist so I cannot really judge.





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"Re(1):new Metal Slug game" , posted Sat 21 Nov 20:01post reply

quote:
Seems similar to Clash of Clans?
I am not a specialist so I cannot really judge.



Thanks for the heads up! My impression is that this is a continuation of Metal Slug Defense with an emphasis on PvP clan warfare rather than a Clash of Clans style game where you develop your own base. There's one screenshot that looks like a base with its isometric view and clear tiling. But I think it's actually a world map showing you the oncoming levels. But I can't read Japanese so I could be 100% wrong.

One disconcerting thing bout the game though ... in some of the screens the sprites are zoomed in at an awkward level resulting in stretched, awkward, non square pixels. Not sure why that is, because with modern ultra HD retina type screens you can scale low res sprite art up and down without this issue. I hope it's not too jarring in the final release.






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"Re(2):new Metal Slug game" , posted Mon 23 Nov 18:30post reply

quote:
Seems similar to Clash of Clans?
I am not a specialist so I cannot really judge.


Thanks for the heads up! My impression is that this is a continuation of Metal Slug Defense with an emphasis on PvP clan warfare rather than a Clash of Clans style game where you develop your own base. There's one screenshot that looks like a base with its isometric view and clear tiling. But I think it's actually a world map showing you the oncoming levels. But I can't read Japanese so I could be 100% wrong.



It seems closer to a previous mobile entry in the MS series, Metal Slug Wars, IIRC, which was all about base-building and coordinating attacks with other players of the same factions - some of the instructor illustrations from MSD actually come from that previous game, which also used isometric graphics. That didn't get released in Europe, but I guess this probably will.





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"Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Tue 24 Nov 18:51post reply

Somehow Andy managed to become trailer-ready before Terry - and I wasn't really expecting a new trailer before that PlayStation Experience event.
Also, Kyo has brown hair again.





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"Re(1):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Tue 24 Nov 20:06post reply

quote:
Somehow Andy managed to become trailer-ready before Terry - and I wasn't really expecting a new trailer before that PlayStation Experience event.
Also, Kyo has brown hair again.

He's so thin... Are they using the same body for several character and just change clothes/hairs? Him, Kyo and Iori look off in the same similar way... And Andy is the more buff of the three so it shows more.
I wonder if they took the criticism against Ralf and Clark's design in XII too far and will have them weight 50 kg in XIV.





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"Re(1):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Tue 24 Nov 21:03post reply

The first impression was very poor and I wish we saw some more footage, but I like the idea of showing improvements gradually. Hay fever Iori has to be my favorite change so far.

Though, this is a very risky way of marketing your company's most and only anticipated title outside of Metal Slug Mobile Rip-off™.





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"Re(1):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Tue 24 Nov 21:16:post reply

Andy is pretty thin so the question that comes up is whether the art direction is returning to pre-KOF12/13 graphics. I liked the newer Nona style better, it felt more like Fatal Fury/ Art of Fighting.

I also wonder if they've shortened his hair to cut back on development time on animation.





[this message was edited by Professor on Tue 24 Nov 21:19]

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"Re(1):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Tue 24 Nov 21:28post reply

quote:
Also, Kyo has brown hair again.


So while they show "improvements" for the already announced characters they throw in a generic skinny guy in a white outfit and claim him to be Andy. This is just unreal. I wonder who is in charge of marketing for this title..





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"Re(2):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Tue 24 Nov 22:00post reply

quote:
I also wonder if they've shortened his hair to cut back on development time on animation.



I wonder if it wouldn't have been simpler to give him a ponytail like in FF3, Real Bout and his player 2 model in Wild Ambition - but I'm no expert in 3D modelling and physics.





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"Re(2):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Tue 24 Nov 22:29:post reply

quote:
Somehow Andy managed to become trailer-ready before Terry - and I wasn't really expecting a new trailer before that PlayStation Experience event.
Also, Kyo has brown hair again.
He's so thin... Are they using the same body for several character and just change clothes/hairs? Him, Kyo and Iori look off in the same similar way... And Andy is the more buff of the three so it shows more.
I wonder if they took the criticism against Ralf and Clark's design in XII too far and will have them weight 50 kg in XIV.



I'm guessing they are using the same body rig for most of the male characters to save time and money. They will undoubtably do the same for all the women (I'll be surprised if they even have variations in bust size). This streamlines the creation of new costumes for DLC etc.

It's sad to see this happen, especially after KOFXII and XIII had such magnificent variety in body types. That's something that's sorely missing in most games, especially 3d games. </shameless self plug>

Of course KOF is not the only fighting game series guilty of this.

Aside from the odd monster, all the Mortal Kombat characters tend to share the same body types.

In Street Fighter V the bodies have become pretty generalized too. Charlie, Ryu/Ken, Bison, Necali, Vega all seem to have the same body.






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[this message was edited by nobinobita on Tue 24 Nov 22:50]

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"Re(3):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Wed 25 Nov 00:33post reply

This made me realize one of the many bad things about their Kyo model is that he's too thin as well. Kyo is a Japanese teenager, but he has broad shoulders at least. This Kyo is not only thin, his general build is too frail... I guess the only characters who would have this body type in regular KOF would be K' or Ash? Benimaru maybe?
If they apply the same model to the likes of Terry, Kim or Takuma (or, to raise another issue, Kensou), the result is going to be laughable.
I'm also intrigued that we haven't seen Mai yet. Are they struggling with all the things that need to be animated with her (hair, boobs, butt, cloth)?

Nobi, about the link you just posted: I thought Mature and Vice's bodies were identical. Does Vice has a slightly bigger butt, or did you just take a screenshot at different stages of the animation?





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"Re(3):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Wed 25 Nov 01:30post reply

In addition to shorter hair, Andy doesn't even seem to have loose belt extremities. And looking at elements like Iori's jacket and Leona's hair, they don't seem to be using any physics models for animation. So I guess they're hand-animating everything while simultaneously redesigning looks to remove potential difficulties? But their hand animation is kinda...

I also have to say that while I'm glad they're keeping the freakish closeups mostly out of it this time, the characters really seem to lack any expressiveness at all in the normal view.

quote:

It's sad to see this happen, especially after KOFXII and XIII had such magnificent variety in body types. That's something that's sorely missing in most games, especially 3d games. </shameless self plug>



It's funny because now they seem to be doing exactly the opposite of everything that your article was praising them for. Maybe they came across it one day and with their limited grasp of English they misinterpreted it as criticism.





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"Re(1):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Wed 25 Nov 03:12post reply

quote:
Somehow Andy managed to become trailer-ready before Terry - and I wasn't really expecting a new trailer before that PlayStation Experience event.
Also, Kyo has brown hair again.



Probably Terry new design is not ugly enough is not ready to be shown in a trailer.
I hope they will not use that old-terry of that artwork from some months ago.





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"Re(4):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Wed 25 Nov 04:21post reply

Benimaru is meant to be the lanky pretty boy, but he's absolutely ripped. Let's say that the company ignored everything made for the KOFs that weren't monstrously successful inside of China and just looked at... KOF 98. He's absolutely got a lot of musculature in that game, even in his win portrait.

On one hand KOF98 had a lot of similar torsos for the men, and even the Guilty Gear X/XX series had this one male torso that was used for at least 3 male characters (Sol, Johnny, Anji).

I agree with nobi's assessment that a cost-saving measure is probably in place here with rig reuse. It's not as though there isn't historical precedent for it (see the sprite equivalent above!), but it does lend itself to a certain blandness when a larger number of the guys in your game are waifish boys. That isn't to say that they can't have more than one rig (could you imagine Daimon using that rig? it'd be hilarious/awful, and he's an iconic KOF'98 character due to his top-tier common-ness), but I'm 100% expecting all the traditionally "skinny" characters (e.g. Beni, now Andy, Ash, K', Duo Lon, hopefully not Joe because they're overlooking KOF12-13 hahahaha T_T, etc.) to have the same build, in addition to characters newly gaining that build (e.g. Kyo, Iori). Chang certainly has his own rig, though.

One interesting thing to look at with regards to rig variation will be character height. Iori's always got this sort of hunched over stance that makes it hard to tell just how tall he is, but for other fighters that stand up straight, it should be easy to compare. Will everybody be the same height/have the same proportions regardless of their height?





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"Re(5):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Wed 25 Nov 06:03post reply

Oh come on. Honestly, I want this game to be good and I would be thrilled if all my posts about it weren't negative. But at this point the animation looks awful, I don't know if the creators know what sort of art style they want to go with and nobody knows how the game plays. Come on SNKP, give us something to work with!

quote:
I agree with nobi's assessment that a cost-saving measure is probably in place here with rig reuse. It's not as though there isn't historical precedent for it (see the sprite equivalent above!), but it does lend itself to a certain blandness when a larger number of the guys in your game are waifish boys.


Head swaps and clone characters have been with us as long as there have been fighting games so I'm certainly not going to start crying foul about it now. But in the end it's not the limited assets but how they are used that are important. In keeping with SNK, look at Shingo. His movement and voice acting make him come across as young man who makes up for his lack of experience with enthusiasm. But in his idle animation he is one beefy bastard who is obviously Kyo with a haircut. People should be idolizing Shingo, not the other way around. It all comes down to presentation. We'll see if KoF XIV can get there but it has a long road ahead of it.





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"Re(6):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Wed 25 Nov 06:18post reply

quote:

Head swaps and clone characters have been with us as long as there have been fighting games so I'm certainly not going to start crying foul about it now.



I just hope that there's enough variety in there for it to not feel TOO samey. All we have to go on is what little we've seen so far, which unfortunately doesn't inspire confidence. Of course, this might just be a tiny sample that doesn't at all represent the variety that might be in the game: we did see Chang, after all! Maybe hate is just the zeitgeist.

But really, I'd be thrilled if we could half the comedy that swapping movesets on the SF4 characters or the Tekken characters got us. Even if you don't get the delightful SF4 monstrosities where the rigs were grossly incompatible, just sticking male rigs onto female models makes results that are impressively jarring.





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"Re(6):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Wed 25 Nov 07:29post reply

quote:
Oh come on. Honestly, I want this game to be good and I would be thrilled if all my posts about it weren't negative. But at this point the animation looks awful, I don't know if the creators know what sort of art style they want to go with and nobody knows how the game plays. Come on SNKP, give us something to work with!



Yeah I'm actually feeling contempt when I look at this. Maybe even some pity. I can't just write it off as disappointment, at any rate.

If Clark or Vice are in the game I'll at least try it out, but I can't even begin to get excited here.





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"Re(7):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Wed 25 Nov 08:01:post reply

As long as Shermie skips this one, I'm fine with this thing existing. But don't you dare having the best Frenchie in videogame history appearing even as a still image in an ending sequence, SNKP.

On a more positive note: which game had the most palette swaps in the same game?
SF has 4 in general(Ryu/Ken/Gôki and Dan in Zero or Sean in 3)...
Mortal Kombat must have had 4 or 5 ninjas in the last big 2D one...
I think KOF never had more than 2, but many 2s (Clark/Ralf, Mature/Vice, plus the alternate Kyos, alternate Takumas, alternate Leonas...)
Did Garô Densetsu had any? Even Chonshu and Chonrei were nothing alike. Yet another reason MOTW was a mistake.

I'm not sure how much this applies to 3D games though.





[this message was edited by Iggy2 on Wed 25 Nov 08:03]

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"Re(8):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Wed 25 Nov 08:22post reply

Regarding headswaps, it has to be Mortal Kombat Trilogy.
There are also games like Tekken 1/2 which had the interesting approach of providing one headswap for almost every character.





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"Re(6):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Wed 25 Nov 08:49post reply

quote:
Oh come on. Honestly, I want this game to be good and I would be thrilled if all my posts about it weren't negative. But at this point the animation looks awful, I don't know if the creators know what sort of art style they want to go with and nobody knows how the game plays. Come on SNKP, give us something to work with!

I agree with nobi's assessment that a cost-saving measure is probably in place here with rig reuse. It's not as though there isn't historical precedent for it (see the sprite equivalent above!), but it does lend itself to a certain blandness when a larger number of the guys in your game are waifish boys.

Head swaps and clone characters have been with us as long as there have been fighting games so I'm certainly not going to start crying foul about it now. But in the end it's not the limited assets but how they are used that are important. In keeping with SNK, look at Shingo. His movement and voice acting make him come across as young man who makes up for his lack of experience with enthusiasm. But in his idle animation he is one beefy bastard who is obviously Kyo with a haircut. People should be idolizing Shingo, not the other way around. It all comes down to presentation. We'll see if KoF XIV can get there but it has a long road ahead of it.


Based on the first picture from this set of four, looks like "zooming in" is back from KOF 12!!!





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"Re(9):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Wed 25 Nov 09:26post reply

quote:
Regarding headswaps, it has to be Mortal Kombat Trilogy.
There are also games like Tekken 1/2 which had the interesting approach of providing one headswap for almost every character.



MK ninjas don't even get the ignoble title of headswaps because they are mostly just palette swaps. Scorpion, Reptile, Ermac, and classic Sub Zero are all palette swaps with a handful of unique animations between them. Reptile is the only one with a different idle animation from the other three!





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"Re(4):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Wed 25 Nov 19:36post reply

quote:

I'm also intrigued that we haven't seen Mai yet. Are they struggling with all the things that need to be animated with her (hair, boobs, butt, cloth)?


Mai was so central to the reactions to XII and promotion of XIII that they're probably being extra careful with her - maybe even taking into account which prevalent comments to already revealed character models apply to her.





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"Re(8):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Wed 25 Nov 19:50post reply

quote:

On a more positive note: which game had the most palette swaps in the same game?
SF has 4 in general(Ryu/Ken/Gôki and Dan in Zero or Sean in 3)...



This is sort of OT, but back when the first Zero game came out I was disappointed at how Dan was just a head swap of Ryu and Ken. Then Zero 2 came along and I didn't notice anything special. But with Zero 3 they made him even goofier and I started to dislike the character... Yet about a year ago I fired up the first Zero again and noticed that he's completely different in all Zero games. I now main him in the first one. He's much more 'serious' and closer to Ryo / Robert in his first appearance. Oh, and if it's true that Ryu and Ken were not initially in SF3, that means that they're headswaps of Sean. Gouki too.

Like chaz said about Tekken, the first two games recycled animations like crazy (and I believe the very first version of Tekken for the arcade had the 'clone' as your sub-boss; like Lee for Law etc), but I still never found it as offensive as Dural in VF or any other boss character in a 3D fighting game that had moves from every character in the game. I'm glad she got some original stuff in her repertoire eventually. Fighting a boss that felt "incomplete" as a character wasn't very exciting. The fact that she had no personality must have also contributed to that. So I'd say Dural and similar characters were the biggest offender until I saw the latest XIV trailer.

The ninjas in MK games never bothered me until the series went into 3D and they tried too hard to make them all different. In the last two games I can still recognise Sub-Zero, but the rest are nothing like they used to be. They have new personalities and they don't click with me. I skipped all the games after 4 so I don't have anything to say about those. Except that all the characters look like G.I.JOE Action Force rejects.

When it comes to pure head swaps/palette swaps I feel that World Heroes is the series that did it right. They didn't need to strain the designs to be different from each other in NGBC because there was no need for that. By WHP those two were already different characters.





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"Re(7):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Thu 26 Nov 02:44post reply

quote:
Oh come on. Honestly, I want this game to be good and I would be thrilled if all my posts about it weren't negative. But at this point the animation looks awful, I don't know if the creators know what sort of art style they want to go with and nobody knows how the game plays. Come on SNKP, give us something to work with!


Yeah I'm actually feeling contempt when I look at this. Maybe even some pity. I can't just write it off as disappointment, at any rate.

If Clark or Vice are in the game I'll at least try it out, but I can't even begin to get excited here.



SNKP Improving?. KOF XIV - 2°Trailer Vs 3°Trailer - Graphics Comparison. There is a 1st vs 2nd comparison made before. Looks like they have gone from PSone to PS2(joking). Maybe we might see PS3 look next week.





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"Re(9):Andy beats Terry for once - to XIV" , posted Thu 26 Nov 05:10post reply

quote:

This is sort of OT, but back when the first Zero game came out I was disappointed at how Dan was just a head swap of Ryu and Ken. Then Zero 2 came along and I didn't notice anything special. But with Zero 3 they made him even goofier and I started to dislike the character... Yet about a year ago I fired up the first Zero again and noticed that he's completely different in all Zero games. I now main him in the first one. He's much more 'serious' and closer to Ryo / Robert in his first appearance. Oh, and if it's true that Ryu and Ken were not initially in SF3, that means that they're headswaps of Sean. Gouki too.


It is interesting how Dan evolved. I forgot how much more "serious" he was in Zero 1. I loved that he was a hidden character that stunk on purpose and was just mysterious and offbeat. He wore a pink gi, had an undershirt, was a shoto character but... was just weird. And he stunk! Even his cheat code was odd. It involved a lot of quick button presses. I'm just being nostalgic. The scene was a lot more different back then.

I don't know how "successful" Dan's design would have been if he had remained "serious". I think the goofy, obnoxious, cry baby characterization fits a role that no other character has in the SF universe. His comedic pairing with Blanka was awesome. His recurring awkward "relationship" with Sakura is a very memorable piece of SF mythos. I also understand why folks dislike him or just pretend he doesn't exists.

The over-the-top characterization can get tiresome but I think he would be more bland if he remained "serious" like he was in Zero 1. That was a great "in-joke" introduction but that's not enough to carry a character (IMO).

Daydreaming about what Dan would or should be like in SFV, I would continue to have him be a "weak" character overall but have one abusable V-trigger ability. In the unlikelihood that he appears in SFV, he should evolve again. He went from serious to crybaby to goofball to... clumsy master with some respect? I don't know...

quote:
The ninjas in MK games never bothered me until the series went into 3D and they tried too hard to make them all different. In the last two games I can still recognise Sub-Zero, but the rest are nothing like they used to be. They have new personalities and they don't click with me. I skipped all the games after 4 so I don't have anything to say about those. Except that all the characters look like G.I.JOE Action Force rejects.


Maybe its nostalgia but I always enjoyed the ninjas more when they had identical or near identical appearances. I don't know why, but I just do. I'm not a fan of their design revamps. But that just might be my old man grumpy nostalgia talking...





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"Kula is back" , posted Sun 6 Dec 04:30post reply

Kula is in KOF XIV, but nothing can save this game if they don't change the graphics.





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"Re(1):Kula is back" , posted Sun 6 Dec 04:50post reply

quote:
Kula is in KOF XIV, but nothing can save this game if they don't change the graphics.


They had 50 characters and Angel. Does it line up with the previous list with Prisoner Chang or not?

The game didn't even manage to look OK when on a screen filmed from the other side of the room.





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"Re(2):Kula is back" , posted Sun 6 Dec 05:46post reply

If they are actually loony enough to shoot for 50 characters I'll play along for now. Is Angel going to be as mystifying to play as she has been in the past?





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"Re(2):Kula is back" , posted Sun 6 Dec 05:49post reply

quote:
They had 50 characters and Angel. Does it line up with the previous list with Prisoner Chang or not?

The game didn't even manage to look OK when on a screen filmed from the other side of the room.



No, the roster doesn't match the rumor and that rumor was supposedly disproved already (source credibility is 0%).


When SNK narrated their budget & time constraint woes for developing during XIII; I knew for sure that if there it was a XIV, it was gonna be the flugiest in the saga.... And even knowing beforehand, I was not ready.

Is the preorder bonus going to be a CRT adapter?






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"Re(3):Kula is back" , posted Sun 6 Dec 05:55post reply

quote:

Is the preorder bonus going to be a CRT adapter?



I think it will be a composite AV cable, and it will be mandatory to play.





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"Re(3):Kula is back" , posted Sun 6 Dec 07:19post reply

quote:
They had 50 characters and Angel. Does it line up with the previous list with Prisoner Chang or not?

The game didn't even manage to look OK when on a screen filmed from the other side of the room.


No, the roster doesn't match the rumor and that rumor was supposedly disproved already (source credibility is 0%).


When SNK narrated their budget & time constraint woes for developing during XIII; I knew for sure that if there it was a XIV, it was gonna be the flugiest in the saga.... And even knowing beforehand, I was not ready.

Is the preorder bonus going to be a CRT adapter?



Which preorder bonus do YOU want to see in KOF XIV?
CRT Adapter / RF Switch
Composite AV cables
FightLite Weight Loss Pills - Official Sponsors of Andy Bogard
Angel Body Pillow with functional zipper
Disc copy of KOF: Maximum Impact 2






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"Re(4):Kula is back" , posted Sun 6 Dec 13:47:post reply

I was watching the telephone stream and for a minute I thought the animation was looking better until I realized I was trying to judge animation on a 13fps video. Then I turned on some 60fps videos and yup, still looks pretty robotic. The experience makes me wonder if they really tried to copy the keyframes of animation and it's just the linear tweening that's messing it up.

The faces are looking better* (Kyo still looks ridiculous though), and when it's being played it does look quite a bit like KoF. Maybe I can finally get my hopes up a little more.

* for a PS2 game





[this message was edited by Gojira on Sun 6 Dec 13:50]

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"Re(5):Kula is back" , posted Sun 6 Dec 14:58:post reply

quote:
I was watching the telephone stream and for a minute I thought the animation was looking better until I realized I was trying to judge animation on a 13fps video. Then I turned on some 60fps videos and yup, still looks pretty robotic. The experience makes me wonder if they really tried to copy the keyframes of animation and it's just the linear tweening that's messing it up.

The faces are looking better* (Kyo still looks ridiculous though), and when it's being played it does look quite a bit like KoF. Maybe I can finally get my hopes up a little more.

* for a PS2 game


I think it would only make sense that the gameplay is intact, good netcode with great online play, and a dream match will make this game successful. Graphics, story, and new saga should be the least of their concern. However, has it been confirmed that this is a new saga? I have seen people say this is a new saga. With 50 characters, that would only backfire for failure! I think the reason for the PS4 exclusive is for SNK to get extra cash from SONY to help them make this game.





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[this message was edited by neo0r0chiaku on Sun 6 Dec 15:00]

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"Re(6):Kula is back" , posted Sun 6 Dec 16:07post reply

quote:
I was watching the telephone stream and for a minute I thought the animation was looking better until I realized I was trying to judge animation on a 13fps video. Then I turned on some 60fps videos and yup, still looks pretty robotic. The experience makes me wonder if they really tried to copy the keyframes of animation and it's just the linear tweening that's messing it up.

The faces are looking better* (Kyo still looks ridiculous though), and when it's being played it does look quite a bit like KoF. Maybe I can finally get my hopes up a little more.

* for a PS2 game

I think it would only make sense that the gameplay is intact, good netcode with great online play, and a dream match will make this game successful. Graphics, story, and new saga should be the least of their concern. However, has it been confirmed that this is a new saga? I have seen people say this is a new saga. With 50 characters, that would only backfire for failure! I think the reason for the PS4 exclusive is for SNK to get extra cash from SONY to help them make this game.



50 characters is a pretty sad Dream Match for KOF. That's quite a number of characters missing even from that.





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"First reports on New CRT game (aka kof14)" , posted Sun 6 Dec 17:17:post reply

KOF14, Retro now.

The trailer is an odd mix of fair and bad renderings!
So the PlayStation Experience event is happening in California right now, and a demo featuring all the characters up to trailer 3 + Kula are playable.

- KOF14 will have a mashable easy-combo system. Like Persona 4 or Undernight InBirth, the game lets you do a combo by just mashing one button (the weak punch button). Apparently there's some attacks that are exclusive to this system, and likewise to Persona and undernight, it'll even do a super at the end if you have enough meter.
- Jumps in general are slower, which is probably good for new players but will certainly get complaints from old schoolers.
- The combo-heavy HD system from KOF13 has been replaced with "Max Mode" from the past series.
- Basically when you have 1 bar of meter, you can go into Max mode with two button presses, and you can do infinite EX specials for a limited time. (EX specials are more powerful versions of special attacks, fireballs, uppercuts and whatnot)
- You can only do EX specials during Max mode, which is a pretty big difference from KOF13 or even SF4/5.
- There's the "Just defense" system from Garou:Mark of the Wolves where you get some advantage compared to blocking normally, which you can do by blocking at the same time when an attack is coming your way.
- There's guard cancel evasion/rolling but there may not be guard cancel CD/thrust. This could be the reason why Just defense is in the game. (Personally I'd much rather prefer the contemporary guard cancel thrust since it can be used for offense as well as defence.)

... The Neogeo versions of Last Blade 2 and KOF2000 are coming to PS4 as well, which is kind of an odd decision.

Btw, here's a list of photos and videos which I've compiled with a Japanese site.

Videos:
Shakycam stream archive from venue https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ej0Zdjk_Im0
Top players Xiaohai and Dakou gameplay https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZATQmeDg88
SF4 player Nemo's gameplay https://twitter.com/KingsofCO/status/673281587325198336
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0KHYG85ENI
https://twitter.com/KingsofCO/status/673268030822998017
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlAuSdXu5fQ
https://twitter.com/KingsofCO/status/673302186164555776
https://twitter.com/KingsofCO/status/673353216529068032
New Trailer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VmS63iQqdr4
New Trailer (w/o login) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQMYnI5rPhM


Screenshots:
Collection of screenshots
https://www.facebook.com/TeamChaosL.A/photos_stream
character select screens
http://www.eventhubs.com/imagegallery/2015/dec/05/king-fighters-14-character-select-other-menus/1/
http://www.eventhubs.com/imagegallery/2015/dec/05/king-fighters-14-character-select-other-menus/4/
http://www.eventhubs.com/imagegallery/2015/dec/05/king-fighters-14-character-select-other-menus/6/
http://www.eventhubs.com/imagegallery/2015/dec/05/king-fighters-14-character-select-other-menus/7/
https://twitter.com/skullokei/status/673320533371453440
https://twitter.com/skullokei/status/673288040857530368
https://twitter.com/skullokei/status/673366343320657920
Stage select, victory screen, etc
http://www.eventhubs.com/imagegallery/2015/dec/05/king-fighters-14-character-select-other-menus/2/
http://www.eventhubs.com/imagegallery/2015/dec/05/king-fighters-14-character-select-other-menus/3/
http://www.eventhubs.com/imagegallery/2015/dec/05/king-fighters-14-character-select-other-menus/5/
Misc stuff
https://twitter.com/tonpy_/status/673286867215773696
https://twitter.com/tonpy_/status/673285590264102913
https://twitter.com/tonpy_/status/673285093352275968

Gameplay instructions
https://twitter.com/skullokei/status/673322361349791744
https://twitter.com/KingsofCO/status/673254498245042176

Producer was at event.
https://twitter.com/1itzentl/status/673232913652039680/



quote:
No, the roster doesn't match the rumor and that rumor was supposedly disproved already (source credibility is 0%).

The rumored list sleeps deep within the BBS threads!
http://www.mmcafe.com/cgi-bin/forums/bbs/messages/13494.shtml#69318

Team 01 : China Team (?? / Tung Fu Rue / ?? ) ~ Possible Characters ~ ( Jin Chonshu / Jin Chonrei )
Team 02 : Japan Team ( Kyo Kusanagi / Benimaru Nikaido / Goro Daimon )
Team 03 : Fatal Fury Team ( Terry Bogard / Andy Bogard / Joe Higashi )
Team 04 : Art of Fighting Team ( Ryo Sakazaki / Robert Garcia / Yuri Sakazaki )
Team 05 : K' Team ( K' / Maxima / Kula Diamond )
Team 06 : Kim Team ( Kim Kaphwan / Kim's Master / Myeng Swuk )
Team 07 : Criminal Team ( Chang Koehan / Choi Bounge / Newcomer Prisoner )
Team 08 : Women Fighters Team ( Mai Shiranui / King / Alice )
Team 09 : Ikari Team ( Ralf Jones / Clark Still / Leona Heidern )
Team 10 : Psycho Soldier team ( Athena Asamiya / Sie Kensou) / Chin Gentsai )
Team 11 : Yagami Team ( Iori Yagami / Mature / Vice )
Team 12 : Mexico Team ( Ramon / Angel / Tizoc )
Team 13 : Palace Wan Team ( Acting Mask Girl / Teenage Girl Singer with Electric Element / Mysterious Hooded Man )
Team 14 : South Town Team ( Geese Howard / Billy Kane / ?? )
Team 15 : South America Team ( Brazilian Ninja / Handicap Boxer / Pretty Latin Girl )
Team 16 : Alternate World Team ( Nakoruru / Love Heart / Mui Mui )
Mid-Boss : ( Russian Billionaire )
Final-Boss : ( Non-Human Species )

The list is supposedly fake, but little by little it's starting to look legit. Coincedence or smoke of truth?
- Prisoner Chang
- Angel is in the game
- Total 50 characters (48 + 2 bosses)


Regardless of the rumor, I can't imagine 50 characters playable at launch. I'm naturally assuming they'll come gradually.





[this message was edited by Professor on Sun 6 Dec 20:11]

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"KOF14 is 70% complete, says producer" , posted Sun 6 Dec 21:43:post reply

Producer Oda gets interviewed by Famitsu.
http://www.famitsu.com/news/201512/06094695.html

Rough synopsis:

- The Game's development is about 70% complete.
- Aside from supers, there's also MAX supers and Climax supers. Supers will turn into MAX supers when you're in MAX mode.
- Producer Oda: "Climax supers are the biggest moves in the game and they take 3 bars. They're like the NeoMax supers from KOF13 but since not all the characters had it in the game, we'd decided to add it to everyone for KOF14" (Note: Everyone actually had it in KOF13. The producer probably didn't play the game that much)
- There's no Drive meter this time around, only a power meter. The devs decided to simplify things. EX specials can only be done during MAX mode which takes a bar of meter to activate.
- Producer Oda: KOF13 was a so-called combo game because of the drive cancel and EX special systems. There were people that liked it, but also those who didn't. This time, we decided to take a step somewhere inbetween those two kinds of players.
- Because a lot of people play at home on console nowadays and there's a wide range of players, the devs want to keep the controls simple but the game to have depth so you can keep playing and make new discoveries.
- The CD attack/thrust system now makes the opponent hit the wall and crumple for followup attacks.
- The devs don't want to add in too many new systems because KOF has enough as it is. They want to keep tuning/tweaking stuff though.





[this message was edited by Professor on Tue 8 Dec 12:38]

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"Re(1):KOF14 is 70% complete, says producer" , posted Mon 7 Dec 00:08post reply

The graphics still look lackluster, but in terms of animation it seems similar to the past KOF games. And it's nice that Angel is returning.

Maybe KOF XIV will be a fun game, after all.





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"Re(2):KOF14 is 70% complete, says producer" , posted Mon 7 Dec 02:33post reply

Thanks for all the information Professor! Some of the news, such as removal of the drive meter, makes me happy. Other news, such as the MI style mash combos, worry me. Still, at least we now know what sort of game they are trying to make.

quote:
Maybe KOF XIV will be a fun game, after all.


We shall see. It helped to actually see the game in motion as opposed to the trailers where it was the same animation every time just with more textures slathered on.

This picture of Chang haunts me.





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"Re(3):KOF14 is 70% complete, says producer" , posted Mon 7 Dec 04:13post reply

quote:

This picture of Chang haunts me.



That's a fake beard, right?





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"Re(4):KOF14 is 70% a PS1 CGI, says producer" , posted Mon 7 Dec 12:55:post reply

THE格闘ゲー

I have to say the 48+2 Bosses count of the Chinese "Russian Billionaire" rumored roster was at the minimum eerily accurate. And while the game looks like a cheap knockoff from Culture Brain or Tamiya, I do think the changes in game mechanics and rules are going in the right direction, conceptually. That being said, there is still plenty of time for the developers to cave in to the complaints and demands of hardcore fans, the same way KOF12 gave up any ambition to attract a wider audience when the pitchforks were brought at the first loketest.

[edit] The joke is still funny whichever way you phrase it. It might get tiring by the time KOF15 comes out.





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[this message was edited by chazumaru on Mon 7 Dec 20:12]

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"Re(5):KOF14 is 70% a PS1 CGI, says producer" , posted Mon 7 Dec 22:34post reply

quote:
THE格闘ゲー

I have to say the 48+2 Bosses count of the Chinese "Russian Billionaire" rumored roster was at the minimum eerily accurate. And while the game looks like a cheap knockoff from Culture Brain or Tamiya, I do think the changes in game mechanics and rules are going in the right direction, conceptually. That being said, there is still plenty of time for the developers to cave in to the complaints and demands of hardcore fans, the same way KOF12 gave up any ambition to attract a wider audience when the pitchforks were brought at the first loketest.

[edit] The joke is still funny whichever way you phrase it. It might get tiring by the time KOF15 comes out.


I still find this hard to believe that this would be a new arc. Especially based on the so called roster that has been floating around. It’s a confusion selection of characters for it to be a new arc or even a prequel arc to the Orochi saga. Prisoner Chang is an example. That happened before the Orochi saga. Unless, he went on a violent rampage and Kim was not able to contain him. I hope that this roster is somewhat fake and the rest of the characters waiting to be released are heavily new(hoping for more Garou characters). Because Iori, Kyo, Terry, and co. are getting a bit old and should be old in age for that matter in the KOF universe(like Terry in Garou). Shingo should be running this now! lol Maybe he will finally get his flames!





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"Re(5):KOF14 is 70% a PS1 CGI, says producer" , posted Tue 8 Dec 05:16:post reply

quote:
And while the game looks like a cheap knockoff from Culture Brain or Tamiya, I do think the changes in game mechanics and rules are going in the right direction, conceptually.



I feel exactly the opposite. Due to the game's flow; just defense murdered the offense of 90% of the cast in neowave since it created too many windows to combo or input special moves on the attacking side; let alone that the defending character couldn't be guard crushed when using it (basically, it turned what was an offensive game into Justice Gauken); I'm guessing easily 40%~ of the problems it brough in NW are gonna be inherited by XIV, SNK has a long history of not testing too deeply the possibility of their game systems which allow some pretty sazzy things in the end product.

Also, drive cancel really did gave the chance "do something" to characters that couldn't use the MAX mode in the previous games (like many of the grapplers), and that's like, gone now.

edit

quote:

- Producer Oda: "Climax supers are the biggest moves in the game and they take 3 bars. They're like the NeoMax supers from KOF13 but since not all the characters had it in the game, we'd decided to add it to everyone for KOF14" (Note: Everyone actually had it in KOF13. The producer probably didn't play the game that much)



Actually, the bosses didn't have NeoMaxes, but I'd rather put my vote in that "he didn't knew the game that much" rather than "he knew the game up to that point".






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[this message was edited by Toxico on Tue 8 Dec 05:22]

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"Re(6):KOF14 is 70% a PS1 CGI, says producer" , posted Tue 8 Dec 05:50:post reply

quote:
I feel exactly the opposite. Due to the game's flow; just defense murdered the offense of 90% of the cast in neowave since it created too many windows to combo or input special moves on the attacking side; let alone that the defending character couldn't be guard crushed when using it (basically, it turned what was an offensive game into Justice Gauken); I'm guessing easily 40%~ of the problems it brough in NW are gonna be inherited by XIV, SNK has a long history of not testing too deeply the possibility of their game systems which allow some pretty sazzy things in the end product.



Actually, that is not how Just Defending works in KOFXIV. People who played the game and spoke to SNK staff at PSX said that the mechanic as it is implemented in the current build of the game has only two functions. It reduces (not nullifies) the amount of guard gauge damage and it builds a little extra power meter than a regular block. That's it, you cannot guard cancel the JD into a special move and there is no frame advantage or anything of the sort after a JD. You cannot and will not be able to air JD.

As for the neomax comment, that might be a mistranslation. In a full translation of the interview, this is what he said of the neomaxes:

quote:
Famitsu: What are Climax DM's?

Oda: These are DM's that use up 3 stocks of the power gauge, and are the most powerful moves in the game. In XIII there were NEOMAX supers, but they didn't always suit the character. This time, we've made each Climax DM more appropriate for every single character.


Detailed impressions from an old school KOF player who played the game at PSX can be found here:

http://forums.shoryuken.com/discussion/comment/10496706/#Comment_10496706

Seems most that have tried XIV and seen it in person feel very positive about the game.





[this message was edited by izek on Tue 8 Dec 05:52]

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"Re(6):KOF14 is 70% a PS1 CGI, says producer" , posted Tue 8 Dec 05:58post reply

quote:

I feel exactly the opposite. Due to the game's flow; just defense murdered the offense of 90% of the cast in neowave since it created too many windows to combo or input special moves on the attacking side; let alone that the defending character couldn't be guard crushed when using it (basically, it turned what was an offensive game into Justice Gauken)


On the plus side, I've heard that JD in this game will not affect frame advantage/timing in any way.

Not sure to what extent if affects guard crush, though.

Also, props to this board for correctly (well, afaik) pointing out the linear tweening problem. It's something I see people really struggle to articulate elsewhere. MMCafe is truly a font of knowledge.





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"Re(7):KOF14 is 70% a PS1 CGI, says producer" , posted Tue 8 Dec 08:45post reply

After looking at some of the videos Prof posted, I wonder if they could reproduce that effect in the game: the way some 2D ports add scanlines and such, they could add a screen inside the screen to give the impression you're looking from far away and not on the correct angle. It almost looks OK from that distance!

If the previous list ends up being true or mostly true even though it's been debunked, I'm starting to wonder whether the developers stumbled upon it at the beginning of production and thought "well, that's a good roster, let's do that". The list is around 6 months old, I think? I wonder whether the game has been in production for much longer.





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"Re(6):KOF14 is 70% a PS1 CGI, says producer" , posted Tue 8 Dec 19:46post reply

quote:
I still find this hard to believe that this would be a new arc. Especially based on the so called roster that has been floating around. It’s a confusion selection of characters for it to be a new arc or even a prequel arc to the Orochi saga. Prisoner Chang is an example. That happened before the Orochi saga. Unless, he went on a violent rampage and Kim was not able to contain him. I hope that this roster is somewhat fake and the rest of the characters waiting to be released are heavily new(hoping for more Garou characters). Because Iori, Kyo, Terry, and co. are getting a bit old and should be old in age for that matter in the



Well, the previous game did end up with the timeline getting messed with - a character got retconned, a couple of them got their powers back, according to Heidern everybody was forgetting its events anyway, so some other things changing like Kim not getting his hands on Chang and Choi, Angel never getting involved with NESTS and focusing on hanging out with other luchadores because K9999 never existed and space-time itself getting so messed up that Nakoruru and the other pachinko girls appearing doesn't seem that far-fetched a possibility (especially considering the XIII stage cameos).

It's just really weird that if the leaked list is true that Duo Lon in particular is excluded, considering the whole handing plot with the Hizoku - but at least Kensou is still in, and there's a China team with Tung in it, so maybe that story will still get some indirect development.





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"Re(7):KOF14 is 70% a PS1 CGI, says producer" , posted Tue 8 Dec 22:36post reply

Slowly but gradually KOF XIV seems to be getting better and better. On the mechanics end, KOFXIV seems to be one that should satisfy KOF players who were disillusioned with XIII's combo heavy system and those who liked XIII's style. KOFXIV is also willing to rethink mechanics that don't have much of a purpose or use other than "It's KOF so it has to be there". Things like Standing CD attacks leading to wallbounce. For most of the cast in most of the KOF series, Standing CDs were never very useful. They were slow to use as pokes or anti-airs. They also cause knockdown so you can't usually combo after them (unless you get a counterhit). In fact, KOF 2003 relinquished standing CDs and re-purposed their animation for the much more versatile Tag-attack. Of course jump CDs are something else entirely as they are much more useful to the average character. Even jump CDs that don't have that good of speed or range or hitbox can still be useful because they result in a massive blockstun that is instrumental to offensive play in KOF. Standing CDs are a feature that were mostly always kept because A: they were always there before and B: They sort of come as a package with jump CDs since it would be weird for a game to have a jump version of a normal attack but not like a standing version of them. But in XIV they pose a much clearer risk-reward scheme. Use a risky slow attack & you'll be rewarded with corner carry and possibly a combo.

But as mentioned in the thread, it's a shame all of this has to come at the price of very shoddy amateurish visuals, especially coming after XIII's beautiful sprites. I've come to terms with XIV but we would be lying to ourselves if we don't recognize that we lost something with KOF XIV, we lost SNK's pedigree as a premier 2D arthouse in the industry.

And to be honest, I don't blame them really. I don't think anyone wants another KOFXII, which was so obviously crippled mechanically because of the insurmountable amount of resources needed to create the sprites needed for a competent and complete Fighting game with a huge roster in "HD" . And in a sense, even XIII felt very compromised, with most characters having missing far/close normals, or missing specials that were half-replaced by other ones (like Clark's Frankensteiner being replaced by his autoguard SAB, which to be honest is twice as cool anyway), or character's like Vice, who's missing moveset were so detrimental to her ability as a grappler that SNK basically gave her an exploit with EX Sleeves as a megabuff. Or the fact that in the nearly 10 years since KOF XI, the last KOF that used Neo Geo-era sprites, SNK only managed to create a single original playable character with Saiki, who is pretty much an Ash headswap.

I'm still conflicted about it. But I'm much more hopeful now. And whether XIV looks great or looks bad, or plays great or sucks, we will still have the older games. And honestly, I think XIII made so much of an impact that I have a feeling people will still play it for many years after. It definitely has that "beautiful looking and yet so execution-demanding" type of pedigree that 3rd Strike has nowadays, and that's not bad at all.





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"Re(8):KOF14 is 70% a PS1 CGI, says producer" , posted Tue 8 Dec 23:04post reply

quote:
KOFXIV is also willing to rethink mechanics that don't have much of a purpose or use other than "It's KOF so it has to be there". Things like Standing CD attacks leading to wallbounce. For most of the cast in most of the KOF series, Standing CDs were never very useful. They were slow to use as pokes or anti-airs. They also cause knockdown so you can't usually combo after them (unless you get a counterhit). In fact, KOF 2003 relinquished standing CDs and re-purposed their animation for the much more versatile Tag-attack. Of course jump CDs are something else entirely as they are much more useful to the average character. Even jump CDs that don't have that good of speed or range or hitbox can still be useful because they result in a massive blockstun that is instrumental to offensive play in KOF. Standing CDs are a feature that were mostly always kept because A: they were always there before and B: They sort of come as a package with jump CDs since it would be weird for a game to have a jump version of a normal attack but not like a standing version of them. But in XIV they pose a much clearer risk-reward scheme. Use a risky slow attack & you'll be rewarded with corner carry and possibly a combo.



Actually, in KoF94 there were standing CDs but no air version - those were introduced in 95.
The CD attacks in 94 were a carryover from the attacks from FF2/Special that would knock an opponent into a different plane - much like all systems in 94 were adapted from something from FF and AoF (crouch walking stayed an FF-character-only thing though), which over time turned into something more natively KoF-ish, like the dodges which were meant to replicate FF's voluntary place switching, but were to static without a 2nd place, became the more dynamic rolls.





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"Re(9):KOF14 is 70% a PS1 CGI, says producer" , posted Wed 9 Dec 03:45post reply

quote:

Actually, in KoF94 there were standing CDs but no air version - those were introduced in 95.
The CD attacks in 94 were a carryover from the attacks from FF2/Special that would knock an opponent into a different plane - much like all systems in 94 were adapted from something from FF and AoF (crouch walking stayed an FF-character-only thing though), which over time turned into something more natively KoF-ish, like the dodges which were meant to replicate FF's voluntary place switching, but were to static without a 2nd place, became the more dynamic rolls
Ah interesting. I guess they were there before the jump versions. But I suppose as you said, early KOF was just a mishmash of AOF and FF systems to go along with the mishmash of characters. It was only with 96 that the series found its footing and reestablished itself as its own series, with its own system, coupled with the new sprites which reimagined a lot of AOF & FF characters (and gave them new unique moves, like Ryo gaining his new stance & losing his projectile for the short range Koohken he has now)





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"Re(9):KOF14 is 70% a PS1 CGI, says producer" , posted Wed 9 Dec 03:55post reply

quote:

Actually, in KoF94 there were standing CDs but no air version - those were introduced in 95.


Actually, this is wrong. 94 has air CDs, that have different hit effect and block stun than regular heavy attacks, but they all have the same animation has an air D. Heck, I think I remember it even has crouching CDs with that same features, not sure if I remember that one right.


And yes, as people said taking out air CDs does take out a lot of the groove, since since most of the chars have pretty a unique range with them that they don't have with the other attacks (like Ralf, Clark, Maxima and 80% of the cast). Having an air attack that knocks down has also other benefits, like; you don't need to jump fireballs on frame 1 of their animation to punish them (which was annoying as hell in some kofs).






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"Re(10):KOF14 is 70% a PS1 CGI, says producer" , posted Wed 9 Dec 04:55:post reply

quote:

And yes, as people said taking out air CDs does take out a lot of the groove, since since most of the chars have pretty a unique range with them that they don't have with the other attacks (like Ralf, Clark, Maxima and 80% of the cast). Having an air attack that knocks down has also other benefits, like; you don't need to jump fireballs on frame 1 of their animation to punish them (which was annoying as hell in some kofs).



My recollection of watching the "good players" was that KOF 98's Chris was a jump CD that also happened to have a character attached to it.

Also, Humble Bundle with a Neo-Geo deal! Because you REALLY WANT that Art of Fighting 2 soundtrack!






[this message was edited by Spoon on Wed 9 Dec 05:00]

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"Re(2):Re(10):KOF14 is 70% a PS1 CGI, says pro" , posted Wed 9 Dec 05:07post reply

quote:

My recollection of watching the "good players" was that KOF 98's Chris was a jump CD that also happened to have a character attached to it.



Don't judge normals according to old games, the amount of stupidity there is falcepalm worthy (like Goro whose kicks are better than the taekwon do characters; or Vice a "grappler" whose normals beat the sh!t out of karatekas or martial artist in usablity. I could add 8.000 lines to this, but I better stop here).
To be honest, I was surprised how a bunch of the stuff got fixed on XIII (I was surprised that Billy's crouching C could no longer be called "AT Field"); most normals have easy to achieve dead angles for skilled people (I loved this). That's also why I liked EX moves, that meant that "regular" special moves didn't had all of the groove like before (like fireballs that hit hard, break a lot of guard, recover fast, travel fastly and are hard to jump and have annoying voice acting guaranteed to be heard 80 times per round or command throws that were nicknamed "black hole" since they ate 95% of the normals at the game at any range).

If you think about it, tiers in XIII there mostly because of their mobility & conversion ability (dash, jump being too stupidly good) rather than obscene normals (well, Kim is sort of an exception)






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