SFV part 4: A Street Reborn? - http://www.mmcafe.com/ Forums


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Maou
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"SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Thu 31 Mar 14:56:post reply

"I don’t care what the critics say, violence is a beauuuuuutiful thing!"

Now that SFV has some actual content and working lobbies, time for a new thread! If you want to post your Fighter ID, I’ll update here. I’ll host MMCAFE LAGFEST whenever online...you can, too! Add Cafe members to your favorite player list, set slots to private, and then invite whoever's online. If there’s a password it's "4649" until non-numeric passwords are possible, at which point it will immediately be changed to "penguins." The takahes and I will meet you at the New Zealand waterfall, and only at the New Zealand waterfall. GO FOR BROKE!

MMCAFE LAGFEST


MMCafe ID - SFV Fighter ID
Gekiganger V - gekijmo
Gojira - Gojira
Iggy - Iggywata
Ishmael - Ishmael26b
Karasu - MrKarasu
KTallguy - KTallguy
Maou - zonepharaoh
Micky Kusanagi - MickyKusanagi
Mosquiton - ChaosFrame
Red Falcon - Rugalbgood
Spoon - ????? (unlockable like Gouki in SSFIIX)
Tai-Pan - Kusanagi82
Zepy - zepysf


USEFUL THINGS

1. Official site

2. Official blog

3. Loona’s free consultancy on lessons learned from FFXIV re-launch. HEY CAPCOM READ THIS YOU FOOLS

4. “Bring back Q for season two!”

5. “Mr. Vega goes to work”/SFV true opening movie

6. Previous Threads
SFV thread 3
SFV thread 2
SFV thread 1





人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は...

[this message was edited by Maou on Thu 12 May 17:57]

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Spoon
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"Re(1):SFV part 4: A Street Named Desire" , posted Fri 1 Apr 05:07post reply

How is MMCAFE LAGFEST going to be scheduled?

We've got probably full coverage of the major time zones of the world across mmcafe, so I doubt that any one time is going to work for anybody.





Maou
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"Re(2):SFV part 4: A Street Named Desire" , posted Fri 1 Apr 09:47post reply

quote:
How is MMCAFE LAGFEST going to be scheduled?

We've got probably full coverage of the major time zones of the world across mmcafe, so I doubt that any one time is going to work for anybody.

Oh yes, MMCAFE LAGFEST is something any and everyone can run! My current plan involves setting up a room whenever I'm online, with 8 private slots and inviting all the MMCafe members I've added to my CFN list who are online (displaying as "Training" as opposed to "Menu"). But of course, anyone who wants to use the MMCafe clock above to coordinate a specific mass meeting time should!





人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は...

Mosquiton
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"Re(3):SFV part 4: A Street Named Desire" , posted Fri 1 Apr 10:35post reply

My Fighter ID is ChaosFrame.





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Professor
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"Re(4):SFV part 4: A Street Named Desire" , posted Fri 1 Apr 11:19post reply

For sessions I think the best time may be around 9-12pm JST on a weekend which is about 1-4PM in Europe and 7-10AM in New York. However on this timeline the West coast in the US goes out of luck (5-7am).

Another idea is around 7-10AM JST which is midnight-3am Europe, 3pm-6pm west coast USA, 6-9pm east coast USA.





Maou
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"Re(5):SFV part 4: A Street Named Desire" , posted Fri 1 Apr 14:07:post reply

quote:
For sessions I think the best time may be around 9-12pm JST on a weekend which is about 1-4PM in Europe and 7-10AM in New York. However on this timeline the West coast in the US goes out of luck (5-7am).

Another idea is around 7-10AM JST which is midnight-3am Europe, 3pm-6pm west coast USA, 6-9pm east coast USA.

Good call on the best time slots, Prof! I'll likely be online even on weekdays in the former option, too.

In other news, I guess it's neat that ugly Alex is free for now and I mean-spiritedly love it even more that crazed Alex fans will eventually be fined if they want to keep playing him, but what I really love is that I now have cute policewoman Chun-Li and not-dumb-SFIII-spikey-hair Ryu for free. They match nicely with no-pants Cammy, who was worth the price.

More baffling: still no ability to chose between character themes and stage themes when playing online random matches? Hmm. I hope it's stage songs that play in our lounge, though I suppose I would just have New Zealand waterfall playing on loop on another speaker even if it wasn't.





人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は...

[this message was edited by Maou on Fri 1 Apr 14:17]

Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(6):SFV part 4: A Street Named Desire" , posted Mon 4 Apr 01:39post reply

In the event I create a MMC Lagfest lounge, how should I set rounds, time and victory? My opinion is leaving all default -3, 99, first to 1-, but I'm open to suggestions in case. As for the other options, I'll enable character select whenever I personally set the lounge, because it's supposed to be fun -servers and lag permitting LOL- and I don't wanna restrict fellow players' choice to their main. I'll always set our beloved password. I saved all the listed users in Maou's post as favorites in the game, feel free to do the same with me if you like ^^

As for Alex, if he wasn't unlocked on March 30, I'd have thought it was an April's Fools xD After messing around with him a bit in training mode I can say I find him as fun as I remember him from SFIII.

I'd like to take a topic back from the previous thread: Tai-Pan, did you beat Ryu's 10th trial in the end? I couldn't find a way out for the life of me, but finding help on Youtube was piece of cake. You must walk a step forward before the b+HK axe kick. Also, I think I spent an hour on Karin's 6th trial...having to add a "down" input before pressing K for the last Seppo is something I would have never thought of on my own in all honesty.





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Spoon
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"Re(7):SFV part 4: A Suplex Named Desire" , posted Mon 4 Apr 07:45:post reply

General observation:

Character's head's angle themselves so that they "look" at each other in the face. This sometimes has funny consequences, like Alex looking like he's bobbing his head to music if he gets right up next to an idle Ken and walks forward. It's really funny.

Guard-crushing/breaking moves like Ryu's charged fireballs in V-Trigger and Alex's charged clothesline put the opponent in a state where damage taken starting from guard broken state is severely state. This is a legitimately good idea! They can tune guard breaking moves in a way that makes them more reliable, but by toning down the damage you get from them lets them not be totally unbalanced with their newfound reliability. This idea gets a thumbs up from me.

Some Alex observations:

Alex's standing LP and MP animations have been swapped. This makes him more resemble Ryu's current animation set with standing LP and MP. In any case, this elbow now hits more people when they crouch, including Chun. Alex whiffing stupid things against crouching Chun in 3S really sucked. On that same note, his jumping MP and LP animations are kind of switched as well: his jumping MP is definitely like his old jumping LP animation, while his jumping LP retains that horizontal chop nature but is a more horizontal and different animation from before.

Canceling from his standing LP seems unusually hard. I can't do it with any consistency with a PS3 TE stick.

His flying cross-chop is a lot more useful now, having better on-hit properties that allow you to combo out of it.

His forward+MP chop which used to be a poke/anti-air is now an overhead, while his standing HP is now a cancellable move that isn't an overhead. Standing HP becoming cancelling meant that something had to give.

EX Flash Elbow is TERRIBLE on block. According to an online listing, it's -10F (!!!) on block. In 3S, this move wasn't advantageous on block, but it was generally very safe on block due to both its pushback and it being like -6F. In SFV, it doesn't seem to push him as far back, and so is quite punishable.

Jumping LK is his cross-up. The good thing about this is that he has a go-to move for cross-ups.

His jumping MK has had its animation modified in a way that makes it way less cool. The pose it ends with is still like the old 3S one, but how he gets there has changed significantly. In 3S, he swings his leg in a circular arc in front of him. In SFV, he thrusts his leg out straight. The thrust kick makes it seem more like R.Mika's jumping MK, and while I can totally see it seeming like a more efficient motion, it doesn't have the unusual grace of the 3S one.
3S reference
SFV reference

His throw whiff animation! ARGH!
I can understand it having a motion which more resembles the other characters (reaching out with one arm and getting nothing) so that it's easier for a new player to immediately understand, but in 3S Alex and Hugo had really uniquely different regular throw whiff animations that were really interesting. Hugo looks at his hands and sees that they're empty. Alex JUST TWITCHES HIS FOREAMS/HANDS. This is hella cool for all kinds of different reasons: it's like he doesn't fully commit his body into the throw whiff the way others do, the little twitch sometimes almost seems like a fake, the subtler motion makes it harder for opponents to punish (they have less to go on to realize it was a whiff), and is a tiny thing that just makes him seem like a more dangerous and more capable grappler. It was a really subtle animation for what ought to be a failure state that winds up making him seem more cool. That is incredibly brilliant! For contrast, in 3S Chun puts her whole body into the whiff leading with her arm, and her face is full of surprise at the whiff. Urien and Yun/Yang use both arms, and Yun and Yang almost tip over at the failure. Elena just spins on the spot and isn't even surprised at the miss, it's just another motion in her dance. Alex's old whiff animation made him seem more dangerous. I will miss that animation.

The close MK knee is now gone. There's nothing to replace it. I'm sad, but functionally the improvements to standing MP (links to other things on hit, hits crouchers reliably, cancellable, etc.) would've left it in a spot where it's purpose wouldn't be well-defined.

HP Flash Chop no longer puts foes in a back-turned state with enormous hit stun. So no more stuff like HP chop -> combo. The backturned suplex is now chained from it as the only thing you get from it. This makes the use of HP chop a little more straight forward and make it not detract from the heavy counter hits of the game, especially given that counter-hits were how the move landed in general in 3S.

MP+MK V-Skill is straight up stolen from Tekken and it's great. Throwing people doesn't consume the power-up, which makes throws even more viable since people are scared of being hit. Counter hits having big hit-stun bonuses and allowing combo paths that you don't normally get from a regular hit makes the immediate results of this power-up easily understood and appreciated and more threatening in ways more interesting than just "next hit does 20% more damage". I really like this change, both from how it leverages existing game system and how it fits with the character's gameplan.

His stomp is significantly less safe on block, which is probably for the best. However, it's also slower on startup! The move generally more awkward to use than before, and it made me think, "oh, I guess they want me to punish fireballs with headbutt"... except headbutt is EVEN SLOWER THAN THE NEW STOMP! Good gracious! For reference, the fastest of the new stomp/headbutt is LK stomp, which is 27F startup. 3S Stungun Headbutt is 24F startup, and the slowest of his old stomps was 26F startup, with the fastest of his old stomps being 23F startup. New headbutt is as fast as 30F (EX) and as slow as 44F (HP). 44F is REALLY SLOW.

Cancelling neutral normals into either of his d,u charge moves seems hard to do. I'm not sure why.





[this message was edited by Spoon on Mon 4 Apr 07:46]

Tai-Pan
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"Re(7):SFV part 4: A Street Named Desire" , posted Tue 5 Apr 00:47post reply

quote:

As for Alex, if he wasn't unlocked on March 30, I'd have thought it was an April's Fools xD After messing around with him a bit in training mode I can say I find him as fun as I remember him from SFIII.

I'd like to take a topic back from the previous thread: Tai-Pan, did you beat Ryu's 10th trial in the end? I couldn't find a way out for the life of me, but finding help on Youtube was piece of cake. You must walk a step forward before the b+HK axe kick. Also, I think I spent an hour on Karin's 6th trial...having to add a "down" input before pressing K for the last Seppo is something I would have never thought of on my own in all honesty.



As an old time Alex fan, he is still fun to use. Now, as Spoon described, he is missing certain details that made him Alex (IMO). When using SFV Alex, I get the feeling I'm playing with a younger and dumber brother. He doesn't feel as threatening and dangerous as his SF3 self. But then again, maybe he wasn't yet. Even on Story Mode he is portrayed as a completely different person.
I don't like his new face either. The designers nailed another old time favorite (Mika). Yet they failed to portrait Alex's essence.

I'm having a hard time with specific trials (including Ryu's 10th). I'm obviously missing something, such as those specific inputs that you mentioned. But I refuse to watch youtube videos for help; so I guess I will continue suffering. BTW, is it me or is the timing for some combos completely arbitrary? I get the feeling that some characters' input timing is ruled by completely different set of rules.





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Ishmael
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"Re(8):SFV part 4: A Street Named Desire" , posted Tue 5 Apr 01:20post reply

While I might have a better shot at making the second meet-up time next weekend it's still a bit too early for me to say for certain. Still, if anyone sees me playing SF5 toss me an invite; I'm always up for a bit of fun.

quote:
You escaped


Thanks to Spoon for the detailed breakdown of Alex. Right now my Alex is a bit of a bungler who occasionally strings his huge collection of mostly useless moves together into huge damage. But since SF5 is all about big bursts of damage it makes it less forgivable that Alex seemingly doesn't fully have his act together.





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"Re(8):SFV part 4: A Street Named Desire" , posted Tue 5 Apr 01:23post reply

quote:

I'm having a hard time with specific trials (including Ryu's 10th). I'm obviously missing something, such as those specific inputs that you mentioned. But I refuse to watch youtube videos for help; so I guess I will continue suffering. BTW, is it me or is the timing for some combos completely arbitrary

-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --


As for trials, you can actually watch a demo of the combo in the game now. It is a nice feature. Ryu's 10th trial has a little detail that you probably need to watch a demo of since there is a quick input that the game doesn't tell you that you need to do.

Street Fighter IV was horrible with that. Like Juri and Hakan needed to be in an altered state (Feng Shui engine/oiled up) but the game didn't tell you about that. Some of Dhalsim's combos needed you to do a command normal instead of a normal attack and the game didn't tell you that either.

As for overall timing of combos, it felt like every other character had at least one weird combo.

As far as demonstration mode goes. I cannot figure out why that couldn't have been there day one. Or have some of those details be in the default move list.

Like Zangief's V-Skill has up to four hits of armor if you stand still and take two hits then walk forward. Just throw that stuff in there.

Also, they are still missing some details for some of the characters. Like there is no mention that Zangief's headbutt absorbs a fireball.





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"Re(9):SFV part 4: A Street Named Desire" , posted Tue 5 Apr 07:04post reply

quote:
But since SF5 is all about big bursts of damage it makes it less forgivable that Alex seemingly doesn't fully have his act together.



Since Alex looks and sound so utterly atrocious compared to how he is supposed to be; I have started to mentally call him "GBA port".

That's power to the people(?)






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Spoon
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"Re(9):SFV part 4: A Street Named Desire" , posted Tue 5 Apr 07:56post reply

Alex also invokes some pro-wrestling lingo when he beats R.Mika and Birdie.

Alex takes pro-wrestling really seriously!

Sick burn on Birdie





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"Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Named Desire" , posted Tue 5 Apr 08:24post reply

There are still some trials in SF4 that I was never able to finish. Though to be honest, compared to SF4 or incredibly busy nonsense like this, I didn't find the trials of SFV to be that intimidating or difficult.

Rather than execution, the real challenge for me most of the time was remembering what the hell moves they were asking me to do, seeing how far I could get before I switched the display to commands instead of move names. It made me question why every single target combo needs a fancy name.





Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(8):SFV part 4: A Suplex Named Desire" , posted Tue 5 Apr 20:57:post reply

Spoon: I played a bit of training mode with Alex soon after reading your post, and seeing Alex moving his head like that was absolutely hilarious x'D Thank you for the breakdown, it's very useful both on the gameplay side and the artistic one.

Tai-Pan: I see, I tried Ryu's 10th trial about 10-20 times on my own instead, then I was like "fuck everything, I need help" xD I don't know what's with certain timings, but they remind me of the infamous SFIV one-frame links.

Gojira: I'm trying to memorize move names -I think they could be useful when reading official material from Capcom, they look fond of using names instead of notations in their Capcom Unity posts-, so instead of switching to notations I read the move lists. It's irritating, but I think it'll prove useful when April update details show up. Those target combo names are so confusing indeed x'D





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Tue 5 Apr 21:00]

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"Re(9):SFV part 4: A Suplex Named Desire" , posted Tue 5 Apr 22:42post reply

I'm absolutely lazy when it comes to trial modes in games. The second I see a combo and decide "Nah, I'm not going to do that during a fight" I immediately stop trying. Sometimes trial modes can be good for showing you just what your character and the game engine are capable of but when a trial becomes too complicated and impractical it becomes too much hassle for my limited skills at execution.

Oh, and I should say that I am enjoying Game Boy Alex even if I'm not certain I'll ever get anywhere with the big lummox. One thing I particularly like is that in his Japanese voice he swears in Engrish a great deal. It reminds me of the comedy of Terry's cursing in KoF:MI2.





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"Re(10):SFV part 4: A Suplex Named Desire" , posted Thu 7 Apr 06:40post reply

quote:
I'm absolutely lazy when it comes to trial modes in games. The second I see a combo and decide "Nah, I'm not going to do that during a fight" I immediately stop trying. Sometimes trial modes can be good for showing you just what your character and the game engine are capable of but when a trial becomes too complicated and impractical it becomes too much hassle for my limited skills at execution.



I think I already mentioned I was disappointed in the very basic implementation of the tutorial elements. Why couldn't they do something just a little bit practical....

Okay so this scrub Ken just whiffed a Shoryuken, but you don't have any CA bar or anything. Trial 1 - Hit him with a crush counter and do this basic combo to punish. (By the way, this is how your character can do a crush counter.)

Trail 2 - Now same scenario, but you have one bar of meter... hit him with this slightly more difficult/more damaging combo to punish.

Man, this Ken will not stop mashing out DPs! You now have full CA bar and V-Trigger. Trial 3 do this max damage combo to inflict 45% damage and take the round. *game now fakes a disconnect to simulate a round three rage quit*

Now you have valuable experience that's applicable to the game! Then maybe the game could also offer some insight on the weaknesses of your chosen character....

Okay so the character you just picked... did you know this move is really unsafe on block? You're now playing a mirror match. He's going to keep doing this move without thinking (maybe an unsafe slide that is really tempting to overuse) so blow that shit up and think about how dangerous it is to just throw this out.

Lvl 1 - basic punish
Lvl 2 - intermediate punish
Lvl 3 - max damage punish.... do you see how you don't want to be throwing this out randomly?

Other obvious stuff would be challenges that cover multiple anti-air options for your chosen character (did you ever think of dashing under the attack?), dealing with attempted cross-ups after a hard knockdown, learning how to block/avoid damage from Mika and Karin mixups rather than just freaking out... etc. etc.

Honestly they could have just put YouTube links they grabbed from the beta and had a better tutorial experience than they do now (despite a lot of the information being outdated). Of course watching a video just isn't the same as playing the game, which is obvious to everyone.

I don't have a ton of time but I would like to learn/become familiar with more characters, and I'd rather spend my time playing the game than doing research on the internet and whacking on a training dummy. I have to imagine there might be other people that feel the same way.

Of course, I guess when you think about it, company shareholders don't really need tutorials... they don't even play the game! Silly me.





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"Re(2):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Suplex Named Desir" , posted Thu 7 Apr 17:04post reply

Heh, such tutorials, along with actual practice of the situations, would have been so more insightful than the boring -yet still informative for a hopeless scrub like me- videos in the March update. Capcom said a thousand times they wanted to make this game accessible to players of all levels but they were obviously lying...I'll admit it, I was naive thinking SFV would include modes that could help me step up my fighting game skills.

I really love your remark about shareholders, so sad yet so undeniably true.

On some lighter notes, April update talk possibily beginning already and...shaved Zangief looks like Lino Banfi? (a famous Italian comedian)





Ore no...kachi da!!

Maou
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"Re: SFV part 4: A Suplex Named R.Mika" , posted Thu 7 Apr 23:06:post reply

In honor of R.Mika's reappearance, an event I thought I'd never see, I give you an English-language article on Japanese women's professional wrestling (which is the greatest), another thing I thought I'd never see.

RAINBOWWWWWWWWW





Edit: Not to let Chun-Li be outdone by R.Mika, however, I'm glad to also note that Akiman helpfully clarified semi-recently what was long a source of contention about a certain part of Chun-Li's outfit.





人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は...

[this message was edited by Maou on Fri 8 Apr 01:15]

Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(1):Re: SFV part 4: A Suplex Named R.Mika" , posted Fri 8 Apr 01:20:post reply

Wonderful article, this woman is CRAZY. And I mean it in a very positive way, her devotion warms your heart. Thank you Maou!!

I cleared all the trials for all the remaining characters while waiting for the latest KOFXIV teaser, and while they reminded the for nth time how disgusting my execution is, I had lots of fun. Pointless, spoiler-protected chat about my trials experience ahead :D



Spoiler (Highlight to view) -

I don't remember all the trials properly because I was doing them sparsely and then I had a sudden burst of willpower between yesterday and today, which allowed me to clear trials like crazy, but I'd say Rashid is the second character I had the most fun with, it could have been Karin but she requires too much execution, so she's not gonna become my sub, sadly.

I had a blast with Nash too, but teleport techniques give me serious headaches for some reason.

I enjoy Vegamoto the most when Psycho Crusher is only available as a super and I'd go as far as choosing SFV Vega as my favorite incarnation of him, I love Psycho Inferno and his totally-not-KOF-inspired V-trigger property of chaining a special, an EX and another EX in one majestic string. Too bad this very feature made me sweat quite a bit xD

Chun Li's combos are ballet performances, that's all I'm willing to say about her. So graceful.

I'm biased about Ken so he's obviously the first character I took trials of, and his trials are my favorite ones LOL. A "server maintenance in 10 minutes" warning popped up as soon as I started his trials, and I was getting so nervous during his last trial because servers were just about to close...according to my message log, I cleared it with less than 1 minute to go before servers closed x'D


End of Spoiler







Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Fri 8 Apr 01:23]

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"Re(2):Re: SFV part 4: A Suplex Named R.Mika" , posted Fri 8 Apr 02:50post reply

quote:
I think I already mentioned I was disappointed in the very basic implementation of the tutorial elements. Why couldn't they do something just a little bit practical....

Okay so this scrub Ken just whiffed a Shoryuken, but you don't have any CA bar or anything. Trial 1 - Hit him with a crush counter and do this basic combo to punish. (By the way, this is how your character can do a crush counter.)

Trail 2 - Now same scenario, but you have one bar of meter... hit him with this slightly more difficult/more damaging combo to punish.

Ken Trial 1: Do not do a dragon punch three times in a row.

I really like your idea of presenting players with common situations and then letting them practice with a good way to proceed. It would be far more practical and rewarding than trying to perfect trials that could double as combo videos.

Still, I don't envy the people who have to build tutorials for fighting games. In the past several years there has been such an explosion of information about fighting games that it's creating an artificial sense of complexity. Most players starting out -or, hell, most players period- don't need to know the frame data for their character. So how do you sort through all that information and find the basics that a player needs from a tutorial? I don't know and judging by how many bad tutorials I've ground through most game developers don't know either.

For example, I've tapped my way through numerous Namco character move lists but I still don't understand the "proper" way to play Tekken or Soul Calibur. While that's not good I am a bit less frustrated by it since there are many different ways to interact with and enjoy most Namco fighters. SF5 could have skirted by with the less than illuminating tutorials and trials it currently has but by releasing its content so slowly fans have plenty of time to sort through every little detail.

Speaking of SF5's drip-feed of updates, Ono mentioned the elephant in the room during a recent interview. I would like to see the original interview since the quotes in the article are non-answers but I doubt the original piece is any more illuminating. Even though I'm certain Ono and co. can't deviate from the pre-approved script when it comes to discussing SF5's woes I give them credit for at least admitting there are issues. Hopefully that will lead to remedies and lessons learned but I guess we will have to wait and see on that one.





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"Re(3):Re: SFV part 4: A Suplex Named R.Mika" , posted Fri 8 Apr 06:19post reply

quote:
Ono mentioned the elephant in the room during a recent interview.


For a moment, I actually paused to think of which elephant it would be. SF5 arguably has more than one.

Personally, I'd rather hear an explanation for why they made such an awfully designed Survival Mode and then locked content behind it. I can guess what is probably the "real" answer(*), but I'd like to see how different the "public" answer would be.

(*) My guess for the "real" answer is that it was intentionally designed to be overlong, frustrating, time consuming, and semi-random. Why? Because it exists both to be a pure time-sink grind to greatly inflate the single player "play time" (made even worse with having to replay Survival for each costume) and as a way to gate large chunks of Fight Money where the average player will never obtain it. Why is the latter important? Because Ono had previously made a point that people would be able to earn enough Fight Money in-game to buy stuff; he just never said it would be practical or realistic to do so. Heck, it even had the third benefit of making people happy for the option to pay for color unlocks in the shop.





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"Re(4):Re: SFV part 4: A Suplex Named R.Mika" , posted Fri 8 Apr 07:56post reply

quote:


(*) My guess for the "real" answer is that it was intentionally designed to be overlong, frustrating, time consuming, and semi-random. Why? Because it exists both to be a pure time-sink grind to greatly inflate the single player "play time" (made even worse with having to replay Survival for each costume) and as a way to gate large chunks of Fight Money where the average player will never obtain it. Why is the latter important? Because Ono had previously made a point that people would be able to earn enough Fight Money in-game to buy stuff; he just never said it would be practical or realistic to do so. Heck, it even had the third benefit of making people happy for the option to pay for color unlocks in the shop.



Welcome to F2P, enjoy your stay!

I'm not sure which would work better, making the Hell survival colors cost more premium currency than any other color, or the same amount of premium currency. One rationalization is that people will bang their heads against this input reading wall of doom, and then when they see that they can just buy it for the same cost as any other, they'll spring for it. Another goes that if it costs extra, having tasted how hard it is to get, they'll be more willing to pay more, especially since having it would be a symbol of prestige.

It would be really funny to me if there was a bonus background stage of a small, luxurious, antiquated place. It would be called.... FM Towns. It will have strangely few background characters in it.





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"Re(5):Re: SFV part 4: A Suplex Named R.Mika" , posted Fri 8 Apr 18:02post reply

Just what the fuck is going on with the servers? I tried clearing normal survival with Alex twice, and I got disconnected both times -stage 28 first disconnection, less than 15 stages clear second disconnection-...servers still are shit, what a shame.





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"Re(6):Re: SFV part 4: A Suplex Named R.Mika" , posted Sun 10 Apr 04:07:post reply

I have a theory that the Alex vs. Alex in SFV is a curious match because Alex completely lacks the tools to deal with Alex once Alex gets in. There's no parry to save him, he has no invincible reversal outside of super, and most importantly, Alex's fastest normal is 4F, and as Viscant describes, being at +3F with Alex enables all of Alex's mixups against characters with 3F jabs. But since Alex's fastest move is 4F, there exist even more options against Alex. For instance, any time Alex is made to block Alex's own standing jab or standing strong at close range, it's a command throw mixup that Alex cannot mash jab to beat. Holding up and guessing wrong (i.e. Alex pressed attack instead of throw, for certain buttons, anyway) is going to result in Alex getting a full combo on Alex since neutral/backwards jumps have 4F startup (3F + 4F = 7F, Alex's standing MP has 6F startup).





[this message was edited by Spoon on Wed 13 Apr 06:03]

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"Re: SFV part 4: MMC Championship Edition" , posted Wed 13 Apr 00:38post reply

quote:
I have a theory that the Alex vs. Alex in SFV is a curious match because Alex completely lacks the tools to deal with Alex once Alex gets in.
Woah, this is actually really interesting! For once, I want to see more Alex rather than less, in hopes of seeing a strange divide by zero moment like this. Maybe he has some lines to refer to this...I like how Chun-Li has a wink to two players choosing the same character with her "even a good mimic can't beat me" line.

In other news, now that a successful experimental transcontinental MMCAFE LAGFEST (tm) went off with minimal fuss, it gave me a chance to see more characters than I myself was playing as, and I continue to admire their animation and personality, strange visual design be damned. I haven't chuckled this much watching SF characters guesture and yell since SFZero 2 days back when Dan was still (kind of) funny and when I found I could damage opponents with Sakura's finger-pointing laughing taunt.





人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は...

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"Re(1):Re: SFV part 4: MMC Championship Editio" , posted Wed 13 Apr 01:23post reply

I need to work on Alex so I can overcome the bad match-up of Alex. Heck, I need to work on learning how to play the game!





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"Re(2):Re: SFV part 4: MMC Championship Editio" , posted Wed 13 Apr 03:13post reply

quote:
I need to work on Alex so I can overcome the bad match-up of Alex.



Alex vs. Alex is 70-30 in Alex's favor.

I haven't looked too deeply into the move properties, because hey, maybe Alex has some move that is throw invincible on startup. In SF4, there were command grabs that had throw invulnerability on startup, and I vaguely recall that some others had strike invulnerability but not throw invulnerability. So these were far from perfect reversals, but they were something.





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"Re(1):Re: SFV part 4: MMC Championship Editio" , posted Wed 13 Apr 04:50post reply

I'm happy to hear a Lagfest lounge went well :D In the event I catch and join one, I need some technical support: is it alright if the ports I forwarded in my gateway configuration are listed as closed when I check them on sites like yougetsignal.com? I assigned my PS4 a static IP specifying its MAC address in the appropriate page of the gateway settings, but since I'm totally ignorant in networking I wouldn't be surprised if I'm missing some crucial step. This is the guide I followed to open the ports, my gateway has a different name but the GUI is virtually the same...

portforward.com/english/routers/port_forwarding/ADB/P-RG_A4202N/PS4.htm





Ore no...kachi da!!

Professor
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"Re(2):Re: SFV part 4: MMC Championship Editio" , posted Thu 14 Apr 12:55:post reply

The MMCafe experimental session was interesting! I was surprised that the connection to Ishmael wasn't all that bad leave aside some lag spikes now and then. Hope to run another session soon. Talking to Maou, one thing became apparent; it's hard to tell who's around on Steam when you're playing on the PS4 and vice versa, so poking people that are online can be a headache.


Micky-- Bottom line, if you're already playing online without troubles, it shouldn't be a worry. Btw did your PS4 tell you that you have NAT3? Otherwise I'm not too sure why went through the trouble since the automatic setting usually works fine.





[this message was edited by Professor on Thu 14 Apr 13:19]

Maou
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"Re(3):Re: SFV part 4: MMC Championship Editio" , posted Thu 14 Apr 14:52:post reply

quote:
Talking to Maou, one thing became apparent; it's hard to tell who's around on Steam when you're playing on the PS4 and vice versa, so poking people that are online can be a headache.
Yeah, it's interesting: on the PC version, you can see different statuses for PC and PS4 users as in Training, Survival, or the Menu Screen (which I assume means offline). That should be enough, but hard to tell how robust the invitation system is...messages are in sort of an obscure part of the Main Menu, and I don't know if the invitations popped up for those of you playing Survival or Training?

Either way, Japan-to-US play worked well with Ishmael, even if I wanted to blame his destructive Vegamoto on lag rather than his crazy-excellent teleporting powered up Somersault Skull Diver.

No pants Cammy seems strong! Anyone have a tier chart based on their own experiences yet?

Edit: thanks for adding CFN IDs to our profiles, Prof!





人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は...

[this message was edited by Maou on Thu 14 Apr 14:55]

Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(3):Re: SFV part 4: MMC Championship Editio" , posted Thu 14 Apr 16:44:post reply

quote:
Micky-- Bottom line, if you're already playing online without troubles, it shouldn't be a worry. Btw did your PS4 tell you that you have NAT3? Otherwise I'm not too sure why went through the trouble since the automatic setting usually works fine.


Sorry Prof I forgot a couple things in that post ^^; I started playing online for real last Tuesday, I almost only get European opponents -my ping is 31ms within Italy- and most matches go well, teleport fests are an exception. The PS4 network test says NAT2. So, I think I'm fine after all. Thank you for your support ^^
Capcom made a maintenance a couple days back, I was hoping they would officially patch the "previous version" character select bug, but it's more likely they did it to get the game ready for new measures to discourage rage quitters, which is equally good -to prevent the player select bug, it just takes not to choose Alex as your default character.

EDIT: I made a disturbing find about survival mode: Capcom reduced the fight money amount you get on completion, at least for Alex. For every character I cleared before the March update, it was 6000 on easy and 10000 on normal; for Alex it was 4000 on easy and 9000 on normal. I'm about to try and clear normal survival with a character I still haven't cleared with...hope rewards for old characters haven't changed. Unless there's something about supplements purchase that influences your rewards...I've become completely careless as for what to buy after a stage because of how bad this mode is getting on my nerves.

EDIT 2: normal survival cleared with Balrog, 9000 fight money. What the fuck are those guys smoking?





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Fri 15 Apr 04:09]

Ishmael
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"Re(4):Re: SFV part 4: MMC Championship Editio" , posted Fri 15 Apr 00:15post reply

Our lagfest session was very informative in showing that while my connection to you guys wasn't great it was occasionally workable. It was also instructive in showing me that I need to learn Chun-Li since that's who all the cool kids play. Assuming our schedules can align (and we can figure out how to deal with the PS4/Steam hurdles) we should do it again soon.

Also, thanks for the CFN tags!

quote:
EDIT: I made a disturbing find about survival mode: Capcom reduced the fight money amount you get on completion, at least for Alex. For every character I cleared before the March update, it was 6000 on easy and 10000 on hard; for Alex it was 4000 on easy and 9000 on hard.

I would think this was a way to squeeze real money out of people but since the store isn't operating correctly I don't know what's going on.





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"Re(5):Re: SFV part 4: MMC Championship Editio" , posted Fri 15 Apr 00:44post reply

quote:
I would think this was a way to squeeze real money out of people but since the store isn't operating correctly I don't know what's going on.



My guess is that is exactly what has happened. More people are getting more Fight Money than Capcom wants, so Capcom is already reducing the awards even before the real money shop is in place.

Survival was pretty obviously meant to be a barrier. Everything about its design screams that it was a way for Capcom to lock a large chunk of "free" Fight Money behind a barrier that the majority of players wouldn't overcome.

But people are overcoming it.

On PC, some people are risking the use of trainer programs to cheat with infinite life or one-hit kills. Some are doing it offline just for the color unlocks, but some are risking it online for the Fight Money.

People have been finding patterns and tactics that can be used to cheese the AI. You can find descriptions on forums or YouTube videos. No, it doesn't do away with either the drudge work or all of the risk of losing, but it probably has allowed more people to complete more Survival modes. (I'm pretty sure Capcom has also tweaked the AI since release, making Survival mode harder.)

I've heard that accepting an online match will prevent a loss in Survival, at least if you accept the match before you actually lose the Survival round. So you can apparently cheat the system by leaving yourself open for online matches, and simply ignoring the matches found until it looks like you are going to lose a Survival round.





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"Re(6):Re: SFV part 4: MMC Championship Editio" , posted Fri 15 Apr 04:16:post reply

Baines: that's exactly what I suspect, and before the March update, I was afraid that Capcom could do it. By the way, I had made a big mistake in my previous post -"10000 on hard" and "9000 on hard", it's "10000 on normal" and "9000 on normal" instead-, you can still see it in Ishmael's quote LOL.

Now I'm MAD. How could the game fucking pit me against players who have double the LP than me or are 10000 ranks above me? The matchmaking turns into shit as soon as you get Super Bronze. I'll turn ranked OFF as soon as I get Super Bronze again -I'm 907 now-, my online activity will be CASUAL ONLY until I get on par with players like those who destroyed my rank. Doesn't SFV have a system that understands your skill level after you play a certain amount of matches? Looks like it isn't working at all for me.

By the way, I know Maou's directions for the Cafe lounge suggest to only invite people whose status is training, but I'd be glad if you guys invited me to the lounge no matter what mode you see me online. Come on, you'll get a good laugh at my (lack of) skills xD





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Fri 15 Apr 17:53]

Professor
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"Re(2):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Named Desir" , posted Fri 15 Apr 19:13:post reply

Ahh ok, so the CFN has an online status thing within the SFV game itself. That makes sense.

Gojira-- just to make sure, that's you with around 3600LP and Laura, correct?





[this message was edited by Professor on Fri 15 Apr 19:30]

Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(3):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Named Desir" , posted Fri 15 Apr 20:27post reply

Yes Professor, you should be able to see what mode a favorite player is in, from menu to survival, as soon as you open your favorites list. I play on PS4, don't know if anything is different on PC, nor how effective status detection is. Besides, I'm afraid there isn't any offline status. Never seen somebody offline whenever I checked my favorites (it's been a couple days since I last remembered to take a look at my list).





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"Re(4):Re(10):SFV part 4: rA Shi Named Do" , posted Mon 18 Apr 14:05post reply

I was not ready.

This is actually brilliant





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"Re(5):Re(10):SFV part 4: rA Shi Named Do" , posted Mon 18 Apr 14:29post reply

quote:
I was not ready.

This is actually brilliant

"I've never seen a battle like this!"

I...I wasn't expecting to encounter such joy of a kind I haven't experienced since the proto-absurdist days of the late 1990s consumer internet! All this and more from the same gentleman poster who first pointed out the most important bridge/chorus in all of SFV.





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Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(6):Re(10):SFV part 4: rA Shi Named Do" , posted Mon 18 Apr 17:42post reply

I only heard that awesome chorus in Rashido's theme for the first time when doing his trials...oh the joy!! It was the only character theme I didn't like before that, and I didn't get it when you guys talked about this self-celebrating chorus, but since then, I love it.





Ore no...kachi da!!

Iggy
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"Re(7):Re(10):SFV part 4: Guile's meme" , posted Tue 19 Apr 01:03post reply

http://www.capcom-unity.com/street_fighter/blog/2016/04/18/guile-joins-street-fighter-v-and-april-update-news

And to celebrate LEGENOARYNINLIA's thread, they apparently gave him a Fatal Fury crouching walk.

I guess they took out Chun li's infamous barrage of kikkouken from the beta because they thought it would be more fitting for Guile?





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"Re(8):Re(10):SFV part 4: Guile's meme" , posted Tue 19 Apr 02:56post reply

Things I liked:

Guile rolled his sleeves up all the way to his armpits. He has to give those flag covered guns some breathing room during a fight.

His V-trigger looks like handcuffs.

Things I didn't like:

It looks like Guile's glasses are bolted to his head. Was having more than two moves (even if one was a pointless taunt) too taxing for Guile players?

Come to think of it, where is the game pulling the reflection on his glasses from?





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"Re(9):Re(10):SFV part 4: Guile's meme" , posted Tue 19 Apr 03:26post reply

quote:
Things I liked:

Guile rolled his sleeves up all the way to his armpits. He has to give those flag covered guns some breathing room during a fight.

His V-trigger looks like handcuffs.

Things I didn't like:

It looks like Guile's glasses are bolted to his head. Was having more than two moves (even if one was a pointless taunt) too taxing for Guile players?

Come to think of it, where is the game pulling the reflection on his glasses from?



I know that's an airforce uniform, but the first thing I thought of when I saw that was Paul Blart, Mall Cop.






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Spoon
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"Re(8):Re(10):SFV part 4: Guile's meme" , posted Tue 19 Apr 03:30post reply

quote:
http://www.capcom-unity.com/street_fighter/blog/2016/04/18/guile-joins-street-fighter-v-and-april-update-news

And to celebrate LEGENOARYNINLIA's thread, they apparently gave him a Fatal Fury crouching walk.

I guess they took out Chun li's infamous barrage of kikkouken from the beta because they thought it would be more fitting for Guile?



I think it's even better that Guile being able to throw out tons of booms means that they've decided to bring in features from Rainbow Edition.

The V-Trigger putting out a projectile that improves his own projectiles that pass through it is cool and its most recent antecedent is from Ky in Xrd.

Guile in CvS2 was really interesting in that he had the ability to sustain a very safe offense that ground the opponent's guard gauge down. With the advent of white block damage in SFV, I wonder how they will incorporate his aspect of safety on block. In SFIV, the answer was to have generally mediocre damage output (e.g. sonic boom did less damage than a medium punch, and was the lowest damage projectile in the game!). But since you can cash in unscaled white damage, being able to safely crank it up makes a safe, sustained offense surprisingly rewarding. In this regard... that'd actually be a lot like Ky in Guilty Gear! Again! Ky didn't do a huge amount of damage natively, but he could do a lot of safe stuff that would increase the opponent's guard gauge, which would then result in a big damage increase in whatever combo he's able to land.





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"Re(9):Re(10):SFV part 4: Guile's meme" , posted Tue 19 Apr 04:22post reply

Good. Guile has never been among my favorite characters, even though I do regard him as one of the best ones, in both gameplay and artistic side -come on, he's the epitome of the all-American hero in Japanese videogames :D-, but after reading about his V-System I really look forward to try him. Of course the acronym SNK echoed in my head as soon as I read "crouching walk" xD





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"Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: Guile's meme" , posted Tue 19 Apr 09:30post reply

quote:
paul blartt


You aren't the only one!





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"Re(2):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: Guile's meme" , posted Tue 19 Apr 12:39post reply

quote:
paul blartt

You aren't the only one!



It's great to see Capcom maintaining the highest visual standards with each new reveal.






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"Re(3):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: Guile's meme" , posted Tue 19 Apr 13:22post reply

The way in which his arms swell (but unfortunately with the USA tattoo out of sight) when he does his Sonic Hurricane is pretty hilarious, though!





Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(4):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: Guile's meme" , posted Tue 19 Apr 16:18:post reply

Swelling arms...Capcom has his own lighter version of Wyler? LOL :D I don't like that certain Criticals don't have any cinematic angle during their actual hits...when I saw the screens yesterday, I was afraid Sonic Hurricane would join the club, and sadly I was right. Nevertheless, I'm looking forward to Guile, his SFV incarnation could end up being the most fun ever to me.

I'm dying from laughter x'D





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Tue 19 Apr 20:54]

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"Re(5):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: Guile's meme" , posted Wed 20 Apr 01:57post reply

What is going on with this game?
Ugly and disappointing Alex, exciting new Guile?
It's the end of the world as we know it.
(I mean, the end of the world for the 10 people who remembered who Alex was).





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"Re(6):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: Guile's meme" , posted Wed 20 Apr 04:00post reply

quote:
What is going on with this game?
Ugly and disappointing Alex, exciting new Guile?



Guile's battle stance looks so amazing(?) that it fits perfectly my mental image of a man being left naked in the middle of a snowstorm.






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"Re(6):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: Guile's meme" , posted Wed 20 Apr 05:01post reply

quote:
What is going on with this game?
Ugly and disappointing Alex, exciting new Guile?
It's the end of the world as we know it.
(I mean, the end of the world for the 10 people who remembered who Alex was).


Does Alex know how to duck walk? Does Alex wear a bandana headband like a balding middle age rock star instead of letting his hair sprout into a massive crew cut/high top fade/outdoor table umbrella? Does Alex wear both suspenders and a belt instead of swanky Cool Hand Luke sunglasses? I can't believe I'm saying this, but Guile is where it's at.





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"Re(6):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: Guile's meme" , posted Wed 20 Apr 06:14post reply

quote:
What is going on with this game?
Ugly and disappointing Alex, exciting new Guile?
It's the end of the world as we know it.
(I mean, the end of the world for the 10 people who remembered who Alex was).



One thing which I cannot deny SFV has done very well is giving us some of the most uniquely playing versions of the characters with very deliberate and generally thoughtful gameplay design. Guile and Nash are REALLY different from each other, and each has their own unique gimmicks! Ken and Ryu are REALLY different from each other, with animations that reflect their style! And they're all really coherently made characters, gameplay-wise, too!





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"Re(7):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: Guile's meme" , posted Thu 21 Apr 06:24post reply

quote:
What is going on with this game?
Ugly and disappointing Alex, exciting new Guile?


Guile's battle stance looks so amazing(?) that it fits perfectly my mental image of a man being left naked in the middle of a snowstorm.



Do, yo bess.





/ / /

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"Re(7):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: Guile's meme" , posted Thu 21 Apr 06:52post reply

quote:
What is going on with this game?
Ugly and disappointing Alex, exciting new Guile?


Guile's battle stance looks so amazing(?) that it fits perfectly my mental image of a man being left naked in the middle of a snowstorm.



Reposting from previous thread, because it's still the most inspired Guile fanart anywhere





Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(8):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: Guile's meme" , posted Thu 21 Apr 17:25post reply

I'll gladly say it again, that artist is so brilliant both in art style and setting ideas.

I'm a bit ashamed to say this, but I could have made a huge mistake about the Fight Money thing some days ago: if my research is right, it's just a matter of having raised characters' experience level by watching their tutorials, which weren't available when I made my first survival runs.

For example, Easy Survival actually nets you 2000 FM only, any other FM reward is for leveling up and separate from that. When I saw two separate FM rewards after each survival playthrough, I thought the SFV servers weren't able to give more than 5000 FM in a single reward and it was a weird way to give you more than 5000 at once -I'm prejudiced about those servers x'D-, but it was me jumping to conclusions, you get separate rewards from survival and experience, and watching tutorials scrambled my progression for those characters I hadn't completed survival with yet LOL.

Sorry for alarming you :P





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"Red Bull Kumite... Re Tokido v Infiltration" , posted Mon 25 Apr 04:27post reply

The grand finals of this tournament is, once again, Tokido vs. Infiltration.

Tokido fighting from the loser's side, has so far managed to take 2 games from Infiltration in the grand finals, which is the best he's done so far. This is absolutely the premier rivalry of this game so far.





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"Re(1):Red Bull Kumite... Re Tokido v Infiltra" , posted Mon 25 Apr 04:46post reply

quote:
The grand finals of this tournament is, once again, Tokido vs. Infiltration.

Tokido fighting from the loser's side, has so far managed to take 2 games from Infiltration in the grand finals, which is the best he's done so far. This is absolutely the premier rivalry of this game so far.



Infiltration wins! Again! 3-1 in the reset!

At this point, Tokido has become the #1 jobber, and should Daigo ever meet Infiltration in a match it will be the hypest thing ever. Daigo's got the whole "training in secret" thing going on, Infiltration's got the "defeating everybody and the #1 challenger over and over again", and Tokido's got the "I CAN'T BEAT INFILTRATION" thing going on. This is the greatest angle, no kayfabe even needed.





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"Re(1):Red Bull Kumite... Re Tokido v Infiltra" , posted Mon 25 Apr 05:05post reply

quote:
This is absolutely the premier rivalry of this game so far.


At the moment this feels like the only rivalry that's worth talking about. Hopefully some other players can step it up soon because at the moment it feels like Infiltration and Tokido are far and away the best players around.

Digression: I finally saw Nash's alt costume in action and was surprised to see that his upper shins are exposed like they were in his Alpha sprite. Here I thought the alt would simply replace his mottled skin but they gave him new pants and boots as well.





Spoon
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"Re(2):Red Bull Kumite... Re Tokido v Infiltra" , posted Wed 27 Apr 05:32post reply

quote:
This is absolutely the premier rivalry of this game so far.

At the moment this feels like the only rivalry that's worth talking about. Hopefully some other players can step it up soon because at the moment it feels like Infiltration and Tokido are far and away the best players around.




After 3 events full of international entrants, I agree, it can't be disputed. They are absolutely going to enter every tournament as the guys to beat.

That said, Evo this year already has >4000 (!!!) entrants for SFV. If they once again manage to finish 1-2 in that, it will be a rivalry the likes of which we have seldom seen in any tournament fighting game. It would be like... Dakou/Xiaohai in KOF'98.





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"SFV PC model swaps never go too far" , posted Sun 1 May 12:41post reply

I'm sure somewhere out there is a compilation of this super animation with every female character

Is Guile truly the gift that never stops giving?





Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(1):SFV PC model swaps never go too far" , posted Mon 2 May 02:59:post reply

I don't know which one cracks me up the most xDDDDD I love these mods, maybe more than the serious ones. Don't get me wrong, the Q skin for Vega is god tier -by the way, do you think the cinematic story will tell us something more about him?- and the classic Alex and Gouki ones are good stuff too, but when I stumble upon mods made to make us laugh our asses off, they make my day :D

I messed around with Guile for about an hour and I'm impressed, he's still Mr. Sonic Boom & Somersault at heart but his V-System is a breath of fresh air. Could he juggle an opponent with his Somersault after Guile Kick in SFIV? I don't remember, but he can in SFV, and I like it. His Somersault cancel into Sonic Hurricane/Tempest is another pretty option.





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Mon 2 May 03:05]

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"Re(1):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Mon 2 May 18:25post reply

Wow, I stick my head in here after how long, and there are actually discussions about fighting games! ww





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"Re(2):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Tue 3 May 03:10post reply

quote:
Wow, I stick my head in here after how long, and there are actually discussions about fighting games! ww



we can talk about the Babalu Destructoid if you prefer





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"Re(3):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Tue 3 May 11:14:post reply

quote:
Wow, I stick my head in here after how long, and there are actually discussions about fighting games! ww


we can talk about the Babalu Destructoid if you prefer



For a second I wondered what that was, lol.

Welcome back RedFalcon! It's great that a lot of members are coming back with the recent fighting game stuff that's been happening.



The crates don't seem to break in Guile's stage! It's a bit of a pity there's not much background interaction leave asite Hong Kong. Meanwhile, the mods still bring in a lot of laughter.





[this message was edited by Professor on Tue 3 May 11:18]

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"Re(4):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Thu 5 May 02:24post reply

quote:

The crates don't seem to break in Guile's stage! It's a bit of a pity there's not much background interaction leave asite Hong Kong. Meanwhile, the mods still bring in a lot of laughter.



That is such a pity. Stage interaction could have been very easy to implement considering they are using the Unreal engine...





"Those who follow the path of a warrior must be ready to die in order to stand for one's convictions live for one's convictions die for one's convictions"

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"Re(5):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Thu 5 May 23:51post reply

I wonder if stage interactions will be added in at a later date? The list of possible patches continues to grow...

Speaking of sloppy things that are barely held together, I'll probably be online tomorrow around 23:00 JST if anyone wants to hit me up for a few games.





Maou
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"Re(6):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Fri 6 May 00:07:post reply

quote:
Speaking of sloppy things that are barely held together, I'll probably be online tomorrow around 23:00 JST if anyone wants to hit me up for a few games.

Hahaha, your speedy Vegamoto seemed plenty threatening to me last time we squared off! I'm travelling this weekend but let's go again soon.

I just updated today and forgot Guile was free until the store works. While I look forward to Alex eventually vanishing from my copy (could I pay to make the same thing happen to Necalli?), I wonder if people will just be annoyed when these freebies are "taken away" from them. For now, I may get Guile's stage even if I temporarily lose the man himself later. I'd pay five fight money to make the crates break, you know.

Also, realistically, will people actually pay money for boxer Bison? I'm hoping a redesign will make Juri a tolerable character.





人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は...

[this message was edited by Maou on Fri 6 May 00:13]

Professor
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"Re(6):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Fri 6 May 09:52post reply

quote:
I wonder if stage interactions will be added in at a later date? The list of possible patches continues to grow...

Speaking of sloppy things that are barely held together, I'll probably be online tomorrow around 23:00 JST if anyone wants to hit me up for a few games.




I should be able to join in around 11:20 or so and play for an hour!





Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(7):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Fri 6 May 20:56post reply

quote:
I wonder if stage interactions will be added in at a later date? The list of possible patches continues to grow...

Speaking of sloppy things that are barely held together, I'll probably be online tomorrow around 23:00 JST if anyone wants to hit me up for a few games.



I should be able to join in around 11:20 or so and play for an hour!


I'm in!!





Ore no...kachi da!!

Ishmael
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"Re(8):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Fri 6 May 22:53post reply

quote:
I wonder if stage interactions will be added in at a later date? The list of possible patches continues to grow...

Speaking of sloppy things that are barely held together, I'll probably be online tomorrow around 23:00 JST if anyone wants to hit me up for a few games.



I should be able to join in around 11:20 or so and play for an hour!

I'm in!!


Sounds good, I'll set up a room at that time!





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"Re(9):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Fri 6 May 23:36post reply

quote:
I wonder if stage interactions will be added in at a later date? The list of possible patches continues to grow...

Speaking of sloppy things that are barely held together, I'll probably be online tomorrow around 23:00 JST if anyone wants to hit me up for a few games.



I should be able to join in around 11:20 or so and play for an hour!

I'm in!!

Sounds good, I'll set up a room at that time!



I didn't think I'd actually be available now but it turns out I am. How can I join in?





Ishmael
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"Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Fri 6 May 23:39:post reply

quote:
I wonder if stage interactions will be added in at a later date? The list of possible patches continues to grow...

Speaking of sloppy things that are barely held together, I'll probably be online tomorrow around 23:00 JST if anyone wants to hit me up for a few games.



I should be able to join in around 11:20 or so and play for an hour!

I'm in!!

Sounds good, I'll set up a room at that time!


I didn't think I'd actually be available now but it turns out I am. How can I join in?


I'll send you an invite, one sec.
EDIT: What is your CFN id?





[this message was edited by Ishmael on Fri 6 May 23:45]

Gojira
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"Re(2):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Fri 6 May 23:47post reply

quote:
I wonder if stage interactions will be added in at a later date? The list of possible patches continues to grow...

Speaking of sloppy things that are barely held together, I'll probably be online tomorrow around 23:00 JST if anyone wants to hit me up for a few games.



I should be able to join in around 11:20 or so and play for an hour!

I'm in!!

Sounds good, I'll set up a room at that time!


I didn't think I'd actually be available now but it turns out I am. How can I join in?

I'll send you an invite, one sec.
EDIT: What is your CFN id?



It's just Gojira, is it not working?





Ishmael
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"Re(3):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Fri 6 May 23:50post reply

quote:
I wonder if stage interactions will be added in at a later date? The list of possible patches continues to grow...

Speaking of sloppy things that are barely held together, I'll probably be online tomorrow around 23:00 JST if anyone wants to hit me up for a few games.



I should be able to join in around 11:20 or so and play for an hour!

I'm in!!

Sounds good, I'll set up a room at that time!


I didn't think I'd actually be available now but it turns out I am. How can I join in?

I'll send you an invite, one sec.
EDIT: What is your CFN id?


It's just Gojira, is it not working?


It's listing you as not found. I'll try again but sorry about that.





Gojira
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"Re(4):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Fri 6 May 23:54post reply

quote:
I wonder if stage interactions will be added in at a later date? The list of possible patches continues to grow...

Speaking of sloppy things that are barely held together, I'll probably be online tomorrow around 23:00 JST if anyone wants to hit me up for a few games.



I should be able to join in around 11:20 or so and play for an hour!

I'm in!!

Sounds good, I'll set up a room at that time!


I didn't think I'd actually be available now but it turns out I am. How can I join in?

I'll send you an invite, one sec.
EDIT: What is your CFN id?


It's just Gojira, is it not working?

It's listing you as not found. I'll try again but sorry about that.



No need to apologize, I know this isn't working perfectly.

It's kind of frustrating that I can see that you're currently in a Battle Lounge but I get no option to join at all unless I can somehow find it through a random search.





Gojira
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"Re(5):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Sat 7 May 00:34post reply

quote:
I wonder if stage interactions will be added in at a later date? The list of possible patches continues to grow...

Speaking of sloppy things that are barely held together, I'll probably be online tomorrow around 23:00 JST if anyone wants to hit me up for a few games.



I should be able to join in around 11:20 or so and play for an hour!

I'm in!!

Sounds good, I'll set up a room at that time!


I didn't think I'd actually be available now but it turns out I am. How can I join in?

I'll send you an invite, one sec.
EDIT: What is your CFN id?


It's just Gojira, is it not working?

It's listing you as not found. I'll try again but sorry about that.


No need to apologize, I know this isn't working perfectly.



Backup plan! See if you can invite MisterTwit. That's my backup PC account.





Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(6):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Sat 7 May 02:01post reply

While I hate to get the nth confirmation of my (lack of) skills, I had a blast experiencing a MMCafe Lagfest first hand, and I hope to be available for as many others as possible. Thanks!! :D





Ore no...kachi da!!

Professor
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"Re(7):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Sat 7 May 08:49post reply

quote:
While I hate to get the nth confirmation of my (lack of) skills, I had a blast experiencing a MMCafe Lagfest first hand, and I hope to be available for as many others as possible. Thanks!! :D



Good games yesterday night! If 11PM JST is fine, I'll probably call for another one soon.





red falcon
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"Re(8):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Sat 7 May 11:26post reply

I'll join in again too, if everyone's on for it. If only SF V was...





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"Re(9):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Sat 7 May 12:12post reply

Next time we should have Gojira host the session just to avoid any further complications.





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"Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Sat 7 May 13:15post reply

quote:
Next time we should have Gojira host the session just to avoid any further complications.



I've hit Gojira about it and it's semi-solved. He can be called in as long as you've got him on your list (For some odd reason when in the lounge his name can't be typed directly).





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"Re(2):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Rebo" , posted Sat 7 May 16:59post reply

So this is the part where I have to mention I was kind of lucky that I was available before, since 23:00 JST is pretty early in the morning here and I just happened to be up then. Otherwise I'm kind of a late sleeper.

That said I do want to get in on this so I'll try to be there if I can manage it.





Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(2):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Rebo" , posted Sun 8 May 01:19post reply

quote:
Next time we should have Gojira host the session just to avoid any further complications.


I've hit Gojira about it and it's semi-solved. He can be called in as long as you've got him on your list (For some odd reason when in the lounge his name can't be typed directly).



By the way, the status system in favorites list seems to have taken a big step forward: there's an offline status now and status updates look real time, or reliable at least. I think it's very useful for setting up a lounge.





Ore no...kachi da!!

Spoon
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"Guile the People: pumped up kicks" , posted Sun 8 May 02:07:post reply

A random thought looking at SFV Guile:

There are a lot of re-used frames in fighting games, notably in the older 2D ones because of time/money/memory budgets. Guile is a great example of a great amount of reuse:

- the famous upside down kick is his jump animation combined with the hitting frame of his d.MK

- d.HK is d.LK followed by d.MK

- j.HK is d.MK

- j.LK and j.MK are mostly the same sprite, with the difference being his left leg (extended or not), with the startup frame just being one of the jump animation frames.

(reference)

So an interesting thing about Guile's kicks is that all three of his crouching kicks are EXTREMELY horizontal, as well as his j.HK and his upside-down kick. You see these moves often enough (hey, you see upside-down kick all the time when you and everybody else is terrible at the game and mashing away!), and they really become part of what you remember about how the character is because of this distinctive aspect of how the character moves. His b/f.HK step-kick introduced in ST is another incredibly horizontal kick. I remember trying to goofily do them decades ago and wondering "how does Guile make his leg go so straight? How does he spin without falling over? How come his moves look so cool?"

As time has passed and budget has increased and 3D models have made animating moves a bit easier, Guile's gained a lot more variety. SF4 was very much a SF2 homage, and as such Guile moved quite like SF2. (reference) But you'll notice that they added some subtle changes to d.HK to make it seem stronger: he torques harder on the second hit compared to d.MK, and what he does with his outward arm bigger to help sell how much stronger this motion/attack is.

Some changes were made to his jumping kicks in SF4, too. (reference) His torso turn is reversed for j.LK, in a pose more resembling his crouch block animation and almost identical to the other great western military wrestler of history. The pose of j.MK is like before, but a bit more horizontal, but j.HK is now TOTALLY DIFFERENT! It's no longer a straight copy of any other kick he has, and has a big downward angle.

In SFV, Guile's kicks are now prominently downward angled. Most of his crouching kicks no longer are perfectly horizontal, with his d.HK making me think of T.Hawk's because of the first of hit... but the second hit of Guile's d.HK has that perfectly straight, horizontal leg. His dramatic/weird j.MK is now his j.HK, but it regains its downward angle compared to SF4. Like Alex's j.MK, Guile's d.MK which used to have a circular motion is now a forward thrusting motion. The more downward angled kicks to me were something that Nash/Charlie brought in SFA.

He also saw some changes to his punches: his standing MP is now exclusively one move, which looks like his old close standing MP (the odd hook punch), rather than the singular and curious upward punch where he leans forward. His neutral standing HP (which was formerly his close standing HP, and was kind of like his d.HP) is no longer a fully extended upward punch.

The intro of his Sonic Hurricane makes me think of his SF2 Movie sonic boom.

There's a certain uniformity of motion that I think is very fitting for Guile, given his straightforward military nature. Some of his poses are somewhere between oddly fabulous body builder pose (the way he looks like he's flexing during his SF2 j.LK/j.MK, or his standing block animation), orthodox (a lot of his straight punches, his boxing-like stance, his suplex), and just plain "wat" (his jump animation, his flash kick). It's an interesting and odd collection of movements! I think that there's still plenty of interesting-ness and oddness in his SFV moveset, and I don't really think I can effectively critique their effectiveness as a whole...

... but they are different.





[this message was edited by Spoon on Tue 10 May 06:05]

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"SF5 sales" , posted Mon 9 May 17:17post reply

Capcom discretely updated its million seller list and one can find SF5 in #45 at 1.4 Million sales (retail shipments + downloads for both platforms). You won't be surprised to hear this is below their expectations as they were apparently targeting 2 Millions by April.

Also, I am quite impressed by the performance of MVC2 on PS3/360, which is also right there at 1.4 Millions. I am not sure how little the Dreamcast version sold initially but that must be quite the jump in sales between the original release and its digital re-release. I guess it shows both how the Pringles Curley meme word-of-mouth improved the notoriety of the game, how popular fighting games were again in 2009, and possibly more than anything how big Marvel has become in popular culture.





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GekigangerV
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"Re(1):SF5 sales" , posted Mon 9 May 21:53post reply

quote:
Capcom discretely updated its million seller list and one can find SF5 in #45 at 1.4 Million sales (retail shipments + downloads for both platforms). You won't be surprised to hear this is below their expectations as they were apparently targeting 2 Millions by April.

Also, I am quite impressed by the performance of MVC2 on PS3/360, which is also right there at 1.4 Millions. I am not sure how little the Dreamcast version sold initially but that must be quite the jump in sales between the original release and its digital re-release. I guess it shows both how the Pringles Curley meme word-of-mouth improved the notoriety of the game, how popular fighting games were again in 2009, and possibly more than anything how big Marvel has become in popular culture.



1.4 million is better than I expected at this point in time. I would have thought Capcom would have released a press release when the title passed 1 million sales.

I imagine it crossed 1 million around the time they expected it to cross 2 million and didn't want to have that stuff pointed out.

I see no mention in their earnings report about hurdles in setting up the in-game shop, an addition source of revenue. I have to imagine that everyone getting to try Guile for free REALLY hurt them there. The fan favorite character being open probably tickled the casual player who might get their fill of him now and pass on actually paying for him later.

On their earnings report, I also see that they plan on expanding more into mobile/tablet. I didn't see any mention of Breath of Fire 6 which launched earlier this year.

I also see they are going to try and get more movies made. I think we are on the last Resident Evil movie soon. So unless they are rebooting RE, I cannot see any other property that they could adapt.





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"Re(2):SF5 sales" , posted Mon 9 May 22:17post reply

quote:
1.4 million is better than I expected at this point in time. I would have thought Capcom would have released a press release when the title passed 1 million sales.

I imagine it crossed 1 million around the time they expected it to cross 2 million and didn't want to have that stuff pointed out.


Probably. Still, considering all the bad press it got, the problems with online servers and the controversies involving Laura's alternate outfit, Mika slapping her own buttocks being censored and all, 1.4 million is way more than I expected it would have sold by now (even though it is still quite behind what Capcom estimated the game would have sold by now). Maybe SFV won't die after they release Boxer, Juri, Ibuki and Urien, after all (but it probably won't come close to MKX/MKXL's sales, either).





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"Re(3):SF5 sales" , posted Mon 9 May 22:24post reply

quote:
Probably. Still, considering all the bad press it got, the problems with online servers and the controversies involving Laura's alternate outfit, Mika slapping her own buttocks being censored and all, 1.4 million is way more than I expected it would have sold by now (even though it is still quite behind what Capcom estimated the game would have sold by now). Maybe SFV won't die after they release Boxer, Juri, Ibuki and Urien, after all (but it probably won't come close to MKX/MKXL's sales, either).

Just 400k more sales and it'll reach SFxTK!





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"Re(1):Guile the People: pumped up kicks" , posted Mon 9 May 22:25:post reply

quote:
Spoon on Guile

Spoon, this is really interesting analysis, as usual. We must have a Cafe duel soon, if only so that you can destroy all of us with your mind without moving a finger, like a true master martial artist.

Chaz, great note on sales. In a way, I'm not surprised that such as joyously fun and pretty game like Marvel 2 still sells. I'm always happy to play that goofy thing, and I don't even like superheroes. Put another way, I'm (almost) surprised that Capcom doesn't have the Zero series in constant re-release (who the hell is going to play SFZero Collection with me on PS2?), but I guess there's no point in creating a rival for SFV online. SFIII doesn't count, of course.
quote:
Just 400k more sales and it'll reach SFxTK!
Hahahahahaha





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[this message was edited by Maou on Mon 9 May 22:27]

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"Re(3):SF5 sales" , posted Mon 9 May 22:30post reply

Well, 1.4M is probably not much more than what Capcom shipped day one. It's roughly the same start as SF x Tekken, which got to 1.4M a bit quicker, but accross more platforms (did you remember there was a Vita version of that game?).

The two major differences being that the micro-payment system of SF x Tekken was actually functional, and that SF5 is a game people actually enjoy playing. So it will be interesting to see where it ends. SFxTekken is at 1.8M nowadays.





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"Re(4):SF5 sales" , posted Mon 9 May 23:21post reply

quote:
Just 400k more sales and it'll reach SFxTK!



Not exactly a great achievement, is it?

Still, it's better than not even reaching that, I guess.





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"Re(5):SF5 sales" , posted Mon 9 May 23:50post reply

quote:
Just 400k more sales and it'll reach SFxTK!


Not exactly a great achievement, is it?
Still, it's better than not even reaching that, I guess.

You're right and the game underperformed.
However, the fact SF5 probably cost far less to make than SFxT (massively outsourced, no rights to Bamco, Sony helping out, only 2 platforms instead of 4, much smaller marketing effort, no unnecessary expenses such as FMV for 40+characters...) hopefully makes it largely more profitable.
Jokes about the Vita aside, I was expecting the loss of the X-Box crowd to hurt them far worse than it did.





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"Re(5):SF5 sales" , posted Mon 9 May 23:51post reply

quote:
Just 400k more sales and it'll reach SFxTK!


Not exactly a great achievement, is it?

Still, it's better than not even reaching that, I guess.



Man, it's a bummer that most of my favourite fighting games (Darkstalkers, CvS, SFIII, Rival Schools etc) never broke a million in sales except for Street Fighter Alpha 3. I wonder if any SNK fighting games have ever sold over a million. I guess 2d fighters that weren't part of the SF2 series have always been pretty niche.






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nobinobita
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"SF5 has 8 frames of input lag on PS4" , posted Tue 10 May 00:22:post reply

It's been proven that Street Fighter V has 8 frames of input lag on PS4, the tournament standard:

http://www.eventhubs.com/news/2016/mar/15/street-fighter-5s-input-lag-more-four-times-skullgirls-or-mortal-kombat-x-research-video-battlenonsense-eye-opening/

What do you all think? Now I'm not a competitive player by any means. I don't remember my frame data. I can't play at a high level. But I can tell you that as an animator, 8 frames at 60fps is pretty much the smallest amount of frames in which you can create a smooth action that reads clearly. It's very palpable.

Many are saying that this delay makes it nearly impossible to punish on reaction and neuters the game in many other ways.

For me it explains why SFIV (which also had extreme input lag) and especially SFV feel so gooey and overanimated. From the get go it already feels like you are playing online with lag. I guess this was by design, so that the offline experience isn't that different from the online experience. I wonder if this is going to be a common practice moving forward in other games.


There's some great stuff from Mike Z of Skullgirls fame in the comments section. I'll post a few choice quotes here:

quote:
"It's totally possible to bring input lag down to 3f, yes, as long as the developer is willing to make whatever changes are necessary to do that.
I have been waiting for commentators to get wise to what this much input lag means.
Instead of saying, "Oh, got him too scared to try a punish!"
they should start saying things like
"Since Ken's dash is 15f and his throw is 5f startup, and since average human reaction time is 11f or higher, because of the 8-9f of input lag in SF5 it is humanly impossible to counterpoke or avoid the grab on reaction, rather than anticipation."
or
"Since 11f is at the low end of human reaction time, adding the 8-9f of input lag in this game makes Ken's 22f V-Skill cancel not generally punishable on reaction even by a 3f normal, since 11+8+3 = exactly 22. You have to guess he's going to do it and press the button early."
But you know, those things are much less exciting to say. :^\"


quote:
"Mike_Z said on March 15, 2016 at 4:25 p.m.
Reply @fuffyfaf #52
Removing frames of delay from your game's code is not trivial. It often requires rewriting substantial parts of the engine so that operations happen in a different order, and occasionally requires replacing entire systems. It's unlikely to get fixed."


quote:
"Mike_Z said 5 hours, 39 minutes ago
Reply @Cagar #24
> My biggest fear regarding this is that Capcom seriously balanced the game around having this much input lag. frown emoticon
You can tell they did balance it with that much lag in mind, though.
Ryu's overhead is 20f in SF5, whereas it was 17f in SF4 and 14f in Third Strike. Since it has the same purpose in all those games, as a standing overhead, you know they placed it at the barely-reactable boundary - which is vastly slower in SF5 due to the extra input lag."







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[this message was edited by nobinobita on Tue 10 May 00:41]

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"Re(6):SF5 sales" , posted Tue 10 May 01:03post reply

Thanks to Spoon for the write-up on Guile! It's interesting to see how he was updated while the core of his movements were kept to maintain Guile's on-screen identity.


As for SF5's sales, I agree with everyone that while it may not be as big a turkey as initial numbers suggest it's still a long way from being a success. That 1.4 million is the nicest possible spin on how many copies of SF5 has gone out the door but the fact that Capcom quietly released this information instead of issuing a victory lap press release is telling. Perhaps the reputation of SF5 can eventually be salvaged but having it only do marginally better than the 3DS version of SF4 does not make for a good first impression.





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"Re(6):SF5 sales" , posted Tue 10 May 03:13:post reply

quote:
I wonder if any SNK fighting games have ever sold over a million. I guess 2d fighters that weren't part of the SF2 series have always been pretty niche.


I think the only one who'd have a chance to pass the million sales threshold is KOF'97 OnLine on smartphones because of the Chinese and closeby Asian markets. It's a huge success, right? It might have passed it already, for all I know. Is it still sold at a very cheap price or did they switch the business model to something like free game + subscription for online play?

Otherwise, the biggest mainstream hit for a SNK fighting game is probably KOF'95 which is one of the most produced Neo Geo cartridges for arcades and home, is most almost certainly the best selling Neo Geo CD game (it sold something north of 160k in Japan alone), then sold very well on Saturn (257k) and PS1 (145k) in Japan. On those numbers alone, it's pretty safe to assume it landed around 500k shipments in Japan.

Then take into account it got a worldwide shipment on both PS1 and Saturn which probably included a MG deal, received a GB port (if you are nice enough to accept that one in the mix), and got featured both on Virtual Console and Game Archives. I am not sure how much all that is, but it adds up. I might be undershooting some Takara ports in the SFC era but I am pretty sure none of them came close to KOF95.[*]

On the other hand, just to give you an idea, Capcom Vs. SNK 2 shipped slightly more than 400.000 copies in Japan alone.

[*] Now that I think of it, it's unfair and stupid to single out SFC ports when I combine all versions of KOF95. If you add up all versions of Fatal Fury 2, Fatal Fury Special and Samurai Spirits, there is a good possibility these three games passed a million sales.





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[this message was edited by chazumaru on Tue 10 May 13:01]

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"Re(1):SF5 has 8 frames of input lag on PS4" , posted Tue 10 May 03:16post reply

quote:
It's been proven that Street Fighter V has 8 frames of input lag on PS4, the tournament standard:



Wow, this actually might explain a lot of the problems I felt I was having when I first started playing. Why didn't my move come off? How the hell did he throw me out of that?

Bleh.

I do need to look up how the rage quitter solution is working out so I can decide how much I want to get back into it. I do like the game but I guess it's fair to say SFV hasn't had the ideal scenario.





/ / /

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"Re(1):SF5 has 8 frames of input lag on PS4" , posted Tue 10 May 03:50post reply

Here's a simple explanation for why I think there's so much input latency.

It takes time for prediction and results to happen.

In the offline experience, you are used to a certain amount of delay (here, 8f) before anything happens from a button press. You might not be aware of it consciously, but it's a feeling that gets ingrained. Those 8F are totally not needed in the offline mode, but the purpose of their existence is online.

In the online experience, those 8F are used to cover for the time it takes for the communications of gamestate and inputs to be transmitted and reconciled. If the results arrive before the 8F window ends, no problem: we just stash them and use them later.

So what happens is that the game "feels" the same whether it's online or offline up until the latency and update time exceeds 8F. It doesn't matter whether the button you pressed makes a 10F startup move or a 3F startup move.





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"Re(2):SF5 has 8 frames of input lag on PS4" , posted Tue 10 May 04:44post reply

quote:
Here's a simple explanation for why I think there's so much input latency.

It takes time for prediction and results to happen.

In the offline experience, you are used to a certain amount of delay (here, 8f) before anything happens from a button press. You might not be aware of it consciously, but it's a feeling that gets ingrained. Those 8F are totally not needed in the offline mode, but the purpose of their existence is online.

In the online experience, those 8F are used to cover for the time it takes for the communications of gamestate and inputs to be transmitted and reconciled. If the results arrive before the 8F window ends, no problem: we just stash them and use them later.

So what happens is that the game "feels" the same whether it's online or offline up until the latency and update time exceeds 8F. It doesn't matter whether the button you pressed makes a 10F startup move or a 3F startup move.



That's pretty the theory in play here, eh?

I'm not 100% against the idea of developing a game with consideration for how it will play online. And as you mentioned, in any game it's something you get used to.

I don't think Street Fighter V feels bad, but obviously the amount of latency will impact someone's ability to do something on reaction. I can understand the concerns people have.





/ / /

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"Re(1):SF5 has 8 frames of input lag on PS4" , posted Tue 10 May 06:18:post reply

quote:
hard to punish


It's worth pointing out that in a few cases, there are secondary visual/timing elements that may make moves that should be unpunishable given the 8F delay, punishable.

For instance, the hitstop frames of heavy hits give you time to read and input even when those heavy hits are cancelled into something else.

quote:
balance


Mike Z is mostly right on this one. Keep in mind, even though we have slower overheads (which are mixups that should be reactable to), the poking normals have not been similarly slowed down. Ryu's d.HK is 2F slower on startup compared to SF4, but is 6F (!!!) faster (22F vs. 28F) on recovery, and 3F better (-11F vs. -14F) on block. What this means is that a whiffed d.HK is actually more difficult to punish in SFV than in SF4, even before the 8F delay. That seems like an awfully curious choice if done conscious of the 8F latency.





[this message was edited by Spoon on Tue 10 May 10:05]

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"Re(2):SF5 has 8 frames of input lag on PS4" , posted Tue 10 May 09:09post reply

quote:

It's worth pointing out that in a few cases, there are secondary visual/timing elements that may make moves that should be unpunishable, punishable.

....
What this means is that a whiffed d.HK is actually more difficult to punish in SFV than in SF4. That seems like an awfully curious choice if done conscious of the 8F latency.



So I guess it's punishing whiffs in particular that seems to be the major gripe.

For me, I am tempted to say that it feels strangely tough to counter jump-ins... but Claw does not have the greatest AA options to begin with. Still, I feel like the anti-air claw special (HP ASE) is risky even if the opponent straight up yelled "Okay I'm jumping on the count of three."

I'll also say that throw-techs have felt more difficult for me in 5 than in 4. Just my personal observations of course, I have not run any scientific tests myself regarding this matter.

Game is still fun, but I am kind of disappointed I don't have a stronger urge to play these days. Dealing with rage quitters had really left me with a bad taste in my mouth earlier as well. I'm worried that the new penalties are too light and easily worked around by people who dead set on exploiting the system to raise their rank/get those trophies.





/ / /

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"Re(2):SF5 has 8 frames of input lag on PS4" , posted Tue 10 May 10:27post reply

quote:
It's been proven that Street Fighter V has 8 frames of input lag on PS4, the tournament standard:


Wow, this actually might explain a lot of the problems I felt I was having when I first started playing. Why didn't my move come off? How the hell did he throw me out of that?

Bleh.

I do need to look up how the rage quitter solution is working out so I can decide how much I want to get back into it. I do like the game but I guess it's fair to say SFV hasn't had the ideal scenario.



For some reason, SFV reportedly has more lag when playing with an official PS4 stick rather than a legacy/PS3 stick via game settings. So basically, right now it's better to play with a PS3 stick than to dish out money for a PS4 stick if you're only playing SFV.

That put aside, KOF13 had 5 frames of input lag (4 frames online) which was used as buffer time to see if the player was doing simultaneous inputs. I'm not sure if that's the case with SFV, but given that the game is supposedly catered towards newer players, I wouldn't be surprised.





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"Re(3):MMC fest has 800 frames of input lag" , posted Tue 10 May 10:28:post reply

quote:

Game is still fun, but I am kind of disappointed I don't have a stronger urge to play these days. Dealing with rage quitters had really left me with a bad taste in my mouth earlier as well.

Mosqui-tan, the MMCAFE LAGFEST will never rage-quit on you, I guarantee! Our lag is also well-advertised and transparent~~~

I might host this weekend.

How do people like Guile, impeccable style aside?





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[this message was edited by Maou on Tue 10 May 10:30]

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"Re(7):SF5 sales" , posted Tue 10 May 15:38post reply

quote:

Otherwise, the biggest mainstream hit for a SNK fighting game is probably KOF'95 which is one of the most produced Neo Geo cartridges for arcades and home, is most almost certainly the best selling Neo Geo CD game (it sold something north of 160k in Japan alone)...


I can't remember where I read it from, but in an interview some honcho from SNK Japan said that their peak in popularity was during Garou Densetsu Special. I'd like to see how well that sold in comparison to GD2, and if it managed to sell AES systems as well.

quote:

a GB port (if you are nice enough to accept that one in the mix)



Those GB ports by Gai Brain are sweet. Especially '96.

quote:
8 frames of input lag


I think I'm buying Skullgirls.





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"Re(8):SF5 sales" , posted Tue 10 May 16:28post reply

Yeah, it wouldn't surprise me if Garospe or Samurai Spirits ended up being the best selling game (and managed to reach a million sales worldwide), especially with the SFC and Mega Drive ports that sold like crazy back then. SamSpi GB was also a huge commercial hit as well.

That being said, do you know/remember whether he was referring to revenue (from the arcades) or specifically in terms of copies sold? I could see an old school SNK boss be more interested to show off the revenue generated in arcades rather than the plain number of home conversion copies sold.

(I might be repeating myself here but) I was really surprised recently that a couple of 30-something Japanese colleagues who show zero interest in the current SNK and modern fighting games could mimic all the characters SFX from Garospe on queue (provided they are drunk enough). That game was clearly a big deal back then.

I also wonder how the royalty deal was structured with Takara, Saurus, Sun and anyone who gave a shot at the ports.





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nobinobita
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"Re(9):SF5 sales" , posted Tue 10 May 17:36:post reply

quote:
Yeah, it wouldn't surprise me if Garospe or Samurai Spirits ended up being the best selling game (and managed to reach a million sales worldwide), especially with the SFC and Mega Drive ports that sold like crazy back then. SamSpi GB was also a huge commercial hit as well.

That being said, do you know/remember whether he was referring to revenue (from the arcades) or specifically in terms of copies sold? I could see an old school SNK boss be more interested to show off the revenue generated in arcades rather than the plain number of home conversion copies sold.

(I might be repeating myself here but) I was really surprised recently that a couple of 30-something Japanese colleagues who show zero interest in the current SNK and modern fighting games could mimic all the characters SFX from Garospe on queue (provided they are drunk enough). That game was clearly a big deal back then.

I also wonder how the royalty deal was structured with Takara, Saurus, Sun and anyone who gave a shot at the ports.



That's a good point. Back then arcades were pretty ubiquitous. Even if most gamers didn't own the games at home, they would have had at least a passing familiarity with stuff like Samurai Shodown and Fatal Fury from arcades (which also existed at theaters, pizza huts, bowling alleys, laundramats etc). I guess it's hard to judge a Fighting Game's popularity by console port sales alone.

Also as far as brand recognition goes, millions of people throughout Asia love SNK, but probably primarily know their stuff through bootlegs. SNK was finally able to capitalise on this with King of Fighters 98 Mobile, which was no 1 in China:
http://dreamcancel.com/2015/10/29/the-king-of-fighters-98-ol-launches-at-the-top-in-app-store-rankings/
^This has got to be the most widely distributed (what is the word for this? I can't say "best setlling" since it's f2p) and profitable SNK game ever.

Also apparently the KOF97 Doyou Cup in Shanghai is the most widely spectated fighting game tournament ever, with over half a million views online.

http://dreamcancel.com/2014/12/21/kof-97-douyu-cup-becomes-one-of-the-most-spectated-fighting-game-tournament-in-history-with-500000-peak-viewers/

This is far in excess of any Evo or Capcom cup tournament. Half a million is a far cry from the 32 million people who tuned in for the LoL World Championships, but it's still really impressive and can probably go way up for future events.

If they play their cards right, King of Fighters could possibly go on to be more popular than Street Fighter 2 has ever been. Maybe not as culturally/historically significant as a brand, but definitely with more people playing and watching.

quote:
SamSpi GB was also a huge commercial hit as well.


Oh god I loved that port so much! They did a fantastic job! The game was very playable and the sprite art was awesome! Without those great Takara gameboy ports there might never have been a Pocket Fighter!






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[this message was edited by nobinobita on Tue 10 May 17:42]

HokutoAndy
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"Re(9):SF5 sales" , posted Tue 10 May 17:43post reply

I've heard Weaponlord was the first fighting game designed from the ground up with online play lag in mind, wonder what the input lag of that game is.





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"Re(10):SF5 sales" , posted Tue 10 May 18:28post reply

All this talk about factoring the arcade revenue in SNK's old games remind me how we'll probably never see the full picture of Virtua Fighter or Tekken.





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"Re(9):SF5 sales" , posted Tue 10 May 22:44post reply

quote:

That being said, do you know/remember whether he was referring to revenue (from the arcades) or specifically in terms of copies sold? I could see an old school SNK boss be more interested to show off the revenue generated in arcades rather than the plain number of home conversion copies sold.



I can only remember that they used the word popularity. No mention of numbers IIRC. I also remember they pointed out that this was in 1993.

Speaking of Garospe... Fatal Fury Special World Cup 2016 is coming!





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"Re(10):SF5 sales" , posted Wed 11 May 05:03post reply

quote:
I've heard Weaponlord was the first fighting game designed from the ground up with online play lag in mind, wonder what the input lag of that game is.



Well, that would explain how horrible the controls were on that game. Don't get me wrong, I love Weaponlord, which made me struggle with the controls for a year or two. You would randomly input the commands for a move and wait 3 seconds to see it execute.





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"Re(3):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Rebo" , posted Wed 11 May 18:43post reply

If anyone is up for a lag fest tonight, I'm down for a while.





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"Re(4):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Rebo" , posted Wed 11 May 23:02post reply

quote:
If anyone is up for a lag fest tonight, I'm down for a while.



I will add you





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Ishmael
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"Re(5):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Rebo" , posted Wed 11 May 23:10post reply

I walked through the rain to get to work today when I could have stayed home and gotten whupped by Rugal in SF5.

An odd part of me still wants to see Weaponlord make a comeback. Out of all the games in the world that's the one I want to play?





Just a Person
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"Re(6):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Rebo" , posted Wed 11 May 23:25post reply

quote:
An odd part of me still wants to see Weaponlord make a comeback. Out of all the games in the world that's the one I want to play?



I can't blame you for that; there are some obscure N64 fighting games that I wish could someday be revived (Fighter's Destiny, Mace: The Dark Age, Flying Dragon). With much improved gameplay, of course.





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Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(7):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Rebo" , posted Thu 12 May 00:57:post reply

As for the lagfest, sorry but I'll pass, I got quite an obnoxious headache and I barely played 2 online matches to give my Plus subscription a meaning for today...

Never tried Weaponlord first hand but I saw some gameplay bits recently. It's gorgeous. But I didn't know about these atrocious lag issues...I get that the lag was put there to make online play more feasible, but if Tai-Pan's words are anything to go by, I'll be in for some serious frustration when I try it xD

I tried playing those 2 SFV online matches with my stick set to PS3 mode and inputs just felt less laggy. Could it be coincidence? The game pits me against European players 99% of the time, and I played against a French player in these matches, but I did have the impression inputs came out too late in some past matches. I'll have to play more matches in a row -but maybe a survival run could do the same- to get a better feel of the differences, and I'll update my impressions when I do it.





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[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Thu 12 May 01:13]

Maou
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"SFV part 4: A Rugal Reborn" , posted Thu 12 May 11:36post reply

quote:
I walked through the rain to get to work today when I could have stayed home and gotten whupped by Rugal in SF5.
Shoot, me too! Years later, a common question people will ask, akin to other tragedies: "Do you remember where you were when you failed to battle Rugal online?" Rugal, Red Falcon, is your CFN the same as your PSN ID?

Also, I don't hear much about the next character...maybe after the botched store having to offer Guile for free, they're begging off until it actually makes sense. Other scenario: the store never happens, and we're stuck with only Guile (oh, and Alex) forever.





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LEGENOARYNINLIA
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"Re(6):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Rebo" , posted Thu 12 May 16:10post reply

quote:

An odd part of me still wants to see Weaponlord make a comeback. Out of all the games in the world that's the one I want to play?



I'm quite happy with all the games we already have access to with $$$, but there are two series that I'd love to see making a comeback. Toshinden and Zero Divide. But they wouldn't be the same if the soundtracks weren't up to par with the originals. I can accept making a few errors that end up with unbalanced mechanics, but releasing a game with a shitty soundtrack.. hell naw.





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red falcon
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"Re(1):SFV part 4: A Rugal Reborn" , posted Thu 12 May 17:26:post reply

Yeah, my CFN is Rugalbgood. In fact, since I no longer live in the US, that isn't my PSN ID anymore... www
Side note, does anyone else have this problem? I'm stuck fighting a fucking ocean of bronze and rookier rank players. I get literally one point (to 10 points) for a win, and lose like 180 for a loss. So I'm stuck in gold, I win like 40 matches then lose to a random who is actually not weak and have to work my may back up.





[this message was edited by red falcon on Thu 12 May 17:30]

Just a Person
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"Re(7):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Rebo" , posted Thu 12 May 22:23post reply

quote:

I'm quite happy with all the games we already have access to with $$$, but there are two series that I'd love to see making a comeback. Toshinden and Zero Divide. But they wouldn't be the same if the soundtracks weren't up to par with the originals. I can accept making a few errors that end up with unbalanced mechanics, but releasing a game with a shitty soundtrack.. hell naw.



Ah, Toshinden... good memories. Bad graphics and gameplay in all games (and they surprisingly seemed to get WORSE in each sequel), but the soundtrack was so good and most fighters were so bizarrely interesting that these problems could be forgiven.

Yes, that's a franchise that would be welcome back any day!





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"Re(8):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Rebo" , posted Thu 12 May 23:04post reply

quote:

Yes, that's a franchise that would be welcome back any day!



It didn't get such a warm reception last time...





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Just a Person
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"Re(9):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Rebo" , posted Thu 12 May 23:58post reply

quote:

Yes, that's a franchise that would be welcome back any day!


It didn't get such a warm reception last time...



Sorry, I meant Toshinden is a franchise that would be welcome back BY ME any day... then again, as I said in a previous post, I like many franchises that most players probably hate (Fighters' Destiny, Flying Dragon, Mace: The Dark Age, Power Stone...).





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"Re(9):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Rebo" , posted Fri 13 May 00:28post reply

quote:
It didn't get such a warm reception last time...



Did the Wii title have any relation at all to Battle Arena Toshinden? The only connections that I recall were that both games had the word "Toshinden" in their title and that they shared the same publisher.

Beyond that, they had different styles, different developers, different characters, and different settings. They seemed to be two completely different game series.





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"Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Reb" , posted Fri 13 May 01:26post reply

quote:
Sorry, I meant Toshinden is a franchise that would be welcome back BY ME any day... then again, as I said in a previous post, I like many franchises that most players probably hate (Fighters' Destiny, Flying Dragon, Mace: The Dark Age, Power Stone...).

I agree with the limited appeal of the other names, but I have never met anyone who actively dislikes Power Stone, let alone hate it. At worse it was a mild "ah yeah, that weird game with the crazy levels".
Power Stone is probably my nº1 franchise I'd like Capcom to revisit, before Rockman, Vampire and others, because I'm almost confident they would probably not fuck it up too badly and even eventually have a good chance of making something potentially good out of it perhaps.





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"Re(2):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Stre" , posted Fri 13 May 02:41post reply

The public capitulation that everything about the release of SF5 wasn't a particularly good idea is interesting. This acknowledgment is nice but here's to hoping these obvious lessons are put into practice.

quote:
Power Stone is probably my nº1 franchise I'd like Capcom to revisit, before Rockman, Vampire and others, because I'm almost confident they would probably not fuck it up too badly and even eventually have a good chance of making something potentially good out of it perhaps.


PS would make for a great revival. The first game was a mess but it was a really fun mess so I would be onboard for a sequel if they could that going again.





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"Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Reb" , posted Fri 13 May 11:05post reply

quote:
Did the Wii title have any relation at all to Battle Arena Toshinden? The only connections that I recall were that both games had the word "Toshinden" in their title and that they shared the same publisher.
Beyond that, they had different styles, different developers, different characters, and different settings. They seemed to be two completely different game series.



Well, that's what failed reboots do for you. Not a single character returned but/because every new character was a "spiritual successor". Eiji Shinjō became Tōji Shindō, Sofia became Sylvia, Eris became Lilith etc. I get the idea but, in practice, it made if feel more like the game was a Hong Kong-made copyright-slaloming copy rather than a true heir to the series. They don't even share the same title, since the original series was written 闘神伝 when the reboot was written 闘真伝 (imagine something like "the true Tōshinden starts here"). At least, that part held up to the "stupid pun" tradition of the series. The sad part is that it is Dream Factory's last known game. What a way to go...

I agree with Iggy that Power Stone has kept a stronger reputation than the other titles that Just a Person mentioned. It's probably deserved, but I think the overall popularity and appreciation of Capcom plays a big role in that. The other series, with the exception of Mace The Dark Age, all came from smaller developers. (You do make me wonder whether Warner Bros owns the rights to Mace the Dark Age. I don't know what happened to it after Midway filed for bankruptcy.)





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Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(2):SFV part 4: A Rugal Reborn" , posted Sun 15 May 22:27post reply

quote:
Yeah, my CFN is Rugalbgood. In fact, since I no longer live in the US, that isn't my PSN ID anymore... www
Side note, does anyone else have this problem? I'm stuck fighting a fucking ocean of bronze and rookier rank players. I get literally one point (to 10 points) for a win, and lose like 180 for a loss. So I'm stuck in gold, I win like 40 matches then lose to a random who is actually not weak and have to work my may back up.



Somebody else noticed it at last. Some weeks ago, I ranted about being assigned 2000+ LP opponents most of the time as soon as I got Super Bronze. I know a number shouldn't be considered a reliable indication of a player's skill, but my level is low enough that anyone with more than 1000 LP is guaranteed give me some serious trouble. This happens both in ranked and casual, and it's seriously getting on my nerves.

Seeing how frustrating this issue is for both skilled and unskilled players, I wonder how come it isn't making the headlines in FGC sites...





Ore no...kachi da!!

LEGENOARYNINLIA
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"Re(9):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Street Rebo" , posted Mon 16 May 06:31post reply

quote:

Yes, that's a franchise that would be welcome back any day!


It didn't get such a warm reception last time...



That's because they ditched the great original character designs (or couldn't use them) and didn't have the awesome soundtrack either. The characters can't be replaced, and I'm convinced that they would make for a great game. They deserve one, infact.

Bonus:
Street Fighter V hair in the intro





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"Re(2):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Stre" , posted Mon 16 May 07:53:post reply

quote:
Mace the Dark Age


I remember really liking the arcade game of this back when it was new, and being excited that it got a home console port.

An interesting historical footnote is that it, like a bunch of other games, was released during the first major age of consumer "3D accelerators", a time in which 3dfx was a big and relevant company and Glide was a major API. It's interesting looking back at the games which have a 3dfx splash screen... who could've predicted back then that the Voodoo brand could come and become dominant, then within just a few generations become defunct. Or that in contrast, geforce would be a brand name that would survive for 20 years and still be alive today, in spite of all the technological and market changes that have happened since the late 90s.





[this message was edited by Spoon on Mon 16 May 07:54]

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"Re(3):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Stre" , posted Mon 16 May 19:22post reply

Anyone up for some SFV now until around 10:00 JP time, I'm up for a lag fest.





Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(4):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Stre" , posted Tue 17 May 17:01post reply

quote:
Anyone up for some SFV now until around 10:00 JP time, I'm up for a lag fest.


Hmpf, I hadn't read the Cafe at all until it was too late to get involved.

I wonder what's next now that Capcom has somehow apologized for SFV's incompleteness...I'm afraid they're happy with free trial DLC characters and a couple free costumes. How about fixing matchmaking issues as a part of the May update? They merely promised more frequent matches in the April update, but I really think adjusting the theoretical gap between players is way more important, and to add insult to the injury, match frequency didn't increase at all for me. I live in Italy and have a 31ms ping, and I still have to wait almost 10 minutes to get a match...





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red falcon
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"Re(5):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Stre" , posted Fri 20 May 17:18post reply

quote:

Hmpf, I hadn't read the Cafe at all until it was too late to get involved.



No worries! Anyone up for some lagfest SF tonight? Let's get what we can out of this mess of a SF before we all move on to something more interesting!





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"Re(6):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Stre" , posted Fri 20 May 18:43post reply

quote:
No worries! Anyone up for some lagfest SF tonight? Let's get what we can out of this mess of a SF before we all move on to something more interesting!

Too late for me.... The two-hit-combo Dark Souls 3 => Stellaris K.O.ed my efforts with Laura and let her rot into dust... Continue... without... me...





Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(6):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Stre" , posted Sat 21 May 06:33post reply

...got too absorbed between watching Frionel's KOF14 streams and reading Jojo ^^;

Can't wait to see what ideas Capcom will come up with for Bison's V-System. I really like how this mechanic emphasizes each character's fighting trademarks.





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Just a Person
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"Re(7):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Stre" , posted Sat 21 May 06:46post reply

quote:
...got too absorbed between watching Frionel's KOF14 streams and reading Jojo ^^;

Can't wait to see what ideas Capcom will come up with for Bison's V-System. I really like how this mechanic emphasizes each character's fighting trademarks.



The new chapter from the current part? If so, is it good?





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kofoguz
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"Re(8):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Stre" , posted Sat 21 May 07:18post reply

quote:
...got too absorbed between watching Frionel's KOF14 streams and reading Jojo ^^;

Can't wait to see what ideas Capcom will come up with for Bison's V-System. I really like how this mechanic emphasizes each character's fighting trademarks.


The new chapter from the current part? If so, is it good?

It is good but beware the spoilers. It seems like Araki will (hoppefully ) fix the plot holes.





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"Re(9):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Stre" , posted Sat 21 May 07:31post reply

quote:
It is good but beware the spoilers. It seems like Araki will (hoppefully ) fix the plot holes.



Great news! Thanks!





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"Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4: A Str" , posted Sat 21 May 17:51post reply

Anyone want to play today? It's the WEEKEND woooo





Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(2):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4:" , posted Sat 21 May 17:58:post reply

quote:
Anyone want to play today? It's the WEEKEND woooo


Me :D What time do you plan to open the lounge?
I'm taking the Jojo talk to the Jojo thread.





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Sat 21 May 18:10]

red falcon
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"Re(3):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4:" , posted Sat 21 May 18:49post reply

quote:
Anyone want to play today? It's the WEEKEND woooo

Me :D What time do you plan to open the lounge?
I'm taking the Jojo talk to the Jojo thread.


8;00 JP time. What's your ID?





Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(4):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4:" , posted Sat 21 May 19:18:post reply

quote:

8;00 JP time. What's your ID?


MickyKusanagi, both CFN and PSN.

EDIT: LOL we both decided to leave the lounge at the same time xD Too bad connection was unbearable this time, while it was playable when I had played with you, Ish and Prof. Thank you for the matches and let's hope for a better connection next time ^^

Maybe things will go better when my ISP activates fiber connection in this neighborhood. Lots of fiber workings were done in the past weeks, now I must wait for the bureaucratic stuff to get worked out by my ISP...





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Sat 21 May 20:44]

red falcon
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"Re(5):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4:" , posted Sat 21 May 20:09:post reply

quote:

8;00 JP time. What's your ID?

MickyKusanagi, both CFN and PSN.


wwww, apparently we need an intermediary in the US to come even remotely close to playing.
It's so bad I'm past my usual "annoyed" phase and am just laughing. ww





[this message was edited by red falcon on Sat 21 May 20:24]

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"Re(6):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4:" , posted Sun 22 May 07:20post reply

Okay, I'm going to try to be available at JPN 23:00 on both Sunday and Monday. If someone wants to invite me to a room drop me a line.





Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(7):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4:" , posted Sun 22 May 17:39post reply

quote:
Okay, I'm going to try to be available at JPN 23:00 on both Sunday and Monday. If someone wants to invite me to a room drop me a line.



I'd be happy to host the lounge but my current connection isn't anywhere decent for cross-continent netplay. I'll still give it a shot in case nobody can answer.





Ore no...kachi da!!

Ishmael
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"Re(8):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4:" , posted Sun 22 May 22:28post reply

quote:
Okay, I'm going to try to be available at JPN 23:00 on both Sunday and Monday. If someone wants to invite me to a room drop me a line.


I'd be happy to host the lounge but my current connection isn't anywhere decent for cross-continent netplay. I'll still give it a shot in case nobody can answer.


My schedule is not working out for me on Sunday so I'm not certain I'm going to be able to play after all. Sorry, I suck!





Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(9):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):SFV part 4:" , posted Sun 22 May 22:43:post reply

No need to apologize Ish. I'll still try and open a lounge sometime around 23:00 JST, and I'll keep it open for some minutes. If any of you can play and tells me here in this thread, you're welcome; if you can't, no problem.





Ore no...kachi da!!

[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Sun 22 May 23:28]

Iggy
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"Re(1):SFV part 4: A Street Reborn?" , posted Mon 30 May 12:16:post reply

OK, for all the annoyance, SF5 top 8 at Combo Breaker was a lot of fun, and Ibuki is way better than I imagined.
PLUS, no Bison until July. So many good news!





[this message was edited by Iggy on Mon 30 May 12:17]

Maou
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"Re(2):SFV part 4: An Ibuki Reborn?" , posted Mon 30 May 12:23:post reply

quote:
OK, for all the annoyance, SF5 top 8 at Combo Breaker was a lot of fun, and Ibuki is way better than I imagined.
PLUS, no Bison until July. So many good news!

Marvelous! Get KTallguy in here immediately.

I LOVE that she's in her school uniform shared by Hinata, just as Iggy's grand translation in the other thread highlighted it.

What's even more important is that her ninja theme music is almost certainly the work of our fighting game music lord and savio(u)r, Kobayashi Keiki, long may his post-Soul Calibur reign continue.





人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は...

[this message was edited by Maou on Mon 30 May 18:59]

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"Re(3):SFV part 4: An Ibuki Reborn?" , posted Mon 30 May 22:35:post reply

quote:

What's even more important is that her ninja theme music is almost certainly the work of our fighting game music lord and savio(u)r, Kobayashi Keiki, long may his post-Soul Calibur reign continue.



... ah... I feel like this is my fault for guessing wrong, but the person who did the Kanzuki stage theme was actually neither Kobayashi nor Aoki nor Fukasawa but a relative unknown by the name of Takatsugu Wakabayashi. And thus far this particular stage music is the only track he's credited for on the soundtrack. He's done some tracks for Basara 3 Utage and Rage of Bahamut.

I wouldn't be surprised if he did this track as well, since it doesn't even resemble her SF3 themes at all. No matter who did it though, if it's totally original I only ask that the C part contain the most kickass of shamisen solos, because it really sounds like it's going that way. ninja link for only ninjas





[this message was edited by Gojira on Mon 30 May 22:43]

Maou
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"Re(4):SFV part 4: An Ibuki Reborn?" , posted Mon 30 May 23:48:post reply

quote:
the person who did the Kanzuki stage theme was actually neither Kobayashi nor Aoki nor Fukasawa but a relative unknown by the name of Takatsugu Wakabayashi.

WHAT

See, something useful came of your somewhat disappointing purchase of the SFV soundtrack after all!

I meanwhile am so ashamed at botching both this and Edayan in one day that I should be the one punishing myself with Ehrgeiz. Fortunately, there's no copy around so I'll be listening to Kobayashi's actual work on Ace Combat instead.





人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は...

[this message was edited by Maou on Mon 30 May 23:51]

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"Re(5):SFV part 4: An Ibuki Reborn?" , posted Tue 31 May 02:52post reply

quote:

I meanwhile am so ashamed at botching both this and Edayan in one day that I should be the one punishing myself with Ehrgeiz. Fortunately, there's no copy around
I'd say, it's the perfect day to buy Romancing Sa.Ga 2 on mobile and document your adventure with caption through the best place in our Lord Kawazu's brain.





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"Re(6):SFV part 4: An Ibuki Reborn?" , posted Tue 31 May 05:39post reply

Ibuki is looking neat-o. It's a shame that SF5 is currently nothing more than a spectator sport nowadays since I would like to try her at some point.





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"Re(7):SFV part 4: An Ibuki Reborn?" , posted Tue 31 May 16:45post reply

She looks so fun to play with, wow!! Now, let me ask a silly question: when's the freaking update? After May ends?





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"Re(8):SFV part 4: An Ibuki Reborn?" , posted Tue 31 May 18:26post reply

quote:
She looks so fun to play with, wow!! Now, let me ask a silly question: when's the freaking update? After May ends?

I love that they released a trailer without a date, because that's totally what trailers are for.
Or maybe it's because the answer was...
http://www.capcom.co.jp/game/content/streetfighter/saikyoblog/1233
quote:

In addition, "General Story" is decided to be distributed as a free DLC at the same time as "Ibuki"!


Capcpom plz





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"Re(9):SFV part 4: An Ibuki Reborn?" , posted Tue 31 May 19:27post reply

Uhmmm...I got a really bad feeling about this ^^;
My bad, I almost never visit the official SFV site and blog. Thank you Iggy.





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"Re(10):SFV part 4: An Ibuki Reborn?" , posted Tue 31 May 19:41post reply

quote:
My bad, I almost never visit the official SFV site and blog. Thank you Iggy.

If someone should say "my bad" about the release of Ibuki or anything not working as intended in SF5, it's definitely not you...
Except if...

...
... Are you the guy who did the entire online infrastructure of the game?





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"Re(2):Re(10):SFV part 4: An Ibuki Reborn?" , posted Tue 31 May 21:10post reply

At this stage, I'd just have wished Headless Chicken went all the way and calmly announced Ibuki will arrive on May 42nd, just as planned.

Interesting that her V-kill is neither her peculiar dash nor the kunai stocking (quite literally on her stockings), but that weird charged energy attack you see roughly around 00m25s-00m30s in the trailer.





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"Re(2):Re(10):SFV part 4: An Ibuki Reborn?" , posted Wed 1 Jun 00:24post reply

quote:
My bad, I almost never visit the official SFV site and blog. Thank you Iggy.
If someone should say "my bad" about the release of Ibuki or anything not working as intended in SF5, it's definitely not you...
Except if...

...
... Are you the guy who did the entire online infrastructure of the game?



LOL that has to be the only time I feel relieved not to have developed any information technology expertise. I can't imagine how many people would want me dead if I had any part on SFV's online side xD





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"Re(3):Re(10):SFV part 4: An Ibuki Reborn?" , posted Wed 1 Jun 21:40:post reply

DISCLAIMER: this was intended to be an edit to my previous post. I still mix up "edit" and "reply" in this board. I'm sorry.

*********

This shit of a matchmaking system put me against a rank 10071 player. I'm a144000 good for nothing scrub. I know SFV's netplay component has been shit from the very beginning, but the abyss is just getting deeper and deeper.





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"Re(9):SFV part 4: An Ibuki Reborn?" , posted Wed 1 Jun 23:19:post reply

quote:
Or maybe it's because the answer was...
http://www.capcom.co.jp/game/content/streetfighter/saikyoblog/1233
In addition, "General Story" is decided to be distributed as a free DLC at the same time as "Ibuki"!



There has since been Twitter confirmation that Ibuki won't be released until the end of June.
https://twitter.com/StreetFighter/status/737720093652570112

Looking at Twitter's timestamp, the notice was posted 1 minute before mindnight. Coincidence, or was it a planned choice to delay until literally the last minute of May?





[this message was edited by Baines on Wed 1 Jun 23:21]

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"Re(4):Re(10):SFV part 4: An Ibuki Reborn?" , posted Wed 1 Jun 23:45post reply

So was Ibuki delayed because she's not finished or because the store still isn't finished? Capcom probably doesn't want to have free demos for half their DLC characters.

quote:
This shit of a matchmaking system put me against a rank 10071 player. I'm a144000 good for nothing scrub. I know SFV's netplay component has been shit from the very beginning, but the abyss is just getting deeper and deeper.

Either the abyss is getting deeper or the player pool is getting more shallow. The amount of people playing must be eroding at a steady clip whether it's due to SF5's continuing problems or because there are simply other games out there to play. The last time I fired up the game I was put up against someone who was far above me in rank. That match wasn't much fun for me and I doubt it was a good time for the other player either. Odds are everyone at my skill level was off playing Overwatch. Next time I want to play a fighting game I should play Vampire Savior instead. Vampire Savior is the correct answer to most problems that come along.





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"Fated Retribution: Time Release Reborn?" , posted Thu 2 Jun 00:23post reply

There it was this silly talk about how the Tekken team is going to change how they approach their arcade business model, and apparently at least the 40 characters total that Harada promised for Tekken 7 are going to finally see the daylight instead of suffereing from the producer being too lazy eventually to release them.

By all means, it looks like their new policies.... Are not new policies at all; after all so far they have been keeping most Tekken arcade boards slightly and constantly fidled with for how about 18 months with each release ever since Tekken 6; unless they meant that they are going to go way beyond those 18 months; in that case my condolenses to whoever expected a console version (which Harada already said he was aiming to be the "final" version of the game).
Another interesting bit is that Harada has the habit of "temporarily stop updating" like a month before tournaments, since he doesn't want updates to screw with the player's preparations (this also means a long string of almost half a year no important updates other than clothes to the machines due to the anual tournament schedule of Japan), is he still going to keep it at that?

...... And of course so far everything about Fated Retribution has been a mistake, let's not even mention Gouki's presence, but rather start from not releasing the game like a month after it was announced since it adds nothing significantly new other than 2 characters so far (one of which isn't new).






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"Re(1):Fated Retribution: Toxico Reborn?" , posted Thu 2 Jun 00:45:post reply

Dearest Toxi-chan: while Gouki's presence in Tekken arguably makes Tekken into Street Fighter, I fear that this excellent post will get lost unless it moves from the SFV thread to the general fighting games thread. Then again, it's comforting to know that another venerable fighting game series is being handled just as poorly as SFV!

Or perhaps this subject is an important prelude to the impending release of Tekken X Street Fighter that we are somebody must be waiting for!

HOWEVER

much less helpfully, I seem to recall that the traditional JJJ approach involves a link along the lines of:

DEAR UNDEAD FRED TOXICO YOU ARE OFF-TOPIC





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[this message was edited by Maou on Thu 2 Jun 01:01]

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"Re(10):SFV part 4: An Ibuki Reborn?" , posted Thu 2 Jun 00:50post reply

Baines: ah, I forgot to spend a couple words about the Ibuki delay...Capcom wanna make it look like a miscommunication case, but they had published a defined schedule ages ago, which clearly stated that each month from March to September we were gonna get a new character, except June, the month designated for the infamous cinematic story. Do they really think our memory could get so lacking? Give me a break...

Ishmael: you got a point, and you also reminded me how this situation is depressing for both sides -the unskilled players like me and the good players who can't get a proper challenge-...but Capcom only cares about those who can play at high level AND can attend majors regularly. I remember how the #1 argument against those who criticized the lack of content was "SHUT UP AND PLAY ONLINE"...a valid argument indeed.





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"Re(1):Fated Retribution: Time Release Reborn?" , posted Thu 2 Jun 06:48post reply

Wait, Fated Retribution hasn't been released yet?
But I thought I've seen matches with both Nina and Gouki months ago... Was it the location test?

Since I have little interest in the actual gameplay of Tekken but a lot more into the scenario of Tekken, the addition and their handling of Gouki has been absolutely perfect for me. What has been a mistake about the game (in terms a 17 years old pretty girl like me could understand)?

As for Ibuki's one month delay...





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"Re(2):Fated Retribution: Time Release Reborn?" , posted Thu 2 Jun 08:14post reply

quote:
Wait, Fated Retribution hasn't been released yet?
But I thought I've seen matches with both Nina and Gouki months ago... Was it the location test?

Since I have little interest in the actual gameplay of Tekken but a lot more into the scenario of Tekken, the addition and their handling of Gouki has been absolutely perfect for me. What has been a mistake about the game (in terms a 17 years old pretty girl like me could understand)?



We don't know of FR's actual sins yet (unless you count being a disguise resembling 95% of the previous title); the current problem is that, as you have somehow perceived; Harada keeps aiming at the wrong crew with his publicity and it's showing. He basically disappears for 3 months or so, and then pop ups promoting the game; game which is basically in the same state that it was first unveiled (not even with added stages nor costumes); furthermore he pops up in places that are hoping for a console release (like americans events with their dead and buried arcade scene) and assures them that the arcade release is coming along nicely in the far future once they can finally put aside Pokken's success (and pretty much everyone understands that after arcade release, well have to wait a year or two so for console version). (Let alone that since all showings of the game show absolutely no developing progress at all, community anxiety outside large sites has been obviously noticeable)

Basically, Namco has been more けち with this release's details than what they have been with a brand new entry to the series; and there is no sign in the horizon that the game is even going to be released this year thanks to Pokken's success and upcoming update(?). And as the cherry of the cake they are trying to please the crowd that hasn't touched the game (for about 60% of the target audience) by showing them elements that make them grow more hopelessly miserable instead.


It is as if someone like me is designing their PR moves, and is trying to spread despair as much as possible all across the globe before trying to replace humanity with dolphins.






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"Re(3):Fated Retribution: Time Release Reborn?" , posted Thu 2 Jun 14:15:post reply

quote:
Wait, Fated Retribution hasn't been released yet?
But I thought I've seen matches with both Nina and Gouki months ago... Was it the location test?

Since I have little interest in the actual gameplay of Tekken but a lot more into the scenario of Tekken, the addition and their handling of Gouki has been absolutely perfect for me. What has been a mistake about the game (in terms a 17 years old pretty girl like me could understand)?


We don't know of FR's actual sins yet (unless you count being a disguise resembling 95% of the previous title); the current problem is that, as you have somehow perceived; Harada keeps aiming at the wrong crew with his publicity and it's showing. He basically disappears for 3 months or so, and then pop ups promoting the game; game which is basically in the same state that it was first unveiled (not even with added stages nor costumes); furthermore he pops up in places that are hoping for a console release (like americans events with their dead and buried arcade scene) and assures them that the arcade release is coming along nicely in the far future once they can finally put aside Pokken's success (and pretty much everyone understands that after arcade release, well have to wait a year or two so for console version). (Let alone that since all showings of the game show absolutely no developing progress at all, community anxiety outside large sites has been obviously noticeable)

-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --


Are we looking at another Fighting Games crash? SFIV came out 8 years ago. There seemed to be a big resurgence for Fighting Games following it. Feels like things are really cooling down now though if people are tepid on the latest Street Fighter and Tekken.

Side note: More time has passed between the release of SFIV (2008) and SFV (2016) than SF2 vanilla (1991) and SFIII: New Generation (1997). Crazy huh?






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[this message was edited by nobinobita on Thu 2 Jun 14:18]

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"Re(4):Fated Retribution: Time Release Reborn?" , posted Fri 3 Jun 01:38post reply

Speaking of a fighting game "crash" is kind of strange when in terms of a fighting game "revival" it was really just a few big things:

- SF4
- MvC3 (possibly greenlighted by the success of SF4)
- introduction of esports/mainstream streaming awareness

It's not as though SF4 prompted a huge influx of higher budget fighting games. SF4 was VERY popular, historically so, but that didn't mean that it led to a surge in all other fighting games. Capcom made two very successful new entries in longstanding fighting game franchises that had been absent of new releases for a looooong time, and players jumped on them. MvC3 stopped getting updated and got dominated by really good players and is now in its twilight. SF4 has been supplanted by SF5, but people are either dissatisfied with the release state of SF5 or no longer feel starved for fighting games after a near-decade of SF4, and haven't turned out.

People have been putting fighting game videos on youtube for literally more than a decade now, but the higher visibility and greater live spectating power brought on by marketing campaigns with an actual budget, social media, and streaming services like twitch brought in a lot of new viewership and a lot of new players willing to show up to events.

Guilty Gear Xrd is one of the best new fighting games to come out in the world post-SF4-vanilla, but it sure didn't light up the sales charts. It had a strong presence at Evo, but I have no idea if that was powered by new players, or just lots of old players who now have the wherewithal years later to actually show up to Evo. Tekken, the other largest fighting game franchise in the world not named Smash, still hasn't released T7 on consoles (wtf?).

So is it a fighting game crash, or just an SF crash (no pun to the delightful Korean tournament intended)?

Smash is still going strong, and its hardcore scene is stronger than it's ever been. But its success and SF's success has largely been orthogonal. Consider that Super Smash Bros. N64 was released in 1999!





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"Re(5):Fated Retribution: Time Release Reborn?" , posted Fri 3 Jun 03:18post reply

Let's not forget that Capcom blew up all the good will they had gathered with SF4 and MvC3 (UMvC3 notwithstanding) with the atrocious SFxT.

I keep reading that the 2013 patch of SFxT improved a lot of things in the game, but it was too little, too late.

The Tekken situation is strange. I understand why one would complain about 7FR (thanks Toxico!) but then, Pokken was also announced so early before the game actually came out that people almost forgot it (and then, it was only the botchered arcade release). So maybe that's how the marketing team of Harada prefers to work now?
I really wonder how much of Pokken's success was expected, and whether the numbers were so big they actually shifted workforce around between that team and T7's. One thing is certain, we're not going to see a new Soulcalibur anytime soon...

The day where Smash and Pokken have replaced SF and Tekken as FGC's core is looming.





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"Re(6):Fated Retribution: Time Release Reborn?" , posted Fri 3 Jun 03:51post reply

Two thoughts:

1. Tekken 7's path to glory makes no sense. The North American tournament for a game that has no discernable release date is incredible. I may never get to play the game but judging from Namco's PR I guess I'm supposed to be excited that some player in a Tokyo arcade can put an ugly t-shirt on Akuma.

2. Why is everyone talking about a fighting game "crash" when Mortal Kombat destroyed the sales charts last year? There will never be a slump in fighting games as long as the duel kings of Nintendo and NetherRealm are around.





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"Re(7):Fated Retribution: Time Release Reborn?" , posted Fri 3 Jun 05:31post reply

quote:

2. Why is everyone talking about a fighting game "crash" when Mortal Kombat destroyed the sales charts last year? There will never be a slump in fighting games as long as the duel kings of Nintendo and NetherRealm are around.



This is also true!

There's certainly a disproportional focus on how the fortunes of a genre are spinning when the focus is entirely on one of game (admittedly most storied and historically important) of that genre.

I think overall this begs the question: by what metric(s) can the health of a genre be ascertained? Good ones include total sales and change in sales over time, number of titles released and change in that over time, number of active players (for multiplayer games).... if there's a general upward trend, then you can certainly say "it's healthy!", but I wonder about more enlightening realizations that could be drawn. In market research thinking, sometimes poor numbers in those could represent an under-served market (e.g. "nobody has been making high-production value fighting games in the past few years and it's not like a whole lot of people are playing 3SO online") but they could also represent an exhausted market (e.g. "nobody is making or buying music games that have unique peripherals").





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"Re(8):Fated Retribution: Time Release Reborn?" , posted Fri 3 Jun 17:05post reply

So to get back on the topic of Delay Fighter V, I've recently been suspicious that Capcom has always had poor communication internally (which in turn causes poor outward communication) but I did not think more evidence of this would come so quickly.

Some new drama arose today with the differences between the Capcom Unity apology and the Saikyo Blog version of the apology, which is a little different and points to some things Capcom USA did with the roadmap. At least it seems like that's what the blog is saying to me, but my reading isn't perfect. Can someone else confirm?





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"Re(9):Fated Retribution: Time Release Reborn?" , posted Fri 3 Jun 18:50post reply

quote:
which is a little different and points to some things Capcom USA did with the roadmap. At least it seems like that's what the blog is saying to me, but my reading isn't perfect. Can someone else confirm?

I confirm, Japan being Japan.
As a friend was saying, "this is not the Capcom vs Capcom people were hoping for".





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"Re(7):Fated Retribution: Time Release Reborn?" , posted Fri 3 Jun 19:17post reply

quote:
Two thoughts:

1. Tekken 7's path to glory makes no sense. The North American tournament for a game that has no discernable release date is incredible. I may never get to play the game but judging from Namco's PR I guess I'm supposed to be excited that some player in a Tokyo arcade can put an ugly t-shirt on Akuma.

2. Why is everyone talking about a fighting game "crash" when Mortal Kombat destroyed the sales charts last year? There will never be a slump in fighting games as long as the duel kings of Nintendo and NetherRealm are around.



Shoot you are right! Just the other day HokutoAndy was pointing out to me that Nintendo now has more games at Evo than any other company (Smash Wii U, Smash Melee, Pokken). And Mortal Kombat is doing better than ever it seems. What a sea change!






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"Re(8):Fated Retribution: Time Release Reborn?" , posted Fri 3 Jun 20:55post reply

quote:

Shoot you are right! Just the other day HokutoAndy was pointing out to me that Nintendo now has more games at Evo than any other company (Smash Wii U, Smash Melee, Pokken). And Mortal Kombat is doing better than ever it seems. What a sea change!



But, that's cheating!
They have 2 games that are one the sequel to the other





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"Re(9):SFV: Time Non-Release Reborn?" , posted Fri 3 Jun 23:52post reply

The dueling blog posts from Capcom are something else. There is so much he said/she said going on that I don't think anyone has a clear picture of the situation, including the people who work at Capcom. All I know is that several years from now this is going to make from some incredible interview anecdotes on the CFN portal.

quote:
But, that's cheating!
They have 2 games that are one the sequel to the other


The only certainty in fighting games is that Melee will be around until all the players die of old age.





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"Capcom vs. Capcom: Millennium Fight" , posted Sat 4 Jun 00:09post reply

quote:
I confirm, Japan being Japan.
As a friend was saying, "this is not the Capcom vs Capcom people were hoping for".

Ahahahahaohmygod I have not seen that vicious an intra-organizational undercutting (at least in public) in all the bureaucracies I've worked at.

"It appears that the source of the information [on the roadmap] is the Capcom USA community site Capcom-Unity."

"On the Japan side, we concluded that we should not announce any information that we could not guarantee 100% or inflate any expectations."

FISTS WILL FLY AT THIS LOCATION

"this location" being the annual company retreat

Indeed, the interviews about all this later will be incredible. I'd love to add the reportedly widely disliked Capcom Europe to the mix to see what's going on there.





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"Re(10):SFV: Time Non-Release Reborn?" , posted Sat 4 Jun 02:37post reply

quote:

The only certainty in fighting games is that Melee will be around until all the players die of old age.



I remember a joke 10+ years ago was that ST was a game that only 30-something fogeys played.

I like that there can be so many people who so love a game and its nuances that they will turn up in hundreds or thousands to support it even, long after its successors have been released, long after its platform has become obsolete in multiple dimensions (CRT TVs are needed for optimal Melee play! The preferred Wavebird controller has been out of production for like a decade!), to the extent that the recent influx of esports into fighting games sponsors players for it!

I'd have to look it up, but are any players sponsored for playing an older, not-actively-updated game than Melee? There are plenty of fighting game players that have played and will play older fighting games, but their active sponsorship is based on performance in a more recent game (see: a whole bunch of the SF5 pro players).





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"Re(2):Re(10):SFV: Time Non-Release Reborn?" , posted Mon 6 Jun 01:04post reply

One of my favorite video game franchises ever getting treated so bad by its own developer...sadness.





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"Re(1):Capcom vs. Capcom: Millennium Fight" , posted Wed 8 Jun 03:00:post reply

The sad thing is that internally, Capcom often works against itself. I've heard rumors of people sabotaging one another. So it doesn't surprise me that the development schedule is borked.

There are plenty of existing games that do what Capcom is trying to do with SFV. Logistically there are different challenges, but there is proof that these models work. If they're to succeed, the entire company has to be behind it.

Releasing the game without an active storefront means they're losing money every day that it's on the market. Several months after the game's release, it's hard enough to get those people who skipped the game to buy it, but it's also hard to get people who've bought the game and tired of it to log back in and engage with the store. Without all of those wheels in motion, you lose engagement and people move on.

The efforts towards building a competitive scene can't carry a large enough fanbase (right now), because the rest of the market isn't engaged in the core product.

Once Capcom gets all their monetization stuff in place, they pretty much have no choice but to release the game for free, or risk not even being a blip on the radar. That means they'll have to gift the folks who spent $60 lots of things. Even then, many people will have already started playing the next big game.

So yeah, it's unfortunate that they didn't have their ducks in a row. They sacrificed that for EVO, but a part of me thinks that was a poor choice, even though I understand the rational.

On a lighter note, Ibuki looks fun :)





Play to win... or to have fun too! :)

[this message was edited by KTallguy on Wed 8 Jun 03:03]

Baines
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"Re(2):Capcom vs. Capcom: Millennium Fight" , posted Wed 8 Jun 08:49post reply

quote:
That means they'll have to gift the folks who spent $60 lots of things.


There are already people starting to get angry over buying the Season Pass. Season Pass owners paid extra to get content that Capcom has let everyone access for free anyway.

Sure, that is only temporary access for those that don't own the Pass, but "temporary" has turned into a rather long time and there is no sight of it ending anytime soon. And people are already giving up on SF5.





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"Re(2):Capcom vs. Capcom: Millennium Fight" , posted Wed 8 Jun 19:36post reply

quote:
If they're to succeed, the entire company has to be behind it.
This quote in particular reminded me of old rumors about the Bio Hazard team being hard to work with when adding their characters to a crossover, and the DMC flat out refusing (I guess that was a case of Kamiya being Kamiya). Similarly, some people were amazed the Basara team managed to get some MonHan-themed DLC in Sumeragi, as the MH team is apparently overtly protective.

If Nintendo manages to includes Pokémon characters in their games even though they have to work with the famously rigid TPC, there is no reason it would be so difficult to have people from the same company work together. Makes you wonder how toxic the atmosphere at Capcom has been for all these years, when all we saw were these pretty art books.





Micky Kusanagi
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"Re(3):Capcom vs. Capcom: Millennium Fight" , posted Thu 9 Jun 16:03:post reply

Wait a minute...this Ibuki update mess is happening just a couple weeks after Capcom announced in their financial report they would strengthen the update strategy for certain titles including SFV. How ironic.





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[this message was edited by Micky Kusanagi on Thu 9 Jun 16:05]

chazumaru
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"Capcom vs. Zenny" , posted Fri 10 Jun 00:36post reply

I am not sure many of us had the Japanese Limited Edition with the free Zenny, which as far as I've been told was the only way to get Zenny until know, but anyway, the whole thing is moot now.

quote:
We have an important announcement regarding the in-game currency system. We will no longer be introducing Zenny to Street Fighter V as a real money currency option. After extensive testing and development, we came to the conclusion that it was not necessary in order to carry out our original vision for the product. Instead, we will be utilizing the PlayStation Store and Steam stores to carry out real money transactions.


Pretty much the only thing I had done so far with SF5 was entering those damn codes...





Même Narumi est épatée !

Iggy
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"Re(1):Capcom vs. Zenny" , posted Fri 10 Jun 00:43post reply

Soooooooo.... Basically, back to the same system as SF4, with everything being a DLC bought through the store?

Now I think of it, what was the theoretical advantage of the Zenny system, since it was a separate currency from the fight money anyway?
Or was it not?
I am confused.





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"Re(2):Capcom vs. Zenny" , posted Fri 10 Jun 01:04post reply

I am... Not sure... I'll guess we'll never have to find out.

Urien will have a Kazuma Kiryū cosplay in SF5. I guess his story mode will explain how he lost all his clothes.





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"Re(3):Capcom vs. Zenny" , posted Fri 10 Jun 01:13post reply

quote:
I am... Not sure... I'll guess we'll never have to find out.

Urien will have a Kazuma Kiryū cosplay in SF5. I guess his story mode will explain how he lost all his clothes.



What if his fight intro animation just plays the 3S fight intro backwards

he walks in with just the banana hammock, does a pose, and a perfectly fitted suit unshreds itself onto his body





Iggy
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"Re(3):Capcom vs. Zenny" , posted Fri 10 Jun 01:19:post reply

quote:
Urien will have a Kazuma Kiryū cosplay in SF5. I guess his story mode will explain how he lost all his clothes.

I'm not sure how I like this design for Urien, but I love this design as a fighting game character.
It's like.... Yashiro and the rock-star prosecutor from GS4 fusioned? Me like.

This boxer, however is... hum...

Apparently, the 6 characters will be playable in the story mode (with a warning "this character is not final").
They will also expand some stages to have lateral expansions, like the Chinese street one (good to know they can still finish the game with time).

quote:
Daily Challenges are currently being re-tooled and optimized for the game, and we will share the new timing of this feature as soon as we more details. The feature will now be called “Targets,” and they will still be daily goals for players to complete and generate Fight Money, which can be used to purchase in-game content like new characters and costumes. New single player modes including Extra Battle and Versus CPU are also in the works. We’ll share more details on these modes and features as soon as we can.


Edit: OK, I am sold. The scenario mode is MARVELOUS.





[this message was edited by Iggy on Fri 10 Jun 01:25]

Ishmael
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"Re(4):Capcom vs. Zenny" , posted Fri 10 Jun 01:42post reply

Quick thoughts:

Like everyone else here I never really understood the Zenny system. Apparently everyone at Capcom finally realized there was no advantage to it either.

What is the deal with Bengus nowadays? From having a Golliwog character up front and center to deciding that lens flare is where it's at his art on this game has been uneven to say the least.

The story mode looks like it's going for that Justice Gakuen storytelling device of having two characters walk up to each other and yelling "Hey, let's fight!" Still, I really, really hope that both opponents can be fought in that opening with Nash.





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"Re(4):Capcom vs. Zenny"