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| Professor 3990th Post
  
MMCafe Owner
     
|  "Ultra Guilty King of Fighting Game Thread V" , posted Mon 3 Feb 21:44:  
New Thread!
Starting off with Guilty Gear Xrd.
Previous trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQ9Cd4MKqHs
The game is loketesting for about a week starting today in Japan. I don't think overseas arcades can get it unless they can somehow connect to the Sega Aime networking system. Anyway here's my first impression.
No filming was allowed. I wonder how long that'll last during this test.
1. In this new beta build, the game is completely playable up to the end. All the Instant Kills are there as well as the cinematics, last boss, and ending. Basically, we're already seeing the final product. In fact, it could even be switched to other games on the Sega Aime cabinet (DOA5, Undernight Inbirth, etc).
2.The Aime IC card is already usable though I haven't checked yet if there's a login page for the beta testing. By default, 6 colors are usable. Unfortunately No Maetel color for Millia.
The movie and cut scenes still seem to still run in 30fps. I thought this was a mid-development thing but I guess not.
3. I swear that some of the graphics have not only been polished up, it's also been changed to keep consistancy. For example, Millia in her loss screen doesn't have as much of a cute/comical expression as before.
4. I didn't notice if this was implemented before, but the developers put effort in the win/loss screen's background too, like for example the crew on May's ship are looking unhappy when she's lost.
5. Each character has an introduction scene and a mid-boss battle in the 6th stage (there's 8-9 stages total). There's also a cutscene after the 3rd stage where the Genrouin(Senato) are talking to each other, but that's pretty much the same for characters.
6. The Instant kills are nice! Remember how Arcsys had different Afro graphics for each character with Dr.Baghead's Instant Kill? A lot of the Instant Kills in Xrd seem to have similar details. Here's the few that I played-
- Dr.Baghead: Opponent is on surgery table while an orchestra of Dr.Bagheads plays music in his background. He takes out a scalpel and starts working on the opponent and you can see fear in their faces. When the surgury is done you see the opponent with a complete facelift, looking like a Golgo13 or some character from The Rose of Versailles. On a side note, if you do it to Potemkin, his mask is off during the whole Instant Kill sequence and you can see his good ol' face. So yes, the rendering is already in the game.
- Millia: Completely domes the opponent with hair needles and shoots at them from all directions. You can see the opponent completely clueless to what to do because it's basically like a larger, nastier, Gilgamesh's Gate of Babylon. Similarly to Dr.Baghead's instant kill, each character has a different expression on their face (Slayer looks calm, May looks like she'll cry, etc).
- Bedman: Scene turns into a movie theater, Bedman takes a seat and says "ok, let's see your darkest memories". The opponent is seen in the big screen (black and white), shouting out a line as a bunch of eyes appear in the sky and evidently kills him. The line is different for each character:
Zato: "If I didn't pick that child up back then... oh well."
Ky: "That can't be true! Why.."
Chip: "All I needed was one more vote!"
- Ino: hits the opponent and goes into a cinematic where she does her boss version super from the previous games (complete with the "X" icons).
On a side note, there seems to be huge differences on the ease of using the instant kills. Bedman takes a LONG time to prepare going into instant kill mode, whereas it's a lot shorter for other characters. Some of the characters definitely have invincibility on their instant-kill attack, not sure if it's universal.
7. Almost forgot! There's obviously no cloth damage in the game but there's something similar to it-- Ky's ponytail loosens off and he goes long-haired after fighting for a while. I think it happens when he gets hit by a strong move.
Spoilers below
- The story for Xrd focuses on two related incidents caused by the Genrouin(Senato). They're the guys wearing the metallic masks in the trailer.
1. Zato-1's ressurection. It seems that Zato-1's whole incident (not sure if that's about his death or ressurection) was an experiment related to--
2. The appearance of Ramletherl Valentine (the girl in the trailer) and the Senato's decision to "team up" with her so that the future of the world will go as they have planned.
2. Ino talks about killing Ramletherl a number of times before, but nothing's changed, and this time it might be diffrerent because "the Man" is involved. She later also talks about how "this Sol is another disappointment". Are we seeing another looping world like Blazblue or some story gimmick similar to that?
3. And obviously, the main last boss in the game is Ramletherl. She looks like a loli in the trailer but that's only because of the camera angle and her dress. In the actual game, she wears a white hot pants and she has a pretty womanly physique comparable to BBCP's Bullet. Carries a pair of huge floating swords on her back and also has a pair of black and white bats that look like Rachael's pets from Blazblue.
- Bedman is a bad boy. He's sort of like a sweeper/hitman who takes care of potential problems for the Genrouin(Senato). Ino talks about how she's "never met him in previous instances".
- Dr.Baghead finally gets a lead from a mail by Slayer that his tragic surgery incident may have been plotted by the Genrouin(Senato). That's his intro in a nutshell.
- Slayer is easedropping on the Genrouin(Senato), but his informant gets killed by Bedman who tells him that he was just pretending that he didn't notice him spying so that he'll leak information.
[this message was edited by Professor on Wed 5 Feb 20:44] |
| Replies: |
| Maese 731th Post
Red Carpet Regular Member+
   
    
    
| "Re(2):Ultra Guilty King of Fighting Game Thre" , posted Tue 4 Feb 14:33:
quote:
Guilty Gear Xrd loketest
Never was a big fan of GG, but Professor's report piqued my curiosity and today I just went to have a look by myself at lunch time nonetheless. I can't comment much on the gameplay but, boy, those visuals sure are GORGEOUS. The animated cutscenes are particularly nice, it's a pity most players seemed too eager to skip them to begin with the actual match. Character roster seems too short, tough. Even a profane such as me sorely missed some familiar faces. The old ones, on the other hand, looked prettier and shinier for sure, but pretty much the same as always.
What surprised me most, however, was seeing a hefty number of female players around, and they were pretty capable players for what I could ascertain. I'd never imagined that GG would have any kind of following among female demographics, but Japan and her people never cease to amaze me, huh.
quote:
Street Fighter 2 the legend
That link made for an incredibly amusing (and insightful!) read to kill time at the office on this rainy, gray Tuesday morning. Thanks for posting! I wish I'd ever be able to witness a job interview such as Akiman's with Okamoto. I guess it's true that Osaka's ways are waaaaay different than Tokyo's, or the rest of the country for what's worth.
[this message was edited by Maese on Tue 4 Feb 14:35] |
| Ishmael 4813th Post
PSN: Ishmael26b
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Wii: n/a
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
    
     
 
| "Re(3):Ultra Guilty King of Fighting Game Thre" , posted Wed 5 Feb 03:57
Man, there was a lot of good reading in this thread. Thanks everyone!
quote:
Street Fighter 2 the legend
From the picture of Guile's handcuffs to the Akiman stories, that was a great read.
Chun-Li has big thighs, right? So back in the day, I asked Mr. Yasuda, "Why does she have such big thighs?" And he started shouting and went off and was like, "I can't believe you don't understand the appeal." And he started explaining the attraction.
Some designers ape trends and create characters that are momentarily in fashion but don't have that spark. Akiman, however, stares directly into the void without blinking.
Speaking of game designs that are willing to go there and do that...
quote:
What surprised me most, however, was seeing a hefty number of female players around, and they were pretty capable players for what I could ascertain. I'd never imagined that GG would have any kind of following among female demographics, but Japan and her people never cease to amaze me, huh.
I don't know if GG is intentionally courting that market or if female fans found something in there that they liked but it doesn't surprise me that it has a strong cross-gender appeal. Considering that one of the game covers featured Sol tied up in chains with Ky's head snuggled up in his crotch it's a game that's never been subtle about letting its true feelings be known. When Bridget gets released as DLC I'm certain he will sell like hot pants. Hot cakes. Whatever.
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| Nekros 586th Post
New Red Carpet Member
| "Re(1):Ultra Guilty King of Fighting Game Thre" , posted Thu 6 Feb 03:13
quote:
Guilty Gear loctest
Yo Cafers, nice to see you again (have to arrange my life recently, new degree, new work, new studies...).I keep reading the board but don't have much time to post, but it's always a pleasant read with you love and knowledge (I'm serious, it's great).
So about GG Xrd I have a bunch of questions for the Prof (or anyone who played the recent build).
The cutscenes are 30 fps but the game runs solid 60 fps, right? I mean the actual fight is 60 frames but doesn't cut to 30 during the special moves animations?
What about the music? Any glimpse of the tracks?
Is this game linked to the pachislot in some way? Is it a new episode or a reboot (didn't read the spoilers)?
The general feel of the game is like playing GG or something else? Does 3D graphics any damage to the core gameplay and the comboing system (frames, collisions, etc.)?
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| Professor 3991th Post
MMCafe Owner
| "Re(2):Ultra Guilty King of Fighting Game Thre" , posted Thu 6 Feb 11:26:
quote:
Guilty Gear loctest
Yo Cafers, nice to see you again (have to arrange my life recently, new degree, new work, new studies...).I keep reading the board but don't have much time to post, but it's always a pleasant read with you love and knowledge (I'm serious, it's great).
So about GG Xrd I have a bunch of questions for the Prof (or anyone who played the recent build).
The cutscenes are 30 fps but the game runs solid 60 fps, right? I mean the actual fight is 60 frames but doesn't cut to 30 during the special moves animations?
What about the music? Any glimpse of the tracks?
Is this game linked to the pachislot in some way? Is it a new episode or a reboot (didn't read the spoilers)?
The general feel of the game is like playing GG or something else? Does 3D graphics any damage to the core gameplay and the comboing system (frames, collisions, etc.)?
The game runs on solid 60fps for sure. It's only the zoom-in sequences and cutscenes that feel choppy. As Nobi said, it might actually even be lower than 30fps. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if it was like 15fps. While I'd normally agree that lower framerates can bring a nostalgic feel, when you actually play this game, it stands out in a pretty bad way-- it's simply not seamless and brings down the gameplay experience.
I think the game adopts some of the world view from the Pachislot, though I can't be sure because I haven't tried the latter. It's a continuation of the series and not a reboot.
The general feel of Guilty Gear Xrd is sort of like playing with Guilty Gear characters using the game engine of the first Blazblue release (Calamity Trigger). That's to say, the game features state-of-the-art 2D graphics for its time, but it plays pretty slow and it feels relatively bare-bone. I'm pretty sure that we'll be seeing a sequel to this somewhere next year. That said, the 3D elements in the graphics has no side effects to gameplay and it feels like a normal 2D fighting game.
I unfortunately couldn't hear the tracks! I don't recall if they were remakes or new.
[this message was edited by Professor on Thu 6 Feb 11:41] |
| Gojira 3019th Post
PSN: Gojira_X
XBL: Gojiraaa
Wii: n/a
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(2):Oh no! What will happen to Killer Insti" , posted Fri 7 Feb 21:20
Man, the KI. I initally had very little interest in KI after seeing what it had turned into, but hearing how smoothly it played and how surprisingly balanced it was I had some passing interest in trying it at the end of season 1, when the game could be called properly finished. So, this news has been pretty frustrating.
To try and make sense of it, I pieced together the events of the past few months to come up with what I think happened (this is all just a guess, so nobody quote me on this):
November/ December 2013: Microsoft issues an ultimatum to DH that if they don't meet a certain quota or milestone that Microsoft will take over development of the game themselves because it has been consistently going behind schedule and over-budget.
December 2013/ January 2014: DH fails to meet that quota or deadline, putting quality of the game over speed of development. Somehow the Spinal patch gets released, albeit with bugs and issues. Under this pressure they may not have had time to test it. Microsoft makes good on their promise, cuts ties and tells DH to pack up their stuff and send their unfinished work and assets for season 1 to MS. DH, now without the direct support of Microsoft, has to put themselves up for sale or they lose a ton of money and have to fire half their staff. Luckily they probably already had a list of potential buyers. Amazon Games agrees to buy them out for X dollars with some unknown agreement that leaves DH staff with jobs intact and a reasonable source of funding.
February 2014: Info becomes public, players panic. Here we are.
Ishmael's observation also has me thinking that maybe Microsoft was always looking to have more control over KI, because that's really been the only runaway success of their big Xbone launch, eclipsing even their great white Call of Duty hope and its innovative next-generation dog soldier warrior class. If the development of KI was proceeding too slowly for them, with their system's popularity on the line against DH's not-great reputation it makes sense that they would want to take the reins. So it's possible that they bullied DH out of the picture so they could more closely control things.
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| Maou 2597th Post
PSN: zonepharaoh
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Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(1):MMCafe Fighting Game session #1" , posted Fri 14 Feb 11:30:
quote:
OK, the first session will be for SF4AE!
The time will be as follows for each country-
April 14 (Fri) 7PM PST (LA, Portland, etc)
April 14 (Fri) 10PM EST (NY, etc)
April 14 (Fri) Midnight Chile
April 15 (Sat) 4AM Paris
April 15 (Sat) 7AM GST (UAE, UK, etc)
April 15 (Sat) noon JST (Japan)
Write a quick hollar below if you're interested in joining.
Terrible Third Strike announcer sez: Yeah! I've been waiting for this! Hope to be able to join you all, though not positive. Prof, I'm thinking you mean February as opposed to April, ya?
人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は．．．
[this message was edited by Maou on Fri 14 Feb 11:30] |
| Professor 3996th Post
MMCafe Owner
| "Re(2):MMCafe Fighting Game session #1" , posted Fri 14 Feb 15:58:
quote:
OK, the first session will be for SF4AE!
The time will be as follows for each country-
April 14 (Fri) 7PM PST (LA, Portland, etc)
April 14 (Fri) 10PM EST (NY, etc)
April 14 (Fri) Midnight Chile
April 15 (Sat) 4AM Paris
April 15 (Sat) 7AM GST (UAE, UK, etc)
April 15 (Sat) noon JST (Japan)
Write a quick hollar below if you're interested in joining.
Terrible Third Strike announcer sez: Yeah! I've been waiting for this! Hope to be able to join you all, though not positive. Prof, I'm thinking you mean February as opposed to April, ya?
Oops February-- thanks, fixed it! It'll be pretty casual so just hop on if you're up to it!
Little Mac fits perfectly in Smash Bros! I wish a Cing character would eventually make their way in... I'm assuming that Nintendo who owns the rights to the characters.
On a completely different note, with the JAEPO amusement expo happening, I was checking up on some Nesica titles and realized that Dimps wiped out all their web site pages for "The Rumble Fish" series. I can only assume that whatever future plans they had for the franchise back when they ported RumbleFish2 has been canned.
[this message was edited by Professor on Fri 14 Feb 18:22] |
| Pollyanna 3613th Post
PSN: Lilly_Dopamine
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Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(9):MMCafe Fighting Game session #1" , posted Wed 19 Feb 22:17
A little late to the party (thanks for posting videos), but Valentine has got some seriously sexy polygon legs. And those hips! Also, mouth cape. She looks pretty much like a normal character, so I'm sure she'll be unlocked eventually. Even if she and Bedman are the only two new characters, they might become my new favorites.
I think new characters are very important here, so I'm actually extremely supportive of Sin being included, even though I'm not personally a fan. The game looks fantastic, but the character selection is pretty weak and I can see myself gravitating back to the old GGXX+whatever with friends. Even though almost all of my favorites are missing, I hope that they add new characters as much as they bring back old ones. I think I would even trade in old characters I know I love for new characters that might or might not be favorites. I'm sad that the move lists of returning characters have changed so little as well.
Well, whatever. Pumped either way, though like many fighters, it might not be until the second edition that I get really excited.
I am undressed from 80’s style and recreated with modern sexy and beautiful style that amaze you and feel never been experienced world before.
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| Professor 3998th Post
MMCafe Owner
| "Re(3):Re(10):MMCafe Fighting Game session #1" , posted Thu 20 Feb 14:03:
quote:
> red falcon
We'll do sessions some other time too, no problem!
Excellent! If you ever feel like chatting again and goofing around in a game, hit me up, okay?
Sounds good, will do!
And so, GGXrd is playable now. The game is slow but fun, definitely a good game for entry-level Guilty Gear players or someone who hasn't played the series in over a decade like myself.
As far as customizations go, it seems like Arcsys hasn't worked on much. There's very little options available-- player title, icon, plate, and that's about it. I'm assuming they'll add things like alt costumes later.
But one cool thing, you can hear a character voice when you log into the player's guild. They have about a whoppiong 30 or so voice messages per character including Ramleathal, and they say things like "Had lunch yet? Wild rabbits taste best when they're well-roasted" (Sol).
And as you can see, there's an icon for Ramleathal too.
http://www.mmcafe.com/tiermaker/xrd/
[this message was edited by Professor on Thu 20 Feb 19:30] |
| karasu 1328th Post
PSN: robotchris
XBL: robotchris
Wii: n/a
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(3):It was a trap, but not in that sense." , posted Tue 25 Feb 01:39
quote:
Whatever. Valentine has tipped me into the land of "don't care" on character additions. I expected like...two more, but fewer is probably better for me anyway, since I tend to use a bajillion characters poorly rather than 1 or 2 well.
Oh, I agree! Valentine's design is much better than just about any ArcSys final boss since... oh wait, I-No was a final boss never mind-- I was going to say Justice, but... well yeah. Very excited to see the official Valentine art still!
quote:
No Bedman penetration, but something almost as interesting-- the Player's guild for Guilty Gear Xrd is actually viewable without an account. That means the stats like nationwide character usage and win rates can be checked by anyone, pending they can read the Jp character names. Here are the links.
Top page
http://ggxrd.com/pg/index.php
Nationwide character usage
http://ggxrd.com/pg/usage_rate_view.php
Nationwide Win rates by characters
http://ggxrd.com/pg/diagram_view.php
Professor, that's fantastic news, and some pretty interesting info to be seen. One question (and maybe it's answered if I dig around more), but is this data for every single machine in aggregate? It would be cool to see it broken out regionally. Just like way back with Aquapazza, I feel like this info could be presented in a somewhat more clever and attar chive way, but I still can't decide exactly what way that should be. I'll think on it and maybe some kind of web-based app might result? I'm not even sure if anyone but me cares the slightest about this stuff!
www.secret-arts.com
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| Professor 4004th Post
MMCafe Owner
| "Re(5):Paging kofoguz" , posted Tue 25 Feb 19:44:
quote:
One question (and maybe it's answered if I dig around more), but is this data for every single machine in aggregate? It would be cool to see it broken out regionally. Just like way back with Aquapazza, I feel like this info could be presented in a somewhat more clever and attar chive way, but I still can't decide exactly what way that should be. I'll think on it and maybe some kind of web-based app might result? I'm not even sure if anyone but me cares the slightest about this stuff!
Unfortunately no, it doesn't display by region-- it's a complete aggregate of all the machines running in Japan. Because of that, some wierd things are happening. For example, the top character on the national winrate is Zato-1, but it's mainly because there's one guy at an arcade in Tokyo (which coincedently happens to be Maou's favorite location) who's been getting a huge winning streak. From what I understand, he's singlehandedly raising the character's win rate in the country right now.
Nobi: As far as the 3D animation staffs go, they're indeed recruiting from both the 3D and 2D field. I'm assuming it's because they understand that artists with talent and experience in animation can do a good job regardless of dimensions.
Gojira: The game often shows freezeframes in multiple directions (or even rotating, which happens when the round is over). I'm assuming that there's some instances where the animation's angle is forced to be fixed, but so far I haven't seen anything where it's too obvious.
Also, the Blazblue sprites are all done from 3D prerenders! As you can see with this Azrael sample, they use a relatively simple 3D model and improvise on the details when they're drawing the sprite.
[this message was edited by Professor on Tue 25 Feb 19:48] |
| Spoon 2564th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(9):Paging 3D models" , posted Thu 27 Feb 04:01
It should be noted that often when the word "rotoscope" is used, it's often used with the connotation of "footage of real-life subjects e.g. people/animals", and that's the usage I meant when I said it. However, it can be footage of ANYTHING, so if they were rotoscoping over footage of 3D models, well, that'd still be correct. Now, the process of motion capture -> 3D models -> render to images/video -> rotoscope is not an impossible process, as commercial motion capture was available by 1994/1995, which is probably around when AoF3 was in development (AoF3 was released in 1996).
But I don't actually know what they did, so this is just speculation.
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| Lord SNK
0th Post
New Customer
| "Here comes a new challenger..." , posted Thu 27 Feb 04:56
quote:
It should be noted that often when the word "rotoscope" is used, it's often used with the connotation of "footage of real-life subjects e.g. people/animals", and that's the usage I meant when I said it. However, it can be footage of ANYTHING, so if they were rotoscoping over footage of 3D models, well, that'd still be correct. Now, the process of motion capture -> 3D models -> render to images/video -> rotoscope is not an impossible process, as commercial motion capture was available by 1994/1995, which is probably around when AoF3 was in development (AoF3 was released in 1996).
But I don't actually know what they did, so this is just speculation.
Hi to all cafe members, I come out of my long lurking as I can provide some information about this argument.
I have saved on my disk a copy of the old official USA site of SNK, from 1997 if I remember correctly.
They wrote exactly this about AoF3:
quote:
The first neo Geo title ever to incorporate, "MOTION CAPTURE" technology. This cutting edge advancement gives character animations human like qualities and movements that blaze up the screen. Download AVIs now and feel the motion capture!!!
There were some videos linked below, I don't think I have them...
They then list the features of the game and close the page like this:
quote:
ART OF FIGHTING 3 / PATH OF THE WARRIOR, this 298 MEG monster has no boundries in it's path. Premiere "motion capture technology"; countless new options and features; and the patented ART OF FIGHTING style of gameplay.
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| Just a Person 1574th Post
Red Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Member
| "Re(1):Masked Cammy" , posted Mon 17 Mar 12:42:
quote:
The last/5th character in Ultra SF4 is masked Cammy (Decapre). Not surprising at all, but Capcom clearly went budget on this game as expected.
En Trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dC-Hl33Xqpk
Jp Trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rKJruVAtSWw
...
...
...Oh well, at least Poison and Rolento are being added to this game. Would have preferred Gouken's daughter or Jessica (Haggar's daughter) over her, not interested in one single Doll at all (now, if ALL Dolls were in it, that would be a different story), she looks like a really bad result of Cammy and Psylocke being fused, but at least Poison and Rolento are also being added to this game.
Plus, Chun-Li is already in it. Can't hate any game with Chun-Li in it (except for the SF Movie game).
EDIT: Oh, and there's the Edition Select feature. That sounds cool as well (though not as cool as in Hyper SFII, where depending on the version selected of a certain character, he or she wouldn't just play differently, but also get a different portrait, a different voice, sometimes even different winning poses).
I can be any person in the world... maybe I'm this person right in front of you... maybe I'm not.
[this message was edited by Just a Person on Mon 17 Mar 13:10] |
| Just a Person 1574th Post
Red Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Member
| "Re(5):Masked Cammy" , posted Mon 17 Mar 20:24
quote:
Better than not having a fifth character at all I guess.
Nah, It would have been better just having the first 4.
It's wonderful how they outdid the initial "Roxy" predictions, hahahahahahaha.
Decapre's reveal probably wouldn't be so disappointing if she were revealed from the beginning, alongside Poison, Hugo, Rolento and Elena. Back then, Ultra was news, so any character announced wouldn't disappoint people so much.
Instead, they took over half an year to finally announce the identity of the fifth newcomer. Stupid decision unless said character was someone that the players wanted or that is more well-known.
Even then, though, Capcom COULD get a less negative reception if they announced Decapre BEFORE the Edition Select feature. If Edition Select were the big announcement for Final Round 17, people who got angry at Decapre would most likely forget her and be caught up on the hype for the possibility of playing as past versions of each character.
...Oh well, what's done is done. I hope at least her prologue and ending (assuming she'll get one of each - her trailer seems to indicate so) will show the fate of the other Dolls (except Juli and Juni, already shown in Cammy's and T.Hawk's stories).
I can be any person in the world... maybe I'm this person right in front of you... maybe I'm not.
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| Spoon 2574th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(6):Masked Cammy" , posted Tue 18 Mar 05:05
Prof, you know we love you, but dammit you have to use your own site's URL linking feature properly!
The charge air cannon drills and teleport dashes are quite the SFA3 reference, but it still being a modified Cammy still sucks.
quote:
nonsensical character select screen
Once a game's cast gets big enough, aside from starting P1 and P2 at the "main" character spots and having related characters diametrically opposed, what ways are there to arrange them sensibly? Sure we could put Dee Jay beside Guile, but that doesn't say much about where that pair should go in the first place. I think any beginner to a game with a huge roster is going to be overwhelmed with new stuff and choice no matter what the sorting scheme is, but I do wonder what a good arrangement would be without straight up lumping them into broad, named categories in the first place.
quote:
Cammy is my least favorite SF character-maybe my least favorite fighting game character, so having another one of her is literally the worst option possible for me.
That's an impressive amount of disdain, why so?
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| Pollyanna 3620th Post
PSN: Lilly_Dopamine
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Wii: n/a
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(7):Masked Cammy" , posted Tue 18 Mar 07:25
The KOF comparison isn't really fair in context, as we're not seeing a KOF game with only recycled material. If there was a new KOF/update with only old sprites, recycled sprites from other SNK games and backgrounds from other SNK games, with another Kyo being the only "new" character, it would be the same. The closest is Neowave, I guess?
quote:
That's an impressive amount of disdain, why so?
There's no an exciting story here, just that I don't like anything about Cammy (design, theme song, voice, move set) and she's annoying to fight against, especially in any kind of lag environment. So it's not that I aggressively hate anything about her, so much as I just somewhat dislike everything in a way that doesn't apply to any other fighting game character. I'd be happy if she just went away, so I can't be anything but irritated when she's multiplying.
I am undressed from 80’s style and recreated with modern sexy and beautiful style that amaze you and feel never been experienced world before.
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| Just a Person 1576th Post
Red Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Member
| "Re(8):Masked Cammy" , posted Tue 18 Mar 22:55
quote:
The KOF comparison isn't really fair in context, as we're not seeing a KOF game with only recycled material. If there was a new KOF/update with only old sprites, recycled sprites from other SNK games and backgrounds from other SNK games, with another Kyo being the only "new" character, it would be the same. The closest is Neowave, I guess?
Well, in SF's defense, Ultra is a mere upgrade of SFIV. KOF XIII recycled a lot of material from XII; sure, it also added a lot of new material, but XIII is supposed to be a sequel, not an upgrade (even if that's what it turned out to be in the end - it's still a great game, though).
I can be any person in the world... maybe I'm this person right in front of you... maybe I'm not.
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| Ishmael 4842th Post
PSN: Ishmael26b
XBL: n/a
Wii: n/a
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(8):Masked Cammy" , posted Wed 19 Mar 00:42
quote:
The KOF comparison isn't really fair in context, as we're not seeing a KOF game with only recycled material. If there was a new KOF/update with only old sprites, recycled sprites from other SNK games and backgrounds from other SNK games, with another Kyo being the only "new" character, it would be the same. The closest is Neowave, I guess?
I don't think anyone is trying to make a 1:1 comparison between USF4 and incremental updates in other game franchises. For me at least I was merely pointing out that Decapre is coming from a lineage that includes Mr. Karate, early versions of Robo-Ky, and half the cast of Namco's fighting games. Capcom took the path of least resistance with Decapre but fighting game fans should be used to seeing this sort of budget stretching by now.
I wonder, were people expecting a new character built from scratch? USF4 is essentially just KoF98UM. It's a fun remix for fans but it's also a six year old game that is on the previous generation of consoles. How much did people realistically expect? Still, as Karasu noted, you think they could have at least slapped a new head on Cammy. It would have made it look like it was an attempt at a new character instead of simply being Cammy with half her face scraped off. All the A3 dolls were Cammy head swaps so it would have been keeping with tradition.
quote:
Once a game's cast gets big enough, aside from starting P1 and P2 at the "main" character spots and having related characters diametrically opposed, what ways are there to arrange them sensibly? Sure we could put Dee Jay beside Guile, but that doesn't say much about where that pair should go in the first place. I think any beginner to a game with a huge roster is going to be overwhelmed with new stuff and choice no matter what the sorting scheme is, but I do wonder what a good arrangement would be without straight up lumping them into broad, named categories in the first place.
I agree that the select screen is a mess but I also agree that there is no obvious, easy remedy either. At least none of the characters are currently hidden off-screen since that is easily the worst idea for character placement I've ever seen.
quote:
I am surprised CammyFan hasn't updated yet.
Good grief, that page is still around? I hope it is somehow running on a GeoCities account.
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| Just a Person 1577th Post
Red Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Member
| "Re(8): Cammy with a purple bikini" , posted Wed 19 Mar 02:00
quote:
I was actually thinking about that for the 39 seconds I did not spend thinking about heading back home to continue Dark Souls II today. Since Street Fighter is a game which has characters from many places around the World, maybe one way to arrange the roster would be to place them on a map / globe according to where they originally come from. Obviously the map would not be entirely balanced (not many people on the African continent) but better than nothing.
And although it would not help a complete newcomer figure out the characters, at least they could choose a character based on their affinity to a specific country.
The big problem with this idea is that Japan and USA (maybe China as well) would be overcrowded in the select screen, while some countries would only have one or two characters and, unless I'm forgetting someone, Elena would be the sole representative of the entire African continent.
...Thinking about it, there should be more African characters in fighting games. In fact, there should be more African characters from DIFFERENT countries; sometimes it seems that Africa is treated as if it was a single country with a single culture, instead of a huge continent full of countries, each one with its own culture, geographic characteristics, and - in the case of fighting games - each one with its own fighting style.
I can be any person in the world... maybe I'm this person right in front of you... maybe I'm not.
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| Baines 401th Post
Gold Customer
| "Re(6):Masked Cammy" , posted Wed 19 Mar 04:08
quote:
The only thing that makes this super sad is that they've talked so much about this new character like we're supposed to be excited. Well...people were excited. All we thought we were getting was ONE new character and it was enough to get hopes up. The fact that they couldn't even manage that after recycling all of the other characters AND stages is pretty sad. I guess they just don't have anyone in the 3D modeling department available? I don't know.
Capcom hyped a new character for, what, half a year? Teased the identity with clues throughout that period. Pushed the idea that the character was somewhat important. The reveal trailer even makes jokes about the fan guesses of Retsu and R. Mika.
And then it was revealed to be an alternate outfit of Cammy with new specials. Sometimes it feels like Capcom actively hates its fan base, actively trolling them and actively trying to drive them away in anger. (The prime example being Capcom's treatment of Mega Man over the years. Capcom didn't just neglect Mega Man, but did things that seemed to have no purpose other than to outrage fans.)
Worse, if Capcom was going to be stuck recycling assets, why didn't they recycle Tekken characters from SFxT. Capcom would have to avoid making a straight up clone, but it could have taken the movesets of a couple of characters and meshed them together, added in a few new specials, and sent the chosen base model to a graphics artist for a makeover. While the result wouldn't be a truly new character, it would be "new" to Street Fighter, and certainly newer than Masked Cammy.
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| karasu 1346th Post
PSN: robotchris
XBL: robotchris
Wii: n/a
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(8):Masked Cammy" , posted Wed 19 Mar 07:02
quote:
Locally we've taken to calling this kind of thing a "Gobbledygooking", in reference to the infamous reveal of the Gobbledy Gooker back in the day in the WWF. A lot of parallels, tease people for months about something to build up expectations, and then ultimately reveal something really stupid or disappointing. Happens all the time! I'm not disappointed though, I fully expected a doll since day 1. I have to admit, however, that I at least expected a head swap ala Juni or Juni...
I think that's what makes it feel pretty cheap to me. Since the character has a somewhat changed move set it's not as though it's literally just Cammy with a mask and maybe psycho power effects, I would have at least expected that the character render would be a little bit more varied. Or how about this: if it's a different person from Cammy, why the braids, although that's more of a question for the designer of the Dolls in the first place. Here it's just a poor choice of which Doll was chosen.
Man, I'm often a defender of Capcom (when maybe I shouldn't be) since they get so much crap for almost any decision they make, but this is particularly insane. For example, I didn't roll my eyes about the Evil Ryu reveal since they hadn't teased his character so outlandishly for months.
Any sane/normal company might read this as a sign that people really really want R. Mika and Retsu for the inevitable upgrade to Ultra in a year or two, but I doubt it will sink in with Capcom.
www.secret-arts.com
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| Professor 4018th Post
MMCafe Owner
| "Dengeki Fighting Climax" , posted Wed 19 Mar 17:09:
Putting aside the Decapre conversation a little bit, Dengeki Fighting Climax came out just yesterday and I tried it out at lunch break together with BBCP's update (Bullet finally feels like a grappler!). Here's a quick summary.
1. People are calling it Dengeki FUCK
When you're coming up with a name for a new game, you really need to consider how people will abbreviate it. Such wasn't the case with this poor game. Dengeki Fighting Climax is pronounced in Japanese accent as Dengeki Faitingu Kuraimakkusu. Because of that, people here are abbreviating it under the horrible name of "Dengeki Fakku" (Dengeki FUCK). When you keep in mind that "Dengeki" means "electric shock", the name gives a totally new meaning.
2. Nice HD sprites, but choppy & only 8 characters
First of all, this game has awesome sprites. It's developed by the Melty Blood/Undernight In-birth developers and the high-quality HD pixel art shows it. However, time constraints were obviously tight and while the pixels look great, their animations are lacky and they move in the smoothness that reminds you of an old PS1 port. Another clue to the tight development is that there's only 8 characters in the game (9, if you include Akira who's the last boss). They compensated for this by adding in a lot of assist characters sort of how Examu did with Aquapazza. Unfortunately even the assist characters lack in animation... and that's a comparison to Aquapazza. Btw on a completely irrelevant note, Akira looks like Emiya from Fate Zero in a martial artist cosplay.
3. The dialogue portraits animate incredibly smooth
While the animation during gameplay is shaggy, it's quite the opposite for the dialogue scenes. The character faces uses Motion Portrait technology and it does quite the magic-- just imagine the various characters like Shana or Heiwajima moving ever so subtley in their original art style. In fact, they move a lot more naturally than games like ToHeart2 that sort of just slapped Motion Portrait technology on to their PS3 port.
4. Etc.
All in all, if you can get past the lack of animation, Dengeki FUCK seems like a potentially fun game. It feels a bit like a traditional ground-to-ground fighter since there's no air-dash, but the game has a "Burst" to escape out of combos. The game is relatively beginner friendly but with enough elements to keep advanced players also interested. For example you can just do combos by mashing the A button just like Persona 4 Arena, but you can cancel into an assist or take various other super cancel routes if you're a more savvy player. Most of the joystick motions are universal for every character, and moves like a guard attack can be done by just pressing two buttons, no life or meter penalty. The game is generous enough to include two guard attacks for each character, some of which advances forward. If you're doing combos manually, you can use the guard attacks as a part of it.
Here's a few match videos from Dengeki.com
http://dengekionline.com/elem/000/000/821/821230
[this message was edited by Professor on Wed 19 Mar 19:02] |
| TreIII
175th Post
Regular Customer
| "Re(4):Japanese artist launching BL fighting g" , posted Wed 26 Mar 03:12:
quote:
I'm honestly surprised it took this long for a BL fighter to come out. Whether it is the GG guys squinting at each other while showing off their perfectly toned abs or whatever Iori's deal is, there has always been an undercurrent of this theme in almost all fighting games. It reminds me of an article I read about how a lot of old kung-fu movies eventually turn into displays of homoerotic sadomasochism. I don't know if mainstream fighting game developers are intentionally courting that demographic or not but it seems that the sight of two muscled men grabbing each other can be read in several different ways.
Well, with that said? If you put it in this way, practically every major Japanese-made FG can be described as a "BL game".
And of course, these devs have to know that this demographic exists. After all, even if these specific sects of fans may or may not even buy the games, they certainly can be relied on to buy the merchandise! This is how the likes of BASARA continues to be a reliable source of revenue for Capcom, even though the games themselves don't sell millions.
In that light, the main difference that will separate this game from its peers is that it'll do more to pretty much wear this type of thing on its sleeve, instead of leaving it to the fangirls' imaginations~!
And that's what I think will be most interesting, especially if they're willing to go beyond even Metal Gear-levels of blatant homoeroticism.
quote:
Basara X had a lot of interesting ideas, but was really poorly executed. Still, experience has taught me never to underestimate how poorly implemented a fighting game can be.
SBX's problems were multifaceted. Among them being that because there was such a large fujoshi presence at the loke tests, few "real" players ever got a chance to try the game out during the time when it would've been appreciated to get such input.
[this message was edited by TreIII on Wed 26 Mar 03:18] |
| Spoon 2599th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(4):Re(10):Rise of the drug-tests in Shinag" , posted Sat 3 May 02:56
It's one thing that I've always felt the game moved slowly (I'd like to think it's out of necessity due to the huge variety of movement and mixups/rushdown possible, but MvC3 and GG always make me think twice about that), but when you hit people in the game, it seems like it's not just a hitstop that occurs. It seems like a slowdown in addition to it, or maybe it's just a trick in how the velocities of the sprites are going. I'm normally a fan of big hit stops and time dilations to emphasize impact and intensity (as well as the practical use of giving me more time to decide/execute), but in AH the dilation together with the motion of the sprites seems to have a mush-ifying effect on the whole experience for me. And this is even taking into account the fact that I love its HnK-like mechanics that do result in interesting movement with unusual/extreme velocities. I think its version of HnK's banishing strike (charge E normal in AH) having a vertical version is one of the most awesome things ever. But something about the game feels weird to me.
And this is also coming from the view of a person that normally likes the (The) Rumble Fish games, which definitely has some of the most weirdly sluggish movement outside of combos of any decent fighting game.
Other counterpoints/contradictions to what I said:
GG combos frequently feature big huge hitstops. No better example than Sol's Sidewinder loops in all versions of GG after Guilty Gear Slash. It's awesome.
In Blazblue, hit stops were reduced in the most recent version because it made the combos longwinded. But the hitstops in Blazblue didn't feel weird, it's just that in long combos it made them feel too long/annoying.
I hesitate to include any SF example, because SF is so foundational to my sense of fighting games that I have a hard time saying how anything in it feels wrong. For instance, SF2WW is one of the games with the most exaggerated hitstops and time dilations of all, but it feels WONDERFUL. It isn't (normally) a game about double digit+ hit combos, so each hit that does get landed can be played up a bit more, but it's great.
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| Ishmael 4874th Post
PSN: Ishmael26b
XBL: n/a
Wii: n/a
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(4):Re(10):Rise of the drug-tests in Shinag" , posted Sat 3 May 03:05:
quote:
I can't quantify just what it is about Arcana Heart games that doesn't feel right to me (something about its speed...), for instance.
In the meantime, can you elaborate on what you don't like about Arcana Hearts? It animates just fine from the videos I've seen, and I don't remember it feeling bad the brief time I've played it.
I would be interested in hearing what you had to say about Arcana Hearts as well. Although I didn't particularly care for AR1 -the only game in the series I have tried- I'm not certain I could articulate why. Perhaps it's because AR is trying to be this highly mobile air game like the Marvel games with the combo action of something like Melty Blood. Trouble is, AR doesn't have the screen filling density of a team game like Marvel and the attacks from the characters didn't portray a sense of weight and impact like you find even in Melty Blood or other competent second tier fighters. Without having assists or a singular, powerful presence to help hold interest in the match the characters just ended up buzzing around those massive stages like they were skirt wearing mosquitos. If I was going to summarize it, AR simply felt empty.
That, or maybe it's that I found all the cast of AR to be stupid as all hell and ran into Pollyanna's problem of a game where I couldn't get past the character select screen. Whatever it is, at least AR gave me something to think about while I wait for my flight to take off.
EDIT: Ack, you posted while I was typing!
[this message was edited by Ishmael on Sat 3 May 03:08] |
| nobinobita 1290th Post
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(5):Re(10):Rise of the drug-tests in Shinag" , posted Sat 3 May 03:48:
quote:
It's one thing that I've always felt the game moved slowly (I'd like to think it's out of necessity due to the huge variety of movement and mixups/rushdown possible, but MvC3 and GG always make me think twice about that), but when you hit people in the game, it seems like it's not just a hitstop that occurs. It seems like a slowdown in addition to it, or maybe it's just a trick in how the velocities of the sprites are going. I'm normally a fan of big hit stops and time dilations to emphasize impact and intensity (as well as the practical use of giving me more time to decide/execute), but in AH the dilation together with the motion of the sprites seems to have a mush-ifying effect on the whole experience for me. And this is even taking into account the fact that I love its HnK-like mechanics that do result in interesting movement with unusual/extreme velocities. I think its version of HnK's banishing strike (charge E normal in AH) having a vertical version is one of the most awesome things ever. But something about the game feels weird to me.
And this is also coming from the view of a person that normally likes the (The) Rumble Fish games, which definitely has some of the most weirdly sluggish movement outside of combos of any decent fighting game.
Other counterpoints/contradictions to what I said:
GG combos frequently feature big huge hitstops. No better example than Sol's Sidewinder loops in all versions of GG after Guilty Gear Slash. It's awesome.
In Blazblue, hi
-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --
HITSTOP! That was the term I was looking for! (as you can tell I'm not a very competitive fighting gamer)
It's the way Under Night In-Birth handles hitstops that really sets it apart from other games superficially similar to it.
Most anime-ish fighters tend to have big hitstops that freeze both players. They also tend to freeze at the moment of impact where the attacker is at full extension. They also tend to do this thing where sometimes the attacker's frame rate slows down if the opponent is blocking as if the motion were being performed by clockwork and there's something gumming up the gears.
UNIB has fewer and quicker hitstops. And the game doesn't freeze on the moment of impact, instead the character completes the motion and there's a few frames of settling animation before the next action.
This makes a huge difference to me because it makes you feel like you're punching THROUGH your opponent, which is what you're supposed to do in real life striking. When you want to give someone a good punch to the face, you're actually supposed to aim at the space BEHIND their head, imagining your first traveling THROUGH their skull.
I really like how this feels. Each attack in UNIB feels like I'm slugging a baseball while other recent fighters tend to feel like I'm punching an inflatable doll (no resistance so my limb can comfortably stay at full extension, no recoil or settling)
Aside from the hitstuns, UNIB also just has really good animation in general. Good poses. There's a good sense of tension and release with the way they design their motions. You can generally freeze the game at any point and get a good sense of where the character's weight is. A lot of other fighting games pay less attention to weight and gravity and feel more like the characters are simply snapping from pose to pose.
The characters in UNIB also tend to really step into their attacks, with alot of their power coming from the way they twist their core into each action so there's a constant sense of forward momentum. It's like they're constantly throwing power punches whereas most motions in other similar games feel like pokes and jabs. The game feels like you constantly have a low level alpha2 custom combo activated. It feels aggressive.
So yeah, i guess what I really like about UNIB is that it has the speed and flashiness of an Arc System Works game with much fewer (and shorter) hit stuns and slightly better poses(in terms of weight, timing and spacing) to its animation.
I can't really comment on the complexity of the gameplay, but i just like how it "feels" more than most other games. Feeling is the most important part of a game's controls for me.
www.art-eater.com
[this message was edited by nobinobita on Sat 3 May 03:51] |
| Toxico 5905th Post
PSN: Toxic-Baron
XBL: n/a
Wii: n/a
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
|  "Re(6):Re(10):Rise of the drug-tests in Shinag" , posted Thu 8 May 04:50
quote:
So yeah, i guess what I really like about UNIB is that it has the speed and flashiness of an Arc System Works game with much fewer (and shorter) hit stuns and slightly better poses(in terms of weight, timing and spacing) to its animation.
I can't really comment on the complexity of the gameplay, but i just like how it "feels" more than most other games. Feeling is the most important part of a game's controls for me.
Oh, well. Way too late to the party (?) but since people where asking about it, might as well add to it.
"Does this game has a following", well; since it's only in Japan right now we can only look at it from that perspective, but right now there are severals micro communities of players that are focusing on playing this game a lot and are trying to make the most out of the game mechanics; thus there are basically arcades where this game "it's hitting it on strongly", dragging a decent amount of players and characters to the fry. Some players have gotten ridiculously good, which is a good sign that points out that the game is being taken seriously.
Some of the arcades where this one is hitting it off, are also arcades where Melty Blood has been successful, so probably the "similar scent" attracted people (which is funny, because French Bread really went out of their ways to make this play differently), I also suspect that the game having the handicap of being on Sega's rindedge board may be hampering a little it's success, the more Arc system works games you see having the spot light on a arcade; the less chance of seeing this one shinning as brightly there.
It hasn't been that long from the update release (like a year or something?), so the game'd population hasn't dimmed to it's lowest yet (unlike other "old" fighters, like TTT2 or KoF XIII). As for "what the update changed", the first version was basically a succession of big combos; not only combos where frequent and damaging; but they also generated resources to perform even longer combos later. The latest version toned down that a lot, and while there are still a bunch of 30%~40% damage combos, they don't produce the same resources that they did before, thus getting a hold of the game flow is a little bit more important now.
Balance has been a complaint, but rather than being about the overpowered characters, it was more about players complaining about the "can't do anything tier" in a game with such a low cast number.
さっきの感じならあと100発はもつ‥‥と思うぜ
Update 24 as of 03/04/12. // 104 personajes traducidos
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Last update : Chapter 25 as of 31/08/12
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| Sasha
3th Post
New Customer
| "Re(1):Ultra Guilty King of Fighting Game Thre" , posted Thu 29 May 23:20
quote:
New Thread!
Starting off with Guilty Gear Xrd.
Previous trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQ9Cd4MKqHs
The game is loketesting for about a week starting today in Japan. I don't think overseas arcades can get it unless they can somehow connect to the Sega Aime networking system. Anyway here's my first impression.
No filming was allowed. I wonder how long that'll last during this test.
1. In this new beta build, the game is completely playable up to the end. All the Instant Kills are there as well as the cinematics, last boss, and ending. Basically, we're already seeing the final product. In fact, it could even be switched to other games on the Sega Aime cabinet (DOA5, Undernight Inbirth, etc).
2.The Aime IC card is already usable though I haven't checked yet if there's a login page for the beta testing. By default, 6 colors are usable. Unfortunately No Maetel color for Millia.
The movie and cut scenes still seem to still run in 30fps. I thought this was a mid-development thing but I guess not.
3. I swear that some of the graphics have not only been polished up, it's also been changed to keep consistancy. For example, Millia in her loss screen doesn't have as much of a cute/comical expression as before.
4. I didn't notice if this was implemented before, but the developers put effort in the win/loss screen's background too, like for example the crew on May's ship are looking unhappy when she's lost.
5. Each cha
-- Message too long, Autoquote has been Snipped --
http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/05/29/guilty-gear-xrd-sign-officially-coming-west-for-ps3-and-ps4?abthid=53872f8996533ed048000017
Yeshh, just got announced today for PS3 and PS4. Bittersweet news (for me) since no PC version was announced, though, I still have some hope. The potential mods are something to dream about with that beautiful engine, and I really wish to experience my first LET IT OOUUUUUTTTT in max settings.
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But other matches against players from Africa and Europe worked out well. 
I must be... tired! 
MESSA~CHU 
