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| Digitalboy 674th Post
 
Red Carpet Regular Member
  
    
    
|  "Re(5):Old New, New News?" , posted Mon 15 Feb 21:19
Shit, son.
I love TvC, son. I shower in that shit, son. Breakfast, lunch, and dinner, I eat that shit for all the meals. That is until I got Muramasa: The Demon Blade. But that is different story.
SF4...My top complaints are the limited supers/ultras; projectile spamming and a weak roster. The game mechanics/collision boxes are good. Graphics, I wish it was 2D.quote:
I never got the impression that no one cared about TvC. The game seems pretty well liked from my observations. And on SFIV, I was always under the impression that it wasn't that MOST people here hated it; it was that those that didn't like it were more vocal and posted more often about why they didn't like it. For some reason, people having negative things to say about a game brings out more energy than those who praise the game.
Either that, or maybe SFIV's supporters posted less because there were so many other places they could go to talk to others who liked the game. Just guessin'.
I don't know how to live
But I've got alot of toys...
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| Pollyanna 2856th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
    
    
 
|  "Re(2):Trailer n'stuff" , posted Thu 18 Feb 13:03
quote:
Dudley sounds like he has no dignity.
He does have that DEMPSEY ROLL Ultra, so, trade-off, I guess?
The sad thing is, after hearing Alex's appalling new voice in TvC, I'm thinking that Dudley's English voice may be our best option.
I can't tell if he's actually bad, or just not nearly as awesome as the original.
quote:
WHY ARE ALL THESE ENGLISH VOICE ACTORS HORRIBLE?!
Hey. Cody is awesome. He might be lacking in "HAH-HAH!" power, but the voice is dead-on. Adon sounds remarkably like his Japanese counterpart. You can't tell me Japanese Adon somehow sounds less ridiculous. Deejay's voice is appropriately awful and Juri sounds just fine.
Everyone else is pretty damned terrible, though...especially Makoto, it seems.
青春謳歌 弱肉強食
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| Just a Person 1342th Post
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(7):Trailer n'stuff" , posted Thu 18 Feb 23:16
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I don't mind Makoto's voice, Ibuki's is actually a little annoying, but DUDLEY'S? All I can say is, I hope the Japanese voice is much better (and really, how much worse than the Engilsh voice could it possibly be?).
I haven't heard it yet... is it THAT bad??
By the way, I never got to play a lot of 3rd. Strike (the only SFIII arcade that came to my city was the 2nd. Impact one), so would you guys say if Dudley was a popular character? Ibuki is pretty much one of SFIII iconic characters (alongside Alex and Yun), and I know Makoto was quite popular due to her being one of the high-tier characters, but it seems that Dudley wasn't so beloved by the SF players until he appeared in that poll asking which characters we would like to see in SFIV...
Although storyline-wise (not that Capcom cares about the SF storyline), his inclusion makes more sense than Ibuki and Makoto, who should be kids by the time SSFIV takes place...
I can be any person in the world... maybe I'm this person right in front of you... maybe I'm not.
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| Gojira 2578th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(10):Trailer n'stuff" , posted Fri 19 Feb 03:05
Dudley's English voice is actually not that bad. His intro speech sucks, and the initial impression is that it's just not deep enough, but otherwise with some getting used to it'll be fine. For the most part it doesn't sound any more phoned-in than the JP version, which has its own set of issues.
Ibuki's is okay... it's a different approach to her personality that kind of works, although some of the lines just sound lazy. The JP voice is better overall, more forceful and tomboyish, but I guess if you'd rather she acted more like a high school kid than a ninja you'd go with the English.
But Makoto... what in god's name IS that supposed to be. "Euuuugh euuuuugh stop hiiiiting meeee euuuugh euuuugggghhhhh saychoosan JAPANESEISEASY" It's gotta be a conspiracy to make people switch to the JP voice. Since, you know, they did so much work on it, hiring that expert and keeping the original VA. BTW I'm slightly amused that she sounds older when she's supposed to be a younger character, but that's how real time works.
P.S. Hakan sounds like a cross between Niko Bellic and Dr. Nick Riviera. That alone may be enough to sell me on the English voice.
shipoopi
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| Maese 566th Post
New Red Carpet Member
| "Re(2):Re(10):Trailer n'stuff" , posted Fri 19 Feb 07:00
Well, well, seems like things are shaping up quite nicely. While this new SFIV certainly does not sound good at all, it does look terrific!! Dudley, Makoto and, specially, Ibuki are probably my favourite characters from SF3, and they all look really gorgeous in my opinion. I'm kind of excited about this game.
My only beef is... was this *so* difficult to do from the beggining, Capcom? I mean, since the first installment of the game? Hmm, better to leave it as a merely rethoric question, I'm afraid.
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| Megane 466th Post
Gold Customer
|  "Re(3):Re(10):Trailer n'stuff" , posted Fri 19 Feb 08:40
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My only beef is... was this *so* difficult to do from the beggining, Capcom? I mean, since the first installment of the game?
Technically, yes. Capcom didn't want to do SF again, need to go with safe cast for max familiarity, dev't time constraints, etc.
quote:
I haven't heard it yet... is it THAT bad??
By the way, I never got to play a lot of 3rd. Strike (the only SFIII arcade that came to my city was the 2nd. Impact one), so would you guys say if Dudley was a popular character?
It really doesn't fit Dudley the way you remember his voice in 3S. His in-combat grunts and attack call-outs sound a bit better.
As for Dudley's popularity. Dudley seems to have a cult following or something. He's not the poster boy for SF3, no, but there are many players scrub or elite who like him for his effectiveness and style.
Anyway, further news/rumors for Hakan:
The dudes who've had a try at the build says that Hakan is "gimmicky", "but vaguely original", Gief users might be more comfortable using T.Hawk, and "Losing to Hakan robs you of all sense of dignity. Especially if he Ultras you."
I don't suppose any depants'-ing is possible in SF4 (as that was a win-condition in oil-wrestling, or so I've read), I have no idea how to interpret the last one.
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| Pollyanna 2858th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(10):Trailer n'stuff" , posted Fri 19 Feb 11:17
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I think that Capcom Japan recorded the English voices as well but I can't find the citation for that one so don't quote me.
Usually the company (or rather, their American branch) chooses a studio and director for the project. The director then calls in people from his preferred pool of talent and holds auditions. The director chooses the strongest auditions and runs them by the parent company, who then decides the cast. The only Japanese company I know of that's directly involved in the recording (when it isn't ORIGINALLY in English) is Square. They have a Japanese representative approve each line as it is delivered.
Again, in defense of the SF4 English dub, I don't think long-term SF fans are the audience. Even if the dub was especially good, would you choose to use a set of voices that are different than the ones you grew up with? Even if the Japanese performances aren't good (something no one seems to accept as a possibility, by the way), they're still iconic. For someone who has always been happy with them, there's no even a need for a dub.
Although I will undoubtedly be playing the game in Japanese, I think...on the whole...the English dub is a good effort, and a greater accomplishment than I would expect for the English dub of a fighting game.
Also, although Makoto's dub voice is undeniably grating, it's also a reasonably approximation to her Japanese voice...annnnnddd although her Japanese leaves something to be desired, it's much better than the English we're used to hearing from Japanese people in fighting games.
青春謳歌 弱肉強食
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| Just a Person 1343th Post
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(2):Re(10):Trailer n'stuff" , posted Fri 19 Feb 22:32
quote:
Going into info dump mode, the main page has been updated.
OK, only now did I see the trailers page, and I'm certainly surprised they put so many references to the dolls in the 1st animated one... I wonder if that'll have any relevance in the actual game, like DLC, alternate skins for Cammy, or some randori mode or battle in story mode like the Juni & Juli fight in SFA3.
Someone at SRK.com translated T.Hawk's short bio for SSFIV, and it apparently mentions that he's once again looking after "Julia" (aka SFA3's Juli). So yeah, I guess they are relevant to the actual game.
S.I.N. is probably kidnapping the former Shadaloo Dolls, although we still don't know why.
But yeah, your ideas are quite good! Maybe there could be a surprise bonus stage where the player needs to fight all the 12 Dolls. At once. Maybe with some restraints to them so the match is more even (like making them with no special attacks, Supers or Ultras; maybe each one having half of a health bar).
Unfortunately, that just won't happen...
I can be any person in the world... maybe I'm this person right in front of you... maybe I'm not.
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| Ishmael 3692th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(4):Re(10):Trailer n'stuff" , posted Sat 20 Feb 01:08
Concerning my previous post: I was thinking of this development blog post discussing the voice work. The post talks about the work the team did putting the English voices into the game even though they had no idea what the hell the English voice actors were saying. There was, however, no mention about Capcom Japan having anything to do with the voice recording. Sorry about that.
quote:
A good point about the Japanese cast also sucking---outside of Vegamoto, they do---but I wasn't sure what you meant by "alwasy been happy with them," since the cast for SFIV are almost entirely new since the Zero series and III. I mean, at least they speak like normal human beings who are miscast, rather than...strange creatures in English, but still.
Wow! Shows how ignorant I am! Here I'm saying "can't you tell bad Japanese acting when you hear it?" when I can't even tell one actor from another.
Was there a backlash against the cast changing in SFIV? I honestly didn't even notice. I just assumed that some characters sounded a little different because so much time had passed since their previous recording.
Capcom has always had a slash and burn policy when it comes to SF voices so in a way yet another shifting of the voice talent is just business as usual. Back when all the characters did was grunt or shout the occasional tough-guy line it probably wasn't considered that big a deal but I wonder if that will change now that the characters are starting to have dialogue.
Personally I miss the SF2:WW days when the characters sounded like they were screaming into a metal barrel. Those were some amazing voice clips.
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I don't suppose any depants'-ing is possible in SF4 (as that was a win-condition in oil-wrestling, or so I've read), I have no idea how to interpret the last one.
Haken continues to intrigue me.
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| Just a Person 1344th Post
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(4):Re(10):Trailer n'stuff" , posted Sat 20 Feb 21:22
quote:
Anyway, further news/rumors for Hakan:
The dudes who've had a try at the build says that Hakan is "gimmicky", "but vaguely original", Gief users might be more comfortable using T.Hawk, and "Losing to Hakan robs you of all sense of dignity. Especially if he Ultras you."
I don't suppose any depants'-ing is possible in SF4 (as that was a win-condition in oil-wrestling, or so I've read), I have no idea how to interpret the last one.
Maybe he covers the opponent in oil, so he/she continuously slips and falls to the ground, without Hakan even needing to hit him/her.
I'm very curious to see this character! When do you think Capcom will reveal him? First half of March, perhaps?
I can be any person in the world... maybe I'm this person right in front of you... maybe I'm not.
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| KTallguy 1181th Post
Red Carpet Premium Member+
| "Re(7):Re(10):Re(10):Old New, New News?" , posted Tue 9 Mar 10:39
I think putting fan favorites in is an easier way to get my money, unfortunately. I'm supremely happy that Ibuki is in the game. I wish there was a tag team function, so I could do an Ibuki/Guy team :)
On top of that, out of the truly new characters in SF4, Viper is the only one that feels like she has staying power. The other characters are pretty boring/ugly (not their playstyle, but their visual design). I would rather have Alex over Abel, and I would prefer a less offensive design for Rufus. Fuerte is ok, I guess.
But we still have one more new character to go, and apparently he's really hilarious and offensive, so we'll have to see!
Unfortunately everyone online is still going to play Ken over and over...
Play to win... or to have fun too! :)
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| Pollyanna 2876th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(8):Re(10):Re(10):Old New, New News?" , posted Wed 10 Mar 05:57:
quote:
On top of that, out of the truly new characters in SF4, Viper is the only one that feels like she has staying power. The other characters are pretty boring/ugly (not their playstyle, but their visual design). I would rather have Alex over Abel, and I would prefer a less offensive design for Rufus. Fuerte is ok, I guess.
On its own, I don't necessarily disagree with this statement, but I don't think it's fair to compare the old characters to the new ones. The old characters are iconic (SF3 excluded). They have solid designs, but they're still stereotypes. I don't know if they would really stand out by today's standards if they were freshly introduced. The new characters have the disadvantage of needing to fit in (somewhat) with the older designs and still feel new and interesting.
I think they really broke this idea with Juri, but she has my favorite design...so what can I say?
I love the (hand drawn) art from SFIV. It's amazing. The sketches in the art gallery blew my mind. Still...for the rest of my life, I'll be left wondering what characters Akiman would've designed. That man is the king of "simple but effective" character design. Regardless of how good (or bad) the SFIV designs are, I will always lament his lack of involvement.
(Random) EDIT: Seth has just about the lamest design I can possibly imagine. Almost anything would've been better.
青春謳歌 弱肉強食
[this message was edited by Pollyanna on Wed 10 Mar 05:59] |
| Ishmael 3712th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(2):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Old New, New News?" , posted Thu 11 Mar 01:46
quote:
Famitsu article , they where slower than I thought...
Is the baby faced apron girl of the background of his profile pic is wife? Considering the miss match, I suppose that it's not surprise that the man has been active.
I'll commend Hakan for being the only thing in S/SFIV that has liven up to my expectations... For now.
If that is his wife, she must have married really young... she looks like a teenager to me. But I'm relieved that the blue thing in his head seems to be just a helmet or something like that, looking at his artwork.
Anyway, Hadoken.net has posted several match videos from the event where Hakan was first presented. In all matches it seems the players were quite even; Ibuki seems to have a lot of possibilities, but she's still defeatable by guys like Hakan or Dee Jay... is that a sign that there is a good balance among all characters? I hope so!
Those videos are making me feel really good about the character. Getting in and grappling combined with constantly having to monitor his oil levels looks to be an interesting play style.
The uses of his second Ultra also made me feel a bit more comfortable about the counter Ultras. For a counter move, Hakan spent a large amount of time sprawled on the ground. At one point instead of having to time the Ultra with an opponent's attack Hakan was able to able spot a jump, activate the Ultra, and wait for the opponent to land on him. While the uses for counter supers still look conditional that gives me hope that they aren't totally useless.
I also like the idea that Hakan would be really unpleasant to the touch. It's been some time since I've thought about how a character would smell or the other ways they could be offensive to the senses. Even a win against Hakan would be a sticky, outfit-ruining experience.
So welcome to SF Hakan. I'm looking forward to not only seeing what sort of color combinations are avaliable for your body and hair/bathtub mat helmet but to the joy of winning a match by squirting people out from between your legs.
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| Pollyanna 2877th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Old New, New News?" , posted Thu 11 Mar 04:42
quote:
I'll commend Hakan for being the only thing in S/SFIV that has liven up to my expectations... For now.
I had no expectations and he's far exceeded them!
quote:
Anyway, Hadoken.net has posted several match videos from the event where Hakan was first presented. In all matches it seems the players were quite even; Ibuki seems to have a lot of possibilities, but she's still defeatable by guys like Hakan or Dee Jay... is that a sign that there is a good balance among all characters? I hope so!
Way wayyyy too early to say, especially regarding a character people have at most, spent a few hours with. Still, reading about some of the changes Capcom implemented on old characters gives me hope. It seems that we can expect at least the same level of balance as the last game with less Sagat abuse.
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I think she is. Remember, Sally, Dahlsim's wife, looks tremendously good as well. I like this trend.
Perhaps someday we'll see an ugly woman with a ridiculously handsome husband as well. Hmmm...though I can't think of any female characters that are ugly in a fun way.
青春謳歌 弱肉強食
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| Burning Ranger 1644th Post
Tailored Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Member
| "Re(7):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Old New, New News?" , posted Fri 12 Mar 03:18
quote:
Hakan is so awesome I spilled oil all over my pants
Why is it that of all these new character designs, Hakan seems so much more in keeping with the old SFII roster? Plus he's got such... charisma! Which I am sure helps generally.
Seriously, I keep trying decide what it is that they got right with him that they got wrong with many of the others.
I think he's a character that doesn't take himself seriously, if this makes any sense. Sure, he's a Turkish wrestler, with a unique play dynamic. Serious gameplay, but otherwise, it seems to be all humor. Maybe like a Dan or Rufus, only turned up to 11.
So much to do so little time...
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| karasu99 305th Post
Bronze Customer
| "Re(8):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Old New, New News?" , posted Fri 12 Mar 04:04
quote:
I think he's a character that doesn't take himself seriously, if this makes any sense. Sure, he's a Turkish wrestler, with a unique play dynamic. Serious gameplay, but otherwise, it seems to be all humor. Maybe like a Dan or Rufus, only turned up to 11.
That's a good point. Also, I think giving him a family somehow makes him a little more interesting, if that makes any sense.
Incidentally, Hakan is up on the official site. Plus a bunch of weird stuff on Nakky blog.
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| kofoguz 825th Post
Red Carpet Regular Member+
| "Re(7):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Old New, New News?" , posted Fri 12 Mar 04:27
quote:
Seriously, I keep trying decide what it is that they got right with him that they got wrong with many of the others.
It's so deep you have no idea they even got the wife and daughters right. Turkish fathers are really proud of their daughters. Turkish culture nowadays looks patriarchal, but in fact, in its nature it's matriarchal. So daughters are very precious to especially fathers. The arranged marriages' purpose was to protect daughters but in modern days some uneducated families act like its a sell-out, (they also destroying the culture with some stupid really old traditions like "berdel", "beşik kertmesi" and honor killings)...
So with "I love my daughters, they're so pretty", they even got that tiny part of reference right.
The sun burned skin, special pants texture, the personality and even his english sound like what it should be. The sounds, the "r"s, and the each stresses on each syllables sounds right.
The moves are perfect parody of the real moves. Only mystery is the helmet thingy and it looks good.
So they're pretty much did every part right. I'm very surprised.
Now they might tackle with BGM and Stage so I'm waiting with high expectations.
quote:
"I think he's a character that doesn't take himself seriously, if this makes any sense. Sure, he's a Turkish wrestler, with a unique play dynamic. Serious gameplay, but otherwise, it seems to be all humor. Maybe like a Dan or Rufus, only turned up to 11."
Its the opposite way, I think he take himself very seriously, he puts humor into his fighting in purpose. Its a strategy in oil wrestling to taunt opponents to psyche them up, while taking them down.
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| Maou 1942th Post
Gold Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Executive
| "Re(7):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Old New, New News?" , posted Fri 12 Mar 14:22
quote:
Seriously, I keep trying decide what it is that they got right with him that they got wrong with many of the others.
Yeah, I personally think it's the sort of hearty cultural bits (as kofoguz kindly affirms) they've associated with Hakan that are absent in other new characters. Like, to some degree, you could call the Street Fighter II cast stereotypical, but viewed in a more optimisitc light, I feel like there's a certain joy to the 'national traits', which can also be sources of pride or exoticism and not just a stereotype. It's FUN to have a yoga guy and a girl in a qipao and a Spanish fighter with roses and all that, and I think having a new character like Hakan identify with a country makes him more exciting almost--like, Abel and Rufus can't be traced to anywhere except "boring" and "ugly" just by looking at them. Viper may suffer from the same, a combination of bad design and lack of a culture to give her some sort of context. It's possible to do basically stateless/cultureless characters in a fighter too, of course, but for every dictator Vega or Rolento or whomever, you have a lot of chance for blah, too, since fighters are so visual and need to tell us a story based on their look/style, as often expressed in cultural terms.
人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は．．．
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| Megane 470th Post
Gold Customer
| "Re(8):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Old New, New News?" , posted Fri 12 Mar 14:54
quote:
Seriously, I keep trying decide what it is that they got right with him that they got wrong with many of the others.
Yeah, I personally think it's the sort of hearty cultural bits (as kofoguz kindly affirms) they've associated with Hakan that are absent in other new characters. Like, to some degree, you could call the Street Fighter II cast stereotypical, but viewed in a more optimisitc light, I feel like there's a certain joy to the 'national traits', which can also be sources of pride or exoticism and not just a stereotype. It's FUN to have a yoga guy and a girl in a qipao and a Spanish fighter with roses and all that, and I think having a new character like Hakan identify with a country makes him more exciting almost--like, Abel and Rufus can't be traced to anywhere except "boring" and "ugly" just by looking at them. Viper may suffer from the same, a combination of bad design and lack of a culture to give her some sort of context. It's possible to do basically stateless/cultureless characters in a fighter too, of course, but for every dictator Vega or Rolento or whomever, you have a lot of chance for blah, too, since fighters are so visual and need to tell us a story based on their look/style, as often expressed in cultural terms.
Let me touch on El Fuerte for a bit. He failed to resonate with players, even though he had the potential to sell well since he's a luchadore. I think it's because of the disjoint between his craft and his story (and maybe personality). We were probably expecting something completely different in El Fuerte, and his major personality trait is... cooking. I mean, I'd probably preferred it if El Fuerte has Griffon's personality; actually, given the little I know of the luchador mythos, I'd expect him to care about justice or standing up for the weak (and children) or whatnot.
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| KTallguy 1189th Post
Red Carpet Premium Member+
| "Re(8):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Old New, New News?" , posted Fri 12 Mar 15:30
quote:
Yeah, I personally think it's the sort of hearty cultural bits (as kofoguz kindly affirms) they've associated with Hakan that are absent in other new characters. Like, to some degree, you could call the Street Fighter II cast stereotypical, but viewed in a more optimisitc light, I feel like there's a certain joy to the 'national traits', which can also be sources of pride or exoticism and not just a stereotype. It's FUN to have a yoga guy and a girl in a qipao and a Spanish fighter with roses and all that, and I think having a new character like Hakan identify with a country makes him more exciting almost--like, Abel and Rufus can't be traced to anywhere except "boring" and "ugly" just by looking at them. Viper may suffer from the same, a combination of bad design and lack of a culture to give her some sort of context.
There's a big danger though. Like if one of Chun-Li's attacks was to throw Gyoza at the opponent, that crosses the line for me. There's a certain line where the character makes fun of the culture in a way that doesn't celebrate it. I think that Hakan is tiptoeing the line, but doesn't quite cross it :)
Rufus is just ugly. I don't know how he was greenlit. If you want a fat, american fighter, something more like the guy in Tekken would have worked.
Play to win... or to have fun too! :)
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| Just a Person 1351th Post
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(8):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Old New, New News?" , posted Fri 12 Mar 21:53
quote:
Yeah, I personally think it's the sort of hearty cultural bits (as kofoguz kindly affirms) they've associated with Hakan that are absent in other new characters. Like, to some degree, you could call the Street Fighter II cast stereotypical, but viewed in a more optimisitc light, I feel like there's a certain joy to the 'national traits', which can also be sources of pride or exoticism and not just a stereotype. It's FUN to have a yoga guy and a girl in a qipao and a Spanish fighter with roses and all that, and I think having a new character like Hakan identify with a country makes him more exciting almost--like, Abel and Rufus can't be traced to anywhere except "boring" and "ugly" just by looking at them. Viper may suffer from the same, a combination of bad design and lack of a culture to give her some sort of context. It's possible to do basically stateless/cultureless characters in a fighter too, of course, but for every dictator Vega or Rolento or whomever, you have a lot of chance for blah, too, since fighters are so visual and need to tell us a story based on their look/style, as often expressed in cultural terms.
Great analysis!
But you talked about Hakan, Rufus, Viper and Abel... I won't even ask an opinion about Seth (since he's not supposed to have cultural traits at all), but what about the other two SFIV/SSFIV newcomers, Juri and El Fuerte?
I can be any person in the world... maybe I'm this person right in front of you... maybe I'm not.
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| Pollyanna 2881th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(4):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Old New, Ne" , posted Sat 13 Mar 18:28
Although Juri doesn't seem to be specifically Korean in any way except her fighting style, there are a large number of Korean nationalists who needlessly and loudly complain about any number of perceived injuries to their country's character. I'm sure she was quite offensive to them.
Actually, maybe Juri isn't so far off, as these Korean nationalists are most certainly rabid and crazy. Of course, this is a nasty stereotype about a sub-group of people, but it certainly does exist.
My favorite Korean stereotype is that they claim everything came from Korea. I didn't want to believe it, but I've seen it come up too many times in person.
Okay, I'm trying to be relatively inoffensive here, can Iggy please come in and be more racist for me?
青春謳歌 弱肉強食
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| kofoguz 827th Post
Red Carpet Regular Member+
| "Re(3):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Old New, Ne" , posted Sat 13 Mar 19:45
quote:
No offense, but what exactly are "Korean traits," exactly? This isn't the first time I've heard this so I've been wondering about it for a while. I don't claim to know much about Korea, but if I were to define a country's culture by its fighting game characters, everyone in Korea would run around in TKD pants with a Korean flag pasted somewhere on them either fighting delinquents or being delinquents. Is there a Korean character out there that doesn't fall under this stereotype that one can look at and say "yes this character is definitely Korean?"
Good points.
But I think this is one of those "I'll know it when I see it" cases. People want something fresh that makes them think "oh cool, this character reflects their nation in a meaningful way." Based on the comments on this board, i would say that Hakan fits that bill.
Exactly. If I had the chance, I couldnt make any better Oil-wrestler for (Street Fighter) other than Hakan.
Saying this I wanna say How I wanted to see a Felicia/Cham Cham case with KOF XIII/SSFIV. Unused designs for KOFXII/KOFXIII (especially mongol one), gives strength to my hopes.
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| Iggy 9081th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(5):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Old New, Ne" , posted Sat 13 Mar 23:39
quote:
Okay, I'm trying to be relatively inoffensive here, can Iggy please come in and be more racist for me?
Korean complains about Juri are incredibly stupid. First, she wouldn't look Korean (but then, what would, except a gi or a traditional robe that wouldn't make TKD easy). Then, her breasts are too small (... for a Korean woman...? Really?)
Then, her stage is insulting, because it doesn't represent the country as it is now, but Korea as it was 20 years ago, or so they say. First, It's like if Mumbai people complained on the Indian stage because it doesn't show buildings and modern stuff. And besides, it's not like all Korea has been razed and rebuilt anew in 2005...
So, yeah. I think some people have such a huge thirst for recognition that they'll be unsatisfied at absolutely everything they'll be given. This side of Eurasia, we call them drama queen.
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| ONSLAUGHT 3883th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Mmmhh..." , posted Sun 14 Mar 03:42
quote:
Okay, I'm trying to be relatively inoffensive here, can Iggy please come in and be more racist for me?
Korean complains about Juri are incredibly stupid. First, she wouldn't look Korean (but then, what would, except a gi or a traditional robe that wouldn't make TKD easy). Then, her breasts are too small (... for a Korean woman...? Really?)
Then, her stage is insulting, because it doesn't represent the country as it is now, but Korea as it was 20 years ago, or so they say. First, It's like if Mumbai people complained on the Indian stage because it doesn't show buildings and modern stuff. And besides, it's not like all Korea has been razed and rebuilt anew in 2005...
So, yeah. I think some people have such a huge thirst for recognition that they'll be unsatisfied at absolutely everything they'll be given. This side of Eurasia, we call them drama queen.
I guess people will complain no matter what (notable exception with Kofoguz and Hakan, but still, it's only his opinion, we don't know what the rabid masses think yet).
1.-If the character has an appareance that makes you think "oh, that guy is from USA/Japan/Russia/etc" (even if those traits are lifted directly from tv shows or comics), he/she will invariably be an stereotype, and people will bitch about it.
2.-If he/she doesn't have certain national traits (again, stereotypes), people will cry "oh, that guy doesn't look american/japanese/russian/etc. at all!".
Number 1 and 2 happened here in Mexico with El Fuerte and T. Hawk respectively, and either one is always a shitstorm when brought to discussion.
What people don't realize, is that a country has a huge diversity depending on the geographic zone. In Mexico you can find, blondes, blacks, browns and a mixture of them. People from the north of the country is usually (but not always) taller and whiter, while southern people is usually (again, not always) shorter and with darker skin tones. Not everybody speaks with the same accent or even use the same slang (as a person that has been living most of his life in the south part, I sure have a hard time trying to understand what the hell the people from Mexico City are trying to say most of the time), that varies from state to state, hell, not everybody speaks spanish here, there are tons of dialects that still survive and are used in towns that are far from the main cities mostly.
So, how do you represent a mexican in fiction? Do you go with the lazy way of representing him as a short, brown noisy guy with a heavy accent? sure, it is accurate enough, but a tall, blonde and educated mexican is not hardly unheard of, but then again, if they do choose that way, people will still say he doesn't look like a mexican at all (even if the persons saying that are blondes themselves... yeah,stupid people), and if they use a luchador, mariachi or whatever, people will say he's a goddamn stereotype and that they don't have imagination anymore... fucking people.
In any case I'm happy with both T. Hawk and El Fuerte design-wise, even if people joke about T. Hawk being an illegal alien living in Mexico.
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| Toxico 4885th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
|  "Re(6):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Old New, Ne" , posted Sun 14 Mar 07:20
quote:
. Then, her breasts are too small (... for a Korean woman...? Really?)
Most korean drawers that I have checked upon draw female breasts with a size as such, that you might be inclined to believe that you taking a trip in one of those "house of mirriors" that distort your image and make you look funny... for example.... Perhaps, that's what they where aiming for?
From the asian cultures that I have bothered to more or less read info about, Korean seems to be the one that has more strongly fused asian + american influence (and wasn't forced to do so by an oppressing government), but this can only be seen when we are speaking at certains "hip levels".... This tendency, however, is clearly denied by them, and as such we can see cases like the one that Polly described (I did it!, my idea!).
For the record, if this is Juri's stage, then I'll have to say, that I find it out of place for one of the villains to be fighting in such a homely environment. It feels so out of place, that it is almost like a 5 year old child that doesn't quake in panic next to "my years 50's B monster movie" like presence.
目に焼きつけて、死ぬがいい・・・
Update 21 as of 29/01/10 (Temporary mega upload link).
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Last update : Chapter 15 as of 21/01/10
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| Maou 1945th Post
Gold Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Executive
| "Re(7):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Old New, Ne" , posted Sun 14 Mar 12:58:
I think Juri's a bit odd in Street Fighter if only because the characters have usually been illustrative of some representative (as opposed to the more negative stereotypical, though they can mingle) facet of their culture. Juri I would have expected to have some more traditional Korean garb or some sort of martial arts motif, so she's definitely unusual for a SF character in that she pointedly has a nation but that it doesn't really tie into her character's image.
Naturally, we all know that not everyone in a culture can be represented by one image, but certain images are so important culturally that people will even permit it to represent themselves to some extent. Like, no one in Japan seriously thinks that it's all karate masters and geisha all day, nor will an American seriously think of their society as being distilled soley in a colonial figure or a romantic horseriding cowboy on the prairie or something, but these are reasonably evocative images that they themselves might use in invoking their own culture---even while knowing in the back of their mind that it's more complicated than that. It's sort of a form of 'self-exoticization' or at least presenting an archtype of one's own culture, but many people would dig it if the image presented is cool enough. Chinese girls all love Chun Li, and who can't admire Ryu or Guile even if they're almost comically over-the-top archtypes?
There's a few characters who stray from this in the original cast (Sagat not being very "Thai" and Blanka being...something, and it sure isn't capoeira), but the core 'cultural icon' cast generally works because even if they're not fully representative, they're cool enough that a person from the culture in question could conceivably think, "Yeah, that's sort of part of what my country is about." Stateless characters are much harder. I think dictator Vega is one of the great accomplishments for doing it so well among an otherwise culture-focused cast.
人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は．．．
[this message was edited by Maou on Sun 14 Mar 13:03] |
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Or it makes Zangief really comfortable...
"Re(3):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):Old New, New News?" , posted Thu 11 Mar 10:50
It turns out after reading it is just some themes for the 360.