| Original message (3544 Views )
|
Replies: |
| kofoguz 663th Post
 
Red Carpet Regular Member
  
    
    
|  "Re(5):Rumor: If fans demand, we could make CV" , posted Tue 20 Jan 05:25
quote:
Speaking of which, a lot of people are intrigued by the fact SNKP calls KOF98UM and 02UM the "UM series".
It may just mean "there are two games, that's a series for you", but some people went mad speculating what other UM game they could do (KOF 2001 or XI UM, with the system of the original game and all the characters from 02UM, for example).
And now, a few of them (us?) want a Nejibako UM (where "UM" would just mean "lots of copipe under the supervision of Neogeo Hakase"), and that would be awesome.
One thing is certain : I think NO ONE wants a SvC Chaos UM.
Well, If you consider Tenka as UM... Btw I do want a lot of remake's under the supervision of Neogeo Hakase.
But I do want another chance for SVC, at least in the new style. Thinking of what magic they did for KoF classics in KOFXII, (chin, kensou, joe especially) one cant help dreaming.
[sigtag][/sigtag]
|
| Gojira 2502th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
    
    
 
| "Re(5):Rumor: If fans demand, we could make CV" , posted Tue 20 Jan 06:16
quote:
But I always welcome NGBC2.
Speaking of which, a lot of people are intrigued by the fact SNKP calls KOF98UM and 02UM the "UM series".
It may just mean "there are two games, that's a series for you", but some people went mad speculating what other UM game they could do (KOF 2001 or XI UM, with the system of the original game and all the characters from 02UM, for example).
And now, a few of them (us?) want a Nejibako UM (where "UM" would just mean "lots of copipe under the supervision of Neogeo Hakase"), and that would be awesome.
One thing is certain : I think NO ONE wants a SvC Chaos UM.
I think SNKP was quite tired enough of the whole Nejibako testing thing.
Personally I think the time is ripe for a Fuun Super Tag UM. Think of it, finally they can add all the original characters! And being UM they will also add random AoF2 characters! Because they're the only sprites that were the right size!
shipoopi
|
| HAYATO 892th Post
Red Carpet Regular Member++
| "Re(3):Re(10):Rumor: If fans demand, we could" , posted Thu 22 Jan 16:34
quote:
Why won't Capcom and SNK end the fuck buddy relationship and just hurry up and get married
Because both of them are dead!!
C'mon, it's time to admit it: all of us here are worshipping a pair of corpses!!! Stop paying heed to that Ono necromancer, things won't return to what they used to be!!!!
Fellow cafers, just follow my example and let things go their natural way. If you love those franchises, don't torture yourselves pointlessly by asking for new installments, just assume they won't ever return in their former glory and leave them behind. As far as I'm concerned, I'd rather see them dead than bastardized ad nauseam for quick bucks.
Please Maese, If you love Darkstalkers, leave them stalking from the Dark... forever.
|
| Iron D 3157th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(4):Re(10):Rumor: If fans demand, we could" , posted Fri 23 Jan 01:51
quote:
Why won't Capcom and SNK end the fuck buddy relationship and just hurry up and get married
Because both of them are dead!!
C'mon, it's time to admit it: all of us here are worshipping a pair of corpses!!! Stop paying heed to that Ono necromancer, things won't return to what they used to be!!!!
I'm pretty much a pessimist when it comes to everything in life. I KNOW that the fighting game community won't be it's mid-to-late-90's self again. Still, when something like SFIV actually happens when no one thought it would, and then it actually turns out to be good which also wasn't expected, you can't help but feel like there may actually be hope for other things.
Plus, I tend to think of the fighting game community as having changed rather than no longer existing "the way it was". Online play really has revitalized fighting games and is actually making money. And when games make money , they get sequels. SSF2THDR doing well in sales and being played a lot bodes well for us all.
quote:
As far as I'm concerned, I'd rather see them dead than bastardized ad nauseam for quick bucks.
I'm pretty sure that image is a fake. It's cruel to even make us think even for a second that Sega might make a sequel to that piece of shit. Shame on you, Hayato.
quote:
Please Maese, If you love Darkstalkers, leave them stalking from the Dark... forever.
I still think that with how well done, cartoony and full of character the character models were in SFIV, a new DS done in a similar style could potentially be awesome...maybe.
Er.....
|
| Ishmael 3383th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(6):Re(10):Rumor: If fans demand, we could" , posted Fri 23 Jan 05:35
quote:
Well I just made a quick google search in order to find a random contemporary Sonic pic to illustrate my point of view, I didn't even bother to read the title of the game. Besides, I couldn't care less about whether it is a fake or not, not anymore...
I just can't stand seeing my childhood raped again and again, so that's why I'd like my fond memories as a teen gamer to remain safe. Please, someone stop this!!!
I'm not picking on you Hayato with the proceeding but the phrasing in your post caused my mind to wander.
What is the deal with that "raping my childhood" phrase? Putting aside the vulgar choice of words, why do people get so upset when a product continues to adapt to the marketplace? Most people don't stalk former lovers they used to be in relationships with, or have their pets or family members taxidermied when they die so they will always remained seated on the couch next to them or doing some other irrational thing that shows they are incapable of accepting change. But these same people will start to wail when something that is ultimately meaningless -such as a toy line, video game series or what have you- is altered by the corporations that control it in order to keep sales up. Why is this? Nostalgia is not a bad thing but I wonder if a sense of perspective is sometimes getting lost.
|
| Ktallguy 1074th Post
Red Carpet Premium Member
| "Re(8):Re(10):Rumor: If fans demand, we could" , posted Fri 23 Jan 09:04
I guess the point is that certain franchises, characters, etc. have special meaning and when they are realized for future in a way that bastardizes the brand or characters, it's somewhat of a waste.
For example, I like SF4 and I think that Capcom has taken great care to balance the old and the new. But games like Shadowrun (an old cyberpunk RPG) being turned into a multiplayer Xbox 360 shooter for some inexplicable reason, or the Mechwarrior franchise being ran into the ground and turned into an arcady shooter, those are the kinds of things that annoy me the most.
Most people who purchase franchises fail to capture the essence of what made that franchise so special in the first place, and look at it as an installed fan base which they can continue to phone in half asses expansions. Some THINK that they are doing the best they can to stay true to the original, but misunderstand and end up failing to some degree.
Sonic Unleashed is a great example, as interviews with the producer showed that he thought "Sonic is all about speed!", when in reality the old Sonics had much more than speed, and the speed was doled out in portions, not a constant thing (in Sonic Unleashed, you're constantly moving fast at all times with no time to really breathe or react to anything).
Fallout 3 is mixed for me, as I think the creators really tried to respect the franchise and do it justice in the best way they could. However it still lacked the quality in writing of the originals, and there were some poor design decisions that marred the experience for me. However it's selling like gangbusters and earning high praises, so I imagine people don't really mind the deficiencies (I just got bored and stopped after a while).
Play to win.
|
| HAYATO 896th Post
Red Carpet Regular Member++
| "Re(7):Re(10):Rumor: If fans demand, we could" , posted Fri 23 Jan 17:08
quote:
Well I just made a quick google search in order to find a random contemporary Sonic pic to illustrate my point of view, I didn't even bother to read the title of the game. Besides, I couldn't care less about whether it is a fake or not, not anymore...
I just can't stand seeing my childhood raped again and again, so that's why I'd like my fond memories as a teen gamer to remain safe. Please, someone stop this!!!
I'm not picking on you Hayato with the proceeding but the phrasing in your post caused my mind to wander.
What is the deal with that "raping my childhood" phrase? Putting aside the vulgar choice of words, why do people get so upset when a product continues to adapt to the marketplace? Most people don't stalk former lovers they used to be in relationships with, or have their pets or family members taxidermied when they die so they will always remained seated on the couch next to them or doing some other irrational thing that shows they are incapable of accepting change. But these same people will start to wail when something that is ultimately meaningless -such as a toy line, video game series or what have you- is altered by the corporations that control it in order to keep sales up. Why is this? Nostalgia is not a bad thing but I wonder if a sense of perspective is sometimes getting lost.
Perhaps it isn't a lack of perspective, it could simply be a matter of what perspective suits you best...
I am of the opinion that some things can get perfected to a certain degree and, should this level be attained, one should stop pushing further, lest you end ruining the whole thing. Some people should argue that there's always room for improvement and I respect that but, concerning videogames, time has proven that the truth is on my side.
I'm not saying that the new installments of those decades-spanning franchises are utter crap in their entirety (some of them, like SFIV are pretty amusing and even technically groundbreaking) but it's pretty clear (based on the huge amount of panning reviews these titles generally get) that some have lost those essential traits that made them unique and appealing for its original audience.
It may be due to a radical change in the habits and preferences of the youngest generations of gamers, and I'm pretty sure that the poor bastards new customers (those who are in their mid-teens now) would find those new installments pretty amusing, be it for the sole reason that they don't know what they've been missing all these years or because the firms made a succesful revamping of their products, "bringing them to a new age of gaming"...
But the fact is that the 90's ended long ago, I'm older and not as easy to amaze as I was back then. In other words: I've changed, and my world with me. The same could be said of the videogame industry and the companies that made me vibrate of eagerness with their games. The original teams that created those franchises I cherished dissapeared years ago, and they'll never join again, so the chances of getting a game of said franchise of my time, made by the people who worked on it then and designed to suit the tastes of people of my age are impossible. And what's even more important to me: no new game will be able to get into me like those I played as a child, no game will provide me with such deep and joyful experiences, because my time of discovering and experiencing the novelty of the media ended long ago. Even if let's say, SFV' ends being a complete HD rehash of SFIII, I'll never be able to feel what I did when I saw SFIII:NG for the first time on my local arcade, or the people I befriended while playing it. If so, while in front of that superb SFV', now adapted to a new playing generation "in HD and with moar lens flarez" I'd recall playing the original SFIII, and then I'd start realizing how old I am and how crappy the industy has become, which is the opposite to what I call "having fun".
And that, ladies and gentlemen, is why I became a true bitch for emulators...
|
| Toxico 4639th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
|  "Re(10):Re(10):Rumor: If fans demand, we could" , posted Fri 23 Jan 22:36
quote:
So wait...SF3 alienated SF2 fans and SF4 brings back SF2 fans, but alienates SF3 fans. So who's a bastard here?
For better or worse SFIII was a very big change from the Zero or 'II series. When rumors of 'IV' popped out a lot of people wanted & expected a fresh, new, different game that will eventually grow & gain life of it's own. And as such, the current SF IV is nothing but a wasted chance, and does certainly noy intend to step away from it's train of thought even if further revisions pop out.
Aswering the previous questions, "yes", there are bastards that didn't disliked neither II nor III, but are alienated by IV 
目に焼きつけて、死ぬがいい・・・
Last updated : 20/01/09 (96 personajes)
|
| karasu99
54th Post
Occasional Customer
| "Re(2):Re(10):Re(10):Rumor: If fans demand, we" , posted Sat 24 Jan 05:33:
quote:
For better or worse SFIII was a very big change from the Zero or 'II series. When rumors of 'IV' popped out a lot of people wanted & expected a fresh, new, different game that will eventually grow & gain life of it's own. And as such, the current SF IV is nothing but a wasted chance, and does certainly noy intend to step away from it's train of thought even if further revisions pop out.
Aswering the previous questions, "yes", there are bastards that didn't disliked neither II nor III, but are alienated by IV
It's hard to say how I feel about SFIV-- I'm glad it was made, and I think that as a 3D game, it's about as good as you can get in terms of closeness in style to 2D. But I agree with you about it being a wasted chance. I remember all the anticipation regarding the cast, and it ended up being... just the SF2 cast.. and, oh yeah, these 4 new guys. While I think the anticipation of there being people from SFIII in there bordered on the obsessive, I'm shocked they couldn't even work in someone like Alex, who is a crossover appearance whore to begin with, but that they strangely decided to include people from Zero. I think one SFIII'er would have been enough to satisfy almost everyone.
But speaking personally, I'm just tired of seeing the whole pre-Super SF2 cast slotted in their entirety over and over into games. I see the whole 'retro' and 'nostalgia' thing being partly responsible in this case-- Capcom feels like they can sell a $60, 3D version of a 16 year old 2D game with a comfortable, familiar cast much more easily than they could a 3D fighting game with unfamiliar systems and 2 or 3 familiar faces in an otherwise all-new cast, and listen for years as people complain about how their favorite from SF2 didn't make the cut. For those of us who didn't stop playing the SF series long enough ago, though, it just ends up seeming like a stale retread in a lot of ways.
Guwahhhh. What am I talking about? It's not as if I won't buy it or something. I just wish there was a chance in hell that they would ever make a new 2D SF. I mean, try to imagine if KOF: Maximum Impact had been the direction the real KOF series had gone in.
EDIT: I realize this just reiterates what has already been said, so it's probably not a very useful comment. But still, it has the strength of my Gigantic Emotion behind it. 
[this message was edited by karasu99 on Sat 24 Jan 05:49] |
| Iron D 3158th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(3):Re(10):Re(10):Rumor: If fans demand, we" , posted Sat 24 Jan 05:57
quote:
Guwahhhh. What am I talking about? It's not as if I won't buy it or something. I just wish there was a chance in hell that they would ever make a new 2D SF. I mean, try to imagine if KOF: Maximum Impact had been the direction the real KOF series had gone in.
There is a big difference here, though. You see, KoF Max Impact was shit, while SFIV is actually pretty good. A better comparison would have been SF EX being the direction the SF series went in.
Quite frankly, I'm not down with the argument against SFIV being strictly that it's NOT 2d. I wasn't feeling too good about it when it was first announced, but seeing what they did with the 3d changed my mind. The game is still beautiful and most importantly it still plays like SF. Not only that, but gameplay wise it's about as much old gameplay as new...this is about as good an example I can think of something being simultaneously new while still being close enough to it's roots that even old school SF2 players like it.
So not only has SFIV to a large extent reinvigorated the already established fanbase, but brought in people who haven't played SF in a long time. It's got enough of the old and new. And if pre-purchases are any indication, it'll sell like hotcakes. So where is the "wasted opportunity"?
Er.....
|
| karasu99
54th Post
Occasional Customer
| "Re(4):Re(10):Re(10):Rumor: If fans demand, we" , posted Sat 24 Jan 06:42
quote:
There is a big difference here, though. You see, KoF Max Impact was shit, while SFIV is actually pretty good. A better comparison would have been SF EX being the direction the SF series went in.
Quite frankly, I'm not down with the argument against SFIV being strictly that it's NOT 2d. I wasn't feeling too good about it when it was first announced, but seeing what they did with the 3d changed my mind. The game is still beautiful and most importantly it still plays like SF. Not only that, but gameplay wise it's about as much old gameplay as new...this is about as good an example I can think of something being simultaneously new while still being close enough to it's roots that even old school SF2 players like it.
So not only has SFIV to a large extent reinvigorated the already established fanbase, but brought in people who haven't played SF in a long time. It's got enough of the old and new. And if pre-purchases are any indication, it'll sell like hotcakes. So where is the "wasted opportunity"?
I'll agree-- "wasted opportunity" is a bit harsh. But I guess my feeling is that if they were going to make this excellent new 3D Street Fighter, I think they could have been a little more original regarding the cast. The Zero and SFIII games both took a chance with the cast on their first two rounds-- Zero by introducing non-SF Capcom properties like Guy and Sodom as well as new characters like Sakura. SFIII was to my mind much more radical in terms of cast by ONLY bringing back Ryu and Ken (and later Chun Li). I would have expected SFIV to follow suit-- it's years later, we've seen both SFIII and Zero play out as series in their own right. But instead (cast-wise), all Capcom did was play the nostalgia card in a big way and bring back the whole cast of SF2, and then add in a few new characters. I'm not including in this, by the way, the console exclusives, eve though they don't go very far against my point.
No matter how beautiful and well-crafted the game is (and it is!), nothing will stop me from being just a little disappointed in the character and aesthetic choices they made, that's all.
|
| Iron D 3159th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(2):I like biscuits" , posted Sun 25 Jan 07:10
quote:
It certainly beats the heck out of the days when fighters were based around either strikers or tag gameplay. Those were lean, difficult years.
You mean that period from about '99 to 2001 where every new fighting game had a tag formula of some sort? I never knew I would appreciate simple one-on-one fighting games as much as I did after all that.
quote:
In the last calendar year fighting games got rehashes, high definition 3D and 2D graphics, and online play. But, none of that, not even the sum of them all, translate to better games.
I would definitely say that what online play does translate to is a healthier and more sustainable community for fighting games. And that's certainly a good thing. Plus, I may not be much of a graphics whore, but better graphics certainly doesn't hurt.
As for the rehash part, we've had some original fighting games come out in the last year too (BlazBlue, Battle Fantasia). If these "rehases" are bothering you, then the original games are out there.
Er.....
|
| Count Hihihi
166th Post
Regular Customer
| "Re(3):I like biscuits" , posted Sun 25 Jan 19:27
I clearly replied to a post that claimed the last calendar year was exceptionally good when it comes to fighting games.
quote:
I would definitely say that what online play does translate to is a healthier and more sustainable community for fighting games. And that's certainly a good thing. Plus, I may not be much of a graphics whore, but better graphics certainly doesn't hurt.
Better graphics. What's the best selling fighting game in the united states? Shiny stuff sells, not good gameplay.
Oh, and..
quote:
Perhaps not but what those things did do was renew peoples interest in fighters. And renewed interest means sales, which in turn means more fighters, which in turn means that the companies producing those fighters will have to make quality titles to stand out, which in turn means...
better games
Online play is just another attraction to slap on top of a game, it can't be built upon to achieve a great fighting game. Why not read the latest Arc Systems interview at Gamasutra. If you don't agree with what they say, please, don't argue about it with me.
..And concerning such things as sales, communities, etc bullcrap arguments that should not concern the customer.. There is a game that didn't sell worth shit, didn't get any praise or was even acknowledged by the mainstream that is going to save your beloved SFIV. Yeah, the one that came before it. People still love it and play it. What matters is the product, nothing else. Why bring up anything else than the game? You can't really make a difference about anything else. All you can do is play the game.
Yeah, ok, you find sales charts so interesting.
I'm waiting for someone to bring up the great depression in relation to fighting games next.
Kotaku Ono and the Fanboy spirit.
|
| Iron D 3160th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(4):I like biscuits" , posted Sun 25 Jan 22:47
quote:
Online play is just another attraction to slap on top of a game, it can't be built upon to achieve a great fighting game. Why not read the latest Arc Systems interview at Gamasutra. If you don't agree with what they say, please, don't argue about it with me.
..And concerning such things as sales, communities, etc bullcrap arguments that should not concern the customer.. There is a game that didn't sell worth shit, didn't get any praise or was even acknowledged by the mainstream that is going to save your beloved SFIV. Yeah, the one that came before it. People still love it and play it. What matters is the product, nothing else. Why bring up anything else than the game? You can't really make a difference about anything else. All you can do is play the game.
Yeah, ok, you find sales charts so interesting.
I'm waiting for someone to bring up the great depression in relation to fighting games next.
......I really hope this is a joke or sarcasm.
Er.....
|
| Variable Savior 463th Post
Gold Customer
| "Re(4):I like biscuits" , posted Mon 26 Jan 03:40
quote:
Online play is just another attraction to slap on top of a game, it can't be built upon to achieve a great fighting game. Why not read the latest Arc Systems interview at Gamasutra. If you don't agree with what they say, please, don't argue about it with me.
..And concerning such things as sales, communities, etc bullcrap arguments that should not concern the customer.. There is a game that didn't sell worth shit, didn't get any praise or was even acknowledged by the mainstream that is going to save your beloved SFIV. Yeah, the one that came before it. People still love it and play it. What matters is the product, nothing else. Why bring up anything else than the game? You can't really make a difference about anything else. All you can do is play the game.
Yeah, ok, you find sales charts so interesting.
I'm waiting for someone to bring up the great depression in relation to fighting games next.
Wow - your response was sooooo BADASS
no... wait, just ASS
seriously though, why did you even respond?
Blood marks heaven's path
|
| Ktallguy 1079th Post
Red Carpet Premium Member
| "Re(6):I like biscuits" , posted Mon 26 Jan 13:51:
quote:
SFIV doesn't have a single element that allows people of all skill levels to "do something." It still has 6 buttons, complicated commands for special moves (+ EX stuff), and even more complicated commands for super and ultra moves. Pressing two buttons at once for a charge attack isn't going to create a fighting game revolution.
Chaz basically said it for me. The target is casual players who loved (on a basic level) SF in the past, not people who have never touched a fighting game before. And even people who have never touched a fighting game before can grasp things like push away from your opponent to block, push up to jump, and hit button near opponent to hit them. From there, if there's lasting interest, they can start learning special moves(and the SF4 inputs are much easier than previous iterations). Even basic attacks in SF4 are very flashy, and the hit effects are over the top. Good players will crush a beginner, but players of equal skill level can still have fun.
Virtua Fighter is a game that I love, but there's a myriad of things that make it unattractive to the new player. The simpler moves aren't very flashy at all, so people get bored quickly. The 3 button system appears to be very straightforward, but you have to time directional input with button pressing very precisely in order to perform any moves other than standard P or K moves. Throw timing is very strict, and there are a lot of multiple button moves combined with directional presses, even on the "beginner" characters. Character movement is slow unless you know how to crouch dash. Also, many people mash the guard button accidentally and get confused.
In my opinion, VF is a game where you have to put a lot into it to get something out of it. But I think Ono has succeeded in making a game where you can still enjoy it without sitting down and studying it.
/rant
Play to win.
[this message was edited by Ktallguy on Mon 26 Jan 13:53] |
|
|
) is a good thing, as far as I'm concerned. And SFIV seems to have done so in a big way, at least based on the numbers of near middle-agers like me who I've heard express their eager anticipation for its console release-- many of whom I didn't even know played games, let alone fighting games.