Fatal Fury BA2 - http://www.mmcafe.com/ Forums


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Ishmael
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"Fatal Fury BA2" , posted Sun 20 Apr 04:51post reply

I picked up the US release of FFBA2 and outside of the odd blood editing and my inability to unlock Nightmare Geese it's a fun port. If nothing else it's great to be able to play the games without sitting through the load times on the Saturn.

But as I was replaying these games it made me start to wonder about how they were received. Was there -or is there still- a competitive scene for any of these games? Were they a success for SNK? While I like the games I wish I knew a bit more about them.






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Toxico
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"Re(1):Fatal Fury BA2" , posted Sun 20 Apr 05:33post reply

quote:
Was there -or is there still- a competitive scene for any of these games? Were they a success for SNK? While I like the games I wish I knew a bit more about them.



Real bout 2 hasn't really died on some circuits, from time to time chazmaru pops up as a strange advertisement with youtube vids about it, then again I think you can still found Fatal Fury Special and Karnov Revenge players through japanese communities.

At least on my country, Fatal Fury special and Real Bout 1 where incredible wildely and widely player all over, so finding oposition was incredibly easily done, even now days you can find hot shots for most 85 ~ current day games.

Now one can stop the reppuken now





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Red falcon
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"Re(1):Fatal Fury BA2" , posted Sun 20 Apr 06:49post reply

quote:

But as I was replaying these games it made me start to wonder about how they were received. Was there -or is there still- a competitive scene for any of these games? Were they a success for SNK? While I like the games I wish I knew a bit more about them.

Yeah, people still play them. Check around Youtube and Niconico for Japanese match vids.





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Iggy
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"Re(1):Fatal Fury BA2" , posted Sun 20 Apr 07:25post reply

I think at the time RB and RBSP had a reasonable success.
But RBSP was quite unbalanced, and RB2 fixed that (amongst other things and becoming a widely superior game) but by nerfing severely the most powerful characters. There was an uproar amongst those who used these characters, and most of them hated RB2 because of all possibilities they felt they had lost.
Players who began with RB2 didn't know about these nerfs, enjoyed the game and were really happy about it; but the schism was fatal to the immediate popularity of the game. Ironically, Geese is supposed to have lost many things between RBSP and RB2. Seeing how he's one of the strongest characters of RB2, I can't imagine how he was back in RBSP.

I think RB2 may be SNK's 3rd strike : one of the best games they ever created, a financial failure, and a popularity that grew so strong with the years that the unpopularity of the game at the time seems unbelievable.
Or maybe more like Vampire Savior : the game was actually killed by the bad business decisions of the company, while Third Strike was killed by the CPS3 itself to begin with, then by the neet who learned to parry on the first SF3 and prevented any new player from learning the basics.

But then, I wasn't much of an SNK fan at the time, so maybe I just misunderstood what I've heard.
That makes me think I need to do that Vampire appreciation thread.





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"Re(2):Fatal Fury BA2" , posted Sun 20 Apr 08:29post reply

quote:

Ironically, Geese is supposed to have lost many things between RBSP and RB2. Seeing how he's one of the strongest characters of RB2, I can't imagine how he was back in RBSP.



RBS Nightmare Geese = Shin Gouki broken.





Toxico
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"Re(2):Fatal Fury BA2" , posted Sun 20 Apr 13:18:post reply

quote:
There was an uproar amongst those who used these characters, and most of them hated RB2 because of all possibilities they felt they had lost.



Not only the imbecile characters where nerfed, but due to a system mechanics change, players could no longer get 80% ~ 150% health combos from a low quick, and they felt that "it was ok before", thus most likely they switched to Guilty Gear right away .

Real Bout 2 was more about working damage, instead of landing a short hop or a low kick near the corner; it was as if RB2 took the old garous as basis, and RBS took RB as basis

Also, as a hidden boss; Geese not only had almost every move from his move list up to that date, but most of the moves where stupidly overpowered; add new moves to that and he enjoys the 'jab / low kick -> incredible damage' universal rule of the game.

quote:

while Third Strike was killed by the CPS3 itself to begin with, then by the neet who learned to parry on the first SF3 and prevented any new player from learning the basics.



The Sean bonus game was a stupid idea to begin with





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[this message was edited by Toxico on Sun 20 Apr 13:31]

Red Falcon
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"Re(2):Fatal Fury BA2" , posted Sun 20 Apr 13:28:post reply

quote:
I can't imagine how he was back in RBSP.



He's incredibly silly, but he also isn't legitimately playable.

Edit: I also know this isn't the place to really say it, but I'm debating having some sort of "Maryland/Virginia/etc. MMcafe get together" again, it's been years since the last one, and I've been severely bored and depressed recently. Will probably post a thread about it soon.





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[this message was edited by Red Falcon on Sun 20 Apr 13:29]

Iron D
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"Re(3):Fatal Fury BA2" , posted Sun 20 Apr 16:44post reply

I got my copy. I find all of stuff in this thread about RB actually still having a community of players surprising, since I've heard very little about any of the RB games anywhere (including the MMCafe itself).

I bought the game simply for RB2, which I was fortunate enough to have found an arcade that had it years ago. I thought it was awesome, and almost as good as MotW. I didn't think there would be any way for me play it at home without getting a MVS emulator. It feels so good to finally own it.

Now WHERE. THE. HECK. IS. SAMURAI. SHOWDOWN. ANTHOLOGY!?!





Er.....

chazumaru
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"Re(2):Fatal Fury BA2" , posted Sun 20 Apr 20:07post reply

quote:
<Iggy's big post>

I think you wrote a fairly valid analysis.

The Real Bout trilogy was mostly eclipsed by KOF's "Orochi" period: strongest popularity period of KOF, growing fandom of specific KOF fans to the detriment of the original concept, growing feeling that one should rather wait for KOF to compile new interesting characters and gameplay gimmicks rather than invest time an dmoney in the other games, etc.

One should remember that Garou Densetsu / Final Fantasy was the Pepsi of fighting games prior to the 32bit era, then almost commited seppuku with Garou 3. The Garou team can be commended for saving their series after Garou 3's failure and creating such a unique but fun and accessible gameplay that it could find its own niche.

Regarding RB2's popularity in particular, it also suffered the fate of being the only Real Bout game that never got a console port until Battle Archives 2 came along (NGCD notwithstanding). Whereas RBS got the Saturn port and the PS special version. That probably played a role in the low popularity of the game in 1998-1999, until emaluation probably helped it as much as the Dreamcast helped Street Fighter III.

I also remember that the announcement of RB2 was met with a lot of disappointment by non-hardcore Garou fans (and even some Garou fans) as it seemed it did not bring much novelty (same engine as RBS, only two characters, no storyline development etc.). The nerfing probably got RBS fans to shit on the final version early on, which probably helped killing off the buzz around the game. And then you can add that it was released in the Heaven-or-Hell-Year 1998, so people had PLENTY of choice for their fighting tastes.

Regarding RB2's resurging popularity, I believe this always happen when a game is actually really fucking good and polished and deep enough that a small community can dig into it for years. The same happened for 3rd Strike, which is still played in both JP and US tournaments.

All of which is quite unbelievable when the more popular Zero series is now on hiatus. Ponder on the fact that Zero 3 PS版 was the last million selling 2D fighting game! Even the Jump games on DS did not achieve that. I am not implying that Zero3 is a bad fighting game, but I get the feeling it was more a vox populi kind of game, almost too popular and accepted to create a tight-knit community. I am sure a lot of core fans still pop up Zero3 from times to times, but it seems to me that most of its core fans drifted to Guilty Gear (at least this is what happened in Europe) while all the casual buyers simply quit 2D fighting games altogether.

On the other hand, I don't think anything replaced 3S or RB2 - or VS for that matter - in their respective communities. I mean, MotW is a completely different game (actually it almost creates a bridge between RB and 3S in a twisted way). So I think that is why the community is still there and active, and always eager to randomly promote the game's qualities (without even being asked to, as Toxico mentioned about me a few posts ahead). And as long as there is a community, there will always be curious newcomers.

The three RB games managed to have enough connections (so you don't feel lost) and differences (so you don't feel bored) between each other, while remaining insanely fun, that this is a very solid compilation in my book. I am still avoiding buying it because I already have all three on NEOGEO, but the cover is really nice too (although I have not seen the US one). I think I'll get it at some point.





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Oroch
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"Re(2):Fatal Fury BA2" , posted Sun 20 Apr 20:41:post reply

quote:

But as I was replaying these games it made me start to wonder about how they were received. Was there -or is there still- a competitive scene for any of these games? Were they a success for SNK? While I like the games I wish I knew a bit more about them.
Yeah, people still play them. Check around Youtube and Niconico for Japanese match vids.



YOU shouldn't be allowed to play RB :( at least thats what I remember from that last get together :)





[this message was edited by Oroch on Sun 20 Apr 20:45]

Toxico
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"Re(3):Fatal Fury BA2" , posted Mon 21 Apr 00:26post reply

quote:
Regarding RB2's popularity in particular, it also suffered the fate of being the only Real Bout game that never got a console port until Battle Archives 2 came along (NGCD notwithstanding).


I remember that the first mame release of real bout 2 took long loading times, something like 40 mins ~ 2 hours on fast computers; and from 20 hrs ~ 40 hrs in non upgraded computers... The good old days where mame was only know to people who wanted to clear Rastan Saga.

I think that 1 year after that the best neo rage version came out, and the whore house got crowded inmediatly.





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Ishmael
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"Re(4):Fatal Fury BA2" , posted Mon 21 Apr 04:35post reply

Thanks for helping fill in the blanks everyone. Even with the really up and down history of the FF series it seemed strange to me that a game as solid as RB2 appears to be was lost in the shuffle for so long. Now I understand why that happened.





Burning Ranger
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"Re(5):Fatal Fury BA2" , posted Tue 22 Apr 08:01post reply

I bought it last weekend. I've been waiting for this port for a while now and like many, now I don't need my Saturn to play RBS.

I'm a big fan of RBS and enjoy playing it for for the fun factor. Now I have to "Get in the Ring" with RB2. A little saddened that Mary is different.






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