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Ishmael
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"SF2HD news" , posted Wed 13 Feb 05:43post reply

Even though SF2HD is moving at a pace so glacial that it rivals an SNK title there is some new news. This time out it's the changes done to Blanka.






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Burning Ranger
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"Re(1):SF2HD news" , posted Wed 13 Feb 07:47post reply

quote:
Even though SF2HD is moving at a pace so glacial that it rivals an SNK title there is some new news. This time out it's the changes done to Blanka.



With SF IV now due out, maybe SSF2HD is irrelevant now. Still, would be nice to see more of the game.






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"Re(2):SF2HD news" , posted Wed 13 Feb 07:59post reply

quote:
With SF IV now due out, maybe SSF2HD is irrelevant now. Still, would be nice to see more of the game.


I have the feeling SF2² will be released before SF2HD.
Which is good for the later : as all new engines, SF2² will have its share of flaws, so "fans" will whine then jump on this if it is released not too long afterwards. It's not like it has any chance of being bad, being the 3rd revision of the 4th revision of the original game.





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"Re(3):SF2HD news" , posted Thu 14 Feb 00:41post reply

So what will be the end result of all this rebalancing? Will every character have an equal distribution of low risk-low reward, medium risk-medium reward, and high risk-high reward attacks so everyone can play competitively on an equal playing field or will we end up with some "rebalanced" moves that may be exploitable.

Its interesting to think that this was announced half a year before Street Fighter IV and we haven't really seen any real game footage yet outside some Ken and Ryu stuff a couple of months back.





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"Re(4):SF2HD news" , posted Thu 14 Feb 05:57post reply

quote:
So what will be the end result of all this rebalancing? Will every character have an equal distribution of low risk-low reward, medium risk-medium reward, and high risk-high reward attacks so everyone can play competitively on an equal playing field or will we end up with some "rebalanced" moves that may be exploitable.

Its interesting to think that this was announced half a year before Street Fighter IV and we haven't really seen any real game footage yet outside some Ken and Ryu stuff a couple of months back.



I'm not sure if equal distribution of all those things is going to be true, but for sure they've been doing a few things:
- making some things that were stupidly disadvantageous less so (see: Blanka ball)

- simplifying some motions to make it more about picking the right time to do it, rather than being able to perform a 4-frame 360 or whatever
(see: T-Hawk)

- giving some characters more options where they previously did not exist (see: T-Hawk and Blanka)

I don't think there's any doubt that SOMETHING is going to end up exploitable; after all, every character ought to have some strengths that you are going to end up playing to.... for instance, I don't think anybody considers fireball trapping to be an "exploit" any more.

But in the end it's still SF2.





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"Re(5):SF2HD news" , posted Thu 14 Feb 07:04post reply

Personally i'd rather have the Street Fighter Alpha series on Xbox Live! instead.





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"Re(6):SF2HD news" , posted Thu 14 Feb 07:46post reply

quote:
Personally i'd rather have the Street Fighter Alpha series on Xbox Live! instead.



Personally I'd rather have a new SF gam-

oh, right.





Ishmael
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"Re(7):SF2HD news" , posted Thu 13 Mar 03:55post reply

SF2HD beta is designed to sucker people into buying Commando 3.

To go along with the announcement two new shots of the game released. I like that Ryu's hand animation has been fixed but the palm imprint inside the fireball still has those psycho thumbs.





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"Re(8):SF2HD news" , posted Thu 13 Mar 06:19post reply

quote:

To go along with the announcement two new shots of the game released. I like that Ryu's hand animation has been fixed but the palm imprint inside the fireball still has those psycho thumbs.



http://blog.capcom.com/archives/998#more-998

Capcom admits SFHD looked like butt!!

It turns out they were pretty unhappy with how the sprites were turning out for SFHD and they went back and redid everything. I'm shocked really. That's very big of them to actually admit the game was below par, even with all the positive fan reaction. It's even bigger of them to take on increased financial risk to get a better looking game out. This has totally changed my oppinion on the entire project.

New sprites look much better. Much cleaner, with more intentional artistic decisions (less arbitrary lines, shading, anatomy etc).

Good for you Capcom!





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"Re(9):SF2HD news" , posted Thu 13 Mar 06:43post reply

I agree that it looks way better now. Sometimes simpler is better! I am pleased with these developments.





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"Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Thu 13 Mar 08:27post reply

This is more in tune with Adon's art style to begin with. Don't know why they tried to imitate KOF's "blocky" shading in the first place.





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"Re(2):Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Thu 13 Mar 08:48post reply

quote:
This is more in tune with Adon's art style to begin with. Don't know why they tried to imitate KOF's "blocky" shading in the first place.



Awesome! Now that Adon's drawing the game, everyone gets a Jaguar Tooth, right?!





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"Re(3):Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Thu 13 Mar 13:22post reply

http://www.gamespot.com/video/939066/6187674/super-street-fighter-ii-turbo-hd-remix-interview-1

Video! Looking a whole hell of a lot nicer than I thought it would. Quite happy with these developments.





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"Re(9):SF2HD news" , posted Thu 13 Mar 14:32:post reply

Better than the previous one. I'm glad quality was not compromised. i hated the previous look and design. there are still things to nitpick (fingers & smaller details) but its a great improvement. it still looks flat though. because the drawing is flat. even in two tones you can make it look not flat when its drawn correctly. The BG however still sucks.





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[this message was edited by D`Cloud on Thu 13 Mar 14:37]

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"Re(4):Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Thu 13 Mar 17:43post reply

quote:
http://www.gamespot.com/video/939066/6187674/super-street-fighter-ii-turbo-hd-remix-interview-1

Video! Looking a whole hell of a lot nicer than I thought it would. Quite happy with these developments.



And Youtube video.
I still care even less about the game than SF2². Bo-ring.





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"Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Thu 13 Mar 20:46post reply

quote:
Better than the previous one. I'm glad quality was not compromised. i hated the previous look and design. there are still things to nitpick (fingers & smaller details) but its a great improvement. it still looks flat though. because the drawing is flat. even in two tones you can make it look not flat when its drawn correctly. The BG however still sucks.



It looks very good, indeed. But I hope the producers change the health bars in the final version, because they look incredibly amateurish...





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Ishmael
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"Re(9):SF2HD news" , posted Fri 14 Mar 00:54:post reply

quote:

http://blog.capcom.com/archives/998#more-998

Capcom admits SFHD looked like butt!!


Not that's interesting. When news about SF2HD started to slow down I began to wonder if the resources dedicated to creating it had been reduced or if the game was going to be quietly cancelled. Instead it turns out they were rebooting the project. This game must be turning out to be a lot more work than was expected but I give everyone involved credit for being willing to sink the time and money necessary into the production in order to make the best game possible.

EDIT: Videos from Gametrailers and screenshots from IGN.





[this message was edited by Ishmael on Fri 14 Mar 04:21]

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"Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Fri 14 Mar 04:44post reply

Yeah, the game looks much nicer now that they removed most of the strange, artificial shadowing on the characters' muscles and clothes. Too bad the removed Q from the ship on Ken's background...





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"Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Fri 14 Mar 05:56post reply

quote:

EDIT: Videos from Gametrailers and screenshots from IGN.



The game still has a bunch of drawing and animation issues, for instance, Ken's head shrinks, grows and also changes between 2 or 3 different drawing styles. But it definitely looks better than before.





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"Re(9):SF2HD news" , posted Fri 14 Mar 10:24post reply

quote:
Capcom admits SFHD looked like butt!!

It turns out they were pretty unhappy with how the sprites were turning out for SFHD and they went back and redid everything. I'm shocked really. That's very big of them to actually admit the game was below par, even with all the positive fan reaction.


To be fair, they are still sticking with saying the outside company wasn't able to match the quality of the Udon keyframe work. They've just added the explanation that they were "aiming way too high" with the amount of detail present.

Rather than just admitting the Udon keyframes would be a nightmare for anyone to animate because of the inconsistencies (ranging from entirely fictional musculature to cut-and-paste headshots with the wrong angle to Guile's pants having random camo patterns.)





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"Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Fri 14 Mar 10:30post reply

quote:

To be fair, they are still sticking with saying the outside company wasn't able to match the quality of the Udon keyframe work. They've just added the explanation that they were "aiming way too high" with the amount of detail present.

Rather than just admitting the Udon keyframes would be a nightmare for anyone to animate because of the inconsistencies (ranging from entirely fictional musculature to cut-and-paste headshots with the wrong angle to Guile's pants having random camo patterns.)



No matter the spin, it's still big of them to do something like this... because it sounds like it's going to cost them a lot.





nobinobita
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"Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Fri 14 Mar 11:50post reply

quote:

To be fair, they are still sticking with saying the outside company wasn't able to match the quality of the Udon keyframe work. They've just added the explanation that they were "aiming way too high" with the amount of detail present.



I was jokingly reading behind the lines of their spin. Really, I'm very conflicted about this project. On the one hand it's great of them to spend the time and money to retool everything, on the other hand, they should have had quality control from the start.

Even if the game does look better than before, I still can't honestly say that I like it, but I feel like a jerk for pointing that out. This is very distressing for me because in the past Street Fighter has been a way for me to relate to people and make new friends, but now I feel like there's this unscalable wall between me and people who actually LIKE how these new games look (and I'm purely talking about graphics, not gameplay).





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"Re(2):Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Fri 14 Mar 12:12post reply

Watching these videos I will find one thing to bitch about, the music. It is not as upbeat as the originals, sounds more like those early 90s Sega CD remixes of games with the cheesy lounge/jazz style music. Doesn't get me as pumped up as the original.





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"Re(2):Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Fri 14 Mar 17:12post reply

quote:
I feel like a jerk for pointing that out.


Oh, I don't.





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"Re(3):Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Fri 14 Mar 17:37post reply

Oh, for the love of god. I just watched one of the videos, and what the hell did they do to Ryu's stance? Jerk-o-vision. It's like they aligned all the frames by the head instead of the feet.





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"Re(4):Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Fri 14 Mar 19:43post reply

IGN claims that you can switch to the original 2D sprites.

If this is true, and you can get the original sprite backgrounds as well, then we all win! Don't we?!!!!

PS: As for the animation... well, it's tough because you have comic artists doing animation, which is actually a totally different discipline. Sequential art is so different, I'm sure.





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"Re(5):Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Sat 15 Mar 07:51post reply

quote:

PS: As for the animation... well, it's tough because you have comic artists doing animation, which is actually a totally different discipline. Sequential art is so different, I'm sure.



I can't pardon this lack of ability though. They were hired to animate, so they should have done some research on how to do it properly. If they had just gone out and purchased The Animator's Survival Kit by Richard Williams and just followed what he outlines in there, they wouldn't have all these problems.

Looking at the SFHD animation makes me recall Animation 101, where lots of students were making the exact same mistakes. Also, I'm fairly sure alot of the Udon Crew studied animation in college. And on top of that, they're not even really animating, they're just redrawing frames, which is where I think things went wrong.

It seems like they approached each frame as a regular illustration, without regard to making motion paths and arcs to make sure that everything lined up across all the frames.

Their comics have the same issues, where character's faces and proportions can change drastically from panel to panel.

To me, these aren't nitpicky little issues, they are big glaring flaws that just shouldn't be in a professional product that money will be made from.





crazymike
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"Re(6):Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Sat 15 Mar 12:52post reply

quote:

To me, these aren't nitpicky little issues, they are big glaring flaws that just shouldn't be in a professional product that money will be made from.



Well how I look at it is this way. As a fan i expect the best, but as a graphic designer who just finished school, it is intimidating as a career because there will always be someone 10X better than you so I can relate to someone whose animations may not be top notch. I draw decently but not enough to even consider a career in Illustration. Unfortunately not everyone in the artistic field can be masters of the craft and video games are no different. It is not like the original SF2 sprites were perfect to begin with and they had just as much "problems"





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"sprite banzai" , posted Sat 15 Mar 13:22post reply

...the hell did I just watch? I swear, even Yie ar Kung Fu has better animation than this shoddy piece of crap.

Wake me when KOFXII hits...





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"Re(1):sprite banzai" , posted Sat 15 Mar 16:12:post reply

I cant judge the animation through the small quality but I would agree on what you guys said.

heres something that i dont like.. the damn fingers.
sf3 http://i25.tinypic.com/2crwmis.png [Image Attached]
sfhd http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3218/2328906567_1a9439ab66_o.jpg [Image Attached]
If they can place a proper finger on a small resolution game, they should be able to put a decent finger on an HD game.

EDIT: just saw the HQ at gamtrailers. HOLY crap you guys weren't kidding!! shit he looks like he's having a seizure!





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[this message was edited by D`Cloud on Sat 15 Mar 17:13]

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"Re(2):sprite banzai" , posted Sat 15 Mar 18:51post reply

The problems the Udon guys are having remind me of some of the biggest flaws in some recent SNKP games.
I wonder how many of them practice some kind of martial art. Many Capcom designers did, and that shows in SF, particularly in the way they took control of SF3.
Knowing how to move each limb of your body to move and hit efficiently was one of the reason Capcom dotters were so successful. Trying to emulate them without this background, and just trying to mimic "dynamic pauses" out of the blue is just doomed to fail.





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"Re(3):sprite banzai" , posted Sat 15 Mar 20:42post reply

quote:
The problems the Udon guys are having remind me of some of the biggest flaws in some recent SNKP games.
I wonder how many of them practice some kind of martial art. Many Capcom designers did, and that shows in SF, particularly in the way they took control of SF3.
Knowing how to move each limb of your body to move and hit efficiently was one of the reason Capcom dotters were so successful. Trying to emulate them without this background, and just trying to mimic "dynamic pauses" out of the blue is just doomed to fail.



I can't tell if you are being serious or not... Is that true?

Also, regarding the two pictures posted above, while I like the Third Strike more, at least now I can emulate Ryu's finger positions in the SSFIITHD one. That's definitely a step in the correct direction.





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"Re(4):sprite banzai" , posted Sat 15 Mar 22:08post reply

quote:
The problems the Udon guys are having remind me of some of the biggest flaws in some recent SNKP games.
I wonder how many of them practice some kind of martial art. Many Capcom designers did, and that shows in SF, particularly in the way they took control of SF3.
Knowing how to move each limb of your body to move and hit efficiently was one of the reason Capcom dotters were so successful. Trying to emulate them without this background, and just trying to mimic "dynamic pauses" out of the blue is just doomed to fail.


I can't tell if you are being serious or not... Is that true?

Also, regarding the two pictures posted above, while I like the Third Strike more, at least now I can emulate Ryu's finger positions in the SSFIITHD one. That's definitely a step in the correct direction.

yes, if your fingers have 4 segments. LOL.

regarding the animation, reference videos or acting out also helps along with the basic training.





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"Re(5):sprite banzai" , posted Sat 15 Mar 22:47post reply

Aw man, I thought you guys were exaggerating the problems with the animations till I watched the HD video. This sucks :(





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"Re(6):sprite banzai" , posted Sat 15 Mar 23:05post reply

quote:
Aw man, I thought you guys were exaggerating the problems with the animations till I watched the HD video. This sucks :(


Oh, god, I didn't see the Ryu vs Ryu video on GT. The standing animations suck! I really don't know why they would even allow that to be put on the net, it's totally horrible. The walking backwards animation also is pretty bad. The rest of the animations seem perfectly fine, so I don't know what the hell is happening with the other two: Shouldn't those be easy to notice AND correct?


quote:
yes, if your fingers have 4 segments. LOL.

In the new one, the position of the fingers is correct. Awkward, but anatomically correct. I don't see a problem there.





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"Re(5):sprite banzai" , posted Sun 16 Mar 04:04:post reply

Look, it's very simple.

In the original low-res SD, the space between pixels is 1 pixel. That same space in HD is 16 pixels. That's nearly 32 pixels of leeway, which is always going to lead to some jerkiness. Especially if the frames aren't all done by the same person, which by now we know they're not. All it takes is some minor realignment on a few of the animations.

Once again, Capcom shows that whoever does their PR is a pile of horseshit. Do they really think people aren't noticing the seams? That "work in progress" excuse is only going to get you so much sympathy from lazy consumers. DON'T SHOW UNFINISHED PROJECTS TO UNINFORMED PEOPLE!!! Jesus.





[this message was edited by Gojira on Sun 16 Mar 04:09]

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"Re(6):sprite banzai" , posted Sun 16 Mar 06:31post reply

quote:
Look, it's very simple.

In the original low-res SD, the space between pixels is 1 pixel. That same space in HD is 16 pixels. That's nearly 32 pixels of leeway, which is always going to lead to some jerkiness. Especially if the frames aren't all done by the same person, which by now we know they're not. All it takes is some minor realignment on a few of the animations.

Once again, Capcom shows that whoever does their PR is a pile of horseshit. Do they really think people aren't noticing the seams? That "work in progress" excuse is only going to get you so much sympathy from lazy consumers. DON'T SHOW UNFINISHED PROJECTS TO UNINFORMED PEOPLE!!! Jesus.



Another problem could also be that this is a video of it, which, as far as I could tell, has some occasionally lost frames (trust me, it's not my PC or connection doing it) almost throughout. Just look at the backgrounds, they're not moving as smooth as they could and that's in spots that there won't be any jerkiness (like the boat rising and falling), so I almost want to give them the benefit of the doubt and say that this is a combination of CLEARLY not being timed right for the animations yet and a video that's missing frames or is mistimed itself.





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"Re(7):sprite banzai" , posted Sun 16 Mar 06:58post reply

I think this would be the perfect time for them to cancel the whole game. If Capcom All-Stars got cancelled, why not this? Everyone who plans to buy this is going to get SFIV anyway.

DELICIOUS CANCEL PLZ





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"Re(8):sprite banzai" , posted Sun 16 Mar 09:36post reply

quote:
I think this would be the perfect time for them to cancel the whole game. If Capcom All-Stars got cancelled, why not this? Everyone who plans to buy this is going to get SFIV anyway.

DELICIOUS CANCEL PLZ



Easier said than done, mainly because of the amount of time and money they invested into this game. If you were in the same position, would you drop this project just like that? Common logic would have you try to recoup your losses, and to only scrap a project if it is totally unsalvageable, no? HD Remix seems to still have problems, but I don't think it's FUBAR.

As I said before, if they keep the option of using the original 2D sprites and backgrounds, I think it will still sell very well because people have a choice in the matter. It will especially be enticing if you can play using the old sprites and the updated gameplay mode at the same time.

With people commenting on the animation, one would have to wonder if this game would have been different had Capcom Japan still owned the rights to SF? In fact, would this game have even been considered at all?

I have a feeling this game will be great gameplay-wise, especially since Capcom have old SF pros like Seth Killian and Dave Sirlin in their building. I may buy this game for PS3, myself, but you can't help but worry when Dave Sirlin states that the game will be out this summer, and we have only seen Ken/Ryu fights in about 3-4 stages so far.





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"Re(6):sprite banzai" , posted Sun 16 Mar 14:33post reply

quote:
Once again, Capcom shows that whoever does their PR is a pile of horseshit. Do they really think people aren't noticing the seams? That "work in progress" excuse is only going to get you so much sympathy from lazy consumers. DON'T SHOW UNFINISHED PROJECTS TO UNINFORMED PEOPLE!!! Jesus.


There are people who have loved nearly everything shown from the start. Defending the flaws, and even denying their existence. Some even seriously preferred the flaws.

Personally, I want to see Sagat in action. That could get pretty funny, considering how Udon was originally changing his proportions between still frames.





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"Re(7):sprite banzai" , posted Mon 17 Mar 02:41post reply

quote:

In the new one, the position of the fingers is correct. Awkward, but anatomically correct. I don't see a problem there.

well sure but my hands dont look like that when i bend them like that. Try it & compare. It's far from exageration.





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"Re(2):sprite banzai" , posted Mon 17 Mar 16:32post reply

quote:
heres something that i dont like.. the damn fingers.
sf3 http://i25.tinypic.com/2crwmis.png [Image Attached]


No more complaining about how things look until you knock it off with ugly filters for emulators! Or did that just resize weird?

EITHER WAY!





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"Re(6):Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Mon 17 Mar 17:53post reply

Well, haven't watched the videos because it's not sth I really care about but there's this one thing...

nobinobita:
quote:

And on top of that, they're not even really animating, they're just redrawing frames, which is where I think things went wrong.



But then again wasn't this what they are supposed to be doing originally?
I mean, IIRC, they were allowed from Japan to change the graphics, frames and backgrounds, and redraw them in HD, but no touching things such as adding or taking out frames, frame rate, etc. Or am I remembering wrong?





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"Re(7):Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Mon 17 Mar 18:08post reply

quote:
I mean, IIRC, they were allowed from Japan to change the graphics, frames and backgrounds, and redraw them in HD, but no touching things such as adding or taking out frames, frame rate, etc. Or am I remembering wrong?


I don't think Capcom Japan cares enough to allow or forbid anything. I thought they just wanted to remain as faithful to the original as possible. Or maybe they had so much work already that they couldn't change that as well.

Someone evoked Sagat, but I would be especially interested to see Chunli. She had such a groovy original sprite.





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"Re(3):sprite banzai" , posted Mon 17 Mar 21:54post reply

quote:
heres something that i dont like.. the damn fingers.
sf3 http://i25.tinypic.com/2crwmis.png [Image Attached]

No more complaining about how things look until you knock it off with ugly filters for emulators! Or did that just resize weird?

EITHER WAY!

am not complaining on the sf3 sprite :P or i didnt get what you were saying... sf3 had small resolution yet fingers are distinguishable





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"Re(7):Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Mon 17 Mar 23:58post reply

quote:

But then again wasn't this what they are supposed to be doing originally?
I mean, IIRC, they were allowed from Japan to change the graphics, frames and backgrounds, and redraw them in HD, but no touching things such as adding or taking out frames, frame rate, etc. Or am I remembering wrong?



What I meant was that they weren't hired to do totally original animation, they are redoing existing animation, which is much easier. But they still have to create animation, which means they should know how to animate, which is unfortunately not the case.

There are lots of problems with SFHD, so many that I need visual aids to describe them:

http://www.geocities.com/nobinobita2095/Ken_HD_errors_01.swf

http://www.geocities.com/nobinobita2095/Ken_HD_errors_02.swf

You can't blame those problems on the resolution increase or a lack of frames or the source material. Those problems exist because the artists didn't know enough about animation to avoid them. It's not an issue of resolution, otherwise Blue Ray Disks would look choppier than standard DVDs. You can't blame the source material, since it also has the same number of frames, yet it looks smoother. The problem is that the new frames have basic drawing errors that make them choppier.

Udon was supposed to just res-up the sprites. Sounds easy enough, but it still requires animation experience to make sure everything lines up correctly. But they didn't really follow the original sprites, they kept the basic motions, but they totally redrew the characters. Such a drastic change requires even more animation knowledge, which the artists were lacking.

It looks like they treated each frame as a single illustration, without checking whether it really fit in with all the other frames. It also looks like multiple artists worked on the Ken Sprite, and each one drew Ken in their own style, rather than following a model sheet. These problems are common errors, especially in the work of beginning animators, but they should never make it into a finished professional product.

At first I was impressed that Capcom USA decided to redo their own work for SFHD. The newest screens looked much better, with the less random coloring and better drawing. But seeing it in motion was a big letdown, because all the same animation errors persist in the revised work.





D`Cloud
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"Re(8):SF2HD news" , posted Tue 18 Mar 01:16:post reply

quote:

But then again wasn't this what they are supposed to be doing originally?
I mean, IIRC, they were allowed from Japan to change the graphics, frames and backgrounds, and redraw them in HD, but no touching things such as adding or taking out frames, frame rate, etc. Or am I remembering wrong?


What I meant was that they weren't hired to do totally original animation, they are redoing existing animation, which is much easier. But they still have to create animation, which means they should know how to animate, which is unfortunately not the case.

There are lots of problems with SFHD, so many that I need visual aids to describe them:

http://www.geocities.com/nobinobita2095/Ken_HD_errors_01.swf

http://www.geocities.com/nobinobita2095/Ken_HD_errors_02.swf

You can't blame those problems on the resolution increase or a lack of frames or the source material. Those problems exist because the artists didn't know enough about animation to avoid them. It's not an issue of resolution, otherwise Blue Ray Disks would look choppier than standard DVDs. You can't blame the source material, since it also has the same number of frames, yet it looks smoother. The problem is that the new frames have basic drawing errors that make them choppier.

Udon was supposed to just res-up the sprites. Sounds easy enough, but it still requires animation experience to make sure everything lines up correctly. But they didn't really follow the original sprites, they kept the basic motions, but they totally redrew the characters. Such a drastic change requires even more animation knowledge, which the artists were lacking.

It looks like they treated each frame as a single illustration, without checking whether it really fit in with all the other frames. It also looks like multiple artists worked on the Ken Sprite, and each one drew Ken in their own style, rather than following a model sheet. These problems are common errors, especially in the work of beginning animators, but they should never make it into a finished professional product.

At first I was impressed that Capcom USA decided to redo their own work for SFHD. The newest screens looked much better, with the less random coloring and better drawing. But seeing it in motion was a big letdown, because all the same animation errors persist in the revised work.

I thought from the very beginning when they released their behind the scenes work that they have a very wrong workflow. and true enough it shows. They are tracing the frames in photoshop for christ sake!
they should've printed the original frames first, rough drawing over > animation check > then cleaned up for consistensy.. IN PAPER!
although Yes, there are digital workflows now... BUT they dont do it in photoshop!





http://www.dustinuy.com

[this message was edited by D`Cloud on Tue 18 Mar 01:20]

dr baghead
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"Re(8):sprite banzai" , posted Tue 18 Mar 04:27post reply

quote:
I think this would be the perfect time for them to cancel the whole game. If Capcom All-Stars got cancelled, why not this? Everyone who plans to buy this is going to get SFIV anyway.



They should just make this a pack-in with the first home release of SF4 (cuz we know they'll make upgrades: NOW WITH 3D SAKURA AND DEEJAY!), call it the "SF 30th Anniversary One-Two Punch Combo Pack" with some big ass ugly Udon cover art with all the SF2 cast in some giant MvC-style cluster pose someone splattered India Ink all over.

That way they can recoup for SF2HD, since no ones gonna spend $20 on it if SF4 has all the same characters and is in shinny 3D, and they can sell SF4:2nd Strike Turbo by itself later on to make actual money for SF4.






Blanka and Dan make for a most excellent tag image (yeah still not funny)
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Sensenic
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"Re(8):Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Tue 18 Mar 19:24post reply

quote:

Udon was supposed to just res-up the sprites. Sounds easy enough, but it still requires animation experience to make sure everything lines up correctly. But they didn't really follow the original sprites, they kept the basic motions, but they totally redrew the characters. Such a drastic change requires even more animation knowledge, which the artists were lacking.

It looks like they treated each frame as a single illustration, without checking whether it really fit in with all the other frames. It also looks like multiple artists worked on the Ken Sprite, and each one drew Ken in their own style, rather than following a model sheet. These problems are common errors, especially in the work of beginning animators, but they should never make it into a finished professional product.



Oh, I see...

Shame on them for re-drawing the frames "from zero" and independently, then. u.u

PS: Nice job you did with those flashes there. >:]





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crazymike
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"Re(8):Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Tue 18 Mar 23:06post reply

quote:


At first I was impressed that Capcom USA decided to redo their own work for SFHD. The newest screens looked much better, with the less random coloring and better drawing. But seeing it in motion was a big letdown, because all the same animation errors persist in the revised work.



I bow before you nobinobita, seeing these sprite up close they really are pretty bad. The growing eyebrows are the worst.

Personally what they should have done was give us a TRUE HD remake, that is don't "stylize" the sprites to look comic-book like, just double the resolution of the originals and clean up the pixellated blockiness to make it appear smoother, kind of like this what-if Sonic 2 HD mock up

http://www.racketboy.com/retro/sega/2007/12/if-sonic-the-hedgehog-2-was-in-hd.html





nobinobita
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"Re(9):Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Thu 20 Mar 05:33post reply

quote:

I bow before you nobinobita, seeing these sprite up close they really are pretty bad. The growing eyebrows are the worst.

Personally what they should have done was give us a TRUE HD remake, that is don't "stylize" the sprites to look comic-book like, just double the resolution of the originals and clean up the pixellated blockiness to make it appear smoother, kind of like this what-if Sonic 2 HD mock up

http://www.racketboy.com/retro/sega/2007/12/if-sonic-the-hedgehog-2-was-in-hd.html



FINALLY!!! THE ATTENTION AND RECOGNITION THAT I CRAVE!!!--ahem, i mean, thank you for your nice comments. I agree that it would have worked out better if they followed the sprites more closely and just subtly updated the drawings.

That Sonic 2 Mockup looks awesome! I would love to see Sonic remade in that awesome 90s airbrush style.

quote:
Many Capcom designers did, and that shows in SF, particularly in the way they took control of SF3.


There's evidence of this in Capcom Design Works. On page 160 they do this A Day in the Life of a Capcom Artist breakdown where they follow around Ikeno. On the top lefthand corner of the page there's a photo of him doing a classic Aś Batido, a Capoeira overhead kick.

Here's the full scan of the page for anyone interested in reading (and translating?) it.





Ishmael
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"Re(10):Re(10):SF2HD news" , posted Sat 22 Mar 00:39post reply

This time out attempts are made to make Sagat less two dimensional.