New fighting game discussion thread! - http://www.mmcafe.com/ Forums


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Spoon
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"The new fighting game discussion thread!" , posted Fri 10 Jun 13:30:post reply

With excalamation marks, so that it gets noticed!!!

Made so that the massive volume of random fighting game chatter is somewhat contained from contaminating all the other threads.

Come in. Sit down. Get owned. Hah.

To commemorate the opening of this thread, I bring you news of a recent update at
This place,
quite possibly the only place on the internet that still updates with Jojo's Bizarre Adventure match videos.

WRYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY

the guy who goes by SQ on that site is way too good. The other players are certainly good, but they do not have an answer for his Mariah and Middler. Lunacy.





[this message was edited by Spoon on Fri 10 Jun 13:30]

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Maou
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"Re(1):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Fri 10 Jun 14:47post reply

Spoon-tastic, a new fighting thread after our Super EX + Alpha intro thread. So yeah, Spoon, while I have your attention, won't ye lend an ear to my plight with SFIII 3rd Strike:

My "master" in fighting games and I played a LOT of Zero2 and Zero3. The problem is that I'm used to that pace (and that large character roster), and while we're entranced by 3S's beautiful art and complicated systems, we keep failing to break into it and get good...when we do play, we do gutless things like play our old Ryu vs. Ken matches with nothing new. In short, despite being solid in the Zero series, we have no grounding in 3S and don't know where to start. Gamest's guides are out of print, no one else we know plays 3S, and on the American side no good guides were made either (i.e. of the very high calibur Versus Books SFZero2 guide by the US's best players). Not that I need an idiot's move guide telling me what cancels etc. to do, but I was wondering if you can think of a good resource that could help ground us in the basic flow of SFIII as differentiated from the Zero series? I know it's fantastic, I just need to find how to appreciate it.





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kyo717
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"Re(2):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Fri 10 Jun 15:12post reply

I thought the US SF Anniversary Collection Guide was pretty good. Some of the people on SRK believe it's better then Japanese 3rd Strike guide because the japanese mook is based on the DC version, the US strategy guide is based on the PS2 version which is more like the arcade version, and the US strategy guide was written somewhat recently so it's more up to date with misc things. Check it out if you can.





Shin Ramberk
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"Re(3):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Fri 10 Jun 15:40post reply

quote:
I thought the US SF Anniversary Collection Guide was pretty good. Some of the people on SRK believe it's better then Japanese 3rd Strike guide because the japanese mook is based on the DC version, the US strategy guide is based on the PS2 version which is more like the arcade version, and the US strategy guide was written somewhat recently so it's more up to date with misc things. Check it out if you can.



Yes. I wholeheartedly agree with Kyo717. The US SF Anniversary Collection Guide is an 'ultimate' guide. Its a really high caliber guide. I initially bought it just 'for fun'. I thought it would be another typical 'garbage' US guide with just movelists, some simple combos and dumb 'strategies' but the guide has detailed frame information on everyone's moves. It has kara canceling info. Charge partitioning. And just about anything else that is important.

I was utterly surprised by this guide. I was SHOCKED. This guide was made by hardcore SF fanatics and not some lame committee at a game guide publisher. This is a real guide. Supreme kudos to its authors and all the players that contributed to it.





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"Re(3):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Fri 10 Jun 15:42post reply

Iiiinteresting, and you're talking about the one by Brady? I was less than impressed with those guys back in the day, but it sounds like they've cleaned up their act for this book? Strangely, a place like Shoryuken.com ought to have some stuff on this too, but I don't see the FAQs I thought I'd find (maybe they're too advanced).





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Spoon
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"Re(4):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Fri 10 Jun 16:26post reply

quote:
Iiiinteresting, and you're talking about the one by Brady? I was less than impressed with those guys back in the day, but it sounds like they've cleaned up their act for this book? Strangely, a place like Shoryuken.com ought to have some stuff on this too, but I don't see the FAQs I thought I'd find (maybe they're too advanced).



Yes, the Brady one was written with input from the good players at SRK, so it contains valid combos and strats. However, it feels like a lot of the strategy/matchup info had to be shortened due to publication constraints... which is really too bad.

If you check SRK's "Articles" section, you'll find two somewhat outdated and in places factually incorrect articles on Kara Throwing and Option Select. The option select thing you are NOT going to be able to use in games if you are just getting into 3S. However, it shows one of the more advanced techniques that you can do in 3S, and highlights the importance of good ground game psychology (or maybe just the importance of guessing right...) in 3S. Kara throw you might use, since it's just a tiny add-on to how you normally do throws... though in the beginning you're probably going to screw up and get lots of random attacks when you really want the throw :)

SRK has a very high noise to signal ratio. Unless you have lots of time on your hands or know exactly what to search for, you can easily get a lot of misinformation.

Actual strategy (OMG!) from SRK link:
http://www.livejournal.com/users/mopreme/





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"Re(1):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Fri 10 Jun 17:41post reply

Well, regarding this
quote:
Well, knowledge counts for nothing if you lack the ability to apply it when it's needed.


It's not that I lack completely of any skill. Only that I can't pull most things 99% of the time, as you said is needed (and I disagree). If I try to use a certain strategy I've learned, it is because I can somewhat do it usefuly. It's not knowledge alone. It's knowledge + a little (but not null) skill, heh.

About Third Strike, my characters are Remy and Makoto. I'm fairly good with both, but I prefer using Remy, because I've always liked (and played) charge characters better. I'm surprisingly good at managing and storing charges, and I were surprised when I read online some of the advanced charge techniques, and discovered that I already used them long ago. I suppose that, since my reflexes are not that good, being able to pull a move by either pushing up + button or forward + button helps me a lot, and that's why I like charge characters.

Anyway, using Remy is even more painful than using Q, in my opinion. Q at least can resist hits. It's really depressing to be controlling a fight, keeping my opponent in range with LoVs, and the occasional combo from jHP, cHP, or cMP, and then be destroyed by literally two combos. My friend, who uses Ryu, has that ugly tendency, and it's not funny at all. And i'm not going to even mention his ridiculous stun gauge.





kyo717
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"Re(5):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Fri 10 Jun 17:45:post reply

Not 3rd strike specific information, but the strategy posted on this site is universal and you can implement it into whatever fighting game you're playing. The author, Sirlin, uses SF2 and Starcraft as examples though. I reccomend reading his "Art of War" articles.

http://www.sirlin.net/





[this message was edited by kyo717 on Fri 10 Jun 17:48]

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"Re(1):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Fri 10 Jun 18:36post reply

Thanks for the Jojo link, I didn't know the site and I love Mariah.

Also, speaking of Remy : what's the use of his 214 kick move ? It's a little too slow to take the opponent by surprise, and jumping close is not something Remy would want to do ? I think ?
(but I'm a Hugo/Alex/Q low level player, so what do I know).





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"Re(2):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Fri 10 Jun 18:53post reply

I used to use Remy quite a bit, but now I find him horribly boring in reference to the other characters.

As for the backwards fireball kick...the hard one is a bit obvious, but I use the weak and middle ones to counter, charge my guage, or get into medium-close range. I find that Remy is even more boring long range, so I like to keep a little closer. I think the move is fast enough to not get stuffed/countered frequently. Maybe I'm just playing with mediocre players, but I find it to be useful and versatile.

I normally use Yang, Necro and Chun Li...with the occassional Alex and Elena.





Time Mage
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"Re(2):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Fri 10 Jun 20:07post reply

quote:
Also, speaking of Remy : what's the use of his 214 kick move ? It's a little too slow to take the opponent by surprise, and jumping close is not something Remy would want to do ? I think ?
(but I'm a Hugo/Alex/Q low level player, so what do I know).


You can use it in various situations. Against players that can't parry well, just throw random high and low LoVs from a distance, and when they decide to jump over the LoVs, you nail them with a 214HK. A Blocked 214K is also surprisingly safe. Surprising, in the sense that if they don't know the recovery of the move, they may try to punish you with something too slow, eating the RRF ([2]8K) or SRRF (236236K) you do immediately afterwards. Also, using the right button for the right distance to hit only with the tip of the shoe makes for a good poke to throw from time to time. The LK version is also a great wakeup against those who like to throw or attack low, since it's airborne for a brief moment, and it's fast enough to be safe if they block. And, since it's an airborne move, if they hit you with something else, you get usually knocked away instead of being set up for a possible combo. The EX version also has its uses, but I guess you only wanted an idea, and I've already written too much for that.





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"Guide" , posted Fri 10 Jun 22:39post reply

Cool to see someone else using Elena (especially since I sorta suck).

quote:
Also, speaking of Remy : what's the use of his 214 kick move ? It's a little too slow to take the opponent by surprise, and jumping close is not something Remy would want to do ? I think ?
(but I'm a Hugo/Alex/Q low level player, so what do I know).

You can use it in various situations. Against players that can't parry well, just throw random high and low LoVs from a distance, and when they decide to jump over the LoVs, you nail them with a 214HK. A Blocked 214K is also surprisingly safe. Surprising, in the sense that if they don't know the recovery of the move, they may try to punish you with something too slow, eating the RRF ([2]8K) or SRRF (236236K) you do immediately afterwards. Also, using the right button for the right distance to hit only with the tip of the shoe makes for a good poke to throw from time to time. The LK version is also a great wakeup against those who like to throw or attack low, since it's airborne for a brief moment, and it's fast enough to be safe if they block. And, since it's an airborne move, if they hit you with something else, you get usually knocked away instead of being set up for a possible combo. The EX version also has its uses, but I guess you only wanted an idea, and I've already written too much for that.



Yeah, with a good player/cheap computer the Cold Blue Kick is relatively frightening if your skills against them are only average. The SF Anniversary guide is great--I plan on buying it when I get the money (even though I own the DC version). The CFE guide is actually moderately good from my brief browsing of it. CFE...heh.

Must. Not. Start. CFAS. Discussion...





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"Re(1):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Sat 11 Jun 00:06post reply

Any tips anyone would suggest to people who play Oro? I recently picked up third strike about a year ago and started getting into playing the game recently again.

I'm not sure if I'm forgetting anything but is there any other ways to innovate his game play besides the use of Tengu stones and just turtling, poking, and his usual command anti-air? I usually use his jumping fierce punch for crossing up, but I heard his jumping medium punch was a whole lot better from what I read in some faqs.

I normally play other characters such as Dudley, Ryu, Yang, and makoto for curiosity sake.





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"Re(2):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Sat 11 Jun 00:23post reply

I'm not the best Oro player in the world, but what I'm going to say is really effective for those who use him sparingly, like me:
- Standing HK is so wonderful that it can't be described with words, but I'll try: Great range, priority and speed, plus it does a ton of stun damage.
- close standing MP is what you want to hit your opponent with. It can be followed by things as simple as a s.HK for starters, but if you practice it, s.MPxx236K,sMPxx236K,sMPxxEX Tengu Stone is the way to go. The button in the 236K varies depending on which character are you fighting against, so practice it. IIRC, you have to use 236MK against the shotos.
- Use the double jump for mindgames, but don't abuse it.
- Far MP is also a good poke.

I really don't go further than that, but I manage to fare decently with those things and mixing other moves here and there.

I wish I could buy one of those guides you're talking about... Looking everything on the internet is quite bothersome at times. Does it has frame data? I suppose not, but it would be great.





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"Re(3):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Sat 11 Jun 00:39post reply

quote:

I wish I could buy one of those guides you're talking about... Looking everything on the internet is quite bothersome at times. Does it has frame data? I suppose not, but it would be great.



Yes. It does have frame data. Every move. Start up times. Invincibility frames. Recovery frames. Canceling abilities. EVERYTHING. My mind boggles that they included this.

There was a website that was actually putting out all the frame data from the Japanese guide online and translated in English. But I forgot the URL (my computer been trashed so many times, lost so many URLs).

It might be tough/expensive, but its well worth importing the guide. Yes, importing a good US Street Fighter guide, who would have thought.





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shin ramberk
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"Re(4):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Sat 11 Jun 00:41post reply

Hey, does anyone play 3S on xbox live? Can someone tell me if its actually playable and what is the skill level of the players online.





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"Re(2):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Sat 11 Jun 00:49post reply

quote:
Any tips anyone would suggest to people who play Oro? I recently picked up third strike about a year ago and started getting into playing the game recently again.

I'm not sure if I'm forgetting anything but is there any other ways to innovate his game play besides the use of Tengu stones and just turtling, poking, and his usual command anti-air? I usually use his jumping fierce punch for crossing up, but I heard his jumping medium punch was a whole lot better from what I read in some faqs.

I normally play other characters such as Dudley, Ryu, Yang, and makoto for curiosity sake.



First note: gamefaqs faqs are good for getting movelists. SOME that are written by respectable folks like Buktooth are quite good. MOST are written by... so-so players, to say the least.

Go to www.combovideos.com and check out the video called "Oro - Man of Gold" or something like that... it details a large number of useful tricks and some general tactics.





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"Re(4):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Sat 11 Jun 00:50post reply

quote:



There was a website that was actually putting out all the frame data from the Japanese guide online and translated in English. But I forgot the URL (my computer been trashed so many times, lost so many URLs).



the site WAS www.karathrow.com, but it's been down for ages.





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"Re(5):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Sat 11 Jun 02:58post reply

Hhah, how bizarre to hear good players (likely some of the Versus SFZero2) from SRK working on the US guide, I might actually have to go find it! That might be just the kind of base we need. Like I mentioned, Spoon, we're no strangers to Street Fighter and play the Zero series very well, but the pacing and feel of 3S was so different when it came out in Japan on PS2 that I felt so ungrounded...I could execute new features like EX and block-cancelling, but not know why or when I might want to. Ditto for charas other than Ryu and Ken...I keep hearing that Yun is awesome, and I like Makoto and Elena's design a lot, but we just couldn't get them working for us the way the Shotokan kids did. I'll have to read up on this SRK blog and US guide.





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"Re(6):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Sat 11 Jun 03:27post reply

New 3S combo video

I have a match vid where Pino AB7 does that exact necro corner dizzy juggle. Crazy.

Dudley double standing HK combo?!

A few video notes on the official site:
http://teamwhales.com/video/





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"Amazon" , posted Sat 11 Jun 04:37post reply

I've found the guide in Amazon.com, and being only 14$ new, I'm thinking about ordering it, but... Does anyone know what would be the shipping costs to Spain? I don't want to pay 20$ of shipping for this...

Anyone from Europe knows, at least an estimate?





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"Because we care..." , posted Sat 11 Jun 06:01post reply

quote:
I've found the guide in Amazon.com, and being only 14$ new, I'm thinking about ordering it, but... Does anyone know what would be the shipping costs to Spain? I don't want to pay 20$ of shipping for this...

Anyone from Europe knows, at least an estimate?



TM, if I can find the guide at a local bookstore or such. I could ship it to you using the cheapest international shipping offered by the United States Postal Service. Let me know if your interested.





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"Yun vs Yang" , posted Sat 11 Jun 06:46:post reply

Does anyone here use Yun and Yang well? I say both, because I use both...or at least, I used to. I found after a while that Yun was useless in comparison to Yang, but I keep seeing people say the opposite. I feel like Yun's "advantages" don't amount to anything in the end.

Like, Yun's QCF+P is fast and has good range, but is way too easy to counter, even in its jab form. It's handy to throw it out after a jab, but the move just isn't safe enough. You can get thrown easily even after the jab version.

Yang's QCF+P move, on the other hand, is completely safe if you use the weak version and cut out early (assuming you miss). It does cheese damage on top of that, and can be comboed from his (completely safe) low middle kick.

The middle kick is awesome for both of them (I've won entire matches with just middle kick...for fun), but I feel like it invalidates Yun's anti-air kick. In fact, I've never found a use for it in a match. Yang's anti-air/roll kick, however, is nice for going under projectiles at least.

That leaves Yun's F,d,df+P move, which is a great projectile counter and combo add-on, but that's it as far as I can tell.

I won't mention the QCB+P move (though Yang's is better) or the command throw...and we all know that Yang's teleport sucks, but the df+K in the air move is still better for Yang, because he can do it after an attack, unlike his brother.

Yun DOES seem to win in the supers department. I think his You Hou (3 hit) super is really nice, as it can be comboed, has great priority and strength and can be juggled after. With Yang, I usually go for his kick super, which has crap damage, but goes under projectiles and can be comboed from his Mp-HP-back HP chain. Otherwise, I use the Genei Jin, but never the punch super which is both hard to hit with and does crap damage.

So as far as I can tell, Yun has the edge in combos and supers (and thus damage), but has less practical/effective skills on the whole.





[this message was edited by Pollyanna on Sat 11 Jun 07:24]

Spoon
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"Re(1):Yun vs Yang" , posted Sat 11 Jun 07:03:post reply

quote:


Yun's QCF+P move, on the other hand, is completely safe if you use the weak version and cut out early (assuming you miss). It does cheese damage on top of that, and can be comboed from his (completely safe) low middle kick.



I really think you mean "Yang" here.

Yun's QCF+P is for combos. Yeah, you might punish the occasional moronic mistake with it, but you can't use it randomly because the risk is high and the reward is puny.

Yun's lp,lk,mp chain is vital. It sets up for his supers (i.e. Genei Jin), and if you stick a LP shoulder on the end, it builds a big chunk of meter.... often enough to put you over the top for a Genei Jin.

Yun has Genei Jin, and moves that are more conducive to it (e.g. QCF+P dash punch, DP shoulder tackle), that's his big advantage... and it's a BIG advantage. Yang's got a bunch of nice moves and tricks (e.g. lk, EX slashes) and against some characters he wins even more easily than Yun (watch matches of good Yangs versus Urien). But genei jin counts for just so much.


Besides, unless it's like Q who gets rushed down by either of the two for free, much of Yun's game is running away and building meter. Getting in their face with Yun has its uses, but by no means is it something that he has to do. It's a different story though when Yun is against someone that can keep up with him (e.g. Yang).





[this message was edited by Spoon on Sat 11 Jun 07:07]

Pollyanna
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"Re(2):Yun vs Yang" , posted Sat 11 Jun 07:27post reply

quote:

I really think you mean "Yang" here.



Yes, I did. And I changed it. Thanks for pointing that out.

Ah, it's good to hear this from you, though, because it's pretty much how I felt. I was getting afraid that I was just totally missing something with Yun. If I want to bring him up to Yang's level, I'll have to spend some time in training mode.





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"Re(1):Because we care..." , posted Sat 11 Jun 07:41post reply

quote:
TM, if I can find the guide at a local bookstore or such. I could ship it to you using the cheapest international shipping offered by the United States Postal Service. Let me know if your interested.



Wow, thank you very much for your offer, I didn't expected this.
But, now that I know the shipping costs, and since they aren't too high, I think I'll use the more conventional channel of Amazon. It will save both of us trouble, even if I might save a little with your offer.
Anyway, thank you very much for your offer.





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"Re(2):Because we care..." , posted Sat 11 Jun 19:52post reply

That combo video was amazing. 336% too much Urien, but still...the Yun and Necro combos (Necro...combo!?) were artsy and beautiful. And...M-Flo...splendid.

When I get my copy of 3S back, it's gonna be hapy training time.





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"Re(7):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Sat 11 Jun 20:54:post reply

quote:
I have a match vid where Pino AB7 does that exact necro corner dizzy juggle. Crazy.


Is that the video of the SBO2004 qualifying rounds? Everytime I saw Pino AB7's Necro I was cheering for him: Such a beautiful and impressive way of playing! I Specially like the round he wins hitting with a taunt after dizzying his opponent. Style points: +1000.



Edit: I have a problem downloading the video. I get this error: "rejected by tracker - Client version is banned. Check with the tracker administrator."
What does that mean? That I need another BT client? I'm using the official BT.

Re-Edit: Nevermind, it was just that my client was too old. Now it works perfectly.





[this message was edited by Time Mage on Sat 11 Jun 21:25]

Spoon
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"Re(3):Because we care..." , posted Sun 12 Jun 07:00:post reply

quote:
(Necro...combo!?)


A lot of people when they first see Necro think he's just Dhalsim with Blanka's electricity... but he's really really different. He can't really play a zoning game like Dhalsim, and instead has to rush... what's more, he has a HUGE variety of combos, and some supers to match.

Electric Snake is unbelievably deadly IF you're good. It does enormous stun, and has a meter that's really tiny. And you get two! The top japanese Necros like Sugiyama are frightening... and when they dizzy you in the corner (which happens with almost unsurprising frequency), you can bet on an exhibition.





[this message was edited by Spoon on Sun 12 Jun 07:35]

Time Mage
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"Talking about strategies" , posted Sun 12 Jun 08:42post reply

Do you have any particular strategy you use and are proud of? It doesn't have to be "the best strategy in the world", just something you came up with and works in your circle of players.

One strategy I'm proud about is the "bouncing Chipp" in GGXX#R. My Chipp got destroyed pretty often as I tried to base my game on running and doing ground combos, until I started to abuse the triple jump: Jump at the opponent, and do randomly a single, double or triple jump, each activated at a different time and direction each time you do it, and land on them with either a jH (common), or use j2K at the peak of the jump to surprise them, then if hit (or even if blocked), combo something simple like S,S,236S,236S, and again to the air. Better if used while invisible, and mixing the blocked S,S strings with a D, 2D or 41236K. It can get incredibly annoying sometimes.





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"Re(1):Talking about strategies" , posted Sun 12 Jun 09:21post reply

Well, this can actually work well for almost any game, and ends up being effective just because it's so simple people don't expect it: the repeated trip alternating with the middle attack. It's incredibly obvious, but since when people play fighters a lot, they can start forgetting how effective the trip mind games are. Even more surprisingly, hardly anyone does it. So, trip, trip, trip, shouryuuken. Next, trip, trip, shouryuuken. When they get used to it, back to the other. Same for SC or other fighters. But the trip-middle alternation games can be beautifully deadly and universally fun in any dimension.





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"Re(5):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Sun 12 Jun 11:04post reply

I'm (obviously) an Ibuki player...

Ibuki is a pain in the ass to get good with. I still can't jump cancel her close roundhouse. I've seen people do it in the arcade and I can't fucking believe it.

Japanese players are just too good usually, although I was playing some scrubs the other day... the problem with Ibuki is she eats a lot of damage.

quote:

Actual strategy (OMG!) from SRK link:
http://www.livejournal.com/users/mopreme/



This strat is really well done and nice, but Japanese players are never that predictable. Saying 'Yun will do *this* unless he's stupid' is maybe something that applies in the states, but I've seen and played so many people who use Yun in many different ways.

I love 3S though.





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"Re(6):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Sun 12 Jun 11:22post reply

quote:
, but Japanese players are never that predictable. Saying 'Yun will do *this* unless he's stupid' is maybe something that applies in the states, but I've seen and played so many people who use Yun in many different ways.





I don't know about that. Most match video Yuns follow one of two formulas:
- mostly what he detailed; running away building meter, rushing with genei, trying to get that juggle just before genei runs out.

- rush even without genei

Those which show Yun rushing even without genei built up tend to be cases where Yun simply can't effectively run away, or isn't hugely benefitted by (e.g. Yun vs. Yun, Yun vs. Q, Yun vs. some guy who isn't nearly as good as the Yun player). And it's not like everything he wrote is baloney, though some of it is questionable. It's true, Yun does do piddling damage when he doesn't have genei; therefore, what is the best way to take advantage of him when he's unmetered? What things are likely to work well on him? What tricks are there to be aware of when he DOES have genei on? I think that write-up is successful in detailing a lot of useful and valid information. It's not as though it's a hard and fast line that Yun is guaranteed to walk; hell, none of that applies if the other Yun is below a certain level of play, because such a Yun isn't going to be playing by such expected lines of reasoning (e.g. "run away until you have a genei jin built up").

I'd like to know just what kinds of "strategies" players like Kuroda and Hayao have in mind... since they use such strategically bizarre characters who knows what the hell they're actually thinking. I sure wouldn't play through an entire round thinking, "alright, red parry SPD to victory!"





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"Re(4):Because we care..." , posted Sun 12 Jun 16:43post reply

quote:

A lot of people when they first see Necro think he's just Dhalsim with Blanka's electricity... but he's really really different. He can't really play a zoning game like Dhalsim, and instead has to rush... what's more, he has a HUGE variety of combos, and some supers to match.



I'm only OK with Necro. Like...not bad, but I don't understand him like I understand Yang/Chun Li. I can only beat people who also have my level of Necro knowledge (or lack thereof).

What are some good practical application combos of his? I mean...corner stuff and dizzy stuff and crossup stuff or whatever is nice, but I'd rather learn relatively easy to apply stuff for more versatility. I'd LOVE to bring Necro up to the level with my good character.





Spoon
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"Re(5):Because we care..." , posted Sun 12 Jun 18:37:post reply

quote:

What are some good practical application combos of his? I mean...corner stuff and dizzy stuff and crossup stuff or whatever is nice, but I'd rather learn relatively easy to apply stuff for more versatility. I'd LOVE to bring Necro up to the level with my good character.



I'm no Necro expert, but here are a bunch of handy things to know:

SAs:
All of his SAs are good.
For safety, pick Magnetic Storm. It's totally safe on block, and comes out real fast. Gives Necro a wakeup option outside of parry/block/tech. Handy to have against quick guys like Yun/Yang/etc. If you're quick, you can cancel it off of a normal in a corner juggle for some hits... but be aware that the damage this move does DIES when super cancelled.

Electric Snake (ES) is the most popular, and for good reason. However, you will rarely land it outside of combos, so keep in mind that that's what it's mainly for. Does OK dmg, but the meter is tiny and the stun is nice. Fun fact: ES goes under aegis and many other projectiles!

The throw super isn't bad, but I'd rather have mag storm.

ES can be comboed/linked off of a bunch of stuff, including but not limited to:
- UOH (link, doesn't have to be meaty)
- d+LK (cancel)
- MP (... link? dunno)
- b+MP (think this links)
- spin punch (either back turn or super cancel)
- DP electricity (super cancel)

Normals notes:
drill kicks (very useful for all kinds of stuff... knockdown, cross-up meaty drill kick... etc.)

b+HP (launches, usually you'll just juggle with db+HP)

db+HP (good for damaging juggles/pushing opponent to corner)

MP (juggle in corner off of throw, combos into ES)

b+HK (chains/links? into a bunch of stuff, but usually you'll just do db+HP)

b+MP (meter builder when far away, cancel into LP spin punch)

b+LK, b+LP (chain... i think it combos into LP spin punch)

d.LK (combos into LP spin punch and ES)

d+MK (poke... yeah, that's it.)

LP (quick, cancels into supers... it's a jab.)

d.LP (it's your quick jab for annoying people or getting them off you up close. combos into LP spin punch, but you gotta be pretty quick)

Some special move notes:

low grabby thing (cancel off some normal for a not-combo that hits way more than it reasonably should)

leaping strike thing (handy quick surprise move)

spin punch (LP combos off many normals, MP and HP don't. MP and HP leave opponent back turned, which allows you to stick on more stuff for more dmg/stun.)

overhead kick (quite good reach for an overhead. you'll probably use it some against cornered opponents.

General ideas:

Necro indeed needs combos to win. Knowing a few combos into ES is good. having d.LK and UOH ES are both pretty handy, as is LP spin punch ES. Against many opponents, playing a defense keep away game is going to be a mistake, as Necro lacks good moves outside of magnetic storm and slam dance for getting people off of him, and he has poor health. So, his best defense is a blistering offense. He has a bizillion ways to juggle dizzied opponents in the corner (every EX move can be used in some crazy ways... i've seen it O_O ). Necro dishes out buckets of stun, and as long as you keep pouring it on them, they're stun meter isn't going to be going down.

Two moves which he gets free juggles off of against cornered opponents are LP spin punch and towards/neutral throw. Frequently you'll just juggle with a MP or b+MP... which is fine. Note that juggling with these moves resets your opponent, rather than knocking them down. This means that the moment they land, they have to make another defensive guess. Just make sure you actually do something. Even throw them again if you want; you'll get another free juggle and they have to make another guess. Sometimes you'll be able to juggle with db+HP, which is nice... except that I don't know Necro well enough to tell you who/when you can off of LP spin punch.

LP spin punch is not totally safe on block, but it's not bad. Practically every cancellable normal Necro has will combo into LP spin punch. If it hits, it sends the opponent a good distance away... hopefully into a corner. It sets up juggles and MP spin punch can be super canceled into ES or mag storm. Don't back off after knockdowns or whatever to build meter; press forward with dashes/drill kicks.

Necro has somewhat dubious anti-airs. b+HP is not bad. d+MP is best done when they're going UP, not when they're coming down.

Aside from drill kicks (which you'll be doing a lot of), you won't be jumping that much. Jumping HP is ok air to air... works pretty good actually if you make sure it comes out a bit early. Jump back MP is a handy FAST overhead for mixing it up.

I remember that there's a bunch of little stuff involving b+LK (and b+MK)? But I can't remember/don't know.

Handy simple combo summary:
blah xx LP spin punch
- this is actually REALLY important.
Just about everything you can cancel will work. d.LK and b+MP are good ones to have.

something into ES.
- spin punch, UOH, MP/b+MP and d.LK ES are all handy to have.

blah into HCF+K (low grab)
- not a real combo, but it catches people more than it should.

(corner)
LP spin punch/f+throw, juggle
- really useful, and easy. If the MP isn't working for you off the throw, I think you can just do LP.

b+HP, db+HP
- b+HP has really good priority.

Examples of combos into ES that are more than "one move, ES":

b+MK xx MP spin punch xx ES
- the b+MK cancel is harder than it ought to be. This is a pretty obvious combo.

b+HK, d.LK xx ES
- well yeah.

Happy fun anti-Alex combo:
(corner only)
b+HK, db+HP x 4 (maybe 5? can't remember)
this looks as funny as it sounds, and takes off like 50% of Alex's health. I don't think it works on anyone but Alex (edit: it supposedly works on Hugo and maybe Urien too). It also isn't easy to do (I've only gotten ALL the elbows like once)... but hey, if you can make this work...





[this message was edited by Spoon on Mon 13 Jun 10:36]

Pollyanna
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"Re(6):Because we care..." , posted Mon 13 Jun 06:39post reply

Spoon: Thanks a lot. A lot of that I already know, but a good deal of it gives me something new to play with. I'm exciteddddd. I didn't realize the electric snake comboed so easily...so that's a pretty big deal in itself. I prefer slam dance to his other super, though, because it has good damage, I never miss with it and the range consistantly surprises people. It'll be hard to get into electric snake, since slam dance is one of my favorite supers in the game.

I can't imagine a situation, outside of a dizzy (or your opponent totally screwing up) where the HP spin punch move would be even remotely safe, though. It has terrible startup and the recovery isn't so hot either. Similarly, I usually only use the HP electricity move when I see an attack (usually jumping) coming from a mile away, because it has that nasty lag on the beginning.





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"The SF guide..." , posted Mon 13 Jun 09:46post reply

A little bit late for the discussion, but clarifying some things about the guide.

The US guide is so good not only because it got input from people of SRK, but it is written by top players at SRK. I think that the main writer was MrWizard, with the collaboration of players like Mopreme who spend a good while playing in Japan.

Another reason why the US guide is so good is because 3S has been out for a long while, so a lot of proven strategies are known.

Also, someone posted that the Japanese mook is based on the Dreamcast version. That is both right and wrong. There was a mook released for the DC version (the Famitsu one), but there is a series of mooks (don't remember the publisher right now) based on the arcade version that include frame data and other advanced info. These are the mooks that got compiled and released as part of the 3S Limited Edition box for PS2.





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"Re(6):The new fighting game discussion thread" , posted Mon 13 Jun 09:49post reply

quote:


Actual strategy (OMG!) from SRK link:
http://www.livejournal.com/users/mopreme/


This strat is really well done and nice, but Japanese players are never that predictable. Saying 'Yun will do *this* unless he's stupid' is maybe something that applies in the states, but I've seen and played so many people who use Yun in many different ways.

I love 3S though.



Actually, Mopreme played for a good while in Japan. So maybe he has a good idea of what to expect against Japanese players.





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Spoon
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"Re(1):The SF guide..." , posted Mon 13 Jun 10:24post reply

quote:
The US guide is so good not only because it got input from people of SRK, but it is written by top players at SRK. I think that the main writer was MrWizard, with the collaboration of players like Mopreme who spend a good while playing in Japan.


A lot of good players were consulted for the guide, including omni, Valle, and I think majestros (or was he just for the CFE guide?). Anyway, they're credited in the book.

Y'know, a friend of mine has this one SF2T/SSF2 guide that was incredible for a commercial guide... it had some REAL combos (like a Guile re-dizzy!), and some other interesting stuff... I don't remember exactly what was in it now, but I do remember being impressed by it all those years ago... not that I was that good at SF back then....





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"Re(2):The SF guide..." , posted Mon 13 Jun 19:16post reply

And how's the SSFIIT part of the guide? Is it as good as the SFIII:TS part? My interst is basically the TS guide, but if the SSFIIT guide is good, even better.





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"Re(3):The SF guide..." , posted Tue 14 Jun 00:57post reply

quote:
And how's the SSFIIT part of the guide? Is it as good as the SFIII:TS part? My interst is basically the TS guide, but if the SSFIIT guide is good, even better.



If people like Valle, Cole and Choi contributed, you can bet it is also pretty damn good.





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"Re(4):The SF guide..." , posted Tue 14 Jun 04:13post reply

quote:
And how's the SSFIIT part of the guide? Is it as good as the SFIII:TS part? My interst is basically the TS guide, but if the SSFIIT guide is good, even better.


If people like Valle, Cole and Choi contributed, you can bet it is also pretty damn good.



The HSF guide part is somewhat sparse compared to the 3S part (no frame data for example), but still pretty good.

The CFE guide is also pretty good, though it has a number of little mistakes in it (mostly typos). The corrections can be found at http://www.sonichurricane.com/ (which is also a really good site if you're into CvS2 stuff).





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"Re(7):Because we care..." , posted Tue 14 Jun 08:55post reply

I actually went and played with Necro a bit to verify all that garbage I posted. It seems it's right.

Random things you might find handy:

a good juggle against many characters cornered following a LP spin punch is db+HP, b+MP. The whole combo will do very solid damage and build a big chunk of meter with that juggle.

his d.LP is just about as comboable as his d.LK. Some things aren't going to combo if you do them from the far extents of the reach on either, though (namely LP spin punch).

uber mash combo:
d.LP/d.LK xx DP+LP xx ES.
this combo requires you to be close enough for the DP to hit (obviously), so you can't do it from quite as far out as d.LK xx ES. However, it's EASY to do, and the LP electricity hit adds some stun and maybe gives you the meter to do ES. I didn't know that LP electricity came out fast enough to combo from his light attacks... shows how much I know about Necro....





Spoon
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"Re(8):Because we care..." , posted Thu 16 Jun 16:44post reply

Y'know what would be fun one day?

A combo challenge board.

But unlike most "duel" type challenges, the idea would be that one person writes out a combo, possibly with constraints, possibly leaving out important details like empty cancels, but never moves that hit, etc. and the other people are left not to just top the combo, but to VERIFY that it's possible! The person who posted the challenge is not obligated to respond in any way until a correct answer is posted. The first person who does post a verified correct answer then becomes "king of the hill", and proposes the next combo. And so forth. And people can have things like, who holds the record for the combo which has stumped the crowd for the longest, who has been king of the hill for the longest, etc.

This, of course, is all out GEEK.





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"Re(9):Because we care..." , posted Thu 16 Jun 17:37post reply

A combo inept like me wouldn't like the idea :P

I can't do many complicated combos. My biggest success may be several 100% combos with Makoto against Gouki, but those are quite easy. Once I need to do complicated things, like kara some move, or Jump Install, or strange timings... I'm screwed.

I don't know if there are many combo experts in this board, but something like what you propose is only possible with enough skillful people.

Still, if something like this is ever done, I'll be a permanent reader. It will be fun.





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"Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Thu 16 Jun 19:35post reply

I finally got 3rd Strike back and I realize what an inept player I am. I was hoping to be the bottom rung of the ladder of success, but instead I'm the top rung of the failure ladder. Everything that everyone talks about everywhere, I am totally incapable of doing.

Like juggling after throwing with Necro in the corner...I can easily juggle with standing MP, but I cannot, for the life of me, no matter how many times I try, juggle with WP (necessary for combos). I also go nuts watching people follow up with jumping attacks after Chun Li's Houyoku Sen. By the time I get in the air, they're already on the ground. Is there some trick to this!?

And I can do some things like that. Like, after Yun's You-Hou, I can do his MP shoulder charge, then hop punch (child's play, I know)...and after Makoto's kick super I can dash under my opponent before they hit the ground and do a move (usually not the one I want, but whatever). That one's tricky, since you want to hit with the hukiage and the controls reverse on you in the middle.

I'm also, tragically too slow to link the genei jin after lp,lk,mp with Yun. As a result, I'm crippled on decent genei-jin comboes, though in my frustration, I made a very pretty one for fun. It's like...
Whatever into Genei-jin, dp+wk,fb+sp,(puts you on the other side)mk,sp,fb+mp,sp,dp+mp,fb+sp

Junk damage, nice and slow so a simpleton can do it, but aesthetically pleasing at least.





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"Re(2):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Thu 16 Jun 19:48post reply

quote:
I also go nuts watching people follow up with jumping attacks after Chun Li's Houyoku Sen. By the time I get in the air, they're already on the ground. Is there some trick to this!?



Just input the super jump on the last hit of the SA2, it's like a cancel.






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"Re(2):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Thu 16 Jun 20:10post reply

quote:
That one's tricky, since you want to hit with the hukiage and the controls reverse on you in the middle.


Just wait until the dash is complete and do the fukiage. It's always reversed commands, so there's no possibility of mistake. After that, 2HK or jump up HP are good followups.


I have yet to practice with Jun's Gen'ei Jin; I always use his SAII. I suspect I won't be able to do the good GJ stuff, but I'll try someday. While SAII may have low damage, it has a short bar and you can store 3 of them, plus it's very comboable from nearly every move. 2MKxxSAII or UOH, SAII (Link) are always good options to have. Also, 3 bars mean lots of EX moves available.





Spoon
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"Re(2):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Fri 17 Jun 01:34:post reply

quote:
I finally got 3rd Strike back and I realize what an inept player I am. I was hoping to be the bottom rung of the ladder of success, but instead I'm the top rung of the failure ladder. Everything that everyone talks about everywhere, I am totally incapable of doing.



This is totally normal.

quote:

Like juggling after throwing with Necro in the corner...I can easily juggle with standing MP, but I cannot, for the life of me, no matter how many times I try, juggle with WP (necessary for combos).



I haven't seen games lost on the (in)ability to do that, so don't worry about it too much. You've got MP down, anyway.

quote:

I also go nuts watching people follow up with jumping attacks after Chun Li's Houyoku Sen. By the time I get in the air, they're already on the ground. Is there some trick to this!?



What IS required is a super jump cancel on the last hit. The window for it is not huge, but if you're having a really hard time doing it, just mash db,uf on your joystick for the entire duration of the SA.

quote:

Makoto



I don't use Makoto at all, but your problems all sound theoretically correct. One thing that you might find handy is to remember that there are "weight classes" in the game; i.e. different characters fall at different rates and get launched to different heights from moves. The significance of this is that the timing, moves, and even possibility of many juggles varies between characters of the weight classes. So how is this at all significant to this? Well, if the whole side switching thing is being a pain, pick a lighter character to be the practice dummy. Alex, the default training dummy for P2, is among the heaviest (i.e. launched to the lowest height for a given move) in the game. Necro is heavier than Ken/Ryu (who are average), and Yun/Ibuki/etc. are among the lightest. Picking a lighter target gives you more time to execute the juggle, usually.

quote:

I'm also, tragically too slow to link the genei jin after lp,lk,mp with Yun.


First of all, this should be a cancel and not a link. Pedantic, yes. But in practice, an important distinction. You can make your life much easier by doing this:
lp,lk, mp xx DP+lp xx genei
If you can land the DP, the genei jin is just another qcf away. You will probably want to hold the mp while doing the cancel, else you might accidentally get a DP+mp, which will NOT combo. The DP also gets you meter. Yay.





[this message was edited by Spoon on Fri 17 Jun 02:07]

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"Re(3):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Fri 17 Jun 05:35post reply

quote:
there are "weight classes" in the game ie different characters

HEY YOU HEAR THAT ? DIFFERENT !
Yes Chunli, I hear that.
ME NOT FAT, ME DIFFERENT ! YATTA !
Yes Chunli, you are not fat. No, stop it, I told you, this is my lunch.
But me hungry....
Yes, but you already ate your meal, and those of the rest of the class as well. That's enough.
IT'S BECAUSE CHUNLI DIFFERENT ! YATTA !
Yes, Chunli, I know, you're... No, that's my leg. You can't eat people's legs.
BUT CHUNLI IS HUNGRY !
Yes, but it's not STOP IT YOU CAN'T EAT PEOPLE'S LEG STOP IT AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH SOMEONE STOP HER SHE'S HEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEELP !!!!!!!!!
ME HUNGRY, ME EAT ! YATTA !


~Fin~





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"Re(3):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Fri 17 Jun 07:38post reply

Lots of stuff...

Burning Kyo: Ah, thanks. I was totally messed up on that. I was trying to time it afterwards and I wasn't even super jumping. It's actually really easy to do.

Time Mage: Or if you're insane, dash and fukiage again.

I'm not convinced with Yun's sourai rengeki. I really think it's his weakest. The advantage is that you build a gauge quickly, and if you can't do anything with genei jin, then it's better for EX moves, but I don't know if it's better than you-hou altogether. I mean, you-hou is also highly comboable, gives you plenty of EX room (though I rarely use Yun's EX moves) and does more damage. Although it takes longer to build, I can build a gauge with Yun faster than anyone else, so it's hardly an issue.

Spoon:
Whew...about Necro. It's not really that I have to have that jab juggle to win, it's more about the frustration of watching someone do (what appears to be) exactly what I do and having it connect, while my poke goes right through the enemy time and time again. I can't figure out what I'm doing wrong.

About Makoto/Chun Li...no more problems.

About Yun...whew. I was avoiding doing the shoulder before the super, because it hurts the damage. Of course, scaled damage is still better than no damage at all. I have problems being consistant on that combo to begin with. I can do the hop punch right after the mp, but the combination of the delay before the MP and doing a dp motion gets me about 2/3 of the time. Anyway, the distance for that is right for a decent corner combo? So I should start with Mp,fHP,fMK,fMK... (after genei jin) right? I realize that there are different weight class combos, but I'm not getting into that mess. I'll just do a dumbed down universal combo.

Also, what should I do from the middle of the screen/after his command throw? It seems like a waste to spend precious genei jin time on his throw, but I find that it connects quite often, since players get scared when you genei jin. I realize that I should always combo the genei jin, but in an imperfect world, I tend to miss it from time to time.





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"Re(4):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Fri 17 Jun 10:35post reply

quote:

questions!



I've got a huge ass reply to all this.

But I need to validate some of the stuff myself on my PS2, and right now I'm in middle of studying for finals (summer classes...) that are coming up in a day or two.

In the meantime, Yun combo for you to try to figure out:
It's so beautiful






burning kyo
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"Re(4):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Fri 17 Jun 17:00:post reply

quote:
Time Mage: Or if you're insane, dash and fukiage again.



You can't unless if you kara the 1st fukiage with HK.
It can lead to a full stun combo on almost everyone : SA2, dash kara-dpMP, dash dpLP, jump HP. There's many videos of this combo on SRK board (>SF3.3>Makoto).

edit : and with Yun, just after his command throw, you can just do a crouch HK and play a guessing game when the opponent wake up.
I remember that you can enter a close MK after the command throw (which lead you to a standard genei-jin combo), but I don't remember with which button you need to input the command throw ...
Too long time I haven't play SF3.3 ...






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[this message was edited by burning kyo on Fri 17 Jun 17:09]

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"Re(5):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Fri 17 Jun 17:43post reply

quote:
Time Mage: Or if you're insane, dash and fukiage again.


You can't unless if you kara the 1st fukiage with HK.
It can lead to a full stun combo on almost everyone : SA2, dash kara-dpMP, dash dpLP, jump HP. There's many videos of this combo on SRK board (>SF3.3>Makoto).


Yeah, that's right, and since I'm an inept Kara-cancelling stuff, I didn't even mention it.


And about Yun's SAII, it has one very important advantage over his SAI: It comboes from his UOH, unlike the You Hou, so that makes Yun quite fearsome in wakeup situations against many characters without a decent wakeup move. The You Hou has a little bit less range, making it not as versatile, in my opinion. I've been able to nail 2 SAII within 5 seconds, just guessing right if my opponent was going to wake up blocking low or high. And that's quite a lot more damage than a You Hou.
Anyway, his best super is the Gen'ei Jin, so whatever.


Oh, and a VERY important question: What colour do you pick for you characters? My picks, in the DC version are:

- Remy: Start+Left shoulder. All black, blue hair. Better suited for him than his original costume.
- Makoto: Green (Y) button: Green hair!
- Yun and Yang: Red (A) Button: Both get a Black & white costume, and Yang gets red hair, effectively making him Iori's long lost twin.

I'll stop here, but I have a colour for nearly every character.





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"Re(6):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Fri 17 Jun 17:58post reply

quote:
Oh, and a VERY important question: What colour do you pick for you characters?


Red Q is surely the coolest, but I get cocky when I pick red Q and make dumb decisions. For this reason I have stopped using Red Q entirely, dropped like a bad habit.

I use White Q whenever I pick SAII, no exceptions. White Q is the moonwalker, capable of escaping gigas even when he is CLEARLY crouching during the super flash (I'm not kidding, I did this twice in a match).

Normal brown Q is usually use when I pick SAI. Brown Q is my training color. It keeps me humble.

Pink Q cannot be picked in the arcade, but his power is theoretically unbounded. Theoretically, anyway.





burning kyo
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"Re(6):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Fri 17 Jun 18:12post reply

quote:
Yeah, that's right, and since I'm an inept Kara-cancelling stuff, I didn't even mention it.
Oh, and a VERY important question: What colour do you pick for you characters?


I can do this Makoto's combo around 70 % of the time. IMO the hardest part isn't the kara-cancel ... for me, it's the 2nd fukiage. Sometimes it did a qcfP instead ... ^_^'
(I play on ps2 version)

My colors are :
- Makoto : MP (white dougi, red scarf, dark green hair) or LP (standard color)
- Chun : LP (standard color) or HK (?) (red clothes)
- Yang : green top, black pant, dark purple hair or standard color or iori color
- Ken : HK (white dougi)






[welcome to the devil's nest]

Pollyanna
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"Re(7):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Fri 17 Jun 18:52post reply

Time Mage: Ah ah! That's a good point about the UOH. I might have to play with that sometime to see if it's worth it on days when I decide that the genei jin isn't worth the stress.

Spoon: Hahaha...that's great that you attribute things to the colors. A long time ago, me and a friend of mine insisted that purple Ken was better than red Ken (in SFZ) and started documenting it. We came up with a Ken tier list and purple Ken was, naturally, on the top. Our friend that argued for red Ken refused to accept our SCIENTIFIC PROOF that purple Ken was superior. I don't know if this applies to Zero 3, SF2 or SF3, though. Maybe Capcom fixed the problem and toned purple Ken down to the near useless level of red Ken.





Spoon
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"Re(8):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Sat 18 Jun 02:08post reply

quote:
Spoon: Hahaha...that's great that you attribute things to the colors. A long time ago, me and a friend of mine insisted that purple Ken was better than red Ken (in SFZ) and started documenting it. We came up with a Ken tier list and purple Ken was, naturally, on the top. Our friend that argued for red Ken refused to accept our SCIENTIFIC PROOF that purple Ken was superior. I don't know if this applies to Zero 3, SF2 or SF3, though. Maybe Capcom fixed the problem and toned purple Ken down to the near useless level of red Ken.



You people are wrong.

The strongest of all Kens is Blue Ken in SFA3. He can only be selected in X-ism. The blue outfit + blonde hair + huge X led us to dub him, "X-Men Ken".





Pollyanna
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"Re(9):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Sat 18 Jun 06:35post reply

quote:

You people are wrong.

The strongest of all Kens is Blue Ken in SFA3. He can only be selected in X-ism. The blue outfit + blonde hair + huge X led us to dub him, "X-Men Ken".



I haven't tested SFZ3, so maybe he's the new "purple Ken". All I know is that he wasn't fixed by Zero 2. But X-Men Ken was a new character, right?

Are there any overpowered colors in 3S? I'd like to put Smurf Urien to the test, but I don't know enough Urien players to test him against other Uriens.





Time Mage
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"Re(10):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Sat 18 Jun 08:11post reply

quote:
Are there any overpowered colors in 3S? I'd like to put Smurf Urien to the test, but I don't know enough Urien players to test him against other Uriens.


Smurf Urien is obviously overpowered, as well as clown Hugo and Barbie Ibuki. Barbie Ibuki, however, is a double-sided weapon: she hurts your view as well as your opponent's. If you can play without seeing, though, Barbie Ibuki is top tier.

Also, THE colour of Twelve is his "army men green" colour, and Chunli is better in her dominatrix incarnation, the all-black Start + right trigger combo.


Oh, and the real Ken is bright orange Ken in SFA2. That's powerful.





Pollyanna
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"Re(2):Re(10):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Sat 18 Jun 08:31post reply

quote:

Oh, and the real Ken is bright orange Ken in SFA2. That's powerful.



Funny that you mention that.Our studies actually concluded that he's top tier, though still under purple Ken.

Hahaha...I can't wait for someone to not realize that we're joking. Though I really did make a ranking of Kens.





Spoon
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"Re(10):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Sat 18 Jun 09:10post reply

quote:

I haven't tested SFZ3, so maybe he's the new "purple Ken". All I know is that he wasn't fixed by Zero 2. But X-Men Ken was a new character, right?

Are there any overpowered colors in 3S? I'd like to put Smurf Urien to the test, but I don't know enough Urien players to test him against other Uriens.



Well, Ken wouldn't be X-men Ken without X-ism, so he's probably just mid tier in earlier games where he's blue.

There is a significant, devoted group that believe the pink characters in 3S are the strongest. This is obviously false, since Red Q is not pink.

Barbie Ibuki is upper mid tier.

Iggy Alex is BOTTOM tier. hehehehe

Black 12 is pretty high tier on dark monitors in the Russia stage. Kinda like how I would use Black Faust in GGXX (he's SIGNIFICANTLY less black in XX#r, serious).

Did you guys ever see the Shin (or some other prefix) Akuma bug in the home (I think PSX) version of ST? If he activates Raging Demon the instant he is hit by a fireball, then the game world freezes except for Akuma. He can shoot fireballs and stuff, but they won't move anywhere. He can hit his opponent or "throw" them and make them lose life.... until he does another Raging Demon, and time resumes. It's the most awesome SF2 glitch EVER, because it confirms why Akuma is flat out broken: he has THE WORLD.

TOKIYO TOMARE





CHAZumaru
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"Re(2):Re(10):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Sat 18 Jun 19:04post reply

Vanilla Q is completely broken.





Spoon
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"Re(3):Re(10):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Thu 23 Jun 15:16post reply

Chaz brought in that speical aroma of French fruit, and now my thread has been ruined.

Sooooo... who wants to play some Jojo's Bizarre Adventure?
Cuz that site updated with a new match compilation vid.

Old Joseph is a f'n grapple monster.





Time Mage
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"Re(4):Re(10):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Thu 23 Jun 17:26post reply

I'm more interested in doing imaginary Third Strike combos (since right now I don't have access to the game). Could any Q player confirm or refute (probably the latter) this combo?:

Q, SAII:

63214K, [4]2[P], [4]2Pxx236236P, [4]2[P], [4]2P

Where [] means "hold".





Iggy
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"Re(4):Re(10):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Thu 23 Jun 17:31post reply

quote:
Cuz that site updated with a new match compilation vid.

I am in awe.





ねんがんの ネ申ゲーをてにいれたぞ!

Jason
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"Re(5):Re(10):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Fri 24 Jun 02:13:post reply

quote:
I'm more interested in doing imaginary Third Strike combos (since right now I don't have access to the game). Could any Q player confirm or refute (probably the latter) this combo?:

Q, SAII:

63214K, [4]2[P], [4]2Pxx236236P, [4]2[P], [4]2P

Where [] means "hold".


I'm gonna step up to the plate and refute. The combo's fine up until the SA, but at this point, you'll notice that the combo counter pops onto the screen before your opponent lands, indicating that no more juggling will be allowed. I'm not sure, but I think it might be due to a 2 hit juggle limit specific to the c&db, much like how knockdown juggles are generally limited to 6 (not counting supers). The fact that you can't juggle after a wall bounce ex-dash if you decide to use it as the second juggle hit after a c&db seems to go along with this. Also, I'm pretty sure that you're limited to one follow-up hit after SAII, even under normal circumstances.





I knew I would do it and I know this I know what I am doing now that I am doing something both beautiful but gruesome because I am destroying its beauty by knowing that it might be beautiful know that if I know that I am dong something beautiful that it's no longer beautiful. - Dave Eggers A.H.W.O.S.G.

[this message was edited by Jason on Fri 24 Jun 02:15]

Time Mage
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"Re(6):Re(10):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Fri 24 Jun 04:14post reply

quote:
I'm more interested in doing imaginary Third Strike combos (since right now I don't have access to the game). Could any Q player confirm or refute (probably the latter) this combo?:

Q, SAII:

63214K, [4]2[P], [4]2Pxx236236P, [4]2[P], [4]2P

Where [] means "hold".

I'm gonna step up to the plate and refute. The combo's fine up until the SA, but at this point, you'll notice that the combo counter pops onto the screen before your opponent lands, indicating that no more juggling will be allowed. I'm not sure, but I think it might be due to a 2 hit juggle limit specific to the c&db, much like how knockdown juggles are generally limited to 6 (not counting supers). The fact that you can't juggle after a wall bounce ex-dash if you decide to use it as the second juggle hit after a c&db seems to go along with this. Also, I'm pretty sure that you're limited to one follow-up hit after SAII, even under normal circumstances.



Heh, I supposed something like that would happen, but I had to try. Thanks for the refutal.





Spoon
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"Re(6):Re(10):Re(10):Because we care..." , posted Fri 24 Jun 04:50post reply

quote:
Also, I'm pretty sure that you're limited to one follow-up hit after SAII, even under normal circumstances.



Except when the SAII dizzies opponent, this is more or less the case.

Corner juggle demonstrated by KYSG following a SAII dizzy:
close LP, UOH, HP





Pollyanna
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"The OTHER best fighter ever" , posted Fri 24 Jun 17:44post reply

OK OK, so I finally broke down and bought VF4: Evolution after giving up hope for a home version of Final Tuned. I haven't spent too much time with it, but I think I've cleared 5 arcades in quest mode (3 clearing all the special quest objectives and 2 clearing some).

I assumed that doing so would unlock more items in the shop, but alas, that is not the case. Do you get items like in VF4, by completing odd objectives? I NEED MORE PRETTY!