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Mosquiton

1462th Post

Red Carpet Executive Member

"RPG system poll" , posted Tue 21 Dec 09:40

Do you like forging, fusing, or synthesising new equipment?
	Yes, it's fun to discover new weapons and items through experimentation.
	Yes, but sometimes it can get too time-consuming or complicated.
	Are you kidding? I hate that shit.
	I'd rather acquire more powerful items gradually.
	Improving stats and items is just a useless way to spend time.

So what strikes your fancy?

Personally, like random encounters I'm completely sick of having to play a lab technician and combine random ingredients together to try and come up with better stuff through trial and error.

I admit that Boktai 2 has a really cool forging system (you go out in the sun to heat the furnace and strike the hammer yourself), but the novelty of combining items is totally gone for me.

I couldn't possibly have fewer qualms about printing out a FAQ and skipping the RPG busywork.

/ / /

Replies:

Nate

352th Post

Silver Customer

"Re(1):RPG system poll" , posted Tue 21 Dec 10:03

quote:

So what strikes your fancy?

Personally, like random encounters I'm completely sick of having to play a lab technician and combine random ingredients together to try and come up with better stuff through trial and error.

I admit that Boktai 2 has a really cool forging system (you go out in the sun to heat the furnace and strike the hammer yourself), but the novelty of combining items is totally gone for me.

I couldn't possibly have fewer qualms about printing out a FAQ and skipping the RPG busywork.

Yeah, I'm rather annoyed that EVERY RPG lately has had some kind of fixation on "HAY HERE'S A RANDOM PROCESS THAT TAKES HOURS TO GET WHAT YOU WANT BUT WHEN YOU DO YOU'LL BE SUPER OVERPOWERED! TOTALLY WORTH IT OMG"

So yeah, I hate that shit. Legend of Mana in particular strikes me as one of the worst offenders.

THIS IS DWARF INVASION!

Juke Joint Jezebel

3236th Post

Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master

"Re(2):RPG system poll" , posted Tue 21 Dec 12:12

i don't care either way. if i've gotta jump through hoops to customize my own stuff, i'll do it, i guess (Hoshigami, Disgaea). i still prefer the old school way

quote:
I couldn't possibly have fewer qualms about printing out a FAQ and skipping the RPG busywork.

exactly. i spend a lot of time doing senseless shit in rpgs, so if i (of all people) need to use a faq to finish the game, then the system's probably too complicated

Pollyanna

670th Post

Red Carpet Regular Member

"Re(3):RPG system poll" , posted Tue 21 Dec 16:43

I don't like forging per se, but I do like "micromanagement" like in Phantom Brave....or any number of other SRPGs. With most Nippon-1 games, I get into the system enough to get me through the game, but can't stand the absurd complexities and tricks needed to finish all the extra stuff. I want freedom and variety that I can enjoy without ridiculous technicalities or devotion of time. (Megaten games tend to give me this pretty well)

But as far as the whole "combining items to get new items" nonsense goes, I lose interest really fast. I especially hated the invention system in SO3. Somehow, (although I think it needs to be streamlined) I'm having at least a little bit of fun with alchemy in Stella Deus. Not because it's a good system, but because it's fun to say "if I can make this item, then I can make this item, but first I have to make this item and this item to make this item...etc. etc." it's absurd, but it's like solving a puzzle. Or maybe it's just a test of patience.

NARUTO

2829th Post

Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master

"Re(4):RPG system poll" , posted Tue 21 Dec 19:09

well IMO I like it, I've spended hours and hours to do this on Ledgend of Mana.
Still, forging is one thing, but the system that allow you that should be well done...

The biggest Talent

it's to make peoples belive you're talented...

HAYATO
141th Post

Regular Customer

"Re(2):RPG system poll" , posted Tue 21 Dec 19:10

quote:

So yeah, I hate that shit. Legend of Mana in particular strikes me as one of the worst offenders.

Yeah, I thought about this one when I answered the poll...what a pain in the ass.

I find this upgrading system quite appealing per se, but it all depends on how you translate the idea to the real game...

Iggy

5223th Post

Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master

"Re(2):RPG system poll" , posted Tue 21 Dec 20:01

quote:
So yeah, I hate that shit.

Totally agree.

quote:
Legend of Mana in particular strikes me as one of the worst offenders.

Totally disagree. Mana was more about personalization and less about having über items. The game wasn't hard to begin with (or maybe in no future mode), so the purpose of creating a 999 weapon is pretty worthless.

Time Mage

2012th Post

Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master

"Re(1):RPG system poll" , posted Tue 21 Dec 20:19

I spent 50% of the time I played Vagrant Story in the workshop creating new weapons and armors, and loved it.

I think that, if it's well done and well integrated in the game it's more interesting than just going to a shop and buying it.

Nate

356th Post

Silver Customer

"Re(3):RPG system poll" , posted Tue 21 Dec 20:19

quote:

Totally disagree. Mana was more about personalization and less about having über items. The game wasn't hard to begin with (or maybe in no future mode), so the purpose of creating a 999 weapon is pretty worthless.

It wasn't that so much as how frustrating and seemingly random it was to even TRY to make anything better than you could get in stores. Why even include it if it's so hard to do right in the first place?

THIS IS DWARF INVASION!

Iggy

5226th Post

Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master

"Re(4):RPG system poll" , posted Tue 21 Dec 20:34:

quote:
It wasn't that so much as how frustrating and seemingly random it was to even TRY to make anything better than you could get in stores. Why even include it if it's so hard to do right in the first place?

It's completely impossible to use it properly if you don't have the Ultimania with you. But when you have it and know where you're going, it's an interesting mini game / side quest.
Why I don't consider this system enerving is because it can be fun when you do it with the Ultimania, but if you decide to stay away from the workshop, you're not penalized at all, there are several other ways to get some strong equipment. This liberty is severely lacking in other game with a similar system.

[this message was edited by Iggy on Tue 21 Dec 20:34]

KTallguy

443th Post

Gold Customer

"Re(2):RPG system poll" , posted Tue 21 Dec 22:19

quote:
I spent 50% of the time I played Vagrant Story in the workshop creating new weapons and armors, and loved it.

I think that, if it's well done and well integrated in the game it's more interesting than just going to a shop and buying it.

I think Vagrant Story's system was perfect. I remember being in that blacksmith forever... =) I really liked the music too ... I liked how the weapons were really what made the game, and how you could really create good stuff if you were logical about it.

That game needs a sequel so badly... after FF12 is done they have to tackle that one...

Customization is a lot of fun I think, but at the same time, the game has to be fun as well, and likewise, when you customize something, it needs to be reflected in the game in a positive and reinforcing way. I don't want to spend an hour forging a weapon and realize that the only thing that looks different is the damage. My problem with LOM was that the combat got old really fast, and even though the story was interesting, nothing really tied together at the end... if the combat isn't fun, there's no use in forging for me ...

Support the Strongest Cooperation! Ibuki and Genjuro!
"手前がやくぶそくなんだよ!"

HAYATO
143th Post

Regular Customer

"Re(3):RPG system poll" , posted Wed 22 Dec 00:18

quote:
My problem with LOM was that the combat got old really fast, and even though the story was interesting, nothing really tied together at the end... if the combat isn't fun, there's no use in forging for me ...

Well, if I'm not much mistaken, there were at least 2 argumental arcs (the Jumi story and the one about the 3 Dragons), which were consistent enough to be called "plots". The matter was thet you had to finish the events in the correct order to know where all this mess was leading to...Plus, I found the last event in the Mana Tree really thrilling and intense, but my friends say I'm easy to content, so...

Iggy

5227th Post

Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master

"Re(4):RPG system poll" , posted Wed 22 Dec 00:33

quote:
Well, if I'm not much mistaken, there were at least 2 argumental arcs (the Jumi story and the one about the 3 Dragons), which were consistent enough to be called "plots".

The 3 important arcs were the rumi arc, the Escade arc and the dragon killer arc.
I loved all of them, but the Escade arc in particular is one of the best written scenario I ever saw in a game.

KTallguy

446th Post

Gold Customer

"Re(5):RPG system poll" , posted Wed 22 Dec 02:59

quote:

I loved all of them, but the Escade arc in particular is one of the best written scenario I ever saw in a game.

I should play it again when I get a chance, but I just found the combat really boring... I think the only way to have fun with it is to play with a friend. If I recall you couldn't run from battles at all?

Support the Strongest Cooperation! Ibuki and Genjuro!
"手前がやくぶそくなんだよ!"

Mosquiton

1464th Post

Red Carpet Executive Member

"Re(5):RPG system poll" , posted Wed 22 Dec 03:17

quote:

The 3 important arcs were the rumi arc, the Escade arc and the dragon killer arc.
I loved all of them, but the Escade arc in particular is one of the best written scenario I ever saw in a game.

Too bad it wasn't better executed... I enjoyed the game overall, but everything was so fragmented that nothing about that game really stuck with me. That goddamn annoying mail carrier pelican is probably the strongest memory I have of the game....

Speaking of the combat, I often found myself trying to minimize how much damage I did so I could actually build up the special attack gauge before everyone on the screen was dead. And the locking screen....

I'm very much looking forward to the next mana(s), though.

/ / /

Iggy

5228th Post

Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master

"Re(6):RPG system poll" , posted Wed 22 Dec 04:18

OK, OK, I know, not many people love this game, I know, stop it already.
The fights were not all that great, but to me it was less boring as in Seiken 2 and 3. I liked the magic system, and the way you gained new habilities and moves.

But the real reason why this game stays above the usual crap Square is constantly vomiting on its fans is the way the free scenario system is implanted. Not much people like a free scenario game anyways, but for fans like us, it is pure bliss. The way the events happened is the way it should have been done in RomaSaga, it introduced several storylines above the 3 main ones, some less well written and more "Seiken-ish" than the Escade arc, but it introduced a gap I never found in any other game, which is the world is living by his own, whereas the hero is not.

I mean, he is living, but on a plane different of the one where the other characters live; he is between the world of the game and the world of the player. This separation of the worlds, the theme of the reconstruction of the universe which happens via the construction of both individual stories and History, by the hand of the player/hero, is what really hooked me on this thing, and be assured that if I don't say more, it's just because I don't have any of this illegal substance that goes oh so well with this game or Katamari and not because I'm too stupid to say anything more coherent.

Hey, no, wait, I meant the other way. Or no, I meant... oh, well.

HAYATO
147th Post

Regular Customer

"Re(7):RPG system poll" , posted Wed 22 Dec 09:13

Yes, I forgot about Escad and friends. A really emotive story...too bad the ending was so sad. Heaven's gate (the event of the floating dragon world) was really awesome.

Legend of Mana was a great game. Really easy to beat, but fun all the way (except for those gadgets/blacksmith/golem factory thing), one of the best PSOne games IMO.