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Pollyanna

422th Post

Gold Customer

"Avatar Tuner" , posted Fri 20 Aug 00:25

Look at me! Look at me! I'm starting a thread! I'm all grown up now, like a proper lady!

Anyway, I've been playing Digital Devil Saga: Avatar Tuner lately, as any good Megaten fan should. Has anyone else picked it up, or are you all waiting for the US release?

The more I play the game, the more I like it. I was expecting it to be like Persona when I heard that the direction would resemble something like FFX and the scenes were fully voice-acted. However, it's actually quite close to Shin Megaten 3. The battle system is nearly exactly the same and it's very much gameplay and dungeon based.

Of course, having 2 Shin Megaten 3s already, I felt like I didn't need a 3rd at first. At first I felt like it was "baby Megaten 3", but as the game progresses, it adds a lot of depth and customization to the system. However, not being able to negotiate with demons, get items/spells/anything from them leaves a bit of a hole in my heart.

Hmmm...I don't want to write more than people want to read or describe the system if nobody cares. So...I'll be brief for now, unless someone wants to know something.

Good:
Great soundtrack (lots of guitar),weird plot, excellent voice acting, challenging dungeons, SMT3 fight system, interesting characters.

Bad:
Nothing to do with enemies, lots of recycled renders from SMT3, bosses are a little easy (especially after Maniacs), not enough money and no effective way to get it., horrible "villain" designs (no way Kaneko did this mess).

Replies:

Juke Joint Jezebel

3109th Post

Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master

"Re(1):Avatar Tuner" , posted Fri 20 Aug 01:07

cool game, even cooler visuals

http://l-c.hp.infoseek.co.jp/mirror/psx2/ddsat.html

Each day I'm swimming through molasses.

Pollyanna

423th Post

Gold Customer

"Re(2):Avatar Tuner" , posted Fri 20 Aug 01:51

You win again, you rapscallion....but know this:
Justice will prevail in the end!

Variable Savior
209th Post

Frequent Customer

"Demon involvement?" , posted Fri 20 Aug 06:15

I haven't heard much about DDS but I intend to pick up the US release due in November. One of the few things I've heard is that you absorb demon characteristics (possibly by eating their flesh?). I'm curious as to how this actually works (provided that it's even an actual feature of the game).

Does absorption give you access to the demon's spell list or is it just a statistical increase? Is the assimilation of these factors cumulative or can you only 'store' one demon at a time?? While it does seem unlikely I have to wonder if your character's appearance changes at all with the absorption of different demons.

Blood marks heaven's path

Ammadeau

1081th Post

Red Carpet Premium Member

"Recycling isn't always a good thing." , posted Fri 20 Aug 06:33:

I've been playing it off and on, though for some reason the more I play, the less I like. Seeing the same recycled demons over and over wears me down (though I think most of the new demons have terrible designs so I guess its a mixed blessing) and the plot is pretty meh overall. Predicatable stuff. I like the mantra system (especially not losing skills) and linkage is cool even if I hardly ever use it. Human forms don't seem too useful sadly, especially when it takes up a turn to transform.

I think I would like it more if I hadn't played SMT3 for close to 60 hours.

I don't know anything about eating demons since you need a certain skill for it which I do not have.

Currently on 'the Ship' level, which is filled with shock and cold attacking demons who walk right into reflection skills. Not exactly challenging.

Got Next - it's a gaming site I write stupid things for

[this message was edited by Ammadeau on Fri 20 Aug 06:36]

Oroch

679th Post

Red Carpet Regular Member

"Re(2):Avatar Tuner" , posted Fri 20 Aug 06:36

quote:
cool game, even cooler visuals

http://l-c.hp.infoseek.co.jp/mirror/psx2/ddsat.html

jjj the kid toucher!

真剣勝負

sabo10

950th Post

Red Carpet Regular Member++

"Re(3):Avatar Tuner" , posted Fri 20 Aug 06:39

quote:
cool game, even cooler visuals

http://l-c.hp.infoseek.co.jp/mirror/psx2/ddsat.html

jjj the kid toucher!

Shintaisou Kari live action remake!

Welcone
Needless to say
Please give me the Jesus advent

Pollyanna

424th Post

Gold Customer

"Re(4):Avatar Tuner" , posted Fri 20 Aug 13:40

Ammadeau: Uhm...well it doesn't SHOW you eating the demons, but that's like...a major plot element. If you say that it takes a skill (you must be thinking of "hunt") and that the plot is mediocre, I might say "is your Japanese good enough to appreciate the plot?" That isn't a challenge, I'm just wondering...because on the surface, the plot is rather typical, but what's -actually- going on is really interesting (I think).
I -totally- agree about the human form, thing. It's wasted potential and you don't have enough money to keep up weapons for them, either.

Variable Savior: Every place on the internet seems to have a misunderstanding about this. While you do eat the demons you defeat, it's more of a plot element than a gameplay feature. All it does is give you AP to learn different "mantra" or spell sets. The only time it really effects the gameplay is when one character refuses to do it (and rightfully so) and doesn't get any AP for a while.

Every move you have is controlled by mantras. However, you can equip a large number of skills/stat modifiers of your choice from any mantra. Any character can learn any mantra...they just have to learn some before others become available. While characters have elemental affiliations (Serph is weak to fire, for example) that doesn't make him bad at fire spells...quite to the contrary, if you learn enough fire skills, he will overcome his weakness.

The monsters you turn into never change, though. There's just a huge degree of customization in terms of moves. For Megaten fans, it might seem limited, but if you look at it objectively, it's an excellent and reasonably complex system.

Ammadeau

1085th Post

Red Carpet Premium Member

"Re(5):Avatar Tuner" , posted Fri 20 Aug 22:52

quote:
Ammadeau: Uhm...well it doesn't SHOW you eating the demons, but that's like...a major plot element. If you say that it takes a skill (you must be thinking of "hunt") and that the plot is mediocre, I might say "is your Japanese good enough to appreciate the plot?" That isn't a challenge, I'm just wondering...because on the surface, the plot is rather typical, but what's -actually- going on is really interesting (I think).

Yeah, I was thinking of hunt and got a little mixed up. Eating demons is hard to miss as a plot element with 'eat them all' and everything.

I admit my knowledge of Japanese is very bad, so deeper complexity is lost on me, but I've been able to predict virtually everything that's happened so far, which wasn't something I could do with SMT3.

Got Next - it's a gaming site I write stupid things for

Pollyanna

427th Post

Gold Customer

"Re(6):Avatar Tuner" , posted Fri 20 Aug 23:54:

quote:

I admit my knowledge of Japanese is very bad, so deeper complexity is lost on me, but I've been able to predict virtually everything that's happened so far, which wasn't something I could do with SMT3.

Yeah, I can see what you mean, as many of the things that happen are somewhat typical. When I first heard about Sera, I was practically offended. However, as the game has progressed, although there haven't been plot twists on the surface so much, I'm having TONS of fun trying to figure out what everything means and what the world the characters are in actually is.

Edit: Boss fights need to be harder. SMT3 really hardens you up for that sort of thing and AT isn't a test of my experience.

[this message was edited by Pollyanna on Fri 20 Aug 23:55]

Iggy

4164th Post

Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master

"Re(7):Avatar Tuner" , posted Sat 21 Aug 00:31

quote:
I'm having TONS of fun trying to figure out what everything means and what the world the characters are in actually is.

I've heard a few things about the end and what this is all about... And you're saying you don't see where it is going ? Hmmm, interesting.

quote:
Boss fights need to be harder.

You haven't met the hidden boss yet have you ?

Pollyanna

427th Post

Gold Customer

"Re(8):Avatar Tuner" , posted Sat 21 Aug 01:03

Excellent, Iggy. Of course, you know more about the game I'm playing than I do.

I'm pretty much at the end of theg ame now, so I haven't botehred with any hidden bosses yet. Regardless, a few hidden bosses do not make up for (nor do they have relevance) to a game of unsatisfying normal bosses.

Iggy

4168th Post

Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master

"Re(9):Avatar Tuner" , posted Sat 21 Aug 01:08

quote:
Excellent, Iggy. Of course, you know more about the game I'm playing than I do.

I just thought it was a good thing the twist at the end was not announced 10 hours before in a OMG LOOK MAYBE THERE'S A POSSIBILITY THAT WE ARE...! way, but stays a surprise until the end. That's it.

Pollyanna

431th Post

Gold Customer

"Re(10):Avatar Tuner" , posted Sat 21 Aug 01:14

quote:
Excellent, Iggy. Of course, you know more about the game I'm playing than I do.
I just thought it was a good thing the twist at the end was not announced 10 hours before in a OMG LOOK MAYBE THERE'S A POSSIBILITY THAT WE ARE...! way, but stays a surprise until the end. That's it.

Well, there are certainly hints, and I have my theory, but the setting is so...strange...and it's interesting to watch the characters get little glimpses of "reality". I have a pretty good idea how it will end, but watching it happen and trying to figure out how and why is interesting. So...there aren't dramatic plot twists at any point, but more like...brief glimpses of the truth. This is fun for the player...but also fun to watch the characters feel it.

Pollyanna

444th Post

Gold Customer

"Heyyyy Iggyyyyy?" , posted Sat 28 Aug 14:44

Sorry to dig up my own old thread again, but I won AT a while ago and I was interested in what Japanese people were saying about the ending.

Iggy, while I wouldn't encourage you to spoil yourself, it seems like you already have, so I'm interested in what the revelation was. I ask, not because I missed it (that would be kinda hard unless you don't understand the characters at all) , but because I everything in the end is sort of vague and mysterious. So...I'm interested in other people's interpretation of the ending/last scenes.

Strangly, it seems to sort of fit in with the other Megaten games quite well.

Ah, the last boss fight(s) and the bonus fights are a LOT of fun, but I don't think I'm willing to put the time in to finish it all.

Iggy

4253th Post

Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master

"spoilers I'm not sure of ?" , posted Sun 29 Aug 04:01

I can't find any post in 2ch that say again what they said when the game came out (the game is OLD now ! more than a month!)
I think they were saying the game appear to be after the Yosuga ending of Nocturne. I think the trick was that actually that everyone was dead and the whole point of the thing was to come back to life...? I really can't remember excatly.

I think all you get by beating the secret boss is a short message and nothing else...
Sorry, I haven't saved the thread and my memory is... what it is.

Pollyanna

450th Post

Gold Customer

"Re(1):spoilers I'm not sure of ?" , posted Sun 29 Aug 04:12

No, you seem to have it pretty well. It's just that there are a lot of unanswered questions in the ending.

Surprisingly, it does seem to fit into the Megaten plot a bit. I want to say "it fits in better than SMT3", but I also want to say "It seems to fit into SMT3"...so really what I guess I should say is "it's confusing."

Spoiler (Highlight to view) -

While it didn't take me too long to figure out that everyone was dead, I was more interested in what that MEANT and what the consequences were...why they were dead...what "nirvana" and "junkyard" really are and such. WHile the plot in the game itself isn't terribly exciting, these looming questions and subtle hints throghout the game made it worthwhile.

End of Spoiler

Ah, and for me...just fighting the hidden bosses is reward enough. I never feel more accomplished than after I beat an SMT boss.

Iggy

4256th Post

Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master

"Re(2):spoilers I'm not sure of ?" , posted Sun 29 Aug 05:48

quote:
No, you seem to have it pretty well. It's just that there are a lot of unanswered questions in the ending.

Yeah, I think I remember this being part of the complaints about the game, the "wakewakaran" ending that doesn't answer much.

What do you mean "SMT3 doesn't fits in the general world" ? I had the feeling each game was in a universe of his own... You are talking about Gaia and all ?

Pollyanna

454th Post

Gold Customer

"Re(3):spoilers I'm not sure of ?" , posted Sun 29 Aug 14:12

quote:

What do you mean "SMT3 doesn't fits in the general world" ? I had the feeling each game was in a universe of his own... You are talking about Gaia and all ?

Well, SMT1 and SMT2 are directly connected and deal with some of the same issues/characters. SMT3 has no connection to the other 2, as far as I can tell and its system/mythology behind devil summoning is quite different. I suppose someone could say "SMT3 takes place before SMT1", but I think that sort of assumption is just speculation, and at any rate, there are no consequences in SMT3 that would carry over to SMT1 or SMT2 (as far as I can tell).

Some of the program ideas in AT seem to fit into the SMT1/2 world in a way, but the ending...

Spoiler (Highlight to view) -

Seems to drop you right into SMT3, except instead of their being no people at all, they're frozen in place

End of Spoiler

Iggy

4295th Post

Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master

"Re(4):spoilers I'm not sure of ?" , posted Mon 30 Aug 13:45

Well, actually, I had the feeling that every game, NINE, Soulhackers, Maken X and all, was in its own particular parallel universe, so I wasn't bothered by the idea of 3 not following directly 2.