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| OYashiroForever 492th Post
 
Gold Customer
    
    
|  "SVC Impressions Thread #4,132"
, posted Tue 16 Sep 20:42
Howdy, ladies and gents of the MMC.
I've now played myself about 10-12 hrs. worth of SvC (over 4 different days.. twice up in Greenbelt and twice at CTF), and figured I'd chime in with a few of my "too little, too late" impressions. I understand that most of this will be stuff you guys already know (either from playing the game, seeing it in a vid, or reading online), but I feel like saying a few things about the game nonetheless.
Characters I've personally played: Hugo (lots), Iori, Ken (once), Geese, Genjuro (Screw the Y), Shiki, Guile, Kim (once).
Characters I've fought (2-player, of course): just about everyone save for Mars Peeps, Demitri, and I haven't fought a good Genjuro or Choi yet.
Since I played the most with Hugo, I'll begin with him. It took me about 10 or so games to get the feel of SvC Hugo. If you go in expecting to play him like 2I/3S, you'll get murdered.
Bad:
- The jab clap comes out faster, but you can't do the same mix-up games you could do in 3S with the c. forward/c. rh/Meat Squasher. For one, the c.rh has now been relegated to a command move (f+B) which doesn't cover nearly the range that the c.rh did. In addition, you can't cancel the Meat Squasher as quickly as you could in 3S, so you can't surprise as many people with it that way.
- 3S s.strong (Hugo's best poke along with the sweep and c.jab) has also become a command (f+A) and isn't nearly as effective.
- the clothesline is even more useless than it was in 2I/3S. Not only does it completely whiff against low blockers, it gets beaten clean quite frequently by jump attacks.
- the parry is neat, but GCFS makes it totally useless.
Good:
- Hammer Mountain is MUCH better in this game... the first hit has ridiculous range and has a tendency of sucking guys in to get hit by the remainder of the super. The old overhead is still in there too.
- 360 Gigas!!! I nailed it almost every match (mostly off of GCFS... I'll get in to that later on). The fact that you can only do it once per match doesn't bother me at all. 50% and it's a 360... thank you, SNKP.
Iori = 2k2 Iori + old, useless super, old, useless DP+k move, and a free Maiden Masher ending (no super for an additional 15-20% of a bar?... uhh, okay). New counter super is cool (channeling Freeman is fun!), but playing Iori has always bored me to tears. He is VERY powerful, though (probably the best of the non-code chars).
Kim = 2k2 Kim w/ pre-2k2 Hisshou Kyaku and no HSDM. While it was fun to test out his MAX combos (most of the 2k2 ones work), I only used him once..
Geese = WAY... TOO... POWERFUL. Even without the infinite (the timing of which is entirely too easy), Geese is just a beast. It almost kinda sucks, because I've always liked Geese and used him quite frequently in CvS2. I used him a few times here and he feels like a complete character (tons of big-damage options, a move for every situation) which makes all of the other characters (with the exception of Zero + a couple others) feel somehow incomplete and unfinished.
Ken is Ken. Shoto DPs are not as good as the old days, but better than the last couple of SF games.
Genjuro:
- his B and C slashes are WAY too slow to be used as anything but well-positioned counters (no poking), but he has a vast array of his Shura/Rasetsu moves from SS 3/4 which are good situational moves.
- The old 3-slash manuever lost the cross-up properties, but the jab version is good for a quick, decent-damage combo.
- The fact that you can combo after his slash into uppercut move (forgot the name and motion for it) is wild. I saw one guy GCFS in to that move and then juggle with his card super.
- The Rage super is pretty fast and effective, but people have a tendency of running away as soon as you RAGE out.
Shiki:
- Having never used her in Samurai Tamaashi or Asura Zanmaden (which I hadn't even SEEN until recently), I didn't really know what to expect.
- Teleport has a very small vulnerability window. Got me out of trouble on more than one occasion. Good stuff.
- The command throw kiss is evil because it seems to randomly screw up your controls (it's not reversed like with Nicotine or Mizuki's in SS2.. or it doesn't appear to be anyway). One guy comboed me in to the kiss like 4 straight times in the corner until I got lucky and blocked the right way.
- Her exceed can drastically alter the momentum of a match. It does ~80% of a bar and gives her ~25% of a bar back PLUS can be comboed in to easily from her "f+A" slashes.
Guile
- I personally had no trouble adjusting to doing flash kicks. <shrug> Guess this was fixed for the final version. However, I did have trouble doing his charge down supers... but that could've just been me sucking.
- Sonic booms are scary good in this game. If it weren't for GCFS, Guile could seriously lock people down in the corner with the right sequence of pokes and SBs.
Enough character stuff (unless people have any questions... I'd be happy to answer whatever gameplay-related stuff I can).. general impressions.
The Good:
- I like that this game ISN'T "KoF with SF characters"... if anything, it feels more to me like a faster MotW. Most of the SF characters translated fairly well (with a couple of minor exceptions) and the majority of the KoF characters don't play EXACTLY like KoF.
- SNKP really understands what a "dream match" is all about. The character interaction is superb (Engrish aside), there are in-jokes by the ton, and everyone seems to acknowledge each other in a way you'd expect them too (No characters erecting statues of Guile in this one). Ryu is interested in worthy opponents, Shiki is indifferent, and Dan is appropriately pitiful. Good times.
The Bad:
- GCFS is awful. I can see what their (SNKP's) rationale was, but it's simply wayyyy too powerful. It's easy to perform (double-tapping after a block is not hard), uses up almost no meter (you usually gain back that much just by executing a combo after it), has a large invincibility window (on more than one occasion, I GCFSd a jab and had two more whiff before my move came out), and can lead in to ANYTHING. That is simply TOO powerful. I'm not a great player, but within 3 or 4 matches, I could do it consistently and was beating players that have FAR more experience with the game than I do. Add in the fact that normal throws have miserable range (and cost meter if whiffed), you can build meter pretty fast, and CD counters knock people across the screen and it didn't take me long to recognize that the game turns in to a turtle-fest if two people who know what they were doing are playing "to win".
- Code-characters are too powerful. While it is nice to see Dan putting up a fight, Goenitz/Geese/Zero/O.Iori/V.Ken (probably Demitri too, but I didn't see anyone use him) are all leagues ahead of the normal cast. Between tornados, GCFSd command throws, and CD counters Goenitz can keep you away as long as he wants and is incredibly frustrating. Zero has the easy infinite and the obnoxiously effective mine trap. O.Iori is just like regular (who is already very good) except twice as fast. V.Ken's just like regular except twice as fast, does way more damage, and has a zero-frame teleport. It's nuts... if you ban them all (which tourney folk don't usually like to do), you lose 25% of the cast. If you don't, the game essentially becomes 4 or 5 characters (sucks for a 1-on-1 game).
- BAD collision detection and hit boxes: I'm sorry, but there were WAYYYY too many limbs passing ghost-like through other people's bodies. I'm not talking about people going through fireballs or Dhalsim stretchy-limbs (they have to do that or else 'Sim would be Alpha 3 good). I'm talking about full-fledged DC Alpha 3 Sodom ghost limbs. It's nothing that you can't get accustomed to over time, but it's incredibly frustrating and unintuitive.
The Ugly:
- Not the graphics. Seriously, people whining about how "T3RRIBLE" SvC looks need to shut the hell up. Is it high-res? Nope. Neither was SS3 and that was a fantastic-LOOKING game. Does it have SF3-quality animation? Nope, but Hugo looks pretty damn close to his 3S counter-part. I think all you can really say about SvC's graphics are that they're adequate and that all the characters look like they belong in the same game (*cough*Morrigan in CvS*cough*). Does SNKP need to move on to a better piece of hardware that better illustrates what wonderful 2D artists they are? Uh huh. Do SvC's graphics have any negative impact on my feelings regarding the game? Nope.
- Hugo's Midnight Bliss. <shudder>
Bottom Line:
I came in expecting mediocrity and SvC delivered it in spades. While there's definitely a lot of things I like about this game (the graphics aren't half as bad as the whiners would have you believe, the attention paid to character interaction and "the little things" is fantastic, Capcom characters got a lot of new moves, and Hugo has all three of his supers.. yay!), there are just as many things that frustrate the shit out of me (absolutely wretched hit boxes and collision detection, GCFS is BUSTED, and tiny throw ranges). Overall, it's really not bad for a first attempt (the first iteration of nearly every fighting game series has been crap.. see CvS, Alpha 1, SF3:NG, Guilty Gear, X-men:CotA, etc.), but I can only hope some of the nonsense gets ironed out before the inevitable sequel. I plan on continuing to play it "for fun" and also buying the console port, but don't intend to play it as seriously or as much as other games I enjoy (ST, 3S, A2/3, MvC2, GGXX, etc.).
Comments, questions, non-flammable criticisms are welcome and encouraged. Now that I've actually played the game a bunch and seen a bunch of the high-level BS, I'm far more interested in discussing it. <shrug>
"Only two things are infinite the universe and human stupidity and I'm not sure about the former."
"Your denial is beneath you and thanks to the use of hallucinogenic drugs I see through you."
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| emeraldazn
167th Post
Regular Customer
| "Re(2):SVC Impressions Thread #4,132" , posted Tue 16 Sep 21:04
Nice post, I give it thumbs up.
Terry deserves some attention, especially with a combo like this. (thanks to my friend ninjamatt!) I doubt this will be done in matches, but it sure makes one heck of a MAX combo.
get terry to 50% life and build his meter a bit
terry standing in left corner (ryu a char space away)
jump and crossup w/ D,stand 2hit C,dwnfwd+C,
(at the time of hitting ryu w/ dwnfwd+c you should just be entering MAX)2 in 1 the dwnfwd+c to the EXCEED,
do 9hits of the EXCEED, on the 9th hit(its an uppercut)
cancel to the DP+D,cancel to qcf+c,qcb+b,IMMEDIATELY go into
qcfx2+D,on 1st hit of shoulder,cancel to qcf+c, then SUPERCANCEL
to qcbhcf+a,juggle w/ qcfx2+a
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| OYashiroForever 494th Post
Gold Customer
| "Re(2):SVC Impressions Thread #4,132" , posted Tue 16 Sep 21:17
quote:
A well written and well thought out take on it, I respect your position. Oh, and yes, Demitri seems much stronger than all the default charas, too. What days did you go? Shame I didn't bump in to you... planning on going again?
My thanks for the respect, sir. Like I said, I know SvC's been talked to death already, but I had to get a few things off my chest and this is the only gaming board where people are intelligent and mature enough to handle a serious discussion about this.
Anywho, played it at Greenbelt last Sat. and went again today for a couple of hours. Good group of guys there last Sat. (I was teaching lessons over on 3rd Strike ;) ), but it was fairly dead today. I'm probably going to be up in NY again this weekend (after playing up at CTF a few weeks back, my competitive fires have been reignited), but IM me and we can set up a date to meet at Greenbelt. It's a bitch of a ride for me (45 mins. w/ no traffic), but it's worth it just to see more than 1 non-Namco fighting game in a single arcade.
"Only two things are infinite the universe and human stupidity and I'm not sure about the former."
"Your denial is beneath you and thanks to the use of hallucinogenic drugs I see through you."
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| TheBeast 1551th Post
Red Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Member
    
    
| "Re(3):SVC Impressions Thread #4,132" , posted Tue 16 Sep 23:10
quote:
Nice post, I give it thumbs up.
Terry deserves some attention, especially with a combo like this. (thanks to my friend ninjamatt!) I doubt this will be done in matches, but it sure makes one heck of a MAX combo.
get terry to 50% life and build his meter a bit
terry standing in left corner (ryu a char space away)
jump and crossup w/ D,stand 2hit C,dwnfwd+C,
(at the time of hitting ryu w/ dwnfwd+c you should just be entering MAX)2 in 1 the dwnfwd+c to the EXCEED,
do 9hits of the EXCEED, on the 9th hit(its an uppercut)
cancel to the DP+D,cancel to qcf+c,qcb+b,IMMEDIATELY go into
qcfx2+D,on 1st hit of shoulder,cancel to qcf+c, then SUPERCANCEL
to qcbhcf+a,juggle w/ qcfx2+a
Hmmm is this combo really workable? I think you can only do 2 super moves with a full MAX bar, but here you are talking about cancelling it into 3.
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| Sensenic 765th Post
Red Carpet Regular Member+
| "Re(3):SVC Impressions Thread #4,132" , posted Wed 17 Sep 07:35
Thanks for this really good review. Now you've really rised my expectation towards this game, since all the flaws you mention don't really affect me, as the scrub I am, and I really love all the good points, as the details lover I am.
 Love and peace
quote:
I have nothing interesting to say, except "thanks for the well written review". Oh, and "I really have the feeling to live in a third world country, this the capital of France and Fashion, goddamit, why doesn't anyone has this stupid game" too.
The same I'd say for Barcelona (minus the "capital of France and Fashion part"  ), the freakin' game's nowhere to be found. I've only seen ONE KOF2k and some Metal Slugs...
quote:
 your review is awesome! but its not as awesome as this one
There will always be people better than you...
Gamegen Rocks
Mwahahaha! I'm gonna murder someone...
How do you say "sushi" in Japanese? :D
Victoria Beckham (not confirmed)
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| Toxico 3173th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
   
|  "Re(2):SVC Impressions Thread #4,132"
, posted Wed 17 Sep 08:42
quote:
"I really have the feeling to live in a third world country, this the capital of France and Fashion, goddamit, why doesn't anyone has this stupid game"
Hahahahahahaha..... well, at least I do live in a third world country, I do expect the game not to be anywhere to be found. And we call ourselves "The Jaguar of Latinoamerica"... Ignorant people that doesn't know that spain IS part of Latinoamerica (in teory) and that they doesn't know that Spain > Chile any time. And even with crisis Argentina > Chile any time too ¬_¬.
Well, as for the review on this thread I do have to show my resect to the reviewer ;s; I mean, as he himself said "It's something taking out of the chest"... It's always insteresting to read what other people thinks, again, props to OYashiroForever.
quote:
It's a bitch of a ride for me (45 mins. w/ no traffic), but it's worth it just to see more than 1 non-Namco fighting game in a single arcade.
I know that, but in my case it's to find one Namco game ¬_¬
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| OYashiroForever 497th Post
Gold Customer
| "Re(3):SVC Impressions Thread #4,132" , posted Wed 17 Sep 22:38
quote:
so is the greenbelt plaza arcade the new game time?
Nope. Not even close. However, it does have SvC, Third Strike, CvS1+2, and MvC1+2, and a few good players, so that puts it heads and shoulders above anything in Northern Virginia. A couple of guys I talked to said there was an even better arcade for comp in Silver Spring, but I have a hard enough time justifying driving to Greenbelt.
quote:
also genjuros 3 slashes C version will hit behind provided the opponent isnt in a corner
Yes, but it doesn't cross-up. In SS2, you often had to block in the reverse direction depending on the distance. Here, you just hold back and it gets blocked every time.
quote:
shikis kiss just reverses the controls
You may be right, but I could've sworn I was trying to block with up-forward and kept getting comboed.
quote devil: your review is awesome! but its not as awesome as this one
I hereby officially bow in reverence before the verbose, in-depth analysis of Gamegen.
"Only two things are infinite the universe and human stupidity and I'm not sure about the former."
"Your denial is beneath you and thanks to the use of hallucinogenic drugs I see through you."
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