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| iggy 1498th Post
 
Red Carpet Executive Member
    
    
    
    
|  "NGE2 : Shinji vs The Matrix vs Capcom"
, posted Sun 24 Aug 03:35:
quote:
OKay, don't want to start a flame war here.
Oh no, you're right, flame wars are bad, and I sure wouldn't want to start one, either, so I will watch my fingers so they don't type anything offending to anyone.
quote:
But what are some of the reasons for hating Evangelion so much and what are some of the reasons for loving Evangelion so much? I have never seen it but I always heard good things about it and was thinking of buy the box set on a whim. But now I'm unsure. I'm also curious about the 'controversy' behind the series.
It's a pretentious piece of crap made by a guy who read some book "easy philosophy explained to 10 years old" and made a stupid anime from it claiming how he's bright and clever and such. Fortunately, there are many, many people out there who will never be 10 years old and still think "it's cool and whao so intelligent, it makes you think, after watching that, I was like, whaaa, my head hurts, I didn't understand anything, it's sooo cool!".
So if you are less than 10 years old or if you see philosophy and psychoanalisis as a klingon-related hidden wisdom, you may like it.
Oh! and [private joke] it's not only a piece of crap, it's an homophobic piece of crap.[/private joke]
「あ！そっかぁ！さっきのセリフさ、ナンパやったのな。」
「違う！！違う！！違う！！」
[this message was edited by iggy on Sun 24 Aug 03:39] |
| threesixtee 562th Post
New Red Carpet Member
| "NGE2: annihilation" , posted Sun 24 Aug 03:35
man, it really disappoints me that after get all in a huff about a page I couldn't read, it turns out its just a freaking video game I'll never play.
okay, I'll admit, I still to this day very much like EVA. why? well, I think a lot of it stems from being a depressed 14 year old when I first started watching it - and SURPRISE, the lead character is a depressed 14 year old, but he got to pilot a giant robot type thing. also, for added coincidence, I had a crush on a japanese-german girl who went to the same school as me back then.
for great justice.
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| Time Mage 1598th Post
Red Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Member
| "Re(1):NGE2: The Search For Curly's Gold" , posted Sun 24 Aug 05:26
quote:
Replace "piece of crap" with "hard to understand anime that gets boring after if you watch it more then one time" and I completely agress with your statement.
That's basically what I think. Evangelion is the perfect example of trying to do something good by making it complex, and not making it good. I don't know if I explain myself correctly.
I think it's a lot more harder to make a complex story easily understandable than leaving it as is, using the argument "nooo it isn't bad, it's just very deep and complex".
However, the first time I saw it I enjoyed it, except, of course the last two excuses of episodes. It's only that, when I try to watch it again, I think... "how did I liked this?", and stop, just to not ruin too much the fun I had the first time.
Agh, I think this is one of the worst-explained posts of the year.
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| Hungrywolf 2252th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
   
| "NGE2 : The Cradle of Life" , posted Sun 24 Aug 06:52
quote:
OKay, don't want to start a flame war here.
Oh no, you're right, flame wars are bad, and I sure wouldn't want to start one, either, so I will watch my fingers so they don't type anything offending to anyone.
But what are some of the reasons for hating Evangelion so much and what are some of the reasons for loving Evangelion so much? I have never seen it but I always heard good things about it and was thinking of buy the box set on a whim. But now I'm unsure. I'm also curious about the 'controversy' behind the series.
It's a pretentious piece of crap made by a guy who read some book "easy philosophy explained to 10 years old" and made a stupid anime from it claiming how he's bright and clever and such. Fortunately, there are many, many people out there who will never be 10 years old and still think "it's cool and whao so intelligent, it makes you think, after watching that, I was like, whaaa, my head hurts, I didn't understand anything, it's sooo cool!".
So if you are less than 10 years old or if you see philosophy and psychoanalisis as a klingon-related hidden wisdom, you may like it.
Oh! and [private joke] it's not only a piece of crap, it's an homophobic piece of crap.[/private joke]
Great post, Iggy. I don't like Eva. I've called it a love/hate relationship before, but when it gets right down to it, I don't like it because of what happened halfway through watching the series. It started out as a good show and I liked the characters and then it started to screw up everything that was set it place for the first half of the show and the ending, including the ones given by the movies, sucked. That is why I don't like Eva. I've explained it before and will probably again sometime.
Note: NGE2 could have a subtitle like The Cradle of Life actually.
"You're good baby I'll give you that.....but me? I'm magic!"
-Bullseye Daredevil movie
Hungry Like the Wolf
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| Gen 1945th Post
Gold Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Executive
| "Re(1):NGE2: Sons of Liberty" , posted Sun 24 Aug 16:01:
quote:
I don't hate it. It's just bad. I dislike the English language company for putting "greatest anime ever" on the box though.
At least their outlandish statement was their own opinion, unlike the Cowboy Bebop boxes and ads that quote the LA Times to inform us that BeBop is "the most popular anime in Japan"
For a while it seemed like a cool big robot show, and some of the big machines were cool looking. But then the story Kojima'd pretty bad, the ending sucked, and I only liked one character from the whole show.
The ending only sucks if you expected it to "make sense" and to "bring closure" it's great if you want Shinji to stop being a wuss and realize that's exactly what he's going (he's denouncing all others views of him to be himself! He's grown a spine, he's just proving it by piloting his EVA in an awesome battle that blows our heads off)
The story tanked, and they gave a bad quick ending. First of all they shouldn't have tanked the story, but in terms of the ending "too be continued" would have been better than 'we don't have enough time to fit in the ending because the show was poorly planed so here's some psychological crap that doesn't end the story'.
quote:
Look see what I'm doing with the title here! Everyone edit your post titles to include some ridiculous sub-title from a sequel, it's more fun that way!
ok!
threesixtee
quote:
okay, I'll admit, I still to this day very much like EVA. why? well, I think a lot of it stems from being a depressed 14 year old when I first started watching it - and SURPRISE, the lead character is a depressed 14 year old, but he got to pilot a giant robot type thing. also, for added coincidence, I had a crush on a japanese-german girl who went to the same school as me back then.
that's some of the few reasons I could see for people liking the show: age, and relating to it... No offense but you probably hadn't seen very many earlier better Japanese animations that influenced Evangelion by the time you first saw Evangelion.
I know their are exceptions, once again no offense to people who like the show.
Time Mage
quote:
The Search For Curly's Gold
ha!
Radish
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Plus the end seems like the crew saying, "So you want an end to your robot show do you? Well FUCK YOU!"
ha!
Dr Bagheadquote:
I've said it once, and I'll say it again: the only good thing about Dogma was Jay and Silent Bob
Smith is a Catholic for those who don't know. Dogma was fair. I like Mallrats the best. I don't know of anyone else that likes Mallrats the best of Smith's films.
[this message was edited by Gen on Sun 24 Aug 17:25] |
| DarkZero
224th Post
Frequent Customer
| "NGE2: Rei & Asuka GONE WILD" , posted Sun 24 Aug 18:04
I think that what really makes people hate Evangelion is its popularity. Serial Experiments Lain was just as trippy, abstract, and some would argue nonsensical, as Evangelion. However, not many people are running around calling Lain "the greatest anime ever", "the most popular anime in Japan", or "just too deep for you to understand". It's a nice, abstract little story for people like me that like nice, abstract little stories.
In fact, that's the whole problem with this little "genre" of abstract stories that are more concerned with their ideological point than their characters. People advocate them so vigorously that they can't be mentioned without bringing up the horrific image of an obese, unwashed young man cosplaying as Asuka screaming (and spraying) at you that Evangelion or Metal Gear Solid 2 is the most brilliant thing in the History of Man. It can't just be left alone by other anime and video game fans in the same way that people say "I don't like shooters" or "Romance comedies really aren't my bag". You have to love it or hate it because some jackass fanboy is forcing you to choose one or the other.
I think another problem though, now that it just occurred to me, is that too many of these stories are dishonest. It didn't seem weird to me when the ideological/philosophical point of Evangelion or Metal Gear Solid 2 eclipsed the more action-oriented or character-driven portions of the story. The more abstract and obtuse parts of both of them were what I had been following the whole time, so it didn't seem odd to me when my wheat was separated from the chaff. For everyone else, though, the story suddenly changed dramatically because the part that they had been focusing on fell to the side. Even when I watched Evangelion for the first time when I was fourteen, the last two episodes didn't strike me as odd or thrown together. It really seemed very natural. But I had been focusing on that part of the show the entire time, so it didn't bother me that the other, insignificant, part of the story, was left unresolved.
It's really just a matter of taste that has been ruined by the shrill screaming of ignorant fans. None of this, and by that I mean Evangelion, Xenogears, Dogma, The Matrix Reloaded, MGS2, Lain, and their entire method of storytelling, should be this controversial. It's not that special, but it's not necessarily bad, either.
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| Hungrywolf 2258th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(1):NGE2: Rei & Asuka GONE WILD" , posted Sun 24 Aug 20:54
quote:
I think that what really makes people hate Evangelion is its popularity. Serial Experiments Lain was just as trippy, abstract, and some would argue nonsensical, as Evangelion. However, not many people are running around calling Lain "the greatest anime ever", "the most popular anime in Japan", or "just too deep for you to understand". It's a nice, abstract little story for people like me that like nice, abstract little stories.
In fact, that's the whole problem with this little "genre" of abstract stories that are more concerned with their ideological point than their characters. People advocate them so vigorously that they can't be mentioned without bringing up the horrific image of an obese, unwashed young man cosplaying as Asuka screaming (and spraying) at you that Evangelion or Metal Gear Solid 2 is the most brilliant thing in the History of Man. It can't just be left alone by other anime and video game fans in the same way that people say "I don't like shooters" or "Romance comedies really aren't my bag". You have to love it or hate it because some jackass fanboy is forcing you to choose one or the other.
I think another problem though, now that it just occurred to me, is that too many of these stories are dishonest. It didn't seem weird to me when the ideological/philosophical point of Evangelion or Metal Gear Solid 2 eclipsed the more action-oriented or character-driven portions of the story. The more abstract and obtuse parts of both of them were what I had been following the whole time, so it didn't seem odd to me when my wheat was separated from the chaff. For everyone else, though, the story suddenly changed dramatically because the part that they had been focusing on fell to the side. Even when I watched Evangelion for the first time when I was fourteen, the last two episodes didn't strike me as odd or thrown together. It really seemed very natural. But I had been focusing on that part of the show the entire time, so it didn't bother me that the other, insignificant, part of the story, was left unresolved.
It's really just a matter of taste that has been ruined by the shrill screaming of ignorant fans. None of this, and by that I mean Evangelion, Xenogears, Dogma, The Matrix Reloaded, MGS2, Lain, and their entire method of storytelling, should be this controversial. It's not that special, but it's not necessarily bad, either.
True, some people may hate it for that reason, but I think I got across why I hate it clearly enough.
"You're good baby I'll give you that.....but me? I'm magic!"
-Bullseye Daredevil movie
Hungry Like the Wolf
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| Satoshi_Miwa 2343th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "NGE2: Dead by Dawn" , posted Sun 24 Aug 22:55
quote:
I think people frequently overstate how clever Eva is; a lot of people seem fixated on it because (face it) it was the first really popular anime in the U.S.
Nahh, Ranma 1/2 was going as a popular anime before Eva took off and Sailor Moon had started to make waves in NA before Eva's NA release as well. Plus the Ghost in the Shell movie hit before Eva did...(And all three have popularity on the same level, or beyond in the case of Sailor Moon, as Eva).
Eva thrives more because of threads like this, where you have people arguing the pros and the cons of the shows with some good passion. It just draws people to the show so they can see what people are talking about, and then they end up giving their two cents. It's a vicious circle, but the show thrives off it.
You can't just take a middle of the road view of the series, you either love it or hate it. And that's why, regardless of the quality (or lack of quality), Anno has truly created a timeless anime...
Separated at Birth?
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| KTallguy 306th Post
Bronze Customer
| "Re(2):NGE2: Dead by Dawn" , posted Mon 25 Aug 00:46
quote:
I mean, how can you possibly not like Misato? She's a sexy woman who wears skimpy clothes and gets drunk all the time... that's like the ideal human being. :p
I love it.
I think there's a (large) group of people out there that like stuff just handed to them on a plate. They don't like to think about anything, they just want it to be explained in simple terms.
Now I'm not referring to anyone in this board or anyone specifically with this statement, but it's true. Hollywood usually makes its money off of films that aim to make the person walk out of the theater feeling good, not walking out thinking and mulling over the film in their head.
Evangelion doesn't give a concise ending, even in the final movie. But the final movie is such a horrific display of so many different elements, that it's a huge invitation for speculation. I remember getting a headache after watching the ending because it was so intense with its imagery. After thinking about it, I immediately scoured the internet looking for individual interpretations. The movie really made me think about what they were trying to say.
It could have been a huge middle finger up in the air. But it's impossible to know if they were just trying to fuck with their fans, or if they were really trying to convey something deep. Regardless, many people find it fun, even though they may only 'think' they are having intellectual discussions about philosophy and psychology, maybe some of those people will go take a class, and gain a better understanding of it. At least it inspires some sort of thought process, instead of being just mindless explosions and action.
Lain was different than Eva in that it had a nice ending that didn't completely eliminate contraversy, but it wrapped things up nicely. Lain did a perfect job being surreal and abstract, but also making sense. =) That's why it's one of my favorite animes.
I just don't know why everyone thinks Evangelion was just nonsence. Same with MGS2. Kojima fucked with the player's mind near the end of the game, and it's people like him that are going to make that push, that will turn games into a true art form.
I know many of you might disagree with me but that's cool =) just stating my long winded opinion. Feel free to flame me! I need someone to argue with when I'm at work tomorrow.
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| Grave 593th Post
New Red Carpet Member
| "Re(4):NGE2: Friedlander Bey counterattacks" , posted Mon 25 Aug 22:13
quote:
Don't forget the super fun of the menial labor mini "game" you need to do to advance the plot. Nothing says excitment like running back and forth to a shipyard to move boxes to different warehouses for no reason.
Shenmue made me briefly want to forget my college plans, drop everything, and seek a career as a forklift operator at the docks.
No, seriously.
...
Okay, not really. But I think I enjoyed Shenmue far more than anyone else I know. Talking got tedious at tmes, but the atmosphere, the environments, the music, everything was nice enough to make me want to keep going. Hell, I can't explain why I took to the game so much, myself, but I really like it a lot.
Of course, I can see why people don't. But that never damaged my own enjoyment any.
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"Re(6):NGE2: Electric Boogaloo" 
NGE2 could have a subtitle like The Cradle of Life actually. 
"Re(1):evangelion 2???" 
"NGE2: Shinji's Eye for that Kaoru Guy" 
