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| Iron D 2123th Post
 
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
    
    
    
    
    
|  "Re(2):For the wrestling fans on the board"
, posted Fri 31 Jan 16:39
quote:
I know there are few wrestling fans on here. Froboy comes to in particular. Anyways, I thought I would let you know I'm going to be in wrestler's paradise next week. I'm going to RAW Monday at the MCI center in Washington and then the very next day to Smackdown at the First Union Center in Philadelphia. They should be good shows seeing as they are building towards their stories for Wrestlemania
Should be a real good time!
Damn, that cool, man. I went to a Smackdown right before No Way Out last year. It was cool, but they edited a lot of stuff for TV. There was a part when Steve Austin came out and he was talking and he said "I have a problem" and I yelled out "your an alcoholic" and he said "Thank you" that was taken out. My friend started a Maven chant (which died out quickly when he got the Last Ride through a table), but it was a lot of fun. Plus I had a sign that said "DEEZ NUTS"
I hope you have a lot of fun and experience some Mattitude in person when you go to Smackdown.
Are you gonna make signs to bring, if so, what are they gonna say?
Who's your favorite WWE Superstars and Divas.
Mine are:
1. Matt Hardy V 1.0
2. The Undertaker
3. Chris Jericho
4. Shawn Michaels
5. Kurt Angle
6. Mr. McMahon
Divas
1. Lita
2. Victoria
3. Molly Holly
4. Jazz (she's hella tough)
5. Nidia
Anyway, have fun man!
Bastids! I've never been to a live event, but I'm definitely going to go to one sooner or later. The WWE has a habit of focusing it's efforts on the East Coast, so we don't really get too many shows out here. They do go by the Staples Center every now and then, and that's the area closest to where I am.
Anyways, my favorite wrestlers:
1. Tie: Booker T and Y2J.
2. The Undertaker (in any of his gimmicks)
3. Tajiri.
Honorable mention goes out to Los Guerreros, Rey Mysterio, RVD, HBK, All members of Team Angle (including, of course, Kurt himself), Brock Lesnar and Chris Benoit.
Female WWE wrestlers (I refuse to call them "divas") For wrestling ability:
1. Jazz
2. Victoria
3. Molly
And female WWE wrestlers for looks:
1. Molly
2. Nidia
They both have @$$, and NO other WWE ladies do, NOT EVEN STACY KIEBLER!
Btw, if any of you saw SD! last night, I've got an equation for ya.
THE ROCK+HEEL=BADASS!
Useless but true fact: ALL of the top 10 alcohol consuming countries in the world are European.
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| Fro Boy11 1313th Post
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(3):For the wrestling fans on the board" , posted Sat 1 Feb 01:53:
quote:
I know there are few wrestling fans on here. Froboy comes to in particular. Anyways, I thought I would let you know I'm going to be in wrestler's paradise next week. I'm going to RAW Monday at the MCI center in Washington and then the very next day to Smackdown at the First Union Center in Philadelphia. They should be good shows seeing as they are building towards their stories for Wrestlemania
Should be a real good time!
Damn, that cool, man. I went to a Smackdown right before No Way Out last year. It was cool, but they edited a lot of stuff for TV. There was a part when Steve Austin came out and he was talking and he said "I have a problem" and I yelled out "your an alcoholic" and he said "Thank you" that was taken out. My friend started a Maven chant (which died out quickly when he got the Last Ride through a table), but it was a lot of fun. Plus I had a sign that said "DEEZ NUTS"
I hope you have a lot of fun and experience some Mattitude in person when you go to Smackdown.
Are you gonna make signs to bring, if so, what are they gonna say?
Who's your favorite WWE Superstars and Divas.
Mine are:
1. Matt Hardy V 1.0
2. The Undertaker
3. Chris Jericho
4. Shawn Michaels
5. Kurt Angle
6. Mr. McMahon
Divas
1. Lita
2. Victoria
3. Molly Holly
4. Jazz (she's hella tough)
5. Nidia
Anyway, have fun man!
Hey thanks it should be real good. I know I'm going to see Hogan. I can't imagine how many more runs he is going to make this could be one of the last opportunities to see him. Right now the wrestler I am enjoying most is John Cena with his early 90s hip hop gimmick. The way he has been busting on the Guerreros here of late has been very entertaining.
I don't think I going to make any signs but if I was to change my mind I would make maybe a 4 horseman sign.
oh favorite Diva atm Dawn Marie
The cool thing is that you'll probably get to see Dawn Marie in person. Plus, when you hear Stephanie McMahon, it's gonna trip you out. Her voice is soooo sqeaky. I feel sorry for HHH when he's hittin' it. He's probably gotta wear ear muffs because of all the screamin she does (she likes anal btw)
[this message was edited by Fro Boy11 on Sat 1 Feb 01:56] |
| CrazyMax
114th Post
Regular Customer
| "Re(6):For the wrestling fans on the board" , posted Sat 1 Feb 12:51
quote:
I don't know why people aren't interested in Raw, they have been having most of the interesting storylines lately (the necrophilia, d-lo brown being reverse racist, shawn michaels etc.) Smackdown has a good cruiserweight division but I think their angles compaired to RAW aren't as good. I believe the only thing holding back Raw is guys like Booker T and RVD, two of the most popular faces on the show not getting a push. Plus Triple H likes to hog the camera @_@
Why is Raw not getting the attention? Angles or not, with HHH in the current Hogan champion for life position, it seems stale. Raw seems like it is spending more time trying to catch up with what made it popular, as opposed to what in the future could make it popular. Thus the wasted talents of Booker T & RVD, and Jericho for that matter.
Smackdown just seems to present more action for the buck. The majority of the angles are directly tied to the action, with the exception of course of Dawn & Torrie. Raw has spent more time on 'hot shot' angles hoping ANYTHING will pique the interest ( I cracked up when Mcmahon & company were confused that no one in the mainstream gave a rat's @$$ about the necrophilia angle, and it only drove away some of their installed wrestling base. Good going! ), and less on just improving the image of their product.
Raw has had more than it's share of great action in the ring, but all anyone remembers is what tired angle didn't go over today.
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| Fro Boy11 1314th Post
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(7):For the wrestling fans on the board" , posted Sat 1 Feb 13:14
quote:
I don't know why people aren't interested in Raw, they have been having most of the interesting storylines lately (the necrophilia, d-lo brown being reverse racist, shawn michaels etc.) Smackdown has a good cruiserweight division but I think their angles compaired to RAW aren't as good. I believe the only thing holding back Raw is guys like Booker T and RVD, two of the most popular faces on the show not getting a push. Plus Triple H likes to hog the camera @_@
Why is Raw not getting the attention? Angles or not, with HHH in the current Hogan champion for life position, it seems stale. Raw seems like it is spending more time trying to catch up with what made it popular, as opposed to what in the future could make it popular. Thus the wasted talents of Booker T & RVD, and Jericho for that matter.
Smackdown just seems to present more action for the buck. The majority of the angles are directly tied to the action, with the exception of course of Dawn & Torrie. Raw has spent more time on 'hot shot' angles hoping ANYTHING will pique the interest ( I cracked up when Mcmahon & company were confused that no one in the mainstream gave a rat's @$$ about the necrophilia angle, and it only drove away some of their installed wrestling base. Good going! ), and less on just improving the image of their product.
Raw has had more than it's share of great action in the ring, but all anyone remembers is what tired angle didn't go over today.
RAW has been pretty good for the last 2 weeks, but it just pales in comparison to Smackdown, I mean there's A LOT less talking on Smackdown. It's like this, the WWE is "Sports Entertainment" right? Well, Smackdown represents the Sports side and RAW represents the Entertainment side. They (the RAW writers) don't realize that WRESTLING is also ENTERTAINING. Paul Heyman, the head writer for SD, knows this. That's why Smackdown is a lot better than RAW. The only thing I like about RAW right now is the women's division and the interaction with Y2J and HBK.
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| CrazyMike 442th Post
Gold Customer
| "Re(8):For the wrestling fans on the board" , posted Sat 1 Feb 13:35:
Well what I hate is when they ship over wrestlers from the different brands because they didn't get over due to bad handling of their character.
Example: D-Von's preacher gimmick (in my mind) was a really good idea and it was hilarious as hell to see him pass out the collection plate and preach his so called morals and values. But what happened? He speaks for a few weeks and from every Smackdown then he does nothing but comes in and wrestles. Obviously this doesn't work out, you can't get heat by not playing off your character, so it didn't work out and they just send him back to Raw to re-form the Dudleys (yawn).
Personally, I would bring back the ringside interviews like the old days and remove the backstage common "brag, then get beaten up" bit. Another thing I will give WWE credit too, at least there is a lot less of the 20 minute yacking at the beginning of every show, usually coming out of the mouth of a McMahon. But if there is one pet peeve, WWE still has the problem with (on both shows) having main events that end up too much on disqualification endings or winning by cheating. And where are the suprises anymore? Its gotten to where you can know most of the time who is going to win just by looking at the pecking order.
One more thing, while it is annoying to see Triple H handing himself the strap again, I hate how Smackdown shuffled around the world title so many times, Hogan to Lesnar, Lesnar to Big Show, Big Show to Kurt Angle, all in a matter of a few months. Granted Angle will be holding it until Wrestlemania, but I know it will just be dropped again to Lesnar. Longer title reigns give more legitimacy to the belt.
[this message was edited by CrazyMike on Sat 1 Feb 13:40] |
| Fro Boy11 1316th Post
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(9):For the wrestling fans on the board" , posted Sat 1 Feb 16:27
quote:
Well what I hate is when they ship over wrestlers from the different brands because they didn't get over due to bad handling of their character.
Example: D-Von's preacher gimmick (in my mind) was a really good idea and it was hilarious as hell to see him pass out the collection plate and preach his so called morals and values. But what happened? He speaks for a few weeks and from every Smackdown then he does nothing but comes in and wrestles. Obviously this doesn't work out, you can't get heat by not playing off your character, so it didn't work out and they just send him back to Raw to re-form the Dudleys (yawn).
Personally, I would bring back the ringside interviews like the old days and remove the backstage common "brag, then get beaten up" bit. Another thing I will give WWE credit too, at least there is a lot less of the 20 minute yacking at the beginning of every show, usually coming out of the mouth of a McMahon. But if there is one pet peeve, WWE still has the problem with (on both shows) having main events that end up too much on disqualification endings or winning by cheating. And where are the suprises anymore? Its gotten to where you can know most of the time who is going to win just by looking at the pecking order.
One more thing, while it is annoying to see Triple H handing himself the strap again, I hate how Smackdown shuffled around the world title so many times, Hogan to Lesnar, Lesnar to Big Show, Big Show to Kurt Angle, all in a matter of a few months. Granted Angle will be holding it until Wrestlemania, but I know it will just be dropped again to Lesnar. Longer title reigns give more legitimacy to the belt.
Well, they would have kept D-Von there on Smackdown if he wasn't complaining and didn't like his character. So they put him back on RAW, I like that though, because I didn't like teams splitting up especially the APA.
Yeah, I'm glad that they don't do the 20 minutes of talking much anymore, HHH does it a lot.
Smackdown usually have good clean wins at the main event.
Well, when Hogan had the title the Champion was still goin to both shows. All the Smackdown belt stuff happened when Brock was the champ, he had a rib injury, he said he was gonna take time off the heal so he had to drop it to the Big Show, he changed his mind so he dropped it for no reason, so Show had to drop it to Kurt for a big nice main event for WrestleMania where Brock will get it back. So the Smackdown championship has only changed hands 2 times.
I don't like HHH as the RAW champion though, I think it should be Jericho. The last time he was champ the whole HHH/Stephanie story got in the way and made him look like a chump.
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| CrazyMax
115th Post
Regular Customer
| "Re(2):Re(10):For the wrestling fans on the bo" , posted Sat 1 Feb 21:20
quote:
As far as I know, WWE has been trying to have a good relation ship with NJPW. Keiji Mutoh and The Great Muta had dinner with HHH, Stephanie McMahon and Ric Flair about a week ago.
Hopefully, they'll have some of the women in NJPW further train the women in the WWE especially now that the womens division is getting a lot better than usual.
Keiji Mutoh hasn't been NJPW for awhile. He left to run AJP, and it has been a bit of a disaster. But he has gotten Goldberg to wrestle, and there was a rumor for awhile, before Hogan finally settled that Hogan would wrestle there ( sort of ). Which is where the rumors of Hogan & Goldberg being together started. It never happened though. The WWE & NJPW have been doing there own little slow developing relationships.
The WWE has enough problems with all the talent they have on their rosters. I hardly think they can do a better job with more talent. Instead I think they would just piss off Japanese wrestling fans. After all it's been pretty well documented ( the whole WCW debacle is a good example. The invasion was an abortion from the get go cause Mcmahon would never let his WWE get beat by WCW or WCW. They HAD to be put down by his creation. ) that McMahon's ego plays a part in his decision making, and he'd probably treat those guys like he's treated Funaki.
After all, remember Kaientai DX was considered a cool heel group in Japan, look how they got treated when they went to the WWF.
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| GekigangerV 310th Post
Bronze Customer
| "Re(3):Re(10):For the wrestling fans on the bo" , posted Sat 1 Feb 21:33
quote:
Keiji Mutoh hasn't been NJPW for awhile. He left to run AJP, and it has been a bit of a disaster. But he has gotten Goldberg to wrestle, and there was a rumor for awhile, before Hogan finally settled that Hogan would wrestle there ( sort of ). Which is where the rumors of Hogan & Goldberg being together started. It never happened though. The WWE & NJPW have been doing there own little slow developing relationships.
The WWE has enough problems with all the talent they have on their rosters. I hardly think they can do a better job with more talent. Instead I think they would just piss off Japanese wrestling fans. After all it's been pretty well documented ( the whole WCW debacle is a good example. The invasion was an abortion from the get go cause Mcmahon would never let his WWE get beat by WCW or WCW. They HAD to be put down by his creation. ) that McMahon's ego plays a part in his decision making, and he'd probably treat those guys like he's treated Funaki.
After all, remember Kaientai DX was considered a cool heel group in Japan, look how they got treated when they went to the WWF.
Mutoh went to AJP? Damn, its too hard for me to keep up with puro with out a decent web site. How do you follow it Max? Kaientai was rather wack in the WWF. They were totally squashed my the oddities in the 98 Survivor Series(or was it Summer Slam). Either way I was disgusted. However, I still believe Taka Michinoku is THE best cruiser/lightweight champ the WWF will EVER see. Unless Ray makes a run for the belt, but i think that will only bring him down.
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| CrazyMax
116th Post
Regular Customer
| "Re(4):Re(10):For the wrestling fans on the bo" , posted Sun 2 Feb 10:38
quote:
Mutoh went to AJP? Damn, its too hard for me to keep up with puro with out a decent web site. How do you follow it Max? Kaientai was rather wack in the WWF. They were totally squashed my the oddities in the 98 Survivor Series(or was it Summer Slam). Either way I was disgusted. However, I still believe Taka Michinoku is THE best cruiser/lightweight champ the WWF will EVER see. Unless Ray makes a run for the belt, but i think that will only bring him down.
Hey Gekiganger V, go here. It is an editorial about Mutoh's attempts to change the image of AJPW with an infusion of WWE production.
Link Here
In McMahon logic little guys ( cruiserweights ) exist to make his latest big monster heel look more intimidating. When they aren't jobbing to the latest big oaf, they can put on exciting matches against one another. Because of Rey's popularity, he's considered a sort of big guy, and can't be seen going for the cruiserweight title. Despite pleas from fans and some backstage forces.
Yeah, Rey's moves are named after San Diego. The West Coast Bop or Pop and the area code 619. What's scary is that Micheal Cole is the guy who suggested Rey's move 619 and it's name, not Rey. They also thought the Jr. part of his name made him look small.
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| Hungrywolf 1790th Post
Silver Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Executive
| "Re(5):Re(10):For the wrestling fans on the bo" , posted Sun 2 Feb 12:05
quote:
Mutoh went to AJP? Damn, its too hard for me to keep up with puro with out a decent web site. How do you follow it Max? Kaientai was rather wack in the WWF. They were totally squashed my the oddities in the 98 Survivor Series(or was it Summer Slam). Either way I was disgusted. However, I still believe Taka Michinoku is THE best cruiser/lightweight champ the WWF will EVER see. Unless Ray makes a run for the belt, but i think that will only bring him down.
Hey Gekiganger V, go here. It is an editorial about Mutoh's attempts to change the image of AJPW with an infusion of WWE production.
Link Here
In McMahon logic little guys ( cruiserweights ) exist to make his latest big monster heel look more intimidating. When they aren't jobbing to the latest big oaf, they can put on exciting matches against one another. Because of Rey's popularity, he's considered a sort of big guy, and can't be seen going for the cruiserweight title. Despite pleas from fans and some backstage forces.
Yeah, Rey's moves are named after San Diego. The West Coast Bop or Pop and the area code 619. What's scary is that Micheal Cole is the guy who suggested Rey's move 619 and it's name, not Rey. They also thought the Jr. part of his name made him look small.
I was mad about the Jr. being taken off. I think it pays homage to the family you know?
"Someday we'll find it the rainbow connection..." -Kermit The Muppet Movie
Hungry Like the Wolf
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| Fro Boy11 1322th Post
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(2):Re(10):Re(10):For the wrestling fans on" , posted Mon 3 Feb 13:39
quote:
Gah! It sucks not having internet access over the weekends. I missed most of what is a pretty good conversation.
Just to comment on the Raw/Smackdown titles, realize that the World (Raw) title changed hands just as many times as the SD! (WWE) title did. On the exact same nights even.
I've always loathed Vince's "push the big men" mentality. Albert (or A-train, like I give a crap) being pushed over Rey? I almost barfed at that. It's a good thing they put him back over Albert in his return.
Big Show's push I can understand though. I mean, just before he got his push on SD! he was jobbing to Jeff friggin' Hardy! Unbelievable.
Anyways, seeing as the two shows have their own championships, the next step: each show has their own pay-per-views. It'll happen sooner or later.
Hey, I'm not tellin' you guys anything you don't already know...
What I really hated about how they pushed A-Train (stupid name) is that Matt Hardy was the one that was supposed to take out Rey and have a feud with Edge because of it. Everything was set up for it too, but when Matt got to the arena they had changed they're minds. I even hear talk about changing Matt Hardy into a face again because he still gets cheers by teenage girls. Maybe it's because he's actually more entertaining than his brother that people cheer him? I don't know.
I did hear about the brand only pay-per-views, this I think is a good decision, each brand can have a PPV every other month or so. This way, fueds will have stronger and longer build-ups and there will be more title defenses on RAW and Smackdown in the months that particular show doesn't have a PPV. Good idea there.
About the Big Show, well, he just does nothing to me. I'll have to see how well it goes with The Undertaker, but if the man with the golden touch, Kurt Angle can really make Big Show look good, I don't see how Taker can.
I'm just waiting for The Rock to go full heel, he still does some face things like saying "Finally...The Rock comes back too....." and stuff like that.
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| Fro Boy11 1323th Post
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(4):Re(10):Re(10):For the wrestling fans on" , posted Mon 3 Feb 14:39
quote:
I'm just waiting for The Rock to go full heel, he still does some face things like saying "Finally...The Rock comes back too....." and stuff like that.
That was one of the weirdest promos I've ever seen (next to the beginning of Randy Orton's heel turn and a promo from a few years back with Lita and Chyna). First Rock gets pops and fans saying his quotes with him. Then he says "Actually The Rock isn't in Green Bay right now......thank God", and gets booed. Then he rags on Hogan and gets booed. And finally he says the "If you smell" quote and the fans are cheering and saying his quotes with him again. WHAT THE CRAP!?!
In any case, Rock will definitely be playing the part of the heel at NWO. I too am hoping he makes a full heel turn because his face stuff is getting stale (that, and I personally thought he was funnier when he was a heel anyway).
Funny thing: WMX8-Rock (face) vs. Hogan (Heel). NWO 2003-Rock (heel) vs. Hogan (face).
Well, The Rock hasn't done anything heel-like in the ring yet. Basically he's gonna be like Hogan was in WCW with his Hollywood Hogan gimmick. So now it's Hollywood Rock or something, only not that name. I'm waiting for The Rock to call the fans trailer trash and throw people off bridges and stuff like he used to do, and yes, The Rock was WAY more entertaining as a heel than as a face, he was SO damn boring. I was entertained by the fact that people actually started to boo him than actually watching The Rock.
Matt always got more candy than his brother Jeff at Halloween
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| the REAL master
107th Post
Regular Customer
| "Re(5):Re(10):Re(10):For the wrestling fans on" , posted Mon 3 Feb 15:53
quote:
I'm just waiting for The Rock to go full heel, he still does some face things like saying "Finally...The Rock comes back too....." and stuff like that.
That was one of the weirdest promos I've ever seen (next to the beginning of Randy Orton's heel turn and a promo from a few years back with Lita and Chyna). First Rock gets pops and fans saying his quotes with him. Then he says "Actually The Rock isn't in Green Bay right now......thank God", and gets booed. Then he rags on Hogan and gets booed. And finally he says the "If you smell" quote and the fans are cheering and saying his quotes with him again. WHAT THE CRAP!?!
In any case, Rock will definitely be playing the part of the heel at NWO. I too am hoping he makes a full heel turn because his face stuff is getting stale (that, and I personally thought he was funnier when he was a heel anyway).
Funny thing: WMX8-Rock (face) vs. Hogan (Heel). NWO 2003-Rock (heel) vs. Hogan (face).
Well, The Rock hasn't done anything heel-like in the ring yet. Basically he's gonna be like Hogan was in WCW with his Hollywood Hogan gimmick. So now it's Hollywood Rock or something, only not that name. I'm waiting for The Rock to call the fans trailer trash and throw people off bridges and stuff like he used to do, and yes, The Rock was WAY more entertaining as a heel than as a face, he was SO damn boring. I was entertained by the fact that people actually started to boo him than actually watching The Rock.
I feel you on that, i liked the NOD rock, and i hate how they fucked up booker T's character. WWE needs to stop SNKing the storylines
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| Hungrywolf 1792th Post
Silver Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Executive
| "Re(6):Re(10):Re(10):For the wrestling fans on" , posted Mon 3 Feb 16:24
quote:
I'm just waiting for The Rock to go full heel, he still does some face things like saying "Finally...The Rock comes back too....." and stuff like that.
That was one of the weirdest promos I've ever seen (next to the beginning of Randy Orton's heel turn and a promo from a few years back with Lita and Chyna). First Rock gets pops and fans saying his quotes with him. Then he says "Actually The Rock isn't in Green Bay right now......thank God", and gets booed. Then he rags on Hogan and gets booed. And finally he says the "If you smell" quote and the fans are cheering and saying his quotes with him again. WHAT THE CRAP!?!
In any case, Rock will definitely be playing the part of the heel at NWO. I too am hoping he makes a full heel turn because his face stuff is getting stale (that, and I personally thought he was funnier when he was a heel anyway).
Funny thing: WMX8-Rock (face) vs. Hogan (Heel). NWO 2003-Rock (heel) vs. Hogan (face).
Well, The Rock hasn't done anything heel-like in the ring yet. Basically he's gonna be like Hogan was in WCW with his Hollywood Hogan gimmick. So now it's Hollywood Rock or something, only not that name. I'm waiting for The Rock to call the fans trailer trash and throw people off bridges and stuff like he used to do, and yes, The Rock was WAY more entertaining as a heel than as a face, he was SO damn boring. I was entertained by the fact that people actually started to boo him than actually watching The Rock.
I feel you on that, i liked the NOD rock, and i hate how they fucked up booker T's character. WWE needs to stop SNKing the storylines
I love Booker T right now, I think he should be pushed more.
"Someday we'll find it the rainbow connection..." -Kermit The Muppet Movie
Hungry Like the Wolf
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| CrazyMax
119th Post
Regular Customer
| "Re(8):Re(10):Re(10):For the wrestling fans on" , posted Mon 3 Feb 17:00
quote:
Let the topic continue!
So, anyone else sick of seeing HHH with the World title? Who do you think should be the next World champ?
HBK's run was WAY too short for my likes, and it pissed me off that he had to drop the belt back to HHH. Bah! At least it looks like it'll be Y2J vs. HBK at WMX9. This has been one of my dream matches for a long time.
Despite that, I think it's time that RVD finally got the strap. If they give him a little time to develop his character a bit more, and give him a little more of a push, he would make a great champ! I'm also hoping that Booker has a title run before the year is up...
A rumor has begun about RVD possibly getting a shot at a title run. Since HHH is sort of out of action, his chances may improve.
I seriously doubt Booker T would get to hold the title unless he became the obligatory heel black guy. Only way he would champ is if he won in his current face persona, only to drop it to scary HHH to make him look tougher and more of a heel.
HHH as champ is a large symptom of what makes RAW suck. While most fans prefer Smackdown, the show written by Paul Heyman ( a wrestling fan ) as opposed to Brian Herwitz ( a tv writer hired to write RAW ), hmmm... and Smackdown has no HHH.
I think I see a pattern.
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| CrazyMax
122th Post
Regular Customer
| "Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):For the wrestling fans o" , posted Mon 3 Feb 19:20
quote:
I seriously doubt Booker T would get to hold the title unless he became the obligatory heel black guy.
What? What do you mean "obligatory heel black guy"?
Only way he would champ is if he won in his current face persona, only to drop it to scary HHH to make him look tougher and more of a heel.
Booker T is very popular right now. He gets major pops from the crowd. Heck, pushing Booker to the main event status would do wonders for Raw. I'd bet money on that.
One of the reasons why the political situation is such a mess, revolves around anyone who is more 'over' ( popular ) than HHH. Supposedly whoever is considered a threat to his standing. Thus the Jericho non existent title run, the Jeff Hardy false hope run, and RVD's previous attempted title run. Booker T despite his popularity did more comic bits, fewer serious bits, then shunted off to tag team ranks ( with more comedy ).
We are going to avoid any talk about the long time prejudice in wrestling. Eventually everything revolves around HHH and the belt. For Booker T to suddenly win, it would probably be an angle to get HHH over more as a bad guy by beating up the popular minority guy. ( This was an old WWF routine, the heels would always beat the hell out minorities that the mainstream may have feared, to show them as tough. If you doubt me, get a copy of old 80's WWE shows. When the minority guy is waiting in the ring for his opponent, 80% of the time the heel came out to beat the crap out of him. )
For Booker T to get a legitimate title run, with HHH out of the picture and the belt legitimately up for grabs, good money is Booker T would be turned heel. RVD has a better chance of going over as a champ.
Don't bother scratching your head & going "wha?" about the logic involved in that. It's just been WWE/F history. Besides logic & wrestling, not a very good mix.
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| the REAL master
108th Post
Regular Customer
| "Re(2):Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):For the wrestling " , posted Mon 3 Feb 22:15
quote:
I seriously doubt Booker T would get to hold the title unless he became the obligatory heel black guy.
What? What do you mean "obligatory heel black guy"?
Only way he would champ is if he won in his current face persona, only to drop it to scary HHH to make him look tougher and more of a heel.
Booker T is very popular right now. He gets major pops from the crowd. Heck, pushing Booker to the main event status would do wonders for Raw. I'd bet money on that.
One of the reasons why the political situation is such a mess, revolves around anyone who is more 'over' ( popular ) than HHH. Supposedly whoever is considered a threat to his standing. Thus the Jericho non existent title run, the Jeff Hardy false hope run, and RVD's previous attempted title run. Booker T despite his popularity did more comic bits, fewer serious bits, then shunted off to tag team ranks ( with more comedy ).
We are going to avoid any talk about the long time prejudice in wrestling. Eventually everything revolves around HHH and the belt. For Booker T to suddenly win, it would probably be an angle to get HHH over more as a bad guy by beating up the popular minority guy. ( This was an old WWF routine, the heels would always beat the hell out minorities that the mainstream may have feared, to show them as tough. If you doubt me, get a copy of old 80's WWE shows. When the minority guy is waiting in the ring for his opponent, 80% of the time the heel came out to beat the crap out of him. )
For Booker T to get a legitimate title run, with HHH out of the picture and the belt legitimately up for grabs, good money is Booker T would be turned heel. RVD has a better chance of going over as a champ.
Don't bother scratching your head & going "wha?" about the logic involved in that. It's just been WWE/F history. Besides logic & wrestling, not a very good mix.
*king mable comes to mind*
|
| Fro Boy11 1324th Post
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(8):Re(10):Re(10):For the wrestling fans on" , posted Mon 3 Feb 22:37
quote:
Let the topic continue!
So, anyone else sick of seeing HHH with the World title? Who do you think should be the next World champ?
HBK's run was WAY too short for my likes, and it pissed me off that he had to drop the belt back to HHH. Bah! At least it looks like it'll be Y2J vs. HBK at WMX9. This has been one of my dream matches for a long time.
Despite that, I think it's time that RVD finally got the strap. If they give him a little time to develop his character a bit more, and give him a little more of a push, he would make a great champ! I'm also hoping that Booker has a title run before the year is up...
OK, this is something I can do right here. OK here I go. HHH should drop the title to.....KANE!!! I'm not a huge Kane fan either, but I think his time is LONG overdue. He's been getting the shaft for so long, and now he's teaming with RVD, and we saw the same shit with Kane and X-Pac over and over again. "Kane you gotta loosen up man" type shit is getting boring. What happened to that strong silent guy that would just kick yo' ass and leave. Kane is good just how he is, and for the WWE to just shove Scott Steiner down our throats and giving him a title match (which was HORRIBLE) without even having a match is fucked up. Not to mention he failed his physical TWICE before he came to the WWE.
I can't see RVD as the champ for a while. For some reason he's, to me, he's gotten into that Jeff Hardy thing where people just expect him to jump off shit and that's it. There's nothing else to look forward to with RVD, for the champ I think the guy has to be all-around good. Good on the mat, good in the air, good on the mic. So far, I think RVD only has 1, and can you guess what that is.
As for HHH, well, the man happens to be injury prone right now. He can't even wrestle a match for another 2-3 weeks. While Kurt Angle has a bad knee, Brock Lesnar had messed up ribs, and Hogan had a few broken ribs and still worked and defended titles. Since Austin and Kevin Nash is coming back, HHH should drop the title to Austin, Booker T, Y2J, or Kane, go away for a while and heal up completely and come back.
Plus, bring back the IC, and Hardcore titles. There's a reason why Tommy Dreamer got his ass kicked tonight on RAW.....there's no need for him. With no Hardcore or IC titles, there's no need for the mid to low card talent, there's nothing for them to fight for. When the roster split started it was for the mid to low card talent like Edge to come up to high card/main event status and now that those belts are gone the others guys are just doing filler matches.
Gotta love the womens division though, but not on Smackdown...ugh, put Nidia in a match please. Have you guys noticed that the TE champions have amounted to nothing. Nowinski, now that's talent. Maven doesn't have a finisher and he's been there for about 2 years or so, Nidia doesn't wrestle, Jakie and Linda are off to OVW because they suck, and the news guys are probably gonna suck, but Nowinski is good.
Anyway, that's my rant.
Matt always got more candy than his brother Jeff at Halloween
|
| Adon 863th Post
Red Carpet Regular Member++
| "Re(1):Have fun Adon." , posted Tue 4 Feb 00:59:
quote:
I don't know if you have left yet, but have fun. Hopefully the T-Shirt cannon will find its way to you. I hope you are free of bad 3-min warning matchs.
The T shirt cannon missed me by about 10 feet tonight! and noooooooooo I wasnt free of 3 min warning. I also got to see Rico wrestle a old school "jobber" tonight. YOu know the kind the WWF/E had back in the 80s and early 90s used. They are already in the ring, there is no music for them. It was some guy in Blue tights. It reminds me of like Earthquke vs Iron Mike sharp or Barry Horowitz or something like that. I was surprise to see such a generic wrestler now. Even the Jobbers have music and some personalty now.
Saw some intersting Dark Matches
Batista vs Spike Dudley!!!?? talk about being tossed around
and we had Sean O'Haire do a dark match with his new gimmick, he was working the mike with saying stuff you like skin a vision, PPV , there you are in the hotel room, two girls, three girls ah you get the picture fellows. Also on the nostalga front Sgt Slaughter wrestled. It was interesting watching triple H and Flair watch wrestling from the Luxury Suite, hmm thats mostly it for now.
Well Im mega tired got 2 got 2 bed its Smackdown in a different city in a few hours
Oh yeah, Iron D next week RAW in LA here is your chance!
[this message was edited by Adon on Tue 4 Feb 01:12] |
| Suichi
76th Post
Occasional Customer
| "Re(9):Re(10):Re(10):For the wrestling fans on" , posted Tue 4 Feb 02:28
quote:
Let the topic continue!
Gotta love the womens division though, but not on Smackdown...ugh, put Nidia in a match please.
I agree. She's got a lot of talent and no-one to wrestle.
quote:
Have you guys noticed that the TE champions have amounted to nothing. Nowinski, now that's talent. Maven doesn't have a finisher and he's been there for about 2 years or so, Nidia doesn't wrestle, Jakie and Linda are off to OVW because they suck, and the news guys are probably gonna suck, but Nowinski is good.
Anyway, that's my rant.
Maven's been out on an injury for a while with Nowinski being in action all the time. He does have more charisma than Maven does, but I think Maven could be the new Rock <wrestling-wise> if the just bred him right. His moves are crisp and nice like Randy Orton's without even having anything flashy to work with.
The new guys from TE3 are really impressive to me. The fact that John can do the Shooting Star Splash <on the mat, not from the turnbuckle> and a Shooting Star with a half twist is just amazing. Both him and Matt have decent mat sense and physcology so far as well as looking good with the basics. They're much better than Jackie and Linda ever were and I think we can expect better from them. Maybe not great things, but good things at least.
--Suichi
|
| Fro Boy11 1326th Post
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(2):Have fun Adon." , posted Tue 4 Feb 07:14
quote:
I don't know if you have left yet, but have fun. Hopefully the T-Shirt cannon will find its way to you. I hope you are free of bad 3-min warning matchs.
The T shirt cannon missed me by about 10 feet tonight! and noooooooooo I wasnt free of 3 min warning. I also got to see Rico wrestle a old school "jobber" tonight. YOu know the kind the WWF/E had back in the 80s and early 90s used. They are already in the ring, there is no music for them. It was some guy in Blue tights. It reminds me of like Earthquke vs Iron Mike sharp or Barry Horowitz or something like that. I was surprise to see such a generic wrestler now. Even the Jobbers have music and some personalty now.
Saw some intersting Dark Matches
Batista vs Spike Dudley!!!?? talk about being tossed around
and we had Sean O'Haire do a dark match with his new gimmick, he was working the mike with saying stuff you like skin a vision, PPV , there you are in the hotel room, two girls, three girls ah you get the picture fellows. Also on the nostalga front Sgt Slaughter wrestled. It was interesting watching triple H and Flair watch wrestling from the Luxury Suite, hmm thats mostly it for now.
Well Im mega tired got 2 got 2 bed its Smackdown in a different city in a few hours
Oh yeah, Iron D next week RAW in LA here is your chance!
Have fun at Smackdown. I know I'll enjoy watching it. Tell us what happened to Matt Hardy because for some reason I think he'll get his ass kicked by Kidman tonight. Ugh.
Matt always got more candy than his brother Jeff at Halloween
|
| CrazyMax
123th Post
Regular Customer
| "Let the topic continue... How to fix the WWE" , posted Tue 4 Feb 07:45
quote:
yeah i say bring back the ic and hardcore + bring back the jobbers man. thats how characters got built, by smashin jobbers. then eventually going head up with a superstar.
Firstly, thank you Real Master for proving my point. I forgot about King Mable - shudders - they let him win King of the Ring solely cause he was a big black guy heel, and they thought that would scare the bejezzus out of fans & make them root for good guys more. There is no friggin' way he deserved to win the King of the Ring.
But back to continuing the topic at hand...
Bring back the @$&^in IC title! There is no doubt that the mid card has floundered with it's disappearnce. The problem though is with two brands, who gets the IC title? The logic they used is that each brand gets it's own titles, but both brands get one. I.E. Cruiser for Smackdown, Women's for Raw. As long as that stipulation exists, I have no answer.
Yet I do have a different solution. Beef up the Cruiserweight & Women's title. Yeah, I know the powers that be don't like pushing them, thinking they are mild amusement, but this can be done off the main shows. How? The WWE has two shows NO ONE watches, called Velocity & Heat. Use each show respectively to promote those titles mainly. Not just cast off jobber matches that no one cares about.
I especially think the WWE is missing a gold mine with the Cruiserweight title. Hollywood realizes there is money in spotlighting popular sub culture. I.E. Fast & the Furious, Biker Boyz, XXX, etc. They should emphasize that the guys who are willing to throw themselves around like the cruiserweights are daredevils. They don't think & act like the rest of the roster, they have their own little world in the WWE. While the big men may not respect them, they don't respect their big clumsy @$$3$. The guys could make a stand on Smackdown, and announce they are taking over Velocity ( is there a better name for them? ), and making it their show.
Since hardly anyone watches Velocity now, it can be used to please a few hardcore fans and spotlight 2 cruiser matches, a heavyweight, and a skit or two to give the cruisers personality. Make Velocity their show with their sub culture, using it for matches to compete for the Cruiser title, while title matches would be on Smackdown and the main PPVs.
Do the same for the ladies on Heat ( Hmmm, another okay title ), and use the time pointless skits that go nowhere on both Smackdown & Heat for those wrestlers, to help get over lost midcard guys.
Also, I truly believe Jeff Hardy with his Xtreme philosphy should be the guy that leads the charge to spin off the cruisers from Smackdown to Velocity.
That's one idea...
|
| Hungrywolf 1796th Post
Silver Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Executive
| "Re(10):Re(10):Re(10):For the wrestling fans o" , posted Tue 4 Feb 10:02
quote:
Let the topic continue!
Gotta love the womens division though, but not on Smackdown...ugh, put Nidia in a match please.
I agree. She's got a lot of talent and no-one to wrestle.
Have you guys noticed that the TE champions have amounted to nothing. Nowinski, now that's talent. Maven doesn't have a finisher and he's been there for about 2 years or so, Nidia doesn't wrestle, Jakie and Linda are off to OVW because they suck, and the news guys are probably gonna suck, but Nowinski is good.
Anyway, that's my rant.
Maven's been out on an injury for a while with Nowinski being in action all the time. He does have more charisma than Maven does, but I think Maven could be the new Rock <wrestling-wise> if the just bred him right. His moves are crisp and nice like Randy Orton's without even having anything flashy to work with.
The new guys from TE3 are really impressive to me. The fact that John can do the Shooting Star Splash <on the mat, not from the turnbuckle> and a Shooting Star with a half twist is just amazing. Both him and Matt have decent mat sense and physcology so far as well as looking good with the basics. They're much better than Jackie and Linda ever were and I think we can expect better from them. Maybe not great things, but good things at least.
--Suichi
I agree about John and Matt. I mean when I saw John do that shooting star splash off the mat it blew my mind. I wouldn't have thought that possible. My sister told me about it but I missed TE3 that night, but when I saw the episode replay, it was one of the coolest things I've seen recently. Matt also impressed me, I think he has a good presence. I think they could do good in singles (but not great, not without a cruiserweight/light heavyweight title), but if they made John and Matt a tag team, they may do better. I mean, they just got rid of one tag team (since I guess Booker and Golddust are broken up now), so they could use another. Nowinski is awesome. He is doing the best right now of all the TE competitors, even though he is the one who lost TE1. Maven is alright, they need to give him a gimmick or something though...(Dude, I swear Hawk would've been an awesome talent in WWE, I wish he hadn't left TE2. When Hawk left TE2, I no longer cared about the rest of that season, because all of the others sucked. If Jake had a personality he may have been able to do well, but he didn't.)
"Someday we'll find it the rainbow connection..." -Kermit The Muppet Movie
Hungry Like the Wolf
|
| Fro Boy11 1327th Post
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(1):Let the topic continue... How to fix th" , posted Tue 4 Feb 10:35
quote:
yeah i say bring back the ic and hardcore + bring back the jobbers man. thats how characters got built, by smashin jobbers. then eventually going head up with a superstar.
Firstly, thank you Real Master for proving my point. I forgot about King Mable - shudders - they let him win King of the Ring solely cause he was a big black guy heel, and they thought that would scare the bejezzus out of fans & make them root for good guys more. There is no friggin' way he deserved to win the King of the Ring.
But back to continuing the topic at hand...
Bring back the @$&^in IC title! There is no doubt that the mid card has floundered with it's disappearnce. The problem though is with two brands, who gets the IC title? The logic they used is that each brand gets it's own titles, but both brands get one. I.E. Cruiser for Smackdown, Women's for Raw. As long as that stipulation exists, I have no answer.
Yet I do have a different solution. Beef up the Cruiserweight & Women's title. Yeah, I know the powers that be don't like pushing them, thinking they are mild amusement, but this can be done off the main shows. How? The WWE has two shows NO ONE watches, called Velocity & Heat. Use each show respectively to promote those titles mainly. Not just cast off jobber matches that no one cares about.
I especially think the WWE is missing a gold mine with the Cruiserweight title. Hollywood realizes there is money in spotlighting popular sub culture. I.E. Fast & the Furious, Biker Boyz, XXX, etc. They should emphasize that the guys who are willing to throw themselves around like the cruiserweights are daredevils. They don't think & act like the rest of the roster, they have their own little world in the WWE. While the big men may not respect them, they don't respect their big clumsy @$$3$. The guys could make a stand on Smackdown, and announce they are taking over Velocity ( is there a better name for them? ), and making it their show.
Since hardly anyone watches Velocity now, it can be used to please a few hardcore fans and spotlight 2 cruiser matches, a heavyweight, and a skit or two to give the cruisers personality. Make Velocity their show with their sub culture, using it for matches to compete for the Cruiser title, while title matches would be on Smackdown and the main PPVs.
Do the same for the ladies on Heat ( Hmmm, another okay title ), and use the time pointless skits that go nowhere on both Smackdown & Heat for those wrestlers, to help get over lost midcard guys.
Also, I truly believe Jeff Hardy with his Xtreme philosphy should be the guy that leads the charge to spin off the cruisers from Smackdown to Velocity.
That's one idea...
That's a great idea! Plus, for those people who don't get UPN can watch the cruiserweights on Velocity on TNN.
There's some belts missing, those are the IC, Hardcore and European titles. Give Smackdown the Euro title so they have 4 title, that would be the SD championship, Cruiser championship, and Tag championship, and the Euro title.
Raw can have the Hardcore and IC titles, giving them the RAW title, Tag Team, IC and Hardcore.
Both shows would have 4 titles a piece, and since there are women on both shows the Womens' championship can be on both shows, since they NEVER said anything about it being exclusive to any show. This way everything will be even.
Also, trade The Hurricane back to Smackdown! What the hell is he doing on RAW, also, but Spike Dudley on Smackdown too. He's a great cruiserweight type of guy. I'd trade, Chuck Palumbo, and Bill DeMott. Those guys seem like talent that can fit in on RAW. Maybe even trade Jeff Hardy, but I like the fact that the Hardy's are separate because it gives Matt the chance to grow on his own, but to have Jeff on Smackdown with him can make Matt the bigger heel because they have the good Jeff Hardy to compare him too, but I don't want that to happen.
Matt always got more candy than his brother Jeff at Halloween
|
| Iron D 2138th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(2):Let the topic continue... How to fix th" , posted Tue 4 Feb 12:46:
Bring back the Euro title? Why? No one gave a crap about that title. If they were to resurrect the IC title, I say that they should just resurrect the U.S. title as well. If they could do it for the WCW (World) title, I'm sure they could do it for the US title.
Actually I'm more for the idea of beefing up the cruiser and women's divisions. Seriously, I don't think I've seen a boring cruiser match yet, and CRASH friggin' HOLLY has been in a few matches (he's boring, but Noble carried their last match pretty well).
The Women's division would do well with the likes of Jazz, Molly, Nidia and Victoria. If the WWE had the common sense to try to port over some Joshi females that would do wonders!
As for the cruiser belt, it actually does look like they're giving it sort of a push. Kidman is pretty over as the cruiser champ, Mysterio is UBER-over, and with the proper pushes each of the current cruiserweights (except Crash) could be over. Make it about as important as the IC title was. Make angles involving the cruiserweight title. HAVE TITLE MATCHES AT EVERY PPV, AND PROMOTE THE MATCH HEAVILY. I can't possibly emphasive enough how important that last method is.
Btw, Adon, I saw the ad. While I was initially excited, I remembered that I don't have any money. What a crappy time to be broke!
Edit: I repeated myself and had a few grammatical errors.
Iron D-itude fact 1: Iron D steals candy from his little sister on halloween.
Iron D-itude fact 2: Iron D is a member of the M.Bison hat club.
[this message was edited by Iron D on Tue 4 Feb 14:08] |
| Hungrywolf 1797th Post
Silver Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Executive
| "Re(7):Let the topic continue... How to fix th" , posted Tue 4 Feb 15:49
quote:
The last I heard about Goldberg was that he met up with The Rock on the set of Helldorado and they talked about him going to the WWE just for WrestleMania in a match with The Rock.
The rumor is this: The Rock will come back as a heel, lose to Hogan at No Way Out, Hogan fued with McMahon for WrestleMania and Goldberg comes in for WM and beats The Rock, Hogan beats McMahon then starts a Hogan/Goldberg fued, Hogan beats Goldberg and The Rock leaves the WWE for Hollywood permanently.
THIS IS JUST A RUMOR!
Hmm...that all sounds like one big crock to me...
lol I agree, not to mention that would probably piss off alot of fans. i think the hogan/mcmahon feud part will work though. & when nash gets back im sure they will tie him into the storyline not to mention big poppa pump, because even though his foot is shit can still put it down in the ring. & on the rock leaving permenantly, w/ o the rocks WWE backing he probably wont go far in hollywood
I doubt the Rock will go to Hollywood for good, though he isn't gonna be back with WWE long before making another movie, that is true. The plan now is for Rock to wrestle Goldberg at Wrestlemania and the pay-per-view after Wrestlemania. I don't know what the plans are after that. I also want to bring attention to this Sting news. Raven gave me another link to this news, but this is from 411Wrestling.
"Someday we'll find it the rainbow connection..." -Kermit The Muppet Movie
Hungry Like the Wolf
|
| CrazyMax
125th Post
Regular Customer
| "Re(3):Let the topic continue... How to fix th" , posted Tue 4 Feb 16:40
quote:
Bring back the Euro title? Why? No one gave a crap about that title. If they were to resurrect the IC title, I say that they should just resurrect the U.S. title as well. If they could do it for the WCW (World) title, I'm sure they could do it for the US title.
Actually I'm more for the idea of beefing up the cruiser and women's divisions. Seriously, I don't think I've seen a boring cruiser match yet, and CRASH friggin' HOLLY has been in a few matches (he's boring, but Noble carried their last match pretty well).
The Women's division would do well with the likes of Jazz, Molly, Nidia and Victoria. If the WWE had the common sense to try to port over some Joshi females that would do wonders!
As for the cruiser belt, it actually does look like they're giving it sort of a push. Kidman is pretty over as the cruiser champ, Mysterio is UBER-over, and with the proper pushes each of the current cruiserweights (except Crash) could be over. Make it about as important as the IC title was. Make angles involving the cruiserweight title. HAVE TITLE MATCHES AT EVERY PPV, AND PROMOTE THE MATCH HEAVILY. I can't possibly emphasive enough how important that last method is.
The hardcore and Euro title should stay dead! The WWF made hardcore wrestling a joke, and not what became popular with ECW. Also McMahon is pushing for the wrestlers to take fewer risks, so less guys run the risk of extended injuries.
I want to the see the IC title, but somehow having a US title seems redundant. I kind of thing InterContinental somehow covers the US. I always wanted to see the TV title come back, but with a new stipulation. The TV champ is just that TV champ! If he wants air time to spiel about anything, he gets it! The World champ maybe considered the best in the Fed, but the TV champ commands attention. Thus making it as desirable if not more than the world champ. This would the kind of belt you give the guys who can work the mic. Of the guys on Smackdown now, this would be great for Matt Hardy, Edge, & ...I dunno who else. But it's a great way to take that step to world title contendership.
The women's wrestling should stay on Raw, and only female valets & managers on Smackdown. Gives Heat, Raw, & cable their own unique thing. The stigma created by the WWF/E themselves cripples any chance for women's wrestling to be taken seriously. Besides, you import quality joshi, and they just make the women already involved seem like pretty faces with very little talent. As of now, whenever they pull off something cool it gets oohs & aahs all the time.
|
| Hungrywolf 1802th Post
Silver Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Executive
| "Re(10):Let the topic continue... How to fix t" , posted Wed 5 Feb 21:22
quote:
I know i'm just jumping around here, but why is WWE afraid to call Triple H, Orton, Batista, and Flair the new four horsemen? Is "evolution" going to be their name? (lame) They are acting like the horsemen but aren't going to be called that? Although on the other hand, look what happened to the desperate revival of the NWO @_@
That exactly why they aren't calling them that yet, if at all. The nWo angle killed all the heat that they used to have and kinda ruined the name. The Four Horsemen is such a legendary group of wrestlers, that messing it up now would only serve to tarnish the name forever. I do think it would be cool for them to be the "Neo" Horsemen so as such, but I'd rather the idea be the same and not the name. Something new and unique is what the WWE needs right now anyways.
--Suichi
Bah, the nWo would've worked great, but the WWE sure screwed it up. It WAS going wonderful in the beginning, when they ran into the Ambulance with the Semi and stuff. The problem is they watered the nWo down after that. Also, even though fans were cheering for Hogan so much, they shouldn't have changed him, at least not at WMX8, they should've let him stay Hollywood and lead the nWo for a while longer, til Nash was 100%, and Hall shouldn't have been fired. Then Nash and Hall could've run things with the nWo right, and added some to their ranks.
"Someday we'll find it the rainbow connection..." -Kermit The Muppet Movie
Hungry Like the Wolf
|
| Suichi
78th Post
Occasional Customer
| "Re(2):Re(10):Let the topic continue... How to" , posted Wed 5 Feb 21:50
quote:
Bah, the nWo would've worked great, but the WWE sure screwed it up. It WAS going wonderful in the beginning, when they ran into the Ambulance with the Semi and stuff. The problem is they watered the nWo down after that. Also, even though fans were cheering for Hogan so much, they shouldn't have changed him, at least not at WMX8, they should've let him stay Hollywood and lead the nWo for a while longer, til Nash was 100%, and Hall shouldn't have been fired. Then Nash and Hall could've run things with the nWo right, and added some to their ranks.
I really wouldd've liked to have seen a powerful nWo around to liven things up a bit, but what happened was a combo of Austin not willing to job to the nWo any longer and Hall's antics behind the scenes. Besides, not having any kind of power to backup the group really hurt it. They had Hall, and that's about it. Hogan is a good entertainer, but not a good wrestler, and Nash wasn't ready at all. When he tried to perform he hurt himself a few seconds in, and that spelled the end of the nWo having any sort of value.
They pulled the only positive they could out of a bad situation and got a face Hogan to pull seats in. Unfortunately they lost a great angle and Austin in the process, though I grew tired of hearing the stupid primadonna complaints of Austin. He just sucked the heat right out of the whole angle.
I suppose having him back is a better thing now, but I'm very much no longer a fan of the person behind the name.
--Suichi
|
| CrazyMax
143th Post
Regular Customer
| "And the thread continues...." , posted Thu 6 Feb 17:38
quote:
Recently he has done an interview in which he discussed everything that went down from his end. He was on point for most of the things he said, especially when he gave the reason he refused to do the job to Brock Lesnar (no buildup, just crappy ass writing)...
Bah! That was just more whining on his end. Ric Flair, a LEGEND, jobbed to Brock Lesnar without having any build up. So did Hogan, and look at how over he was at the time he had that match. So why couldn't Austin? He just didn't want to job. Period. The egos of some of the upper carders are just awful sometimes.
LOL! I thought Adon was ending this thread, but if it can become bigger than the Goodbye thread, I am all for it!
Austin's arguements for not jobbing to Brock were smart ones. Keep in mind when they asked him to job to Brock, he had asked why and where it was going. Management ( to make it easy we will call the writers, McMahons, & more that ) just said to trust them. Keep in mind, thus far they hadn't earn much of his trust recently. The debacle with Hall, plotlines that went nowhere, and their seeming lack of interest in him at the time, all led to his dissatisfaction with them. Remember he did walk after Wrestlemania, basically putting them on notice, and they still fell back on their old ways.
He didn't see the management with any kind of foresight, and they basically had none. Flair's jobbing to Brock had no point, hell at that point Flair was on a supposed comeback tour. What did Flair get out of jobbing. A faster retirement plan? A job as the mouthpiece for the most long winded person on the WWE roster? Yup, that worked out well for him.
At least for Hogan it was a long planned break for him, that turned extended when things couldn't be worked out. They had no plans for Austin, they just wanted Brock to beat some name to give him some fast credibility. That is short term thinking, and Austin has to think long term. Austin is in that rare position ( made even more rare by HHH's position ) where he CAN dictate his terms.
Whether anyone likes to admit or not, this is what is really behind Austin's problems with the WWE. They can go on about no one being bigger than the company, but in this current business climate, YOU are always bigger than the company. There are no promises that the company or team will take care of you, but you have to take care of you. It's the norm to say take one for the team, if you aren't the franchise player, or being the one asked to bite the bullet. But Austin felt he was being phased out at the expense of Lesnar, with no plans to help him out. Ask yourself, would HHH have put over Brock? Has he?
Austin isn't bigger then the WWE, and they made a big point of telling you, themselves, and anyone else who would listen to that.
So I ask you, who's the big angle for the next PPV and Raw revolve around?
Yup.
Side note. Watching Smackdown and see a part where Hogan passes the winners from Tough Enough 3 and says hi. That is comical when you recall the stories of him in WCW where he wouldn't give the midcard guys the time of day.
|
| Batsu
94th Post
Occasional Customer
|  "Re(3):The Stone Cold truth"
, posted Fri 7 Feb 10:10
quote:
Recently he has done an interview in which he discussed everything that went down from his end. He was on point for most of the things he said, especially when he gave the reason he refused to do the job to Brock Lesnar (no buildup, just crappy ass writing)...
Bah! That was just more whining on his end. Ric Flair, a LEGEND, jobbed to Brock Lesnar without having any build up. So did Hogan, and look at how over he was at the time he had that match. So why couldn't Austin? He just didn't want to job. Period. The egos of some of the upper carders are just awful sometimes.
I agree with Iron D about Austin's ego. It's true, it's true.
Kurt Angle is my Olympic Hero.
At first I thought of it as ego (as it was with Jeff Jarrett, and initially HHH, two people Austin refused to job to before), but I'm gonna have to side with Austin on that one, looking at what has happened.
The writing (on the Raw end) has SUCKED. Bar none. I still watch it, but dammit... it's really bad sometimes (when compared to Smackdown). There was no long-term plan there. Brock was just gonna do a Goldberg, but instead of beating a bunch of jobbers and working to the top, he's beating all the big names. Austin, by that time, even in the company's decline was the biggest name they had. If they were just going to job him out, with no buildup like that... it would hurt both Brock and Austin. Brock would become stagnant...
...a role he's avoided from finally losing (albeit to Big Show, but the writing got around that thankfully). It sounds egotistical of Austin at first (and I was really POed and thought the same thing until I read that article), but seeing what happened to Raw since Stone Cold left exposed the writing to be the crap it was.
Long-term booking works. The fans are finally starting to buy the Brock Lesnar hype (which at least, by his performance he deserves, not hot-shot booking), because they're building his long, strenuous work to beat the one guy that's eluded him all this time, Kurt Angle. That's going to make their (obvious) match at Wrestlemania better than what it would have been if they suddenly just threw him at Kurt Angle off the bat.
They are sort of doing a similar thing with Chris Benoit, where he's struggling to get to the top, but just can't quite make it. And guess what? The fans are tuning in, standing up and applauding him at shows because of it.
But if Benoit came fresh out of WCW, and suddenly took out HHH, Rock, and the other top names in a month of his appearance, well, that would suck, regardless of how great Benoit is. No buildup...no long-term booking...it sucks.
Ric Flair jobbing to Brock was admirable, but really, he had nothing to gain, and neither did Brock since Flair wasn't intended to come in as a full-time wrestler. If it were going to mean anything, they would have built it up...
To me, Brock Lesnar finally got his creds by beating Undertaker at that one PPV. Because he beat him in a match that was built up. He didn't just pull out the F-5. They teased that feud several times. They finally had a match, which ended in DQ, to the disfavor of many fans. Then they finally had a "real" match, and Brock came out the winner. That did well for Undertaker and Brock. Undertaker was able to take the time off he needed, and Brock finally looked like he earned the title.
Rock's match even had better build up than the proposed Austin-Brock match.
And speaking of Kurt Angle... even Kurt had to earn the other titles before even getting in the ring with Rock and taking the WW(F) title from him.
Kurt Angle was booked in the long term, thus he is a relative success today (not on the level of Austin or Rock, but still... a guy that has the potential to draw). Think about it... that whole HHH-Stephanie-Angle angle they had was planted with a tiny little seed. Michael Cole mentioned Stephanie McMahon found Angle attractive way before any of that happened. Months later, they turn it into an angle for the trio.
I hope I'm ...illustrating the point right here.
"Get it straight or get the BOOT !"
"Sakura -- you're pathetic! ... what ? I said you absolutely SUCK !!"
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| Fro Boy11 1336th Post
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(1):The Stone Cold truth" , posted Fri 7 Feb 10:53
quote:
I suppose having him back is a better thing now, but I'm very much no longer a fan of the person behind the name.
--Suichi
And don't forget the wife beating part.
True...
I don't like the way he walked out, or the no-jobbing he was doing before he left, and of course, the domestic disputes. Before that, he was my consistent favorite.
Recently he has done an interview in which he discussed everything that went down from his end. He was on point for most of the things he said, especially when he gave the reason he refused to do the job to Brock Lesnar (no buildup, just crappy ass writing)...
...he gained about 80% of my respect back with the words he said, but he's probably never gonna be 100% again...
Man, I want to read that RAW magazine with the Austin interview, but I can't find a RAW magazine around here. Do any of you know where (if there is a place) on the net that I can read that interview?
MATT FACTS: Matt has a TV/DVD player in his car
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| Iron D 2143th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(4):The Stone Cold truth" , posted Fri 7 Feb 16:14
quote:
Recently he has done an interview in which he discussed everything that went down from his end. He was on point for most of the things he said, especially when he gave the reason he refused to do the job to Brock Lesnar (no buildup, just crappy ass writing)...
Bah! That was just more whining on his end. Ric Flair, a LEGEND, jobbed to Brock Lesnar without having any build up. So did Hogan, and look at how over he was at the time he had that match. So why couldn't Austin? He just didn't want to job. Period. The egos of some of the upper carders are just awful sometimes.
I agree with Iron D about Austin's ego. It's true, it's true.
Kurt Angle is my Olympic Hero.
At first I thought of it as ego (as it was with Jeff Jarrett, and initially HHH, two people Austin refused to job to before), but I'm gonna have to side with Austin on that one, looking at what has happened.
The writing (on the Raw end) has SUCKED. Bar none. I still watch it, but dammit... it's really bad sometimes (when compared to Smackdown). There was no long-term plan there. Brock was just gonna do a Goldberg, but instead of beating a bunch of jobbers and working to the top, he's beating all the big names. Austin, by that time, even in the company's decline was the biggest name they had. If they were just going to job him out, with no buildup like that... it would hurt both Brock and Austin. Brock would become stagnant...
...a role he's avoided from finally losing (albeit to Big Show, but the writing got around that thankfully). It sounds egotistical of Austin at first (and I was really POed and thought the same thing until I read that article), but seeing what happened to Raw since Stone Cold left exposed the writing to be the crap it was.
Long-term booking works. The fans are finally starting to buy the Brock Lesnar hype (which at least, by his performance he deserves, not hot-shot booking), because they're building his long, strenuous work to beat the one guy that's eluded him all this time, Kurt Angle. That's going to make their (obvious) match at Wrestlemania better than what it would have been if they suddenly just threw him at Kurt Angle off the bat.
They are sort of doing a similar thing with Chris Benoit, where he's struggling to get to the top, but just can't quite make it. And guess what? The fans are tuning in, standing up and applauding him at shows because of it.
But if Benoit came fresh out of WCW, and suddenly took out HHH, Rock, and the other top names in a month of his appearance, well, that would suck, regardless of how great Benoit is. No buildup...no long-term booking...it sucks.
Ric Flair jobbing to Brock was admirable, but really, he had nothing to gain, and neither did Brock since Flair wasn't intended to come in as a full-time wrestler. If it were going to mean anything, they would have built it up...
To me, Brock Lesnar finally got his creds by beating Undertaker at that one PPV. Because he beat him in a match that was built up. He didn't just pull out the F-5. They teased that feud several times. They finally had a match, which ended in DQ, to the disfavor of many fans. Then they finally had a "real" match, and Brock came out the winner. That did well for Undertaker and Brock. Undertaker was able to take the time off he needed, and Brock finally looked like he earned the title.
Rock's match even had better build up than the proposed Austin-Brock match.
And speaking of Kurt Angle... even Kurt had to earn the other titles before even getting in the ring with Rock and taking the WW(F) title from him.
Kurt Angle was booked in the long term, thus he is a relative success today (not on the level of Austin or Rock, but still... a guy that has the potential to draw). Think about it... that whole HHH-Stephanie-Angle angle they had was planted with a tiny little seed. Michael Cole mentioned Stephanie McMahon found Angle attractive way before any of that happened. Months later, they turn it into an angle for the trio.
I hope I'm ...illustrating the point right here.
Storyline build up or not, that doesn't justify his just up and walking out just before the show started. How was that supposed to help anything? It wasn't going to help him, and of course it didn't help Raw either.
You just said that he was mad because the writers were caring less about him...and that's exactly it. He wasn't the center of attention anymore.
Also, whether if Austin would have actually jobbed that night, Brock would have ended up on SD! anyway, where he beat Hogan in a match that only had a week's build up (if you could even call it build up). If Hogan can do it, so can Austin.
Add to that his adventures in wife beating and it's plain to see why this guy just looks like a big, whiny baby to me.
Iron D-itude fact 1: Iron D steals candy from his little sister on halloween.
Iron D-itude fact 2: Iron D is a member of the M.Bison hat club.
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"For the wrestling fans on the board" 
